Defense What is their strategy? #1

[Mysteeri]

Ok, when exactly are we going to know about the "half of the story", why wait to go after the killers/kidnappers?

I don`t understand why they aren`t making a plea deal and calling it an accident by telling some "truth". Oh, perhaps it is not possible to make it seem like an accident, have to wait for the forensics.

 

[21merc7]

Maybe Baez is still hoping nothing at the scene definatively has anything to do with perp. However, "no comment" would be his best friend from here on out.

 

[MiraclesHappen]

yes...according to the Florida bar (adorable nickname: flobar!)

"a lawyer shall not represent a client or, where representation has commenced, shall withdraw from the representation of a client if...the client persists in a course of action involving the lawyer's services that the lawyer reasonably believes is criminal or fraudulent, unless the client agrees to disclose and rectify the crime or fraud...[except] A lawyer must comply with applicable law requiring notice or permission of a tribunal when terminating a representation. When ordered to do so by a tribunal, a lawyer shall continue representation notwithstanding good cause for terminating the representation."

I agree!
But I do have a few questions for anyone who may know....
if he has changed his mind about her being innocent do you think
he would still represent her?
I mean.... is there a rule that he can't if he knows she did it?
Also ... do you think if he feels like she did it he would try
talking her into confessing? or would he help her think of a defense?

I hope this makes sense!

Yes he can still represent her. There is no such rule.

The caveat is that he cannot suborn perjury by putting her on the stand to deny a crime if behind the scenes, he is being told by her that she did it.

But he does not have to get off the case bcause of knowledge of her guilt.

jmho

 

[MiraclesHappen]

I do not want to go back in my previous post. (I have no clue how I did that double quote thing..still working on it:crazy

RULE 4-1.16 DECLINING OR TERMINATING REPRESENTATION


(a) When Lawyer Must Decline or Terminate Representation. Except as stated in subdivision (c), a lawyer shall not represent a client or, where representation has commenced, shall withdraw from the representation of a client if:
....

(1) the representation will result in violation of the Rules of Professional Conduct or law;
(2) the lawyer's physical or mental condition materially impairs the lawyer's ability to represent the client;
(3) the lawyer is discharged;

(4) the client persists in a course of action involving the lawyer's services that the lawyer reasonably believes is criminal or fraudulent, unless the client agrees to disclose and rectify the crime or fraud; or

(5) the client has used the lawyer's services to perpetrate a crime or fraud, unless the client agrees to disclose and rectify the crime or fraud......



The crimes cited in this rule , those which would cause a lawyer to stop representing the client, are crimes where essentially, the client's criminal conduct relates to the lawyer's services.

It does not concern the client's conduct unless somehow, the lawyer's actual services are involved.

This rule does not apply to a murder of a toddler as a reason to withdraw from the case..even if counsel knows the client "did it."


I can see how one might think that though. And it is a great find either way! :blowkiss:

 

[ElizaAvalon]

JB is in over his head.

I give it a week or 2 before Cindy (yes, Cindy, not George - because he has absolutely no say) gets convinced by Brad Conway that this is too big of a job for Jose. They'll announced a new big guns lawyer with Geragosian credentials.

IMO.

 

[zoey]

Mark my words all 'The Half Of It' is going to amount to is the general perfidy of Law Enforcement and Media and Opportunistic Individuals trying rail road his poor client.
I think thats going to be the defense: They cant address the forensic evidence,or Casey's behavior so the tact is going to be total denial.
"We cant explain this because its all lies and planted evidence anyway."

and sadly he has played that "defense" to the court of public opinion...I'm tired of the whining ....... I truly am...I'm also tired of the "in it to win" or "playing to win"---that to me is a sporting event----this is supposed to be about truth---defense keeps saying that is what they are looking for--in reality I don't think so--they are looking for holes they can penetrate-which is sad--a child is dead and all they are thinking is kc...not Caylee--

I loved it on LKL or GVs when Pam B saw/heard of jb talking outside the court of the unfairness of it all and she gave a look shaking her head like unbelieveable...I knew the rules of the jail house from listening to reports...what makes her different than the rest......:bang:

 

[manatee]

JB is in over his head.

