Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #40

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I've answered this before, but don't mind repeating. The physical evidence from the autopsies may be helpful. Things such as bruising patterns, sizes, locations. The certain truth of exactly how big the tank openings are and whether the girls could fit in them without ...adjustments. Text messages and electronic conversations between CW and SW are likely to be helpful information. I'm not actually sitting on the fence...just leaning on it at this point, but remaining open as more information comes in. I'm also curious to see if we find anything out about either parent having any prior mental health issues. Those are just a few things I'm interested in seeing. My opinion is likely to change and morph as I gain more information. It's impossible to say what one piece would do it, but any more confirmed facts will play into any opinions I have.

I agree about wanting to see the bruising patterns and such and I'm also looking forward to the text messages between the two. I posted my reasons earlier of what could possibly change my mind. I am firmly in the CW did it all camp so I'm not sure exactly what, if anything, would tip me to the other side. It would have to be something substantial. At this point, I just cannot see any way that SW did it. I've really tried to think about that scenario and I just cannot come to that conclusion, but I honestly do like hearing other people's theories, even if it doesn't seem like it. I do think everyone here has the right to post. I would never say anyone shouldn't post here, whether I agreed or not.

I would like to ask what do the size of the openings matter for your decision whether the kids were killed by SW or CW.
 
I do find it incredibly interesting that when peeps want to demonstrate what a great mother SW was, they point to the photos and videos. However, if anyone sees something else in the videos, they suddenly can't possibly provide any information. I'm not saying she was or was not a great mother, but you (general you) can't have it both ways--they either show something or they don't.
 
I’ll let @Layla123 do her thing, but I’ll talk about the first guest on AB:

He’s a psychologist, and says that Shanann was clearly the dominant player in the relationship.

He buried things deep inside. He may have liked her dominance to a degree, but his darker side emerged later.
 
I can understand wanting to hear those things, I think most of us do. One thing you said I am curious about - is that it would be important for you to know if CW had to make adjustments to fit the bodies in the tanks. Do you mean that makes him more likely to have committed their murders? Dumping them in the tanks without adjustments is more understandable in your mind and not indicative of him being their murderer?
For me, that would be a massive game changer.
 
Dks1DWMU8AAlZRz.jpg upload_2018-10-8_23-16-39.png fullsizeoutput_e8.jpeg fullsizeoutput_e7.jpeg fullsizeoutput_e6.jpeg fullsizeoutput_e5.jpeg View attachment 150154 View attachment 150153 View attachment 150152 View attachment 150151 View attachment 150150 View attachment 150150 View attachment 150151 View attachment 150152 View attachment 150153 View attachment 150154 View attachment 150138
I found more. Reported that detectives brought 2 big bags of bedding out.
Photojournalist for Denver7, KMGH-TV in Denver, CO.
James Dougherty on Twitter
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Edit to add...
Do I see pink, blue and tan/yellow??? Or is the bag they are in messing with my eyes? Off to find pictures of all the bedrooms to compare....
Quoting my own post for the pictures... EDIT...ugh, they didn't post!!!
Ok, I may have found the blue blanket. But I can't seem to be able to save pictures from SW Instagram. Any help on how to do that?
Bellas thin comforter is solid blue on one side, white w/ blue trim on the other.
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Before school this morning, Celeste decided I needed to rearrange Bella's clothes. ‍♀️♀️ I am looking forward to her starting school…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “ #messyhair #love #sleepingbeauties #mygirls #awww”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Love tucking them in at night. #mybabygirls #sweetdreams #myloves #love#mybabies #sisters #sistersforever #beautysleep”
And this blue blanket...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “They love their Thrive K! V”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My kids are weird lol #adventuresofBella #love #mykids #seriously”

Only yellow I could find was bean bags, stuffed turtle and play pillows...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Celeste is tough like me! She cried for a few mins over her tag that came off her blankie and then attached herself to this turtle! She…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My family is why I work hard! I want to set the best example as a mom as I can for my girls! Dream big and your dreams become reality!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Thought I was done cleaning.....We call Celeste the #destroyer every time she goes into a room she dumps ALL of the bins and then plays!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Who is #DUOing it with their Thrive Experience?”
EDIT... pictures added. Thanks to @Allabouttrial
Bag for comparison, from link above...
View attachment 150138
 
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So last night I sucked it up and read Nick van der Leek’s second “book” on this case, “TWO FACE: BENEATH THE OIL.”

After reading his first “book,” I had set a pretty low bar as far as expectations go. Amazingly, this one set the bar for the inevitable third book, right around ground level.

Imagine that one of us, someone intimately familiar with the case, was to take LSD and then attempt to write a book. It would likely be far more coherent, and relevant, than the pointless drivel that this guy just produced.

Considering this crime happened less than two months ago, and this guy is already profiting from it, this is literally capitalism at its worst.

But I digress.

Our esteemed, “best selling author,” opens once again with a premeditated scenario. Shanann returns home from her trip, and enters the house, where she is immediately attacked. He describes CW using Bella’s pillowcase to form a type of lasso (referring to ligature strangulation), which he uses to strangle her.

