*DEVELOPING*CO Shooting at Movie Theater #2

[IzzyBlanche]

No, it's not. Not in Colorado.

It's one of eight states where the burden of proof is on the prosecution.

http://www.enotes.com/criminal-law-reference/insanity-defense

Thank you.

I'm sorry. I'm obviously being dumb. I still don't understand.

You are prosecuting someone whom you don't believe is insane but instead acted willfully, yet you have to prove he's insane?

How does that work? :waitasec:

 

[debirlfan]

if there was a system in place to call his phone when his
apartment was to explode, theoretically the calling device
would have been destroyed before completing the call.
he could have simply set a timed bomb in his apartment
for midnight which would have diverted first responders.
thankfully he didn't think of that, but considering the
methodical planning involved in this, the apartment
bomb plot seems sloppy.

At a guess - calling device is rigged to call him when someone turns the doorknob/rattles the door. Bombs are set to go off when someone actually enters and hits a trip wire. Normally there would be only seconds between the two, but that should be long enough to put the call through. Pretty sneaky and smart, if that's what he did. He just never counted on neighbor not actually opening the door.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Two witnesses now say two perps were involved? Shooter is 5'9" ish Holmes is 6'3". Would any eyewitness not knowing Holmes really be able to recognize who left the theater let alone whether it were the same who returned to do the shooting? Did one let another in? How long between one leaving and the other entering? Was it even Holmes doing the shooting? Proof? Why aren't we seeing his face?

Defence issues can arise from any number of sources. The early live stuff is critical to watch and record. Wish I had recorded the movie clip of the Gangster Squad theater shooting.

So do you think it's a conspiracy to protect the name of the shooter and the "real person" who was arrested?.. Because we've been given the name of the shooter as well as the name of the man arrested for the litany of crimes including first degree murder(tho not formally charged of course).. These two persons(shooter/arrestee) are one and the same, JEH..


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Posting via mobile as well as via tablet so plz forgive all typos.. Btwn the sucky touch keyboard and the obsessive auto-correct it's a big ol' mess :crazy:

 

[scorekeeper]

perhaps this was answered earlier; why did the car have Tennessee plates?

 

[mrsu]

1) he did live there in fact one of his neighbors stated he saw him leaving his apt the evening of the shooting as he was loading black duffel bags into his car. The neighbor says he spoke to him, but that he did not reply with so much as even a hi!..

2) while I know some believe it to possible or even likely(according to some) that he had an accomplice IMO he acted alone.. As far as the mug shot being kept out of public for reasons that it would show a different male and the persons sitting next to him would recognize it was a different person.. IMO this isn't the reason as theyve released the arrestee/suspects name and we have plenty of pics that the witnesses would already be able to see and say hey that's not him.. So IMO that's not the cause for their with holding the mug shot..

3) the fourth gun, which was the other glock handgun was recovered from the suspects car..


____________________...
Posting via mobile as well as via tablet so plz forgive all typos.. Btwn the sucky touch keyboard and the obsessive auto-correct it's a big ol' mess :crazy:

Okay, so the 4th gun was in the car, I was mistaken about that.

Regarding #1. To me that doesn't say he lived there, only that he was leaving from there that day. Who knows how often he stayed there?

#2. How do you know this? From everything we have heard from the gear he was wearing, it hair was not even visible from under the helmet. There is quite a good chance, IMO, that people were not even able to see what he looked like especially with the gas mask on in the dark. They said they were not releasing the mugshots for "investigative" reasons. What else could it be?

I am very very interested in knowing if there are video cameras in the parking lot and around the movie theater.

 

[Tucarra]

Not sure of the method he used, other than preventing the door from closing so he could use it to re-enter the theater.

MOO

As a long time smoker, exiting my own workplace or other buildings to sneak a puff, (ackk...shouldn't be smoking),there are numerous and easy ways to keep a door 'propped open'...pebble, matchbook, cigarette pack, brochure, program, popcorn pack...you name it....

 

[wfgodot]

Thank you.

I'm sorry. I'm obviously being dumb. I still don't understand.

You are prosecuting someone whom you don't believe is insane but instead acted willfully, yet you have to prove he's insane?

How does that work? :waitasec:

No, you have to prove he's not insane. The defense just makes the claim; the prosecution has to disprove it.

