Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #4

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Doing some research on WS for FAs, posting links as I come across them:


Tricia’s blogtalk radio:

Serial Killer Caught/Family Annihilator/ Reinventing Rosalee

“Co-author of the book Final Exams with Dr. Cyril Wecht investigative journalist and true crime author Dawna Kaufmann gives us the details about the family annihilator who killed all the Hart children.

We wrap up our Websleuths Podcast with a very uplifting story. World-renowned body language expert Dr. Lillian Glass is now a documentary filmmaker....”
 
Or the baby boy - no reaction at all about that one, hardly acknowledging his existence. So weird to me, I thought every many wanted a son.

Oh, he didn't mention Niko, did he? Niko didn' exist to him.

Did he suspect Niko wasn't his and therefore didn't exist? Gawd I sure hope SW confided everything in her friend.
 
A guy with facial hair and short cropped hair really does not have to groom all that much in 48 hours.

We only saw him in those initial interviews .



he def ragged out since arrest - which would make me think he did no grooming in the beginning. moo

Yeah, agree. I mostly looked at his eyes and the fact that they weren’t swollen like he was crying or baggy like he wasn’t sleeping.
 
It I am getting this right he stayed with neighbors tues correct>

i got the impression that they called fbi and cops on tues -- is that wrong

I am under the notion that the neighbors had a lot to with having to talk to le

On Wednesday morning, the FBI and the Colorado Bureau of Investigation were brought in to assist with the investigation.
Pregnant woman, 2 daughters reported missing in Frederick
 
It I am getting this right he stayed with neighbors tues correct>

i got the impression that they called fbi and cops on tues -- is that wrong

I am under the notion that the neighbors had a lot to with having to talk to le

I think you are right about the neighbors. They seem thoroughly shaken and comment very specifically about his behavior being at odds with the situation

So where did he stay Monday night?
 
Oh, excellent point..... making his disappearance and the ruse of having to look for the entire family.... him being at work delaying the apparent time of the crime by 24 hours.

So he either didnt know or forgot about the Ob appointment

I sure hope LE got to his computer to look at searches

BBM Yes, and why he panicked when the friend rang the doorbell. He knew he was busted. Did I read that LE was already at his house when he got there? I also believe he thought he was going to get out on bail. He's a big flight risk to me.
 
Or the baby boy - no reaction at all about that one, hardly acknowledging his existence. So weird to me, I thought every man wanted a son.
Did he ever mention the baby in the interview ? I’m babysitting my grandchild and don’t want to play the video while she’s napping on me . I don’t recall him saying anything like I’m worried about them and the baby . Which if he didn’t is obviously alarming .
 
I thought it would be interesting to compile a chart with all the ones we know - a table with their demographics, month they killed, whether they killed or tried to kill themselves, whether the confessed, ages of the kids and things like whether they were having an affair, did they have debt, a secret, whether the spouse had tried to leave, and also whether they had a mental health diagnosis.

There are female family annihilators too and they could be included.
Nobody yet mentioned Andrea Yates. She killed all her children but not the husband. First found guilty, then not guilty by reason of insanity during re-trial.
 
Hello, I've been lurking since the start of this horrific case began, and have been reading all of your ideas & theories. I thought I'd share a few of my own since we will likely be finding out more soon in the upcoming week.

1. Chapter 7 Bankruptcy wipes away all debt, with the exception of student debt. The debt is completely discharged, so the Watts would have been literally getting a financial "fresh start" after 2015. This is different than a Chapter 13, in which payments are made to settle debts, wages are garnished, etc. So, with CW's company car (his truck) and SW's Thrive Lexus, they had no car payments, no debt (with the exception of student loans), and no mortgage (see below). I think they would have been doing fine by 2016 & beyond, although I do believe her SM posts were about promotion/sales and should be taken with a grain of salt. My point is, I think this crime is less about finances than what might be initially implied when you see they declared bankruptcy 3 years ago, although I do believe the pressures of appearances (and the financial stress that entails) definitely plays into this heinous crime.

2. When declaring Chapter 7 protection, they would've had the option to include the house in the filing or not. If they did not, they could live there without making mortgage payments for years. I have seen this happen. They live there for free until the bank forecloses, which can take years. HOA dues are tied up in escrow (or a lien can be put on the house so the HOA is paid upon sale of the house); either way, the bank will have to pay the HOA any unpaid dues upon foreclosure/sale. If the Watts knew that they were forfeiting the house and the HOA dues were tied up in that, they would not pay them. They had an upcoming court date on August 24th with their HOA, so it's more than likely they were being sued for unpaid dues, which would be paid upon foreclosure (HOA probably did not know this yet).