He moves on to discuss the area in which CW grew up, an economically downtrodden town in North Carolina. The point here, is to illustrate that he came from nothing.

The “author’ discusses identity, and how important it is to us. He describes his own “existential crisis,” and how a life coach convinced him to change careers and become an author (possibly the worst advice ever given to any person, in the history of humanity).

He recounts a phone call from a producer at HLN. Basically, she was sussing him out, trying to figure out what inside information he had and who his sources were (none and none).

He talks about how hopeful he was that this could lead to him being interviewed, and how that could positively affect his “book” sales. After the 20 minute phone conversation, in which the producer apparently took no notes (who would), she basically told him “thanks, but no thanks.”

He then attacks the Thayers, who had the gaul to leave a message on his blog page demanding he remove a photo that NT took, that appeared on the cover of the first book. He touches on the legalities of him doing so, and seems to hold a grudge against them for complaining.

I’m not going to go into it, but he devoted an inordinate amount of time discussing what he sees as similarities between the Watts’ and the Thayers (I genuinely hope they sue him).

He goes after Thrive again, going as far as to make the (ridiculous) assertion that Shanann’s Facebook page is still up, in order to promote the company.

He spends a good portion of the “book” on something relatively insignificant, that damn Santa video. He talks about how contrived it was, and how it is a contradiction of the image SW was trying to convey.

A recurring theme throughout, is the loss of CW’s identity in the shadow of Shanann, and how he killed his family in order to reclaim it.

The “author” makes a (rare) good point when he discusses CW’s chance of getting away with the crime, saying that the video evidence from his neighbor’s surveillance camera, all but guaranteed his discovery.

He raises the insane notion that CW grilling on the night in question, was an effort to hide unpleasant smells, possibly from chemicals. The assertion here is that the kids were already dead at this point.

He closes by discussing other cases, offers ridiculous ideas about symbolism, and delves into pointless discussion about Anadarko.

He adds: “If there is a silver linish shimmering somewhere on this giant oil cloud, it’s the fact that this case-grotesque as it is - also reveals the nature of the world to ourselves.” [How incredibly deep]

Some silver lining...

My silver lining lining is that I just wasted 45 minutes reading complete nonsense. And it’s over.

That sounds like it was absolutely excruciating to read... thanks for doing it so others don’t have to! :)
 
I do find it incredibly interesting that when peeps want to demonstrate what a great mother SW was, they point to the photos and videos. However, if anyone sees something else in the videos, they suddenly can't possibly provide any information. I'm not saying she was or was not a great mother, but you (general you) can't have it both ways--they either show something or they don't.
Things can absolutely be deduced from those videos. But to say that they prove certain things, is where there becomes an issue.

The problem is the extent to which these videos prove certain things.

We can’t for instance say that they prove child abuse, verbal abuse, or provide any indication whatsoever that Shanann killed her kids.
 
I do find it incredibly interesting that when peeps want to demonstrate what a great mother SW was, they point to the photos and videos. However, if anyone sees something else in the videos, they suddenly can't possibly provide any information. I'm not saying she was or was not a great mother, but you (general you) can't have it both ways--they either show something or they don't.
Great point!!
 
Agreed. I think that he would be wise to accept a plea deal. But he probably won't, in his pea brain, he has already convinced himself of his story, and that it is all SW's fault. He wants his day in court. I believe that it will be a circus. His lovers, NUA, he wants to tell a "story", that will come across as "Pity Party for CW".

I think that if he portrays SW as the Villian, it won't go over too well.

On the flip side, if CW was a woman, blaming her spouse for all of the problems, I might actually believe it.
Question about last statement. Why?
 
Quoting my own post for the pictures... EDIT...ugh, they didn't post!!!
Ok, I may have found the blue blanket. But I can't seem to be able to save pictures from SW Instagram. Any help on how to do that?
Bellas thin comforter is solid blue on one side, white w/ blue trim on the other.
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Before school this morning, Celeste decided I needed to rearrange Bella's clothes. ‍♀️♀️ I am looking forward to her starting school…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “ #messyhair #love #sleepingbeauties #mygirls #awww”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Love tucking them in at night. #mybabygirls #sweetdreams #myloves #love#mybabies #sisters #sistersforever #beautysleep”
And this blue blanket...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “They love their Thrive K! V”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My kids are weird lol #adventuresofBella #love #mykids #seriously”

Only yellow I could find was bean bags, stuffed turtle and play pillows...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Celeste is tough like me! She cried for a few mins over her tag that came off her blankie and then attached herself to this turtle! She…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My family is why I work hard! I want to set the best example as a mom as I can for my girls! Dream big and your dreams become reality!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Thought I was done cleaning.....We call Celeste the #destroyer every time she goes into a room she dumps ALL of the bins and then plays!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Who is #DUOing it with their Thrive Experience?”
Bag for comparison, from link above...
View attachment 150138

upload_2018-10-8_23-16-39.png

Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Before school this morning, Celeste decided I needed to rearrange Bella's clothes. ‍♀️♀️ I am looking forward to her starting school…”
 