I give it a week or 2 before Cindy (yes, Cindy, not George - because he has absolutely no say) gets convinced by Brad Conway that this is too big of a job for Jose. They'll announced a new big guns lawyer with Geragosian credentials.

IMO.

I'm hoping that now that CA knows Caylee is dead that she wil UNLEASH her anger at KC and turn her back on her. Maybe advising Team KC that they better work on a plea deal because she will not defend her daughter any longer and that as KC is where she needs to be.

 

[MiraclesHappen]

[QUOTE=HeSaidSheSaid;3081704]I have a question, and I'm being completely earnest. My belief for the few *snerk* years I've been on the planet, is that a defense attorney's job is to see to it that their client receives competent representation and a fair trial and isn't completely railroaded, NOT to get them off at all costs.

Am I wrong?

I've seen many posts that speculate as to what Jose will do/say to get his client off, but my understanding of the roll of the defense attorney is that they're appointed/hired to make sure that their client's constitutional rights are upheld, not that they pull out all of the stops to ensure that the client is let off of the hook for the crime that they've commited.

Again, am I wrong?

We are thinking along the same lines! I think our justice system began with an attempt at being "JUST" but has begun to fail in many respects. An attorney should be able to defend to the best of his ability, but when it comes to a case like this..there seems to be no holds barred. Sad but true...especially for the victims. People expect truth and justice no matter what side the attorney's are on, and it isnt always the case.



I'm sure you'll all think that I'm stupid, I've just never understood this.

[/QUOTE]



I agree with you in part. And please, no question here is a stupid one. :hug:

I agree that defense atty cannot use every means possible,and try to get the acquittal at all costs.

The lawyer can never lose sight of the ethical rules and disciplinary rules which govern that lawyer's trial representation, nor can the standing statutes and case law be ignored to sway things to a not guilty.

There a many limits placed on what a lawyer can and can't do in the representation, and many rules to follow.

That said, I do believe a trial atty has to "pull out all legal stops" to attempt to get a successful outcome for the client.

If Baez has one of those "stops" and it is not pulled out, that could cause him problems in the future.

He is bound to represent the client, zealously, and to the best of his abilities.

That is where the moral dilemna arises for many lawyers when representing defendants charged with heinous crimes, terrible terrible things.

I have observed defense counsel bashed for representing "monsters."

Reality is, they might be doing a job out in public and behind the scenes, in tears over the victim's fate.

disclaimer: not defending conduct of Baez :wink:

 

[MiraclesHappen]

If KC were to get off scott-free, how long would she survive? How long before her remains would be found along some roadside?

In all seriousness, isn't her safest address - assuming she wants to live - probably prison?

I'm thinkin that 's not gonna be so good, either.

They cannot keep her at "day camp" forever.

jmho

 

[Spitfire4ever]

I'm hoping that now that CA knows Caylee is dead that she wil UNLEASH her anger at KC and turn her back on her. Maybe advising Team KC that they better work on a plea deal because she will not defend her daughter any longer and that as KC is where she needs to be.

I hope for the same thing but sadly I don't think it will happen. I think she will unleash her anger towards the public. I think she will continue drinking the Kool-Aid. JMO

 

[MiraclesHappen]

She would be a goner within days IMHO. You are right. Her safe haven is prison. And that isn't going to be very safe either. I doubt she even grasps that.

She probably thinks she'll beat this and be out partying in no time at all. She MAY even "potentially" realize it might be 10-15 years but she figures she'll still be hot. Absolutely.

I highly doubt she realizes she'll be kidnapped, wrapped in a trash bag with duct tape and be close to her home in the woods. In her heart after she has met with all the experts assigned to her by the court she will be just dandy and she will feel it Mom.

Just my 2 cents.

