GUILTY CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #69

[ajaylee]

I just found this day-by-day summary of the trial. Apologies if it was previously posted, but hadn’t seen it. Very detailed, with each witness named and extensive narrative of each testimony.

Inside the Patrick Frazee Trial

And Happy Thanksgiving to all!

Reading this article this morning, a couple things struck me.

KB's neighbor - the one with the cameras - moved into her condo in July 2018. KB had moved in during May 2018.

The neighbor installed the cameras because she caught someone stalking her. KB had indicated to her mother that she felt 'safe' having her gun back. I don't believe she ever mentioned a specific threat or concern to her mother.

PF bragged he had a person or people watching KB to get evidence to prove she was an unfit mother. He claimed to have one photo showing her car running with Baby K inside while she went inside a liquor store.

I wonder if the 'stalking' that upset the neighbor was actually someone PF had nosing around after KB and the neighbor was never the target of the stalking.

Also...something I don't recall coming up pre-trial: there is a short period when the door is open and no one is around.

"Between 4:24 p.m. and 4:32 p.m., the door is pictured as open with nobody around, then closed in three pictures."

The defense made much of the fact that there were no pictures of PF taking the tote in or out of the condo - even though the prosecution acknowledged the camera images available were incomplete. It seems to me that 8 minutes was certainly enough time to open the door and take a tote in or out without being caught on camera. It was winter and PF was in a t-shirt. No one leaves a door wide open with the heat on in the middle of winter.

 

[whoizzit]

 

[steeltowngirl]

@whoizzit Though I don’t really know you, I most DEFINITELY LIKE you! Thanks for the smile and Happy Thanksgiving!

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Reading this article this morning, a couple things struck me.

KB's neighbor - the one with the cameras - moved into her condo in July 2018. KB had moved in during May 2018.

The neighbor installed the cameras because she caught someone stalking her. KB had indicated to her mother that she felt 'safe' having her gun back. I don't believe she ever mentioned a specific threat or concern to her mother.

PF bragged he had a person or people watching KB to get evidence to prove she was an unfit mother. He claimed to have one photo showing her car running with Baby K inside while she went inside a liquor store.

I wonder if the 'stalking' that upset the neighbor was actually someone PF had nosing around after KB and the neighbor was never the target of the stalking.

Also...something I don't recall coming up pre-trial: there is a short period when the door is open and no one is around.

"Between 4:24 p.m. and 4:32 p.m., the door is pictured as open with nobody around, then closed in three pictures."

The defense made much of the fact that there were no pictures of PF taking the tote in or out of the condo - even though the prosecution acknowledged the camera images available were incomplete. It seems to me that 8 minutes was certainly enough time to open the door and take a tote in or out without being caught on camera. It was winter and PF was in a t-shirt. No one leaves a door wide open with the heat on in the middle of winter.

"Just forget we were ever here".

 

[GordianKnot]

Reading this article this morning, a couple things struck me.

The neighbor installed the cameras because she caught someone stalking her. KB had indicated to her mother that she felt 'safe' having her gun back. I don't believe she ever mentioned a specific threat or concern to her mother.

PF bragged he had a person or people watching KB to get evidence to prove she was an unfit mother. He claimed to have one photo showing her car running with Baby K inside while she went inside a liquor store.

I wonder if the 'stalking' that upset the neighbor was actually someone PF had nosing around after KB and the neighbor was never the target of the stalking.

RSABBM:

I think you're onto something here.

It would be interesting to know whether or not that neighbor ever caught a look at the person.

If so, one wonders whether or not LE's ever shown her a photo of RS or not.

JMO.

 

[Mimi in London]

RSABBM:

I think you're onto something here.

It would be interesting to know whether or not she ever caught a look at the person.

If so, one wonders whether or not LE's ever shown her a photo of RS or not.

JMO.

There would be some poetic justice in that. RS and/or Other Creeps stalking in such an amateur way as to get spotted by the neighbour, who gets a security camera that ends up taking the pictures that help slam the cell door shut.

 

[Aydrianna523]

We’re looking at this with both the benefit of hindsight, and with the knowledge of things that Kelsey didn’t know.

For every man that does what Patrick Frazee did, there are many more who don’t escalate to physical violence, let alone murder.

My sense is that had there not been a child involved, Kelsey would have run for the hills. He may have been charming and wonderful in the beginning, and those concerning warning signs came far too late.

After the baby.

We don’t know what she knew. We don’t know what she went through. And the one thing we do know, is that she wasn’t able to make a decision in regards to their future.

The story is incomplete, and always will be. That’s why it’s hard to criticize anything.

Impossible even.

They weren’t living together. They weren’t on the verge of living together.

And she never saw it coming.

Yeah. I feel pretty sure if there had been no baby, she would have left him. But she did try twice for a baby so she must have been very attached to him, unfortunately. Sometime love is impossible to figure out. And some of the worst guys seen to be big charmers.
Oh yes, and he wouldn't have killed her if they didn't have a baby imo.

 

[Aydrianna523]

A common denominator in these situations is the angry partner losing control and then being "oh-so-sorry" followed by a terribly romantic make-up period.

It starts to become a pattern that's hard to break, especially when your heart of hearts wants to make a perfect family for your child.

True. It often is a cycle.
But it can be hard NOT worry a bit about your daughters when you hear about this stuff...

 

[Aydrianna523]

I sure didn't mean to insult you, Barb, if you're talking to me.

