Dark Minds Episode on the LISK airing 4/23

[giagreen]

Sorry for quoting Lost Girls so often btw lol but Lost Girls says:

That on July 9, 2007. They were thinking of changing plans and staying another day. The three others she was with left but Maureen stayed behind because an extra night would give Maureen more time to make the money she needed (it sounds as if she really needed that kind of money. Not less- atleast to me it comes across like that.) That's why I think that an offer of a lot of money would have made her you know, bite. Because it seems she really needed THAT kinda money and less would have never been good enough.

But you might be entirely right tho. It'd be interesting to be able to talk with her sister about this.

Or you could be right. That's the nice thing about WS so many different ideas and ways of looking at things. One of us on here has got to be right.

Yeah idk maybe MBB owed back rent and plus utilities or something. Just seems like a lot of money for someone who was renting. I'm sure she also wanted to buy her kids nice things as well. And I don't mind you quoting lost girls at all. I like that book a lot. Just wish I didn't borrow it to my mom so I had it to loom back on also.

Sent from my Z796C using Tapatalk

 

[trigger]

I'm thinking TobyTera was asking about the Captree and Oak Beach shows. Those are listed on www.longislandcollectorcars.com - Not sure if this is the actual 'organizer' of these meets.

Oh ok, my bad.

 

[Theforeigner]

"The caller ID indicated the call came from Melissa's cellphone. The man who sounded like an "older white guy" wanted to know if the person on the line was Melissa's little sister. "The whole year I continued to pay for the phone bill," Melissa's mother, Lynn, told The Daily Beast. "It was only turned on when the guy would turn it on, when he made the phone calls. He would only keep it on for three minutes."

The police traced the calls to cellular towers in Times Square and Madison Square Garden, but got nowhere. Lynn said they received five more calls, the last one on August 26, 2009. "The last call, he said he killed her," then hung up. Investigators also discovered that a call made to Barthelemy's voicemail the day she vanished came from Massapequa, a Long Island town about 20 miles from where her body was later discovered."

That would mean he only turned the phone on to make those calls and turn it off after he was done right? Or did I get that wrong?

Thanks, and no you didn´t get that wrong your sure was right

It wasn´t that I doubted you, I just had not seen that info before, or maybe I just forgot that I´v read it previously.
Thanks again

 

[mainegirl]

How MBB ended up on LI has always been something I've struggled with also. I have also thought that in between calling her sister and getting home, perhaps she was offered a date she couldn't refuse.
Upon talking about it, we thought perhaps she was offered a date on LI and maybe he told her he could put her on the ferry to CT after the date... the Ferry would get her pretty close to home and get her there quite quickly.

Just one more in the many possibilities, just like everything else

 

[mainegirl]

After a little thought.

The fact that more people than not feel this guy wouldn't dare put things on the sites where the girls were found, could be exactly why he felt confident enough to put things there. He could feel confident that people would just think it was a prank, or put there as a nice gesture, and most do think one of these is the case.

He thinks he's very sly and playing that kind of game would be right up his alley, especially when this person drives this road frequently and has made it a point to tell people it's his favorite place to test drive, and has been known to take others along for the ride.

Still, no smoking gun of course, but we don't have a smoking gun on anyone else either so I guess going where there is at least some some, seems reasonable.

There are still MANY people that feel JB (think landscaping supplies) was the killer, despite there being ZERO evidence to suggest that.

There are still people that think it's someone (or a group of people ) at Oak Beach, despite there being obvious reasons to feel Shannan was not the victim of this killer.

Are there probably 100 other guys around that also fit the bill? I'm quite sure there are a few, but we don't know who they are and we may never know who they are.

MIND BOGGLING !

 

[TobyTera]

I think there could be a connection to the time out dolls, car shows and the killer. I used these links to gather show dates/info....specific dates have been hard to find prior to 2009.

A big part of serial killers is their pattern but one thing to keep in mind is that every kill is a little different because even if they have a plan they cannot control outside variables. They may deviate slightly from case to case because of circumstance or if an unexpected challenge pops up. They perfect their kills over a length of time. Early kills may be a little different than later kills because they are still trying to figure it all out. Obviously not all of the victims are going to link up identically to any one theory but finding a common denominator or similar variables is enough to establish a pattern for a suspect. That's what I tried to do here.


http://www.longisland.com/car-shows.html

2010 car show events
http://www.lipulse.com/trends/article/summer-fun-guide-car-shows

2009
http://www.sweetchariots.com/new-york-classic-car-shows/

MBB last seen Monday, July 9, 2007 (corresponding car shows: [Bellmore Train Station and the shopping center parking lot in Oakdale (800 Montauk Hwy, Oakdale, NY) has long been a meeting spot of car lovers for decades, every Friday evening all summer long.] [Tuesdays:
Bald Hill Cultural Center, Farmingville is one of Long Island’s biggest weekly car hang outs. On any given Tuesday all summer long, anywhere from 500 to 1000 owners stop by and hang out in good company]
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Wednesday, July 4, 2007)


