Dog Training: Animal Experts Debunk the Alpha-Dog Myth

[Dark Knight]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20100730/hl_time/08599200725000;_ylthttp://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20100730/hl_time/08599200725000

A very good article!

 

[t93]

Love to hear what Caesar Milan says about this.:angel:


Couldn't get the link to work, just commenting on the info in the title.

 

[Kat]

Darn I got a page not found when I clicked on the link. I really wanted to read that article too.

 

[RLynne]

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2007250,00.html?xid=rss-mostpopular

I think this is the article?

 

[Kat]

Good article. I use positive reinforcement only with puppies and older dogs I've had in my care or owned.

It has never failed me. I have never attempted to use punative discipline with an animal because IMHO it just won't work.

I don't know about all the "dog psychology" that is being talked about in that article. I just know that if you use positive reinforcement, praise when they do something right, redirection when they do something wrong with a firm but soft "no" they usually always respond.

I'll probably get taken to task for this next statement LOL because kids are not animals but that is how I approach and have approached raising my own children and dealing with other people's children in the past.

I don't have to physically intimidate an animal, or strike, hit or beat an animal to get acceptable behavior out of it. Just like I don't have to strike, hit or beat a child.

But that's JMHO. Loved the article DK thanks!

 

[Dark Knight]

Try this link, instead:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20100730/hl_time/08599200725000

 

[Linda7NJ]

Good article. I use positive reinforcement only with puppies and older dogs I've had in my care or owned.

It has never failed me. I have never attempted to use punative discipline with an animal because IMHO it just won't work.

I don't know about all the "dog psychology" that is being talked about in that article. I just know that if you use positive reinforcement, praise when they do something right, redirection when they do something wrong with a firm but soft "no" they usually always respond.

I'll probably get taken to task for this next statement LOL because kids are not animals but that is how I approach and have approached raising my own children and dealing with other people's children in the past.

I don't have to physically intimidate an animal, or strike, hit or beat an animal to get acceptable behavior out of it. Just like I don't have to strike, hit or beat a child.

But that's JMHO. Loved the article DK thanks!

Agree with you!

Personally, I think dog training is very simular to child training.

Honestly, I have been kicked off and banned on prenting boards for sayying so! I STILL say, if I can teach a dog, with the brain the size of a walnut, to sit & stay, surely a two year old can be expected to! I say this when parents would whine their little darling won't sit & stay in "time out." rofl. I would ask them if they though my dog was smarter than their two year old. You want to see parents get all huffy? Just say that!

 

[reportertype]

Agree with you!

Personally, I think dog training is very simular to child training.

Honestly, I have been kicked off and banned on prenting boards for sayying so! I STILL say, if I can teach a dog, with the brain the size of a walnut, to sit, surely a two year old can be expected to! I say this when parents would whine their little darling won't sit & stay in "time out." rofl. I would ask them if they though my dog was smarter than their two year old. You want to see parents get all huffy? Just say that!

LOL! I've wondered how similar it could be. I'm retraining my dogs right now to walk properly, sit before getting food, treats, etc.

 

[Mr. E]

Thanks for the interesting article! I love Victoria Stillwell, and it was from watching her show that we taught our dog to sit, speak, lay down, and stay away from the door when the doorbell rings.

I've never seen Cesar Millan, but he was on the funniest episodes of South Park I've ever seen. I don't know how he is in real life, but he was hilarious when he controlled Eric Cartman on that cartoon.

 

[QueenD]

I use on water spray bottle on my yorkies when they want listen, my female barks at me and comes back for more. She don't care! My male will listen.

 

[Kat]

LOL QueenD, she's a rascal coming back for more hehe. Made me giggle.

 

[Tuffy]

Agree with you!

Personally, I think dog training is very simular to child training.

Honestly, I have been kicked off and banned on prenting boards for sayying so! I STILL say, if I can teach a dog, with the brain the size of a walnut, to sit, surely a two year old can be expected to! I say this when parents would whine their little darling won't sit & stay in "time out." rofl. I would ask them if they though my dog was smarter than their two year old. You want to see parents get all huffy? Just say that!