I wrote that post in a totally lighthearted manner and sure didn't mean to offend anyone but I am glad to know there's someone here older than my 70 year old self!

It's great to meet you. Let's start over.

Lol. At work I teased the older gals that I was the 'baby senior.'
Ok, they were only a couple years older but I eeked it for all it was worth. You know 'nonsense fun'.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Yeah. I feel pretty sure if there had been no baby, she would have left him. But she did try twice for a baby so she must have been very attached to him, unfortunately. Sometime love is impossible to figure out. And some of the worst guys seen to be big charmers.
Oh yes, and he wouldn't have killed her if they didn't have a baby imo.

I have seen multiple times that she tried to have a baby.

This makes me so very upset that there is a groupthink that agrees with such.

Been there done that. There is very much a difference into trying to make a baby, and just not taking the proper precautions. M o o.

Moo, She did not TRY to have a baby. Not going into it as my reasoning.

Other women May understand what I'm saying but I'm not going to go into .....TMI.

 

[tmar]

Personally I am glad this Thanksgiving is not on the 22 nd.
Happy Thanksgiving to all our WS family. I hope everyone has someone to enjoy this day with. Eat the desserts and enjoy every bite. I did most my prep work yesterday, wish all of you could sit down and share a meal in Texas.
Y'all Come.

Thanks, for your comment, that Thanksgiving is not on 22 nd.
It is 29th here, and I am wondering, if my Laptop, has lost days with posts: couldn't work out, what these Thanksgiving wishes were about, arriving days LATER.
Guess we sure differ in our celebrations.
Here we have public holidays for the main Horse Race, and Football final, but no Thanksgiving celebrations.

 

[dalsglen]

No it doesn't make sense that a surgical nurse would have any medical condition such as a tic. God help the patient. What we have here is a very bad actor pretending to actually give a damn.

Wow. One of the best neurosurgeons I know has essential tremors, as do I. Thankfully there's equality acts to ensure we're treated as a normal people, that allows us to do normal jobs...

 

[BeckyF]

I have seen multiple times that she tried to have a baby.

This makes me so very upset that there is a groupthink that agrees with such.

Been there done that. There is very much a difference into trying to make a baby, and just not taking the proper precautions. M o o.

Moo, She did not TRY to have a baby. Not going into it as my reasoning.

Other women May understand what I'm saying but I'm not going to go into .....TMI.

I agree. It has a bad connotation to it, as if she was trying to trap him. JMO.

 

[Daisyeve]

Patrick Frazee's ex told how his mother watched as he burned Kelsey Berreth's body | Daily Mail Online
I think we already knew this. Horrible woman.
Of course she knew.
Was hoping for further charges.

KK had better watch her back as SF may want revenge for the witness testimony that 'ruined' her son !
Added the photo from the DM.
Not a happy woman.
Still haven't forgotten how she and PF's sister treated Kelsey.

View attachment 217711

What a scary picture - thank God she didn’t get custody of that baby!

 

[MemPat]

Reading this article this morning, a couple things struck me.

KB's neighbor - the one with the cameras - moved into her condo in July 2018. KB had moved in during May 2018.

The neighbor installed the cameras because she caught someone stalking her. KB had indicated to her mother that she felt 'safe' having her gun back. I don't believe she ever mentioned a specific threat or concern to her mother.

PF bragged he had a person or people watching KB to get evidence to prove she was an unfit mother. He claimed to have one photo showing her car running with Baby K inside while she went inside a liquor store.

I wonder if the 'stalking' that upset the neighbor was actually someone PF had nosing around after KB and the neighbor was never the target of the stalking.

Also...something I don't recall coming up pre-trial: there is a short period when the door is open and no one is around.

"Between 4:24 p.m. and 4:32 p.m., the door is pictured as open with nobody around, then closed in three pictures."

The defense made much of the fact that there were no pictures of PF taking the tote in or out of the condo - even though the prosecution acknowledged the camera images available were incomplete. It seems to me that 8 minutes was certainly enough time to open the door and take a tote in or out without being caught on camera. It was winter and PF was in a t-shirt. No one leaves a door wide open with the heat on in the middle of winter.

Such a brilliant observation about the stalker who was perhaps Patrick's crazy friend.

 

[MemPat]

You never disappoint, Whoizzit! I loved these and I especially love the poem you shared. Happy Thanksgiving, my friend!

 

[MemPat]

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone!

 

[Mimi in London]

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone!

Is that one of yours Mempat? It’s gorgeous.
Happy Thanksgiving guys.still not quite sure what that’s all about, but I do appreciate it’s Big.

 

[MemPat]

I have seen multiple times that she tried to have a baby.

This makes me so very upset that there is a groupthink that agrees with such.

Been there done that. There is very much a difference into trying to make a baby, and just not taking the proper precautions. M o o.

Moo, She did not TRY to have a baby. Not going into it as my reasoning.

Other women May understand what I'm saying but I'm not going to go into .....TMI.

It surprises me too that people assume Kelsey was trying to have a baby twice.

Another possibility:
Since Patrick was attuned to giving drugs hidden in a drink, perhaps he drugged Kelsey to have unprotected sex with her.

Do we doubt that he would do anything to get what he wanted?!

 

[0101ABA]

Just a heads up, I’m going to work on starting a new thread. Will post the link here as soon as I get it going.

Thread #70 is up. I’ll be closing this thread in a few minutes.