3. I think the fact that SW and the children went to visit her family in NC for 6 weeks very strange and a huge indication here that the couple was separated. I know that she did not portray it this way on SM, but perhaps a final decision regarding their relationship status had not yet been made. I do think this was something like a trial separation, and I think this his a major factor in CW's later actions. I believe that SW returned to CO because of the aforementioned upcoming court date with her HOA. She had to appear in court in CO, and her business trip the weekend before was in AZ, both of which required her to return from NC. I believe her friend knew SW & CW were separated, and SW was planning on staying with her friend after she picked the girls up from their weekend with their dad. CW basically states that they were going to be staying with a friend in his interview. SW was probably dreading going back and confided in her friend.

4. My guess is that SW's friend was to pick here up for her OB appt and either watch the girls at the doctor's office or watch the girls at home while SW went to the doctor. That's how she knew SW missed her appointment. I think she also knew SW was supposed to collect her things and the girls and she were to come stay with her, so alarm bells went off when they "disappeared" right before doing this.

5. I think for the most part, CW was a loving husband and father. Was he as great as SW portrayed on SM? Probably not. Obviously there were problems in the marriage, though I won't assume what those problems were at this point. Anyone who could ultimately do what he did has-at the very least- a personality disorder, all the way to a full-blown sociopathic mental illness. However, I think SW had no qualms about having their children stay with him for a weekend while she went on her business trip, especially since he hadn't seen them in weeks.

6. I don't think he planned it days in advance, but I do think he had the intent to murder his family before he began the act. To me, even if he isn't the most intelligent of men, certain details would have been planned better had he thought about it a bit more. I think he was stewing while she was on her business trip, thinking, "You've had my girls away from me for over a month, I need them here with me, I can't let you do this to me again." He mentions this feeling in his interviews in a roundabout way, stating that he couldn't stand to be alone in the house, he "needed" to have the girls there with him, telling them to eat their dinner, watching TV snuggled up on their couches, etc. It's interesting when you think that he's been alone without those things for weeks and weeks. It's not like that night he's referencing was the first time he'd been without them in days. So he's telling us, I could't bare that. In his mind, this crime was about love. He loved them too much to lose them again. F-d up, I know. It's hard to comprehend why someone would murder their own innocent children. But: they were about to be foreclosed on (my assumption), she was planning on leaving and taking their children (perhaps permanently, but at least for a while as she'd already been gone 6 weeks and was planning to go to a friend's that day), and (in his mind), he was going to lose everything because of her. So, he had to keep that from happening, in one fatal act of control. He loved them too much to lose them again.

7. I tend to think he killed the girls first, then killed his wife. I think he was having this emotional reckoning while she was away on her trip, and killed the girls to keep them from being taken away by SW upon her return. I think their "emotional conversation" was him wanting her to know that she'd lost--not him. He let her know what he'd done, then killed her.
His intent was to put all 3 bodies in the oil wells, which he was extremely familiar with. His job was to check those wells as an operator for Anadarko. More than likely, he knew what ones would be best/most obscure/less used. I think he had no trouble lifting his babies up into the tanks, and he had thought he could get Shannon in as well. At the last minute he realized her dead weight was much harder to hoist up and in than he had thought, so he panicked and quickly buried her in a shallow grave nearby with the intention of getting her into a well when better prepared/more time.
I definitely think he panicked and acted hastily, at least with SW's murder. I think he expected her to return at 11 PM, but she did not come home until 3 hours later. They had a confrontation, she put up a fight (as evidenced by his scratches/bites), and he was left with very little time to dispose of the body/bodies. Add to that her friend showing up at lunchtime, and like many of you have surmised, he had no time to return home and "set the scene."

Like many of you, the most disturbing thing to me about this crime is how such a seemingly normal man could commit such horrendous crimes, and show zero emotion about what he had done.

Wow. This is an excellent post. I have a few questions and hope a Colorado real estate attorney will weigh in.

1. Colorado is a super-lien state, meaning an HOA can foreclose on a property after 6 months of delinquency on dues or special assessments. The HOA is then first in line, supposedly. The actions are judicial, not administrative, and that may explain the Aug 24 date in Weld County Courthouse. What happens to the first mortgage holder? I’m looking at 2014’s HB 12-1736 which updated the super-lien conundrum but it’s just gobbledygook to me.

2. Do the defendants in the action receive the summons in person at the door via the sheriff or a process server and sign for it, or is it by mail?

3. If married, does one party have the right to sign for both parties?

After living in a Colorado HOA for 18 years, I know you don’t mess with them.
 
