Discussions on Formal Sentencing Hearing - Jodi Arias #12

[Frigga]

Wow, lithgow- thanks for that link. I will begin reading one of these with my children over the next few days!

 

[TexMex]

IMO, Travis knew Arias was a stalker and tire-slasher. He knew she was a psychopath but did not know she was capable of murder or at least refused to believe such a notion. I believe he would have taken necessary measures to protect himself if he knew the level of her obsession.

I think what TA knew about JA might have been embarrassing for her if he revealed any of it publicly. But I don't think it was anything that could have ruined her. I mean, she was neither a person of power in her community nor one who was dependent on saving her reputation to save her livelihood. Probably most of what each knew about the other was no different than what most people know about those they date or are more than just acquaintances with. Anything revealed by one about the other would likely have been explained away as an ugly break-up, seen as a "he said, she said" argument.

TA probably had more to lose if JA revealed things about him. He did have standing in his community as a respected business person. He also had standing in his church that could have been affected. I think he knew it could have hurt him and and she knew she could say it in a way that it certainly would have hurt him. I believe she did threaten him with exposure and that's what made him call her the worst thing that ever happened to him. That's just my guess, though, but it is an easy guess to make given what we know about their relationship.

I am not convinced JA feared TA could ruin her reputation. I mean, she may have feared that, but not to a degree of feeling she had to "silence" him. I think she killed him because she had been seething for a long time and could not let go of her anger and it eventually became a malignancy. If all she needed to do was silence him, I think she would have done the deed differently. She might have even sought out someone to do it for her. But barring that, she would at least have murdered with less display...likely would have just killed him quickly as he slept. No fuss, no risk of a bloody palm print left behind. The way she killed him screams of a smoldering, festering anger, a hatred, an evil designed to exact revenge rather than a crime born out of necessity. Jodi Arias brutally murdered Travis Alexander because she is evil and vindictive. Period.

All IMO.

IMO it became a perfect storm in Jodi's mind. The move back to Yreka, the dead end town, dead end job, small room at grandmas, a repossessed Infinity, a blown up BMW and her obsession was 1,000 miles away. She can't drive by his house to see who is there. She can't just drop in with some excuse just to see him. All she can do is stalk him via hacking his email, his Facebook or MySpace. It's not fair. He has a nice home, friends, car, job and he's looking for a wife. The wife will not be her, she is the late night phone sex call girl-not the girl he will share his life and lifestyle with. It's not fair. He is moving on. She can't. Something has to change for her to move on.
Then the May 26 fight. He makes clear that he knows she slashed his tires, twice. She hacked his Facebook He berates her. He admits he is addicted to her sexually and hates himself for not being stronger. She realizes that even if he has sex with her he actually feels disgusted by being with her.

So even if she moves on...she's put in almost two years of investing in being a PPL member, of being a Mormon. She likes the fact that Mormon men are marriage minded. She wants a successful man to marry her. Get her out of grandmas extra room, out of Yreka, away from the Purple Plum. She wants a house, a car. She sees a Mormon man as the quickest way. There are possibilities in PPL as well (hello Ryan). If she established a relationship and it became serious, Travis has a good chance of hearing about it. So, six months of building a relationship (for example) could be ruined by a phone call from Travis "hey dude, be careful...let me tell you just some of what I went through with her"...she doesn't have that kind of time.
It becomes clear to her. For Jodi to move on, Travis has to die. That way he cannot ruin her future love life and she gets rid of her obsession. She won't have to check up on him anymore. She won't feel bad anymore. And he won't be calling her any more names. She won't be the girl good enough to call at 2am for phone sex but not good enough to marry anymore.
So she steals grandpas gun and plans a road trip...

 

[Susza]

I think he was trying to goad her? Possibly he already understood her personality would never stand for someone else to have control over any scenario. I wonder if part of Detective training includes mini psych evaluations or guides to dealing with certain personalities? I'd love to have a "cheat sheet" of things to prepare me for how to deal with some people. I read books and find lots of articles online, but a concise little guidebook would be awesome! *sigh* I STILL have a lot to learn about not letting my emotions override my brain and it must be sooooo hard for LE in that regard until they get more experience. ullhair:

Does anyone know if there's such a thing as a book of Hints, Tips and Tricks for Dealing with Bad People? :drumroll:

BBM - I agree. Actually, what impressed me SO MUCH in DF's way of leading the interrogation was that he seemed to have totally perceived JA's personnality at such an early stage of the investigation.

