I well understand the ideals and principles that she speaks of but I beleive that they are blinding her to a degree. While advocating for fellow health care workers, she appears unable to consider those who are not part of that group. Perhaps Occupational Health is more appropriate an area as opposed to public health?
Ebola outbreak - general thread #9
- Thread starter Harmony 2
- Start date
I well understand the ideals and principles that she speaks of but I beleive that they are blinding her to a degree. While advocating for fellow health care workers, she appears unable to consider those who are not part of that group. Perhaps Occupational Health is more appropriate an area as opposed to public health?
lonetraveler
Crime Addict
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2008
- Messages
- 17,529
- Reaction score
- 45,164
I totally agree. A second test will be done on this patient.
http://www.wwaytv3.com/2014/11/03/nc-patient-tests-negative-for-ebola
"According to a news release, additional testing will be done 72 hours after the man's fever first developed to confirm this preliminary result. The NC Department of Health and Human Services said in a news release it is important to note that the patient's fever could indicate other illnesses."
lonetraveler
Crime Addict
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2008
- Messages
- 17,529
- Reaction score
- 45,164
Hickox also had a problem with having to wear protective equipment while treating Ebola patients.
She was frustrated because the protective gear she had to wear – “this sort of space suit” – made it hard to connect with patients, and the high temperatures inside meant she could only spend an hour at a time in the high-risk tent, which didn’t leave much time to provide care for the 30 or so patients in her care.
“As a nurse and health care provider, we like to be able to look our patient in the eye and hold their hand and to explain to them that we’re there for them,” Hickox said.
She advocates the desire to see HCW to come and go as they please when they return with no restrictions at all and for Americans to not have the knowledge of where these workers or with what disease they were working with or exposed to.
I totally disagree with her logic on this. JMO
(Reuters) - The state of Maine and a nurse who had treated victims of the Ebola virus in West Africa reached a settlement deal on Monday, allowing her to travel freely in public but requiring her to monitor her health closely and report any symptoms.
The settlement, filed in nurse Kaci Hickox's home town of Fort Kent, in Maine's far north, where she returned after being briefly quarantined in New Jersey, keeps in effect through Nov. 10 the terms of an order issued by a Maine judge on Friday.
Hickox returned to the United States last month after treating Ebola patients in Sierra Leone and was quarantined in a tent outside a hospital in New Jersey for four days despite showing no symptoms.
<modsnip>
"They are extraordinary people who are giving of themselves, they are risking their own lives," Ban told a press conference in Vienna.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/03/us-health-ebola-usa-maine-idUSKBN0IN1FD20141103
The settlement, filed in nurse Kaci Hickox's home town of Fort Kent, in Maine's far north, where she returned after being briefly quarantined in New Jersey, keeps in effect through Nov. 10 the terms of an order issued by a Maine judge on Friday.
Hickox returned to the United States last month after treating Ebola patients in Sierra Leone and was quarantined in a tent outside a hospital in New Jersey for four days despite showing no symptoms.
<modsnip>
"They are extraordinary people who are giving of themselves, they are risking their own lives," Ban told a press conference in Vienna.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/03/us-health-ebola-usa-maine-idUSKBN0IN1FD20141103
Ok, everyone's help please in determining the number of ebola survivors we have now here in the US.
Brantley
Writebold
Unnamed patient treated at Emory U
NBC camera man
Nina
Amber
Spencer, currently recovering & condition upgraded
Did I miss anyone?
I'm thinking in terms of having additional people to donate blood just in case others here are diagnosed. Brantley has donated several times so surely some of the others would also be willing to donate.
Brantley
Writebold
Unnamed patient treated at Emory U
NBC camera man
Nina
Amber
Spencer, currently recovering & condition upgraded
Did I miss anyone?
I'm thinking in terms of having additional people to donate blood just in case others here are diagnosed. Brantley has donated several times so surely some of the others would also be willing to donate.
She was frustrated with PPE? What would be the alternative?
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws.english/Health+and+Environment/1.2137705
I knew this would happen sooner or later in Brussels.
This link only stays up for a few days.
I knew this would happen sooner or later in Brussels.
This link only stays up for a few days.
