Discuss Max's death here - Thread #1.

[SophieRose]

I recently read somewhere how "Mommy" is the most common thing for anyone, whether child or adult, to say in moments of extreme duress. Sailors who were dying at sea (from starvation or illness) were claimed to have whimpered for their mothers in their last moments. I can't imagine the name of his father's girlfriend's dog being the last word he uttered, even if he could talk (which I don't believe he could have, based on the autopsy report).

Sharon Tate called out for her mother as she was being stabbed.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Or maybe someone wanted it cleaned up before the usual staff got there, if they did have a usual staff. I would assume they had to have had staff for a mansion that size.

Even if I had maid service I wouldn't wait to clean up shards of glass. As the chandelier hit the carpeted/concrete floor the crystals probably shattered in various directions. It is amazing how far glass pieces can go when shattered.

Rebecca sure wouldn't want the glass shards to be embedded in the carpet or tiny pieces on top where if someone stepped in that area it could go through their shoe soles into the bottom of their foot.

So I can understand why the glass was picked up by her sister then. She was 13...not a baby and she probably just got tiny cuts here and there from handling it. Her sister probably told her to just clean them good and put some neosporyn on them and band-aides.

IMO

 

[jjenny]

Perhaps making sure everything is put away and disposed of. Who knows? Maybe someone or more than one person didn't want something seen.

Both police and paramedics have already been on the scene.

 

[SophieRose]

Okay, but why wasn't she taken to the hospital after she cleaned up glass? If her wounds were such that RZ told the dog guy that her daughter (meaning sister, I assume) was also injured, why didn't a doctor see her? Why go shopping then fly the girl home to get treated?

Her sister was hurt on Monday morning and flew home sometime on Tuesday. The dog guy first came around 4ish on Monday. The sister could have seen a doctor prior to that time. Although when I first heard that her sister was injured, the context made it sound like her sister might also be in the hospital and she needed to also see her. But on Monday her sister would have still been at the house. In fact didn't the guy say there were two women there, so the sister must look older or the guy didn't get a good look.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I want to know where the energy and force came from that would be necessary to launch him over and out so far that he came in contact with the chandelier enough that it broke the heavy chain from the ceiling.

 

[SophieRose]

I want to know where the energy and force came from that would be necessary to launch him over and out so far that he came in contact with the chandelier enough that it broke the heavy chain from the ceiling.

I try to figure that out too. The LE diagram has him running from the left side. If you look at the layout of the house he wouldn't have had enought time and room to run that fast. From the master room on the right, there is a longer straight distance and he may have had more time to get a good running start, but I just don't see it.

 

[CDS22]

Even if I had maid service I wouldn't wait to clean up shards of glass. As the chandelier hit the carpeted/concrete floor the crystals probably shattered in various directions. It is amazing how far glass pieces can go when shattered.

Rebecca sure wouldn't want the glass shards to be embedded in the carpet or tiny pieces on top where if someone stepped in that area it could go through their shoe soles into the bottom of their foot.

So I can understand why the glass was picked up by her sister then. She was 13...not a baby and she probably just got tiny cuts here and there from handling it. Her sister probably told her to just clean them good and put some neosporyn on them and band-aides.

IMO

I wonder why Rebecca didn't do the clean up herself? Also, if the cuts were that minor, why did she tell the kennel guy that her "daughter" was also injured and put her on par with a critically injured child?

 

[CocoChanel]

MS's autopsy report:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...DctZGRjMy00ODVkLTk1YWItODAxZjAxMzE5OTVl&hl=en

From the autopsy report linked above, on page 3:

Body Description:
On 7/16/11 at approximately 1605 hours, Max was viewed supine on a hospital gurney with life support measures in place. He was clad in an Adidas shirt and gray shorts. Medical paraphenalia noted on the body consisted of an endotracheal tube, bilateral intravenous (IV) lines in the upper extremities, a Foley catheter, nasogastric tube, and IV access line in his left foot. Abrasions were noted to the back and face.

BBM
Most likely this has no bearing, but I am curious about MS being clad in an Adidas shirt and shorts. I have blessedly never lost a child, but have experienced my son in ICU on life support with no clear diagosis of what illness was making him so sick he could not breath. There were several hours where we did not know if we were going to lose him or not. He miraculously recovered from what was later determined to be toxic shock syndrome. My point is that he was in the typical hospital gown attire during his time in ICU. I wonder about MS being in play clothes. I suppose it could be that once his parents had realized there was no hope, they wanted him to be comfortable in what he loved best to wear as he left this life. I certainly do not pass judgement on what any family would do in such tragic circumstances. I just found it different than what I would expect, and wondered if anyone else had any insight.

