Identified! CO - Gunnison Nat’l Forest, 3 Decomposed Bodies, long term camping near Gold Creek Campground, July 2023 - Rebecca & Christine Vance & Boy, 14

[RedHaus]

ICYMI - Found another data point to support this location for their campsite in one of the early news stories from KDVR. Starting at 47 seconds in, it shows an overhead view of the general area and then zooms in significantly to the supposed spot where their "makeshift campsite" was found. I believe this location would be slightly to the right of the red oval in the above map, but within the blue oval in the other map you posted on July 15. Nice work!

Of note from the news video you found, is LE was dubious the trio had planned to overwinter in that location based on what they found at the campsite, namely, IMO, the absence of winter clothes and boots, as we learned from other MSM reporting.

We're coming up on 6 weeks since the bodies were found by LE. I wonder why the delay in LE announcing MOD and COD after reporting it would take three weeks for tox reports? Perhaps LE is investigating this case at a deeper level?

 

[Gophers_FTW]

Of note from the news video you found, is LE was dubious the trio had planned to overwinter in that location based on what they found at the campsite, namely, IMO, the absence of winter clothes and boots, as we learned from other MSM reporting.

We're coming up on 6 weeks since the bodies were found by LE. I wonder why the delay in LE announcing MOD and COD after reporting it would take three weeks for tox reports? Perhaps LE is investigating this case at a deeper level?

I totally understand why Mr. Ashe feels that way about them trying to stay through the winter, based on what we know of their gear and supplies.

Clothing/footwear - As you mentioned, it was reported that they didn't have winter clothing and boots. Obviously, a person couldn't reasonably expect to survive at that location through the winter without these items. It is possible they had plans to obtain these items, but perished before that happened.

Shelter - It was reported that they were found in a tent, with a partially constructed lean-to type shelter nearby. A lean-to shelter is a fine emergency shelter. However, a person couldn't reasonably expect to survive in one for an entire winter. It is possible they planned on a more extensive and enclosed shelter, but just didn't get that far. Even so, it would've been extremely challenging to live in a tent, shelter, or combination of the two.

Lean-To Shelter - Survival World

The lean-to shelter is a simple design that every woodsman or survivalist should learn to assemble. If you have the right gear and a little knowledge you can set yourself up with a comfortable shelter that will keep you warm and dry through the night.

www.survivalworld.com

Food - It was reported there was only a single package of ramen noodles found in their campsite, along with some empty soup cans. It is possible that there was food stashed elsewhere that we don't know about, or that they may have been planning on re-supplying somehow. A person couldn't reasonably expect to be able to be able to source adequate food at that location through the entire winter.

Water - It was reported they had water purification equipment. Melting snow is also an option in the winter.

So we are left wondering what the heck happened. Of course, all of this analysis is based on the assumption that people were making rational decisions using sound logic. Did they have plans to go elsewhere, or improve their chances of survival at the Gold Creek site with additional food, gear, etc.? Where was their vehicle? Who was found inside/outside the tent? It would be expected that their autopsy and toxicology work might take extra time, so I don't read too much yet into how much time it has taken. However, it could also be an indication that things aren't quite as straightforward as it appeared initially.

 

[RedHaus]

So we are left wondering what the heck happened. Of course, all of this analysis is based on the assumption that people were making rational decisions using sound logic. Did they have plans to go elsewhere, or improve their chances of survival at the Gold Creek site with additional food, gear, etc.? Where was their vehicle? Who was found inside/outside the tent? It would be expected that their autopsy and toxicology work might take extra time, so I don't read too much yet into how much time it has taken. However, it could also be an indication that things aren't quite as straightforward as it appeared initially.

RSBM
Well summarized, @Gophers_FTW.

One possibility I don't think we've considered on this thread, is whether someone(s) happened upon the grizzly scene of these three dead campers, opted not to report the deaths since the discoverers may have been intentionally under the radar, and instead, they pilfered anything of value to them, including possibly winter clothing, boots, food, etc.

IOW, what if the trio of campers intended to overwinter there (very doubtful, IMO) but it just appears that they did not? I suppose LE could / is tracking down purchases of supplies or items lent to the trio to confirm what they had on hand. That would give LE more concrete data of the trio's preparation, rather than relying upon what was seen at their campsite.

IMHO.

 

[nao]

Moo. Since the group has been found deceased with no foul play. Would not the police just put case closed??

 

[RedHaus]

The COD for the three campers was reported today by the Colorado Sun. They all died of malnutrition and hypothermia.

The lad weighed only 40#, about half the normal weight for a 14 year old. And he was the one found outside the tent. It makes me wonder if he was the last to perish after trying to survive on his own.

How very tragic and sad. May they rest in peace and be free of suffering.

