Dr. Lee's Book

[Toltec]

I personally did not see the stun gun marks but my son did. I will ask him when he calls next time.

I do not believe for one second that JonBenet was stunned...

If JonBenet were stunned she would have screamed. You do not need to stun a child, hit her on the head and garotte her to silence her. She did not weigh 300 pounds for crying out loud!

 

[sissi]

I guess John didn't loosen it while trying to remove the wrist ties?

 

[K777angel]

I guess John didn't loosen it while trying to remove the wrist ties?

No, otherwise it would not have remained on her wrist.

Either he slid the other one off or it was never on in the first place. Can't remember what he said.

Her arms were raised stiff above her head. Dr. Lee called her body "posed." I found this interesting.
If she were struggling just before she died - the position she died in would not have been with both arms raised above her head.

 

[BrotherMoon]

Her arms were raised stiff above her head. Dr. Lee called her body "posed." I found this interesting.
If she were struggling just before she died - the position she died in would not have been with both arms raised above her head.

Posed is right, but for whom? Why would raised arms convince police of a kidnapping by a foreign faction?

I say the posing was for the perp. Also, it is logical to consider the ligature on the neck had the same purpose as the ligatures on the wrists; to pose a body part. And since there is evidence of an initial attack to the neck the final position of the garrote may have more to do with posing than with strangulation.

 

[K777angel]

Posed is right, but for whom? Why would raised arms convince police of a kidnapping by a foreign faction?

I say the posing was for the perp. Also, it is logical to consider the ligature on the neck had the same purpose as the ligatures on the wrists; to pose a body part. And since there is evidence of an initial attack to the neck the final position of the garrote may have more to do with posing than with strangulation.

The cord on the neck did have the same purpose as the cord on the wrists.
The same purpose as the duct tape on the mouth. (And remember - we ONLY have John Ramseys word on that. No one else ever saw that duct tape on her mouth....) The purpose being to STAGE the scene to make the cause of her death seem to be something it was not in order to HIDE the real cause of her death in stager's mind: The head blow.

The police do not know what John Ramsey was doing for an hour that morning of the 26th around 10:00am down in the basement. No one but John Ramsey does. That is an awfully LONG time to be messing around down there without a "task" to be involved in.
It is very possible that John Ramsey actually found JonBenet during this time period. He did in fact state (or slip?) one time saying how he found her "around 11:00 am that morning." I believe this was to John Andrew.
The police reports note that when he DID come back upstairs he was visibly shaken and I believe poured himself a large vodka.
When Det. Arndt asked the group of men sitting there who they thought may have written that note and been involved - everyone had an opinion except the FATHER of the missing child, John Ramsey. She found this very odd.
We may never know just what John Ramsey may have done that morning down there.
Did he, as some speculate, at that point - piece all of his suspicions together and realize that his wife and maybe son were involved and then hid his suspicions going along with it to protect them?
If John was not directly involved up to that point - he would then not be in that category oft cited that those who kill someone do not want to be the one to FIND the body.
This is the $64,000 question: At what point did John Ramsey learn that his family was involved???

 

[BrotherMoon]

Apart from what drove Patsy to kill her daughter, the most interesting aspect of this case is the rumor that John found the body at 11 a.m., then chose to be quiet for two hours until asked to search the house again.

I think he found the body, then went into an extreme introverted mode of thinking. When asked to search the house again he went to the body, faked a discovery and WITHOUT CONSULTING HIS WIFE adopted the victim status.

I think he has been running a parallel course with his wife ever since without being involved with the original crime, the staging or the writing of the note. And more importantly without ever having a "come to Jesus" discussion with Patsy about what she did.

I think John was in a netherworld of indecision from the time he started reading the note. That state of mind deepened when he found the body. His hand was forced when the search was asked for, and he took things into his own hands rather than let Fleet or someone else find what he had already found.

I think John had nothing to do with the killing, staging or note writing.

 

[BrotherMoon]

The accidental head blow theory does not fit with the content of the note; the Biblical references and Patsy's own repeated comments on and use of The Psalms and her belief of a special connection to a supernatural being.

The strange content of DOI confirms, for me, the connection between Patsy's fantasy life, the murder and the content of the note.

 

[K777angel]

Apart from what drove Patsy to kill her daughter, the most interesting aspect of this case is the rumor that John found the body at 11 a.m., then chose to be quiet for two hours until asked to search the house again.

I think he found the body, then went into an extreme introverted mode of thinking. When asked to search the house again he went to the body, faked a discovery and WITHOUT CONSULTING HIS WIFE adopted the victim status.

I think he has been running a parallel course with his wife ever since without being involved with the original crime, the staging or the writing of the note. And more importantly without ever having a "come to Jesus" discussion with Patsy about what she did.

I think John was in a netherworld of indecision from the time he started reading the note. That state of mind deepened when he found the body. His hand was forced when the search was asked for, and he took things into his own hands rather than let Fleet or someone else find what he already found.

I think John had nothing to do with the killing, staging or note writing.

Some interesting thoughts there. Yes, why did John choose to wait for 2 hours before "finding" her (again perhaps?). I think that very possibly it was just a sheer stroke of luck for him that Det. Arndt made suggestion to go and "search" the house. I mean, he must have about messed his pants he was so relieved! Ah - a way out! I don't have to mosey on down on my own (again) and look suspicious - a COP told me to do it!
The fact that he played dumb asking Arndt "is she dead" - when she was stiff from full rigor mortis and had an "odor of decay" about her even - to me says volumes.