And: Yes, such a guidebook would be very interesting.

And: Thank you krkrjx and ElleElle for your explanations.

 

[lithgow1]

Wow, lithgow- thanks for that link. I will begin reading one of these with my children over the next few days!

They are not really kid's stories though older kids might like them - just choose carefully! I read some of them to my early teenage niece and nephew and they liked them. and you can always edit as you read - they might like Tobermory, the cat one, though the ending maybe not so much. I'd suggest pre-reading as I'd hate to be responsible for tears before bedtime!

 

[Meemaw12]

http://wtvr.com/2015/04/15/woman-in-online-relationship-beats-man-with-bat-at-first-meeting/

What is this world coming too???

This is O/T


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[lithgow1]

IMO it became a perfect storm in Jodi's mind. The move back to Yreka, the dead end town, dead end job, small room at grandmas, a repossessed Infinity, a blown up BMW and her obsession was 1,000 miles away. She can't drive by his house to see who is there. She can't just drop in with some excuse just to see him. All she can do is stalk him via hacking his email, his Facebook or MySpace. It's not fair. He has a nice home, friends, car, job and he's looking for a wife. The wife will not be her, she is the late night phone sex call girl-not the girl he will share his life and lifestyle with. It's not fair. He is moving on. She can't. Something has to change for her to move on.
Then the May 26 fight. He makes clear that he knows she slashed his tires, twice. She hacked his Facebook He berates her. He admits he is addicted to her sexually and hates himself for not being stronger. She realizes that even if he has sex with her he actually feels disgusted by being with her.

So even if she moves on...she's put in almost two years of investing in being a PPL member, of being a Mormon. She likes the fact that Mormon men are marriage minded. She wants a successful man to marry her. Get her out of grandmas extra room, out of Yreka, away from the Purple Plum. She wants a house, a car. She sees a Mormon man as the quickest way. There are possibilities in PPL as well (hello Ryan). If she established a relationship and it became serious, Travis has a good chance of hearing about it. So, six months of building a relationship (for example) could be ruined by a phone call from Travis "hey dude, be careful...let me tell you just some of what I went through with her"...she doesn't have that kind of time.
It becomes clear to her. For Jodi to move on, Travis has to die. That way he cannot ruin her future love life and she gets rid of her obsession. She won't have to check up on him anymore. She won't feel bad anymore. And he won't be calling her any more names. She won't be the girl good enough to call at 2am for phone sex but not good enough to marry anymore.
So she steals grandpas gun and plans a road trip...

That totally works IMO. Thanks for solving the mystery!

 

[ZoeyW]

I'm glad they posted this pre-emptive strike on their website re: the troll reviews they anticipate.

NOTE ABOUT REVIEWS OF THIS BOOK: This book includes information about the Jodi Arias murder trial, which was one of the highest profile murder trials in recent history. As a result of the media attention this case garnered, millions around the world have come to know Travis Alexander and Jodi Arias, the woman who viciously murdered him. Though the public came out overwhelmingly in support of Travis Alexander, his friends and family, there is a very small, but vocal group, who, for whatever reason, are supportive of a convicted murderer. Some of her supporters have promised to give this book negative reviews even before it was released. It is expected they will come out in mass to do so. Please consider this when reading the reviews of this book.

I will for SURE go on and leave a good review and ask every friend I have to do the same. Evil will NOT win.

I loved reading your recent blog and cannot wait for your book!! YOU have a beautiful soul!!!

Kathy Monkman ‏@katiecoolady Apr 15
My final thoughts on attending the #jodiarias sentencing Monday. http://twoinnocents.com/2015/04/15/final-chapter-thank-you-travis-alexander/ … Rest in Peace dear Travis.