Quoting my own post for the pictures... EDIT...ugh, they didn't post!!!
Ok, I may have found the blue blanket. But I can't seem to be able to save pictures from SW Instagram. Any help on how to do that?
Bellas thin comforter is solid blue on one side, white w/ blue trim on the other.
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Before school this morning, Celeste decided I needed to rearrange Bella's clothes. ‍♀️♀️ I am looking forward to her starting school…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “ #messyhair #love #sleepingbeauties #mygirls #awww”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Love tucking them in at night. #mybabygirls #sweetdreams #myloves #love#mybabies #sisters #sistersforever #beautysleep”
And this blue blanket...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “They love their Thrive K! V”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My kids are weird lol #adventuresofBella #love #mykids #seriously”

Only yellow I could find was bean bags, stuffed turtle and play pillows...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Celeste is tough like me! She cried for a few mins over her tag that came off her blankie and then attached herself to this turtle! She…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My family is why I work hard! I want to set the best example as a mom as I can for my girls! Dream big and your dreams become reality!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Thought I was done cleaning.....We call Celeste the #destroyer every time she goes into a room she dumps ALL of the bins and then plays!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Who is #DUOing it with their Thrive Experience?”
Bag for comparison, from link above...
View attachment 150138

upload_2018-10-8_23-18-37.png

Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “ #messyhair #love #sleepingbeauties #mygirls #awww”

upload_2018-10-8_23-19-21.png

Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Love tucking them in at night. #mybabygirls #sweetdreams #myloves #love#mybabies #sisters #sistersforever #beautysleep”
 
(Watching Ashley Banfield) Love that someone said something about how people post "happy" times on Facebook. I find real life versus Facebook postings to have a huge gap so hate that Facebook keeps rearing its ugly head in this. I'm more interested in scientific fact and policework. Unless FB has something that has to do specifically with the murders, leave it to be included in the books and movie fluff.
 
<modsnip - quoted post has been removed>.

Last week, I was trying to put forth that I thought that particular video showed SW was under a strain. That was my thought, and I was shocked at how many people suddenly jumped all over me, put words in my mouth, and just made me feel unwelcome for saying she seemed strained and not her usual self (compared to other videos I saw). I didn't like seeing BW sprayed in the face. That brought down a lot of h8 on me.

<modsnip - discussing TOS/moderation>

I didn't like the hectoring treatment I received just for thinking SW was under a strain as long as a year ago. I don't think it is wrong to point out that there is a lot of groupthink going on, and for all I know, this post will be taken down and I will be given one of those long time outs, although with my new plan of just dropping by every week or so after seeing the continuing behavior, I won't be aware of it. I'm not interested in echo chambers instead of discussions, anyway.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Quoting my own post for the pictures... EDIT...ugh, they didn't post!!!
Ok, I may have found the blue blanket. But I can't seem to be able to save pictures from SW Instagram. Any help on how to do that?
Bellas thin comforter is solid blue on one side, white w/ blue trim on the other.
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Before school this morning, Celeste decided I needed to rearrange Bella's clothes. ‍♀️♀️ I am looking forward to her starting school…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “ #messyhair #love #sleepingbeauties #mygirls #awww”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Love tucking them in at night. #mybabygirls #sweetdreams #myloves #love#mybabies #sisters #sistersforever #beautysleep”
And this blue blanket...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “They love their Thrive K! V”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My kids are weird lol #adventuresofBella #love #mykids #seriously”

Only yellow I could find was bean bags, stuffed turtle and play pillows...
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Celeste is tough like me! She cried for a few mins over her tag that came off her blankie and then attached herself to this turtle! She…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My family is why I work hard! I want to set the best example as a mom as I can for my girls! Dream big and your dreams become reality!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Thought I was done cleaning.....We call Celeste the #destroyer every time she goes into a room she dumps ALL of the bins and then plays!…”
Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “Who is #DUOing it with their Thrive Experience?”
Bag for comparison, from link above...
View attachment 150138

upload_2018-10-8_23-21-11.png

Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “They love their Thrive K! V”

upload_2018-10-8_23-21-48.png

Thrive Healthy Fit Mom on Instagram: “My kids are weird lol #adventuresofBella #love #mykids #seriously”
 
For me, that would be a massive game changer.

Ok so if he manipulated the bodies to get into the tank, you feel it's more likely he killed them. And if he didn't, let's say the hole was larger and they fit in easily, then you still think it's possible SW could have killed them? It's not a factor for me at this point, but I do agree if he did manipulate their bodies into a small opening, it would push me even further to him being guilty.
 
Things can absolutely be deduced from those videos. But to say that they prove certain things, is where there becomes an issue.

The problem is the extent to which these videos prove certain things.

We can’t for instance say that they prove child abuse, verbal abuse, or provide any indication whatsoever that Shanann killed her kids.

I would say they also don't really show any signs that CW would later kill his wife and children. Or they don't for me.
 
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