 

[TressaRing28]

Some interesting thoughts there. Yes, why did John choose to wait for 2 hours before "finding" her (again perhaps?). I think that very possibly it was just a sheer stroke of luck for him that Det. Arndt made suggestion to go and "search" the house. I mean, he must have about messed his pants he was so relieved! Ah - a way out! I don't have to mosey on down on my own (again) and look suspicious - a COP told me to do it!
The fact that he played dumb asking Arndt "is she dead" - when she was stiff from full rigor mortis and had an "odor of decay" about her even - to me says volumes.

Steve Thomas said in his Book that John went out to meet Melinda , John Andrew, and Stuart(Melinda's Boyfriend). Thomas stated that John told the children, Jon Benet was dead and later Thomas reported that Stuart during a phone conversation with him stated " John said that he found JB at 11 AM".

Thus, giving Thomas the impression that John didn't Kill JB, but John had indeed found her earlier, and that Patsy was involved. The early morning officer said that Patsy was looking through Splayed fingers. Arnt said in PMPT that John was shaking his knee's and was nervous and at about 1 PM , she ask him to look for anything that might be missing. In DOI John stated , Fleet was standing close by, so he ask him to go look with him. John stated that he thought of going bottom to top of the house thus,he starting in basement.

I my opinion John did not Kill JB, but maybe he found the body at 11AM. I don't think JB was in the windowless room, but in the broileroom room behind the freezer.Then John moved her to wineceller. The only thing curious about this theory is that John should have had the smell of decay on his body maybe he went to bathroom and washed off. Also could answer the question of why he held JB in an upright position as he ran up stairs and why he ran to wineceller and to JB after Fleet had already said he opened the windowless room early that morning and didn't see JB. Huh?

What you think K777?

I hate to think Patsy was involved but, I feel she did write the RN...

If Patsy was the Killer it was an accident.

Not from a mental condition as thought by some members on this forum.

But why would Patsy have staged such a elabarate crime scene ?

A very sick crime scene, Its hard to put her in a catagory with a sexually henious act , I guess she might have thought ,ok JB is dead and I can't let anyone know I hurt her, not even John. I must stage this to look like a sexual pervert came into my home and killed my baby... I must write a RN.

This is pure speculation on my part but, I have to checkout all possibilties.

Tressa

 

[cherub]

I want to order it ,but do not see here the title name.Thanks

 

[BrotherMoon]

I want to order it ,but do not see here the title name.Thanks

I think the title is, Don't Bother.

Or maybe it's, Baby Needs New Shoes.

Or, Sucker.

Or, Rice Already Cooked, But Who Eats Rice, I Eat Plime Lib So Buy My Book.

Or, I'm a Wanna Be Michael Moore.

Or, Science Nerds Revenge!

Or, Hey! Don't Leave Chocolatey Finger Prints On My Pulp Fiction Book While You're Spending 1.5 Minutes In Barnes And Noble Reading This Stupid Chapter, Go Finish Your Tall, Bold With Room and Two Shots Of Vanilla With Your Mint Wafer On Your Own Dime Thank You Very Much.

I'm pretty sure that last one is it.

You are welcome.

Or as TressaRing28 would type "Your welcome".

 

[TressaRing28]

You are welcome.

Or as TressaRing28 would type "Your welcome".

BM go self Medicate yourself ... You know its an art. :loser:

 

[cherub]

:liar: :doh: :crazy: :laugh: :blowkiss: love brothermoon
anyhoo i wanted to have library order it to my branch and bm was so darned helpful .....thanks buddy :truce:

 

[twizzler333]

Is it improper to call someone a idiot on this forum? :waitasec:

 

[TressaRing28]

Is it improper to call someone a idiot on this forum? :waitasec:[/QUOTE

Brother Moon called me an idiot in a private message. He also said that I should go hang myself on a cross. I reported this to Tricia but, haven't heard a word back. I don't think she has checked her PM's lately.


I PMed Brother Moon and told him not to PM me again , that I had sent the PM he wrote to Tricia. Brother Moon sent me one back calling me a SNITCH . So it appears for some--- justice is at question on the JB forum .

I hope that Tricia will get back to me about this matter Twizzler. If not Brother Moon will continue to bad mouth us all, as he pleases. Soon I hope BM will get his just desserts.
Thanks, Tressa

 

[KATKAT19691]

BM go self Medicate yourself ... You know its an art. :loser:

He's BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!:croc:

 

[twizzler333]

We could drive him absolutely nuts and spell EVERYTHING wrong on purpose! He cannot stand to have words incorrectly speeled on hear! LOL

 

[Sally]

What reason would John have for leaving JB on his first "discovery" if, indeed he found her at 11:00? Even if he realized or suspected that Patsy may be involved what was gained by leaving her there?

 

[BrotherMoon]

What reason would John have for leaving JB on his first "discovery" if, indeed he found her at 11:00? Even if he realized or suspected that Patsy may be involved what was gained by leaving her there?

Control, self-determination.

 

[TressaRing28]

What reason would John have for leaving JB on his first "discovery" if, indeed he found her at 11:00? Even if he realized or suspected that Patsy may be involved what was gained by leaving her there?

Sally maybe he didn't think it was Patsy that killed Jon Benet---Maybe he thought it was Burke? You just can't tell whats going on in a person's mind when they discover such a henious crime.