Teen found dead at Colorado campsite with his mom and aunt was down to 40 pounds, autopsy finds

Survival guides and empty tins were strewn across the wooded campsite in Gunnison County where investigators found the boy, his mother and aunt

coloradosun.com

 

[iamnotagolem]

The child most likely died first, IMO. He was younger and smaller. I think he died, they moved him outside the tent and they died later. JMO

 

[RedHaus]

The child most likely died first, IMO. He was younger and smaller. I think he died, they moved him outside the tent and they died later. JMO

I realize the Gunnison County Coroner will rule MOD as accident for this trio. But if what you suggest is true, then I am even more inclined to forever attribute MOD as M-S, IMO. The suffering that boy must have endured just breaks my heart.

 

[Betty P]

The COD for the three campers was reported today by the Colorado Sun. They all died of malnutrition and hypothermia.

The lad weighed only 40#, about half the normal weight for a 14 year old. And he was the one found outside the tent. It makes me wonder if he was the last to perish after trying to survive on his own.

How very tragic and sad. May they rest in peace and be free of suffering.

Teen found dead at Colorado campsite with his mom and aunt was down to 40 pounds, autopsy finds

Survival guides and empty tins were strewn across the wooded campsite in Gunnison County where investigators found the boy, his mother and aunt

coloradosun.com

The article states they were wearing multiple layers of clothing. Why didn't they walk down for help? Very sad.

 

[TwinkieDefense]

August 31, 2023 update

Three found dead at remote Rocky Mountain campsite were trying to escape society, stepsister says

DENVER (AP) — The stepsister of a Colorado woman who was found dead along with her sister and teenage son at a remote Rocky Mountain campsite says the women fled into the wilderness after strugglin…

fox4kc.com

[…]

The sisters from Colorado Springs, about an hour south of Denver, had been planning to live off the grid since the fall of 2021, Jara said. They felt that the pandemic and politics brought out the worst in humanity.

They weren’t conspiracy theorists, said Jara, but Rebecca Vance “thought that with everything changing and all, that this world is going to end. … (They) wanted to be away from people and the influences of what people can do to each other.”

[…]

 

[IceIce9]

What I don’t understand, when they began starving why at least one of them didn’t walk away to seek help? JMO

 

[Friday Fan]

What I don’t understand, when they began starving why at least one of them didn’t walk away to seek help? JMO

The cold itself is pretty dangerous.

I think they "lost it" mentally and couldn't think anymore.

Don't know what the temps were, but -20 is not unusual.

The weather in Colorado is unpredictable.

It can be 70 F degrees one day and 10 F degrees the next.


Or day temps can be in the 50s and sunny and night temps can get very low due to the fact that air is very dry.

A winter storm can come from nowhere.

Even 10 degrees with a nasty wind chill can be fatal, if you're not prepared.

I was in Boulder a few years ago. I think it was 20 degrees with a nasty windchill. We were walking downtown sightseeing. There was ice and snow on the ground. (This always leads to issues with toes) I was freezing as in Wisconsin freezing. My face was cold, my ears were cold, fingers cold. I was well bundled.

If it's 20 degrees in Texas, I'm not that cold because there usually isn't snow and ice on the ground.

 

[Friday Fan]

The article states they were wearing multiple layers of clothing. Why didn't they walk down for help? Very sad.

They may have tried and gave up.
They may have "lost it" mentally due to cold and starvation.

The cold in Colorado is unpredictable.

Weather could have been nice and they didn't have much food, but thought they would be OK.
Doesn't sound like they had phone access with weather forecasts. (Which is absolutely necessary up there. To get out before a winter storm hits)
Then, a storm hits, they're stuck.
They're already in a weakened state.

I'm from Wisconsin and I can tell you if I spent a night outdoors in the winter up there in one of their national forests, I don't think I would make it.
My parents owned property in a national forest, but I could see becoming completely disoriented very quickly in bad weather. There also wasn't much around for miles. There were a few scattered bars/baitshops but they close a 1 am. (Each bar is probably 3-5 mile apart)

But you have to know where the bars and roads are ahead of time. This is Colorado and the terrain was much tougher than Wisconsin. I also don't know if they have bars in Colorado like they do in WI.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Unless one of them left a journal, I'm not sure LE can provide further answers. I think their mental states would be key to understanding what happened.

For eg, it's known from his diary that Chris McClandless in Alaska tried to walk out, but was blocked by the creek temporarily running too high to cross. Then, his biographer believes, he became very sick from eating seeds of a local plant, but not everyone agrees about that.

Geraldine Largay, who became lost on the Appalachian Trail, also wrote a journal while she lay in her tent, waiting to die. She seems to have given up hope after a few days of wandering around trying to get a cell signal/ sending up smoke. She was known to be very poor at orienting herself in the landscape, and would have felt very anxious at being alone. Another person might have more systematically explored around her campsite, and found a nearby track leading out.

I believe much depends on mindset, it will determine what a person does or doesn't try to do.