I will agree with both of you too. I have a very stubborn dog (hound) but positive reinforcement and redirection worked for me. That and consistency. My dog may be stubborn, but he learns quick.

Also my little "darling" wouldn't stay in time out. My two year old daughter was more stubborn than the dog. I had to physically put her on my lap to keep her in time out.

Anyway, kid or dogs, I don't believe in hitting either of them to train them.

 

[Jack]

Being the leader of the pack does not involve hitting. I really hate it when these groups come out and use false information to try to debunk something they don't like. IMO, there is more than one right way to do most things, animal training included. I am dominant over my dog. If I weren't he would run the house, and thats my job. I've never hit him. One thing I've learned from being around people is that most of them think their way is the only right way.

 

[reportertype]

I'm using info I got that I think is based on Milan's. Human = alpha. Jack is right; it never says to hit them or anything like that. Just tell them no and correct them, make them earn food, treats, etc.

All I've changed is we started doing a "pack walk," and they are earning walks, food, water. It seems to be working!

 

[cuppy199]

Thanks for the link. I like both Victoria and Cesar they both are great trainers. But I have to say that there is a reason Cesar is called the dog whisper. He is amazing with canines period. As Cesar says exercise, then discipline, and finally, affection. As the human pack leader, you must set rules, boundaries, and limitations and always project a calm-assertive energy.

 

[Dark Knight]

I'm using info I got that I think is based on Milan's. Human = alpha. Jack is right; it never says to hit them or anything like that. Just tell them no and correct them, make them earn food, treats, etc.

All I've changed is we started doing a "pack walk," and they are earning walks, food, water. It seems to be working!

They have to "earn" basic necessities such as food and water? There is something wrong, there.

Thanks for the link. I like both Victoria and Cesar they both are great trainers. But I have to say that there is a reason Cesar is called the dog whisper. He is amazing with canines period. As Cesar says exercise, then discipline, and finally, affection. As the human pack leader, you must set rules, boundaries, and limitations and always project a calm-assertive energy.

Milan believes in working the dog to death, especially problem dogs, until they are too exhausted to be disobedient. He has talked about the tread mill discipline numerous times, and was recently sued by the owner of a dog who was injured from being worked too hard. Milan also says the same thing about his kids. When they misbehave, they need to run around the block several times until they are too tired to misbehave. He is no "whisperer" he is borderline abusive. There are Facebook pages protesting his methods.

 

[Mr. E]

I use on water spray bottle on my yorkies when they want listen, my female barks at me and comes back for more. She don't care! My male will listen.

That's funny! Our big dog loves to be sprayed, so that kind of thing has never worked (we used a can of pennies at first to train him to stay away from the door, then our sharp voice and a hand signal). We think our big dog is part Portuguese water dog, so maybe that's why he likes the spray bottle. He like playing with the hose, too.

 

[PorcineGranny]

Dark Knight, hi and glad to see you. In your life do people see you and feed you and give you something to drink just because you exist? Yes, dogs have always earned their food and water etc. They do this by protecting their family or whatever they have been taught to do.
Dogs as man's best friend have earned their right to their position by past acts. The only thing that doesn't earn it's food and water, shelter, etc are our children, who by their being are entitled to such from their parents.

I don't use punishment to handle my dogs, but that said, my dogs don't always obey. I think it depends somewhat on the breed, but thats just an opinion.

 

[tehcloser]

*alpha roll, *snort.

 

[Dark Knight]

Dark Knight, hi and glad to see you. In your life do people see you and feed you and give you something to drink just because you exist? Yes, dogs have always earned their food and water etc. They do this by protecting their family or whatever they have been taught to do.
Dogs as man's best friend have earned their right to their position by past acts. The only thing that doesn't earn it's food and water, shelter, etc are our children, who by their being are entitled to such from their parents.

I don't use punishment to handle my dogs, but that said, my dogs don't always obey. I think it depends somewhat on the breed, but thats just an opinion.

Our pets, who rely on us for their food and water, since we can withhold it from them, deserve it just for being part of our family, as well. When they can go to the fridge and make dinner or turn on the faucet for a drink, then we'll talk, otherwise, it's our responsibility (and the law) to make sure they always have those things.