 

[ZoeyW]

I think he was trying to goad her? Possibly he already understood her personality would never stand for someone else to have control over any scenario. I wonder if part of Detective training includes mini psych evaluations or guides to dealing with certain personalities? I'd love to have a "cheat sheet" of things to prepare me for how to deal with some people. I read books and find lots of articles online, but a concise little guidebook would be awesome! *sigh* I STILL have a lot to learn about not letting my emotions override my brain and it must be sooooo hard for LE in that regard until they get more experience. ullhair:

Does anyone know if there's such a thing as a book of Hints, Tips and Tricks for Dealing with Bad People? :drumroll:

Here you go friend. This is the "Reid techniques" Kirk kept hammering Detective Flores about http://www.reid.com/educational_info/critictechnique.html

Less formal,here is a wiki example http://www.wikihow.com/Interview-a-Suspect

Regarding Jodi Arias' being interrogated. It is not often shown, but Detective Flores did read her the Miranda Warning. She, at no time, on either day , asked for a lawyer. He was well within normal rules to lie to her. It was genius how much he got out of her. That Ninja story is what reminded me of the gal in Saki's Open Window. She just created it on the fly.

Jodi Arias police interrogation thanks to David Lohr
Miranda Warning
https://youtu.be/vE_Ue5rF8QM?t=6m37s

Considering she worked part time and went to many seminars on selling the legal insurance, it is SHOCKING how she did not have it drilled into her head, if she were ever to get arrested, to call her lawyer and SAY NOTHING. It was as poor an advertisement for their services as Gus Searcy telling the judge he did not have a lawyer available to call "At this time of day". It was office hours by anyone's standards https://youtu.be/7RhNXaJjISI I laughed till I cried at that one. I wrote in my notes that day same thing I wrote a hundred times in this trial....You just can't make this stuff up! I was joking with a friend saying this guy is straight out of central casting. She said put your pop far away from your computer for this one. His own daughter had to sue him, and.....wait for it......they decided the best place to settle their legal dispute was on Judge Judy. https://youtu.be/Y0ehd7zVwvQ

Here Jodi Arias admits she had two back to back dates with other men from PrePaidLegal , John and Abe . She was "shopping" for man, alright. https://youtu.be/gglhBzgDly8 She admits Travis told her "Go date other people".

 

[G&AMom]

IMO it became a perfect storm in Jodi's mind. The move back to Yreka, the dead end town, dead end job, small room at grandmas, a repossessed Infinity, a blown up BMW and her obsession was 1,000 miles away. She can't drive by his house to see who is there. She can't just drop in with some excuse just to see him. All she can do is stalk him via hacking his email, his Facebook or MySpace. It's not fair. He has a nice home, friends, car, job and he's looking for a wife. The wife will not be her, she is the late night phone sex call girl-not the girl he will share his life and lifestyle with. It's not fair. He is moving on. She can't. Something has to change for her to move on.
Then the May 26 fight. He makes clear that he knows she slashed his tires, twice. She hacked his Facebook He berates her. He admits he is addicted to her sexually and hates himself for not being stronger. She realizes that even if he has sex with her he actually feels disgusted by being with her.

So even if she moves on...she's put in almost two years of investing in being a PPL member, of being a Mormon. She likes the fact that Mormon men are marriage minded. She wants a successful man to marry her. Get her out of grandmas extra room, out of Yreka, away from the Purple Plum. She wants a house, a car. She sees a Mormon man as the quickest way. There are possibilities in PPL as well (hello Ryan). If she established a relationship and it became serious, Travis has a good chance of hearing about it. So, six months of building a relationship (for example) could be ruined by a phone call from Travis "hey dude, be careful...let me tell you just some of what I went through with her"...she doesn't have that kind of time.
It becomes clear to her. For Jodi to move on, Travis has to die. That way he cannot ruin her future love life and she gets rid of her obsession. She won't have to check up on him anymore. She won't feel bad anymore. And he won't be calling her any more names. She won't be the girl good enough to call at 2am for phone sex but not good enough to marry anymore.
So she steals grandpas gun and plans a road trip...