I wasn't up on my law either and blinked twice when I saw that. But, in many states, that used to be the case, until, post-Hinckley-verdict, many shifted the burden.

 

[mrsu]

This is actually very common in situations like this. Conflicting witness statements, confusion, plus the fact that looks like he did buy a ticket - go out and come back in. I can see how people, trying to pay attention to trailers or the movie itself wouldn't notice if the phone call person came back in before the shooter. Police are confident that he acted alone, and so am I.

Not trying to be argumentative but just wondering have they said for sure they have him 100% on video purchasing a ticket to the movie? Seems like that has just been assumed up to this point.

 

[Rallihanna]

What am I missing? I thought he had a mask on- where is there a report that he was wearing makeup?

 

[debirlfan]

Two witnesses now say two perps were involved? Shooter is 5'9" ish Holmes is 6'3".

I think the nature of a theater (with each set of seats a few inches higher than the preceding row) might tend to throw off an estimate of height.

 

[debirlfan]

What am I missing? I thought he had a mask on- where is there a report that he was wearing makeup?

No report, just speculation regarding why the police might not be showing his booking photo, and why other prisoners at the jail reported him being brought in with a towel hiding his face.

 

[mrsu]

What am I missing? I thought he had a mask on- where is there a report that he was wearing makeup?

No, there is not. People are assuming that is a reason they might not be showing the mugshot?

 

[Sonya610]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but he TOLD the police the apartment was booby trapped when they apprehended him.

Plus if the timed music was a lure to get someone to the apartment why not leave the door open a crack? Many folks won't open a closed door but if it was already open they very well might push it open more. Better still why not just rig it to go off remotely with a cell phone or some such thing? He invested so much research/time/money in those explosives why not be sure they go boom?

As far as the alarms on movie theater doors, many years ago I worked at a theater and when we have full crowds the ushers would often tell people to exit through those back doors because the lobby was full of people waiting to enter for the next show. People would often decide to use them on their own instead of waiting for the crowds to go through the lobby too. In theaters they aren't just used for emergencies.

 

[mrsu]

I think the nature of a theater (with each set of seats a few inches higher than the preceding row) might tend to throw off an estimate of height.

On 48 HOURS one witness said the person who went to the door seemed to wave to someone, the he saw 2 shadows, one a bit shorter than the other.

 

[scorekeeper]

If someone saw him loading black duffel bags in his car, was his hair colored red? Perhaps he had a hat on?

If he was asking about other apartments, was he expecting his to be blown to pieces?

If he had pointed his gun(s) at LE, would they have not opened fire?

Did he not have time to get in his car and drive away? Was he casually standing there waiting on LE to arrive?

 

[jjenny]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but he TOLD the police the apartment was booby trapped when they apprehended him. Why bother rigging the apartment if he didn't want anyone to go in it?

Plus if the timed music was a lure to get someone to the apartment why not leave the door open a crack? Many folks won't open a closed door but if it was already open they very well might go inside.

As far as the alarms on movie theater doors, many years ago I worked at a theater and when we have full crowds the ushers would often tell people to exit through those back doors because the lobby was full of people waiting to enter for the next show. People would often decide to use them on their own instead of waiting for the crowds to go through the lobby too. In theaters they aren't just used for emergencies.

Why not leave the door open? Because it was set to blow up when somebody opened the door? If the door were already opened what would cause it to blow up?

 

[Rallihanna]

I swore the neighbor downstairs said on Fox at one point that the door was just "slightly" ajar and that's how she knew it was unlocked... but in later interviews she didn't say it again.

 

[wfgodot]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but he TOLD the police the apartment was booby trapped when they apprehended him.

snip

Here's a link for that info:

Holmes told police shortly after he was apprehended in the rear parking lot of the movie theater that he had rigged his apartment, [Chief] Oates said.

cnn.com

 

[scorekeeper]

Why not leave the door open? Because it was set to blow up when somebody opened the door? If the door were already opened what would cause it to blow up?

The trip wire?

 

[jjenny]

I swore the neighbor downstairs said on Fox at one point that the door was just "slightly" ajar and that's how she knew it was unlocked... but in later interviews she didn't say it again.

No, she said it rattled when she knocked on it.