The nurse had a fever using the forehead reader but not with an oral thermometer. I've personally found a reliable thermometer is hard to find. I've been told wrist thermometers aren't reliable and that many types have variable reliability. I had to buy 3 oral thermometers before I found an accurate one. Before I found a good one I only trusted my old mercury one. I only threw it out after a long search for a new one.
Ebola outbreak - general thread #8
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The nurse had a fever using the forehead reader but not with an oral thermometer. I've personally found a reliable thermometer is hard to find. I've been told wrist thermometers aren't reliable and that many types have variable reliability. I had to buy 3 oral thermometers before I found an accurate one. Before I found a good one I only trusted my old mercury one. I only threw it out after a long search for a new one.
Bonnie2487
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She said she was in a tent and I will believe her before I believe anyone else. Too many conflicting stories.
Well look what time of year it is. What are we doing Nov 4th. That's what it's about.
1 The "temp check" you mentioned was on the arrival in the US. That did NOT happen with Duncan, as I said. Nor were the arrivals funneled through the 5 screening centers.
...Although, even a US temp check wouldn't have detected he had been infected. Nor would an ebola test, for that matter.
2 It is true that he (appeared to have) lied, and that dishonesty can skew some of the screening.
...But the current twice-daily monitoring, for 21 days, no matter what, would have caused a completely different treatment process for him if he had entered now with the same infection and dishonesty.
3 Yes, the idea of simply shutting the doors for 21 days is the safest. But even if they haven't taken the step of shutting the doors for 21 days no matter what, please don't pretend that things haven't changed considerably (and for the better) since Duncan.
Which is why they take your temp twice a day for 21 days thereafter, and monitor you for any onset of symptoms. Let's don't act like the airport temp check is the ONLY or the last monitoring that happens.
Every single one of them? Sorry, just not buying that.
We are all just speculating. Not one of us really knows what happened in that apartment. But people walking around a person as sick as we was and clueless about the dangers of ebola generally don't live to tell about it.
But if you are allowed to run around freely during this monitoring, what good does it do? The good doctor was out in public, using public transportation, and bowling, the night before he got his fever.
When did he become infectious? I am not exactly convinced that he only became infectious after he got his fever.
Elley Mae
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At this link there is a photo of a thermometer in use.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2014/10/15/356398102/how-a-no-touch-thermometer-detects-a-fever
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http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/pdf/ebola-non-contact-temperature-measurement-guidance.pdf
It's a pdf so can't link
For Ebola a fever of 101.5f (36.5c) or higher is considered significant.
In reading further it is fda cleared specifically for adjunctive use only.
BBM
I believe at least 48 people were exposed to Mr. Duncan after he became symptomatic (Sept. 24-he didn't seek treatment until 9/26, admitted on 9/28). Who knows how many people he was around in the days before he started feeling "off". If all of those people make it to day 42 without becoming ill, the American public is going to have to start considering the possibility that you really are not infectious until you become ill.
In one week, anyone whose only or last contact with Mr. Duncan was the day he arrived from Brussels (infected already but asymptomatic) will reach day 42. Each day after that more and more people will cross that threshold.
JMO, but I would hope that any medical professional treating me would be compassionate & not easily scared. The medical profession is not a good match for anyone who scares easily, is uncaring, or faint of heart. Just like the teaching profession is not for someone who is scared of children or dislikes children. If someone makes a mistake in choosing their profession they need to make a career change.
I think too many conclusions are being made based on one person (Mr. Duncan). We know that in Africa numerous family members have been infected.
It would be conclusions based on many people-all the many people who came into contact with him. We know he had ebola, we know he was able to spread it to others here. He didn't have some kind of special ebola or mild ebola, he had a very virulent illness which he was able to pass on. That is not insignificant, and neither will it be insignificant if all of his other earlier contacts remain healthy.
We will also have the early contacts of Amber Vinson and Nina Pham to observe. If all of their early contacts remain healthy, this will also give us valuable information.
Between those three people, it's a good chance to observe how this illness behaves.
Suit yourself, but the evidence doesn't fit your fears. If we look at the EVIDENCE in the US where we have seen things played out in the media, exposure even after a person gets the fever for a few days isn't causing infection.
SITUATION WHEN EXPOSED ...........Number exposed .....Number infected
* pre-symptomatic ebola victims............100s? 1000s?..........0
* 1st few days of symptoms .................dozens ...................0
* dying ebola victim spewing fluids..........HCWs ...................2
Maybe over time the evidence will change. But it's also possible that when the CDC/WHO says any possible contagion starts with only a 100 degree fever, in reality that's already an overly cautious approach.
As far as the idea that family members elsewhere have caught the disease, that data is impossible to factor into our thinking since we can't differentiate who (if any) caught it when their loved one was first sick, vs if they were caring for him when dying. There's a huge difference from what we have seen played out here so far.
trigger
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Officials from New York and New Jersey said they were still working out many details, including where people would be quarantined, how the quarantine would be enforced and how they would handle travelers who do not live in either of those states.
Imo They are not prepared. They had no idea where these people were to go for 21 days...Wow
Imo They are not prepared. They had no idea where these people were to go for 21 days...Wow
Yoda
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JMO
I think we need to teach professionalism, censor, and responsibility. I remember when, if you had a problem, you went to the source of that problem. You went in with solutions and offered to brainstorm to make the situation right or better. If that didn't work, you moved your way up to superiors. A Complaint is not a solution, and being this has all happened recently, patience and understanding would be wise. JMO
Sadly, as someone who works in public health, I am not at all surprised that decisions are being made by politicians with little input from actual scientists. I say this as someone who has been working to change a law that jeopardizes public health for almost a decade. The folks who oppose the law change make very emotionally-compelling anecdotal statements in front of committee, while the scientists testify in monotone. I am sure you can guess who wins the day, and I don't totally blame legislators for this. As scientists we need to be able to provide a counterpoint that captures the imagination as well, and so far we have failed. We cannot hold a candle to appeals which, although not factually accurate, pack an emotional punch. Again, this relates to the general idea that human beings are pretty bad at risk perception.
trigger
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Nov 2nd??? I did google the date lol...Day of the Dead??
ATasteOfHoney
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IMO----as an epidemiologist, you know the sample size of USA citizens surviving Ebola is 100%.......out of what? 4?
Come on!
Also, the worldwide death rate of enterovirus-68 & the garden variety flu that is currently going around do not have the reported worldwide death rate percentage as Ebola does. Percentage-wise, Ebola is much more lethal.
Gardenlady
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Lol yes, Nov 2 is day of the dead, or All Souls' Day. It follows All Saints (all Hallows) on Nov 1.
Not sure what point the op was making - all souls/DotD isn't about Death so much as remembering all the dead. Even my non-practicing self will be at the cemetery, but I'm there all the time anyway since my brother is too damn lazy to take care of our parents' grave. :furious:
Anyway... Is Ebola getting it's own feast day now? Like la Santa muerte? :crazy: wonder how many people will go as Ebola or Ebola patient for halloween...
hoh:So yeah what's up with Nov 2???
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BBM
Dr. Craig Spencer, who arrived Thursday at Bellevue Hospital, was now receiving Brincidofovir to combat the potentially lethal disease.
City officials put out an urgent call for the as-yet-unapproved drug that has previously yielded promising results shortly after Spencer was hospitalized.
http://www.nydailynews.com/life-sty...fovir-fight-ebola-officials-article-1.1986996
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