This is very good. I would only add one thing: that she invested four years of her life in Darryl Brewer, only to end up nothing. LESS than nothing. On top of all the "reasons" you cited for her killing him, there was no way she was going to let some guy brush her aside ever again.

Sent from my KFSOWI using Tapatalk

 

[Newbsleuth]

Within the 1st 10 minutes of so of listening to her initial interrogation tape, my impression was "This woman is full of sXXt." The way she spoke, the tone of her voice, how she went on and on --she was really trying; way too hard; and it showed. I think we've all touched on similar people sometime in life, and we instinctively just know.

 

[TexMex]

This is very good. I would only add one thing: that she invested four years of her life in Darryl Brewer, only to end up nothing. LESS than nothing. On top of all the "reasons" you cited for her killing him, there was no way she was going to let some guy brush her aside ever again.

Sent from my KFSOWI using Tapatalk

Absolutely. IMO the time element played a big part. Four years with DB and she was pushed aside.
Now another two years. In her mind she had devoted herself to PPL for and with Travis, the personal development meetings and conventions. She probably quit several jobs to travel with Travis. Plus she converted to Mormonism for Travis. All to be pushed aside?
She spent almost her entire 20's in relationships that failed. She cannot see that any of it might be her fault. All she knows is she's almost 28 and is going to have to start from scratch.
How dare Travis reject her after she'd converted to his religion and invested all of her time and energy to please him. She was angry at him. She also wasn't going to risk her future relationship target to be influenced by Travis reporting the things she had done. There wasn't time for that. If he was dead, then in her mind she could move on. Free of obsession and fear.

 

[GigiG]

BBM - I agree. Actually, what impressed me SO MUCH in DF's way of leading the interrogation was that he seemed to have totally perceived JA's personnality at such an early stage of the investigation.

And: Yes, such a guidebook would be very interesting.

And: Thank you krxkrx and ElleElle for your explanations.

Not to take anything away from Flores' brilliant interrogation, but it's important to remember that from the earliest minutes of the case (the 911 call), police were given a head's up that Arias was creepy and crazy. Just imagine how many people they interviewed, and from whom they got additional/corroborating information. Flores likely had a pretty clear picture her sociopathy before they ever spoke.

 

[krkrjx]

Not to take anything away from Flores' brilliant interrogation, but it's important to remember that from the earliest minutes of the case (the 911 call), police were given a head's up that Arias was creepy and crazy. Just imagine how many people they interviewed, and from whom they got additional/corroborating information. Flores likely had a pretty clear picture her sociopathy before they ever spoke.

I think Flores knew before he ever spoke with her the first time. But I do not think he knew the degree of her sociopathy. I don't think anyone knew what an over-the-top psycho Arias was until the interrogation was well underway. And even then she kept showing more and more of her own special flavor or depravity. It never stopped, either! It was evident in her "let's make a deal" document. Then in her trial. And her second trial. All the tweets in between. And at her sentencing. She just does not let up, ever. And what's weird is she thinks the more she talks, the more believable she sounds. Always the manipulator!

 

[GigiG]

Absolutely. IMO the time element played a big part. Four years with DB and she was pushed aside.
Now another two years. In her mind she had devoted herself to PPL for and with Travis, the personal development meetings and conventions. She probably quit several jobs to travel with Travis. Plus she converted to Mormonism for Travis. All to be pushed aside?
She spent almost her entire 20's in relationships that failed. She cannot see that any of it might be her fault. All she knows is she's almost 28 and is going to have to start from scratch.
How dare Travis reject her after she'd converted to his religion and invested all of her time and energy to please him. She was angry at him. She also wasn't going to risk her future relationship target to be influenced by Travis reporting the things she had done.

Most people at some point have had relationships that ended badly and have had to deal with rejection. For most of us, those are times when we rely on our close friends for support; that person who says the obligatory: "Forget about him, he wasn't good enough for you anyway."