Great words!:blowkiss:

 

[Pollywog]

Of course he will say she is innocent, but he has to know she is not. He can't be that stupid. KC wll never admit she did it, ever. She will blame it on someone else, zanny or whoever she feels like at the moment. I think the day GA tried to look in the trunk is when she tossed her baby girl "close to home". That was the closest place she could think of. KC is guilty and she will spend her life in prison, hopefully in general population.

It does not matter what JB says or she says, she did in a fit of rage and then had no clue what to do with the body. Had she been smart enough to use the kidnap story before 31 days, she may have gotten away with it, but not now. Her saying she is close was the truth. She has known all along what the ID of the bones were, she knew it was her baby girl as soon as JB told her they had found bones. She was just hoping there could not be an id made or maybe she thought the critters would have gotten it all by this time.

KC knows what she did, JB will defend her based on the lies she tells him and if justice prevails, she gets convicted.

 

[Skully]

I believe I've said this before on another thread but I will say it again here as well.

JB was simply stating the "fact" of the matter for both him and his client in this instance. His job is not to believe her but to DEFEND her per what information she gives him AND the information he recieves from other sources. Along with the given evidence in the case that is at his disposal to investigate on his own to make a worthy enough argument for his "client".

Nowhere in his job description does it state that he has to care. As crass as that might sound it's the truth. His job is to simply "defend" her. The rest is basically left up to Casey.

Spot on! That is his job, to defend her. He doesn't have to believe her, just do his job and make a name for himself. He was an unknown before this case, little defense record, and now he can lose big and on national TV.

Then the family can say they want a new trial b/c the attorney was incompetent.

 

[Skully]

I'm hoping that now that CA knows Caylee is dead that she wil UNLEASH her anger at KC and turn her back on her. Maybe advising Team KC that they better work on a plea deal because she will not defend her daughter any longer and that as KC is where she needs to be.

I don't think she has to turn her back on her daughter or anger, you can still love your kid, and hate and despise what they did. That is why she is acting this way. Mother's usually turn a blind eye to what their kids do, I see it all the time.

 

[Capri]

JB is in over his head.

I give it a week or 2 before Cindy (yes, Cindy, not George - because he has absolutely no say) gets convinced by Brad Conway that this is too big of a job for Jose. They'll announced a new big guns lawyer with Geragosian credentials.

IMO.

Just wondering if Linda Baden is enough for co-counsel. I am also thinking they need/will probably add another experienced attorney, probably someone we've heard of before.

 

[zoey]

I hope for the same thing but sadly I don't think it will happen. I think she will unleash her anger towards the public. I think she will continue drinking the Kool-Aid. JMO

I think she will be focusing on the "nanny" or meter reader...in other words the spin of defense cycle # _______(fill in the blanks with which "story")

 

[Pedrosmom]

Baez' days as lead attorney are numbered. He said too much already. Loose lips sink ships, IMO. The dream team will be seating him in the audience, if they're a real dream team.

 

[MiraclesHappen]

Baez' days as lead attorney are numbered. He said too much already. Loose lips sink ships, IMO. The dream team will be seating him in the audience, if they're a real dream team.

Except that the dream team won't make that decision. It will be Casey's to make. And a Judge's to allow .:blowkiss:

 

[manatee]

Except that the dream team won't make that decision. It will be Casey's to make. And a Judge's to allow .:blowkiss:

Well, since Team KC is representing her for free...anyone can choose to walk out if not listened to...so JB better watch out with all of these "prima donnas"

 

[Pedrosmom]

Except that the dream team won't make that decision. It will be Casey's to make. And a Judge's to allow .:blowkiss:

I think Baez knows he's in over his head. He'll advise KC to take the defense that the team agrees on, which would throw all KC's ideas out the window.

And I do believe, that if KC is adamant on a certain defense because of course she is smarter than everyone, Baez will be the lone ranger and dream team won't waste their time assisting in a conviction. Dream Teams don't assist in dead bang loser cases. It will be their way or No Way.