 

[CDS22]

I try to figure that out too. The LE diagram has him running from the left side. If you look at the layout of the house he wouldn't have had enought time and room to run that fast. From the master room on the right, there is a longer straight distance and he may have had more time to get a good running start, but I just don't see it.

I agree as well. I also don't buy the planking claim made by the Zahau family attorney because he would have fallen downwards and not up into the chandelier.

 

[jjenny]

I wonder why Rebecca didn't do the clean up herself? Also, if the cuts were that minor, why did she tell the kennel guy that her "daughter" was also injured and put her on par with a critically injured child?

Both of them could have been cleaning but only the sister got injured. And by the way the word "injured" isn't reserved for the critically injured only.

 

[CDS22]

Both of them could have been cleaning but only the sister got injured. And by the way the word "injured" isn't reserved for the critically injured only.

No, but she lumped them in the same sentence. "Her daughter was injured as well". Just seems contradictory to discuss Max's injuries, then say "my daughter was injured as well" while Max is on life support and the sister is flying home after a shopping trip to get first aid from a relative. If they were that inconsequential, why mention them?

 

[CocoChanel]

I agree as well. I also don't buy the planking claim made by the Zahau family attorney because he would have fallen downwards and not up into the chandelier.

Not if he was planking on the uppermost railing. Then he would have started the fall from above the chandelier, no?

 

[CDS22]

Not if he was planking on the uppermost railing. Then he would have started the fall from above the chandelier, no?

I was looking at a picture on the very first thread about this case. It shows that the child would have to have fallen across at a pretty wide angle in order to hit the chandelier. He wouldn't have the momentum to do that if he were planking.

And if he were planking (which I don't buy), who was taking the photo? Another child? An adult?

 

[CocoChanel]

I was looking at a picture on the very first thread about this case. It shows that the child would have to have fallen across at a pretty wide angle in order to hit the chandelier. He wouldn't have the momentum to do that if he were planking.

And if he were planking (which I don't buy), who was taking the photo? Another child? An adult?

It would take someone much more skilled than I in physics and calculations to prove what is or isn't possible regarding tragectory and momentum from that uppermost railing or any other.

If planking was a factor, I don't think it was done to document the feat. I think it would have been careless risky play done impulsively without thought of consequence or recognition.

 

[LaLaw2000]

I have no idea how little Max injured himself, but I just do not buy LE's projection of the accident.

It was a tragic accident regardless of how it happened. No one is actually to blame, IMO.

I hope Max is resting in peace. GB him!

 

[arielilane]

I want to know where the energy and force came from that would be necessary to launch him over and out so far that he came in contact with the chandelier enough that it broke the heavy chain from the ceiling.

Hi Oceanblueeyes,Your question is exactly what I am having the most trouble with. As I think LE did as well, hence, the illustration they presented.

 

[arielilane]

I was looking at a picture on the very first thread about this case. It shows that the child would have to have fallen across at a pretty wide angle in order to hit the chandelier. He wouldn't have the momentum to do that if he were planking.

And if he were planking (which I don't buy), who was taking the photo? Another child? An adult?

Hi CDS, I don't buy the planking, either.

However, "IF" (a big if) MS was planking by himself, he may not have been concerned that a picture wasn't being taken. After all, he was only six years old. jmo

 

[MyBelle]

If the severing was as severe as the report states, he couldn't breathe without assistance immediately at the scene of the accident. That's what the analysis says. If he couldn't breathe, then he couldn't talk. That means he couldn't have a lucid period.

I don't see that the AR says anything was severed. The AR does say that RN was not giving CPR when the officer arrived.

According to the AR, lack of oxygen to the brain is what killed him.

JMO

 

[CDS22]

I don't see that the AR says anything was severed. The AR does say that RN was not giving CPR when the officer arrived.

According to the AR, lack of oxygen to the brain is what killed him.

JMO

There was an analysis that I posted the link to earlier. The person analyzing the autopsy report says that the spinal cord was stretched, making it impossible for Max to breathe. If he couldn't breathe, he couldn't talk (as in saying "Ocean"). I also am disturbed that RZ said she was giving the child CPR (so says the report) but when the officer walked in, she was not.

 

[MyBelle]

I agree as well. I also don't buy the planking claim made by the Zahau family attorney because he would have fallen downwards and not up into the chandelier.

The attorney apparently pulled her planking scenario out of thin air before the AR was released that reports a scooter was found on top of the boy's leg. Now that she knows about the scooter, I doubt she will continue with the planking theory.

I'd like someone to ask the attorney to explain the scooter on Max's leg and why didn't Rebecca start CPR prior to the arrival of the officer.

JMO