It appears that during her entire adult life, Jodi didn't really have friends (just boyfriends). It makes me wonder if she would have been better able to cope had she had that kind of support. Of course that begs the question as to why she never had close friends, which takes us back to the borderline personality disorder. Each of her boyfriends put up with her for whatever duration their relationship lasted, but they were getting the benefit of her sexual prowess, which she clearly honed and saw as an asset. What did she have to offer other women? Her narcissism alone would turn off most of them. And with her jealous tendencies, she probably thought of other women as nothing more than competition.

After seven years in Estrella being surrounded by women, she's come to see that they can be used to her benefit, so her manipulations continue, but with different targets (e.g. the "Free Jodi" demonstration). And in court, the way she played up to MDLR and Willmott while dissing Nurmi, further shows this transformation. Gotta hand it to her, she is nothing if not adaptable.

 

[ZoeyW]

Christine has a new blog up. It is spot on! Christine Beswick ‏@bychristinebswk

http://www.examiner.com/article/tra...as-you-tried-to-murder-me-from-the-inside-out

 

[Nancy_Drew]

Someone recently mentioned how manly they think JA is and that they wondered if her testosterone levels were high.

I looked into that, and interestingly I learned that sociopaths and psychopaths do have high levels of testosterone.

http://www.lovefraud.com/2013/05/20/oxytocin-trust-fall-psychopaths/

 

[LinasK]

You have to factor in that Ms. Einstein thought her stealth trip was a perfect alibi and she just 'knew' she would be able to talk her way out of any one believing she could have possibly had anything to do with his murder. She had no clue what all she left behind and with her delusional brain she has no concept of how stupid her story/stories sound. In her mind she wasn't risking anything because she never thought she'd be caught.

Yup! Disguised hair color, nondescriptive car (except for the upside down license plates) and no gas receipts for Arizona means she was never there- only she was, and left a trail of other evidence! Duh Jodi!:doh:ut em up:

 

[MissHaley]

Here is an interesting article about last photographs taken by killers. Travis is listed.
http://swordandscale.com/haunting-photographs-taken-by-murderers/

 

[GigiG]

Someone recently mentioned how manly they think JA is and that they wondered if her testosterone levels were high.

I looked into that, and interestingly I learned that sociopaths and psychopaths do have high levels of testosterone.

http://www.lovefraud.com/2013/05/20/oxytocin-trust-fall-psychopaths/

Wow, what an interesting article. Thanks!

 

[Caylee Advocate]

IMO it became a perfect storm in Jodi's mind. The move back to Yreka, the dead end town, dead end job, small room at grandmas, a repossessed Infinity, a blown up BMW and her obsession was 1,000 miles away. She can't drive by his house to see who is there. She can't just drop in with some excuse just to see him. All she can do is stalk him via hacking his email, his Facebook or MySpace. It's not fair. He has a nice home, friends, car, job and he's looking for a wife. The wife will not be her, she is the late night phone sex call girl-not the girl he will share his life and lifestyle with. It's not fair. He is moving on. She can't. Something has to change for her to move on.
Then the May 26 fight. He makes clear that he knows she slashed his tires, twice. She hacked his Facebook He berates her. He admits he is addicted to her sexually and hates himself for not being stronger. She realizes that even if he has sex with her he actually feels disgusted by being with her.

So even if she moves on...she's put in almost two years of investing in being a PPL member, of being a Mormon. She likes the fact that Mormon men are marriage minded. She wants a successful man to marry her. Get her out of grandmas extra room, out of Yreka, away from the Purple Plum. She wants a house, a car. She sees a Mormon man as the quickest way. There are possibilities in PPL as well (hello Ryan). If she established a relationship and it became serious, Travis has a good chance of hearing about it. So, six months of building a relationship (for example) could be ruined by a phone call from Travis "hey dude, be careful...let me tell you just some of what I went through with her"...she doesn't have that kind of time.
It becomes clear to her. For Jodi to move on, Travis has to die. That way he cannot ruin her future love life and she gets rid of her obsession. She won't have to check up on him anymore. She won't feel bad anymore. And he won't be calling her any more names. She won't be the girl good enough to call at 2am for phone sex but not good enough to marry anymore.
So she steals grandpas gun and plans a road trip...

WOWZA and BAM!!!!!!! Nailed it. Good post Tex.