MB last seen Friday, July 10, 2009 (corresponding car shows:
[The Bellmore Train Station and the shopping center parking lot in Oakdale (800 Montauk Hwy, Oakdale, NY) has long been a meeting spot of car lovers for decades, every Friday evening all summer long.]
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Saturday, July 4, 2009)


MW last seen Sunday, June 6, 2010 (corresponding car shows: [Long Island Cars Custom and Collectible Car Show June 6, Aug 1, 8am-5pm Flowerfield Fairground, St. James August 21&22, 8am-5pm Belmont Racetrack, Elmont (631) 567-5898 http://longislandcars.com] [44th Annual Spring Meet June 6, 11am Old Westbury Gardens]
(corresponding holiday: Memorial Day, Monday, May 31, 2010)


ALC last seen Thursday, September 2, 2010 (corresponding car shows: [All American Car Show To Benefit MS August 29, 9am-4pm Tanger Outlets At The Arches]
(corresponding holiday: Labor Day, Monday, September 6, 2010)


JT last seen July 2003, torso found July 2003
(2003 car shows unknown)
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Friday, July 4, 2003)

The known victims all go missing in the summer, within days of known car shows and summer holidays. Time out dolls are regularly seen at car shows. One POI is a mechanic. I realize these are loose connections, but I think there could be a potential pattern.

Going to a car show is a great way to get away alone from family/work for a few days without raising any red flags. I think it also provides an alibi if the police look into a POI's whereabouts. The killer could register a car and leave the show, but it would appear as if he was just walking around to see other cars. Later, he returns to get the car like he's been there the whole time. I'm assuming before the show the suspect could drop off a second vehicle at the show or within walking distance to drive elsewhere and meet his victims.

Thanks to everyone who provided information about car shows in the area. It helped along the way

 

[mainegirl]

Found this new article by Dr. Scott Bonn - published just this month.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wicked-deeds/201404/long-island-serial-killer-where-are-you-now

I still don't understand the seasonal resident theory. For one thing, we don't know who many of the victims are so there is no way to know when they disappeared. (assuming one guy is responsible for all)

Also, one victim surfaced in April 1996 and another Nov, 2000. Both had characteristics still identifiable that would tell us, they had not been there since the summertime. The 1996 victim has scars identified.

We only know that 5 of them disappeared during the summer. I don't like how they assume such things when all we know is that 50% of them disappeared between memorial day and labor day, because we also know that at least 2 of the unidentified did not.

 

[TobyTera]

I never really went for the seasonal resident theory either. I always thought the killer had to be local because of how well he knew the area.

I don't think he only kills in the summer time either. I think it's quite possible he kills around holidays in general, no matter the time of year. For example the legs were found in April. Easter fell on April 7th in 1996 and 13 days later the legs were found on fire island. I know there's a link somewhere about the length of time when the legs were found I just have to dig it back up. Will edit it in later.

It's very frustrating that so many of the victims are still unknown. The circumstances surrounding their disappearances more than likely hold the key to this case because they are his earlier kills before he was more skilled like with the GB4 who happened later in his "killing career"

 

[mainegirl]

Interesting about the holidays.

Perhaps his wife takes the kids to visit family for holidays...

Or some other reason. That just comes to mind as one

 

[giagreen]

I think there could be a connection to the time out dolls, car shows and the killer. I used these links to gather show dates/info....specific dates have been hard to find prior to 2009.

A big part of serial killers is their pattern but one thing to keep in mind is that every kill is a little different because even if they have a plan they cannot control outside variables. They may deviate slightly from case to case because of circumstance or if an unexpected challenge pops up. They perfect their kills over a length of time. Early kills may be a little different than later kills because they are still trying to figure it all out. Obviously not all of the victims are going to link up identically to any one theory but finding a common denominator or similar variables is enough to establish a pattern for a suspect. That's what I tried to do here.


http://www.longisland.com/car-shows.html

2010 car show events
http://www.lipulse.com/trends/article/summer-fun-guide-car-shows

2009
http://www.sweetchariots.com/new-york-classic-car-shows/

MBB last seen Monday, July 9, 2007 (corresponding car shows: [Bellmore Train Station and the shopping center parking lot in Oakdale (800 Montauk Hwy, Oakdale, NY) has long been a meeting spot of car lovers for decades, every Friday evening all summer long.] [Tuesdays:
Bald Hill Cultural Center, Farmingville is one of Long Island’s biggest weekly car hang outs. On any given Tuesday all summer long, anywhere from 500 to 1000 owners stop by and hang out in good company]
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Wednesday, July 4, 2007)


MB last seen Friday, July 10, 2009 (corresponding car shows:
[The Bellmore Train Station and the shopping center parking lot in Oakdale (800 Montauk Hwy, Oakdale, NY) has long been a meeting spot of car lovers for decades, every Friday evening all summer long.]
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Saturday, July 4, 2009)


MW last seen Sunday, June 6, 2010 (corresponding car shows: [Long Island Cars Custom and Collectible Car Show June 6, Aug 1, 8am-5pm Flowerfield Fairground, St. James August 21&22, 8am-5pm Belmont Racetrack, Elmont (631) 567-5898 http://longislandcars.com] [44th Annual Spring Meet June 6, 11am Old Westbury Gardens]
(corresponding holiday: Memorial Day, Monday, May 31, 2010)


ALC last seen Thursday, September 2, 2010 (corresponding car shows: [All American Car Show To Benefit MS August 29, 9am-4pm Tanger Outlets At The Arches]
(corresponding holiday: Labor Day, Monday, September 6, 2010)


JT last seen July 2003, torso found July 2003
(2003 car shows unknown)
(corresponding holiday: Independence Day, Friday, July 4, 2003)

The known victims all go missing in the summer, within days of known car shows and summer holidays. Time out dolls are regularly seen at car shows. One POI is a mechanic. I realize these are loose connections, but I think there could be a potential pattern.