BBM Yes, and why he panicked when the friend rang the doorbell. He knew he was busted. Did I read that LE was already at his house when he got there? I also believe he thought he was going to get out on bail. He's a big flight risk to me.
Plus remember the protective order mentioned at court he isn’t allowed to contact or intimidate witnesses. Not sure if that’s common to have to order but seems as if prosecution was worried about him doing so
 
Did he ever mention the baby in the interview ? I’m babysitting my grandchild and don’t want to play the video while she’s napping on me . I don’t recall him saying anything like I’m worried about them and the baby . Which if he didn’t is obviously alarming .
The female interviewer at the end of the interview mentioned that they were expecting another baby and he just said "em hum" and didn't really react at all, this was after he described the two little girls.
 
Kindergarten? So was she close to turning 5? She would have had to be 5 by 10/1 to get in to Kinder.

Enrollment & Registration | St Vrain Valley School District

Did anyone state “officially” that this would be public Kindergarten? Not snarky at all, just so much to remember and I, unlike SW, am fortunate to be going through back to school in a couple days, so I’m a little all over the place today:
I saw they went to Primrose, which is a private preschool. Some private preschools do have a Kindergarten grade. Not sure but I’ve seen a lot about starting school, so really just jumping in here moreso because that’s been standing out to me as well and really didn’t get the relevance to it all:
- Primrose is a private preschool. Some private preschools do have a Kindergarten as a transferable grade, as long as they are accredited, which Primrose nationally is. I do not know if they have a “first day of K” as we had transferred to another state and used a different private preschool all together. For us, private merely because we moved to a state where we knew zero caregivers, had zero friends so we did what was best for us, where we could TRUST a caregiver to give, and what we could afford (yes, expensive, but with two full time jobs and a small business, we made it work because education was most important).
- private preschools run all year long. However, at my son’s last two (1 which was a Primrose), you pay the same tuition during the summer months until the next school year officially begins. Summer months it’s officially summer camp at the point we’re all talking about. Per each, in my experience the new school year coincides with the local public school elementary calendar.
- given my last bullet above that tuition continues (month by month), and to not utilize any camps there or elsewhere (the summer vacation break afforded the chance for a longer vacation for the three).... She could work anywhere, he went for a week probably given he was employed and could only take one week off, perhaps. We know he went there to NC for the first week, so her being there for 4 weeks, I currently don’t see as odd given her business team also in NC and given her closest relatives are there. Yet. We’ll see.
- If I was younger and my own 6 year old didn’t have to be so structured, I may visit his both sets of grandparents, his Aunts, cousins, my school friends for that long too. While I do have a Corporate job, and one with the same company for 15+ yrs now, I work from home in technology and HR, so working from a different “home location” makes zero difference to me or to fulfill my demanding job duties.
- even in my 2 week summer visits back home, I do wish my child was local to his family (not NC, or CO), but given the astronomical cost of living in our home town (near Washington DC), that doesn’t work for us.
- may be with the third in the way, after the longer summer visit to NC, perhaps she was looking at being closer to family. But enough to set him over the edge? Still not a valid excuse... not that any thing is or would be.
 
(So, as I’ve mentioned before, one of my strengths in the past has NOT been being able to tell when people are lying (I believed Patsy R until I came here (blush), and even OJ (double blush, embarrassed). I didnt think people could actually harm someone they love.. But I’m getting better as I see more and more of these types of interviews here on WS. I was thinking the other day of starting a thread of reference videos of such lying perps, “please come home safe”, “I’d never hurt my baby boy”, etc etc. Top of the thread would be CW, Mark Redwine and Emily Glass for starters...It would be interesting to compare mannerisms and verbage, etc. Man we could fill up a thread of “lying interviews” in a heartbeat. I’m going to flag a mod and see if this is something they’d approve or not.)
This would be very interesting to see!!
 
BBM Yes, and why he panicked when the friend rang the doorbell. He knew he was busted. Did I read that LE was already at his house when he got there? I also believe he thought he was going to get out on bail. He's a big flight risk to me.

In a much earlier post, I erroneously stated that LE was at the home before he was.

But that is incorrect. As I understand it, Nicole called LE from the home and CW was there when she called.

I also concur that he thought he would get out on bail...... likely to disappear. But bail wasn't part of the original plan as he was going to be the grieving father and husband, or one of the missing.

I wonder how they arrange a massive bail when you don't own your house or your cars, and have no appreciable other assets.
 
Who thinks he has a gf or girlfriends?
I am going with strong possibility. SW was gone for five weeks, she confided in AT that she suspected he was cheating, and it's more convincing if his motive is not money-related. If he did delete his FB, that could have something to do with another woman in the picture, as well.
 
Plus remember the protective order mentioned at court he isn’t allowed to contact or intimidate witnesses. Not sure if that’s common to have to order but seems as if prosecution was worried about him doing so
This is creepy. Does anyone know if this is standard?

I noticed that one of SW's friends posted on SM that no one should be talking to the media. She seemed to be worried about compromising the investigation.
 
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