JMO

*I couldn’t find a thread for Gerry…
"While we grieve for Gerry, we do not second-guess any of the efforts to find her when she went missing. We witnessed firsthand the passion and commitment of the hundreds of game wardens and volunteers who searched for her," Largay's family said in a statement.

"Gerry was doing exactly what she wanted to do," the statement said. "She'd hiked a thousand miles — after 200 miles of training hikes the year prior — and as the warden's report indicates, she was lucid and thinking of others, as always, until the end."

Missing Hiker, Found Dead Years Later, Left Journal Behind For Loved Ones | The Weather Channel

A recent report sheds new light on Geraldine Largay's final days. - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com

weather.com

 

[Cedars]

A journalist has delved into this story, and produced a lot of answers to questions on this
thread:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/colorado-springs-family-christine-rebecca-vance-off-the-grid.html

Since this excellent article (and associated audio version) may not be free access in the future, and is quite long, I'll highlight a few things

- The mother was deeply into Covid-enflamed conspiracy theories and (eventually) persuaded her sister to believe them too.
- They'd had jobs and an apartment that they abandoned
- The boy had spent a lot of time with his father, father's mother and father's other children, although there was no custody on that side.
- The mother lied to the boy's father/grandmother that they were moving to live elsewhere.
- The sister texted the stepsister a lot until they left, that's how the stepsister knew they'd gone off grid.
- they had a car, and took a trip to town in October to resupply. The car was found by Forest Service and eventually towed.
-The author thinks Giardisis was likely an issue leading them to starve.
-the boy likely died first.

JMO

 

[Chimera]

A journalist has delved into this story, and produced a lot of answers to questions on this
thread:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/colorado-springs-family-christine-rebecca-vance-off-the-grid.html

Since this excellent article (and associated audio version) may not be free access in the future, and is quite long, I'll highlight a few things

- The mother was deeply into Covid-enflamed conspiracy theories and (eventually) persuaded her sister to believe them too.
- They'd had jobs and an apartment that they abandoned
- The boy had spent a lot of time with his father, father's mother and father's other children, although there was no custody on that side.
- The mother lied to the boy's father/grandmother that they were moving to live elsewhere.
- The sister texted the stepsister a lot until they left, that's how the stepsister knew they'd gone off grid.
- they had a car, and took a trip to town in October to resupply. The car was found by Forest Service and eventually towed.
-The author thinks Giardisis was likely an issue leading them to starve.
-the boy likely died first.

JMO

Awful.
Adults can and do , do what they want -- but leave minors out of it, please.
Omo.

 

[Cedars]

Awful.
Adults can and do , do what they want -- but leave minors out of it, please.
Omo.

I think a question the article asks is: would Rebecca have done it if she didn't have a child to 'save'.

JMO

 

[Chimera]

I think a question the article asks is: would Rebecca have done it if she didn't have a child to 'save'.

JMO

Well it looks at this time that he was not in any danger from the father's side, anyway.
I.e., Where the 14 year old young teen needed 'saving' ?
I just feel for them all -- esp. the kid.
Not a small child but at that age, but still -- they're fairly impressionable and vulnerable.
Omo.

 

[Cedars]

Well it looks at this time that he was not in any danger from the father's side, anyway.
I.e., Where the 14 year old young teen needed 'saving' ?
I just feel for them all -- esp. the kid.
Not a small child but at that age, but still -- they're fairly impressionable and vulnerable.
Omo.

I meant, save him from 'the world' as she saw it, as it is portayed by those peddling extreme conspiracy theories.

There is discussion in the article of a youtuber 'mother-homesteader-prepper' who may have been influential.

Also, possibly, 'save' him from growing up and no longer being under her control. It seems she was very controlling of both her sister and her son.

JMO

 

[LadyL]

Talon was 40 lbs. It makes me sick that he died that way.

 

[IceIce9]

A journalist has delved into this story, and produced a lot of answers to questions on this
thread:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/colorado-springs-family-christine-rebecca-vance-off-the-grid.html

Since this excellent article (and associated audio version) may not be free access in the future, and is quite long, I'll highlight a few things

- The mother was deeply into Covid-enflamed conspiracy theories and (eventually) persuaded her sister to believe them too.
- They'd had jobs and an apartment that they abandoned
- The boy had spent a lot of time with his father, father's mother and father's other children, although there was no custody on that side.
- The mother lied to the boy's father/grandmother that they were moving to live elsewhere.
- The sister texted the stepsister a lot until they left, that's how the stepsister knew they'd gone off grid.
- they had a car, and took a trip to town in October to resupply. The car was found by Forest Service and eventually towed.
-The author thinks Giardisis was likely an issue leading them to starve.
-the boy likely died first.

JMO

Incredibly sad. If only they hadn’t taken the child with them. He could have stayed with his dad and family