Going to a car show is a great way to get away alone from family/work for a few days without raising any red flags. I think it also provides an alibi if the police look into a POI's whereabouts. The killer could register a car and leave the show, but it would appear as if he was just walking around to see other cars. Later, he returns to get the car like he's been there the whole time. I'm assuming before the show the suspect could drop off a second vehicle at the show or within walking distance to drive elsewhere and meet his victims.

Thanks to everyone who provided information about car shows in the area. It helped along the way

Thanks for this post. For the first time ever in this case that I've read some things are making sense. Time out dolls, car shows, then the dates. I can see it.

I don't think someone was pulling a prank with the dolls. And the only reason I think this is because the dolls are just to creepy and IMO personal to each girl.
I could maybe see pranksters pulling a prank but not with the dolls. That's to well thought out. To much effort for someone just pulling a prank.

 

[trigger]

Found car shows listed in 2010.

Saturday Nights
Cedar Beach. Ocean Pkwy, Babylon, NY

Sunday Mornings
Captree OBI, Oak Beach, Ocean Pkwy, Babylon, NY
Either at Captree or OBI parking lots.

http://dunwellcollision.com/carshowsevents.html

(They charged a fee at Captree but after Labor Day, it was free).

I watched numerous videos on Youtube and did not see any time out dolls except at Belmont Racetrack.

 

[mainegirl]

I've never known them to be associated with car shows myself.
It was always people associated with crafts that had them that I knew of.
They were popular back in the 80's.
They were all over craft fairs back then

 

[mainegirl]

One part of me agrees with that giagreen. Then the common sense part of me says it's too risky.
It's bounced this back and forth for a long while now.

How could someone that would take such risks, get away with doing this all this time?

Could someone be this arrogant and risky?
To me, killing people is pretty arrogant and risky, so I don't know.

I think my head is going to explode

 

[fred&edna]

IMO... The phone calls to the victims' family/friends tells me he is very arrogant... his ego is so big is overshadows risks. I'm not particularly convinced he placed the time-out dolls but I think risks are what strokes his FAT ego.

 

[PickleChris]

Anyone with info on this POI talked about on the show, please drop me a PM.

I'm also starting to think that all GB4 might have had their phones with them but LE asked for people to say they were left behind to provoke the LISK to reach out further and make contact? If that's the case, I want the FEDS back on this immediately. Poor decision.

No one has any more info on the POI from the show? I'm curious to how well that theory has been researched.

 

[ktgirl]

I had dreams about this case, the crosses at Gilgo, and those dolls all last night.

Hoping for a resolution to this case....sooner rather than later.

 

[Theforeigner]

Concerning car shows.......

May 1st 2010 the morning Shannan Gilbert disappeared.

Probably no significance at all but just wanted to mention it anyway:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/06/jersey_city_prostitute_still_m.html

Gilbert began her frantic run at 8 The Fairway, Brewer’s home, and headed east, toward the gate. She ran down the corner of The Fairway, to the home of Coletti, who was up shaving that morning, getting ready to leave for a car show in Rhinebeck

Rhinebeck is 130 miles N/W of Gilgo Beach, pretty long way to drive for a car show! wonder if Gus Coletti was truthfull?

 

[mcme]

Concerning car shows.......

May 1st 2010 the morning Shannan Gilbert disappeared.

Probably no significance at all but just wanted to mention it anyway:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/06/jersey_city_prostitute_still_m.html

Gilbert began her frantic run at 8 The Fairway, Brewer’s home, and headed east, toward the gate. She ran down the corner of The Fairway, to the home of Coletti, who was up shaving that morning, getting ready to leave for a car show in Rhinebeck

Rhinebeck is 130 miles N/W of Gilgo Beach, pretty long way to drive for a car show! wonder if Gus Coletti was truthfull?

He's a fan of older classic type cars, and had one that Sandy ruined on him, not the hotrod type showcased at these other shows.

 

[Puggle]

I'm fairly new here....Has this "Mechanic Man" been a person of interest for a lot of you? and if so.... Apart from the connection of the dolls are there any other red flags about this person that make you consider him a suspect? If someone has more info specific to "Mechanic Man" can you PM me...I would like to help see if I can find out any more information that may relate to possible involvement in these girls cases.

 

[PennyPie7]

I'm going to contact a few people regarding the local car shows (aside from Belmont) to see if they've seen the dolls at any in the past few years. I know a ton of people all over the island who regularly attend.