Second test is scheduled for Wednesday. But it doesn't sound like Ebola. I am glad that we are least are taking it more seriously than when Mr. Duncan arrived. Sounds like the monitoring system is working (even if this person doesn't have Ebola).
Are you a nurse? I am, and I totally get how you could get frustrated with the gear. Many of us go into the profession because we want to make that connection with our patients. It WOULD be frustrating not to be able to touch our patients. It seems you are being critical of her for her statements about frustration with the hazmat; to me, it shows the kind of person who would go to those areas of the world to care for those in need. Kudos to her-I do not have that kind of willingness to put aside comfort, safety, and ease to do what she and others like her do.
Jersey*Girl
Active Member
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2008
- Messages
- 10,266
- Reaction score
- 152
I'm curious about something... If a person is now living here in the USA but was originally from Sierra Leone (just an example), say they went home for a brief visit, came back here to the USA but developed a fever...so they were hospitalized and quarantined based on their fever bc they just recently traveled back here from Sierra Leone after visiting family - who foots the bill? Say the person only had a fever bc they had the flu or something but were quarantined bc of USA policy now - so who foots the bill? What about if the person has an 80/20 plan? If its the patient's responsibility to pay, how fair is it for the person to have to pay 20% (where insurance covers 80% again just an example) of their medical costs when they may not have even felt they needed medical assistance but only contacted medical authorities due to policy? Isn't it expensive to quarantine? Does our govt foot this bill? Does the medical establishment? Anyone know?
No PPE?
Jersey*Girl
Active Member
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2008
- Messages
- 10,266
- Reaction score
- 152
Something else... Since the govt has been placing people on a 21 day self quarantine just bc they were in the same place of someone that tested positive for Ebola, could that person or people be awarded retribution for pay lost? Or what about if they lose their job? Afterall, several states have a hire at will fire at will right. So what about if a person working for a company has a job title/description that makes them detrimental enough to have to be on site to do their job, but say they have to be let go bc of the quarantine as their company has to pay someone else to do their job? So I'm asking - if that person quarantined ends up losing their job and ends up not even having Ebola, who do they sue? Bc I know darn well if I was quarantined without having Ebola, and lost my job bc of it, somebody darn well's gonna payout!
Your questions start with "what if" and then assume the worst case for someone, without any evidence that those things are ever happening. That's not a good way to govern, because life has lots of situations that would be awful if the very worst thing that could possibly happen happened.
For example, should we be calling for all planes to be grounded because one could land on our head? Should we demand that high-speed highways be outlawed lest someone drive down one and a huge sinkhole has opened around the next bend, causing them terrible harm before they can stop in time?
There's simply no way to micromanage risk out of lives. If someone chooses to travel to WAfrica, let them know the consequences in advance, and then if they weigh that the reward for them outweighs the risk of possible quarantine or hospitalization and what that might do to their life, that's their choice.
I think we should be in favor of people having freedom to make their own choices, with the understanding that any choice they make will entail some risk in some way. Besides the fact that a risk-free existence can't be created no matter how smothering you are, life is best lived when people are freed to make their own risk-reward choices and then let their lives unfold.
Yoda
Master
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2011
- Messages
- 6,017
- Reaction score
- 32
Dr Rick Sacro
Yoda
Master
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2011
- Messages
- 6,017
- Reaction score
- 32
SCHMAE
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2011
- Messages
- 13,142
- Reaction score
- 2,916
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/us...ssion-other-key-facts/ar-BBcPy9B?ocid=UP97DHP
''But penetration through intact skin has not been definitively ruled out, said hemorrhagic-fever expert Thomas Ksiarek of the University of Texas Medical Branch (UTMB), who co-led a session on Ebola's transmission routes.
"Does bleach or hand sanitizer," which people in West Africa are using to protect themselves from Ebola, "make the skin more susceptible" to being penetrated by the virus?, Peters wondered. "It's a question that has to be asked."'''
ETA When you get bleach on your hands, it makes them really slick. So now this has me thinking and hopefully someone here will know the answer. Does bleach remove the outermost protective layer of skin? Open the pores up wider? Anyone know ? TIA
ETA Oh UGH! In my haste , I posted before finishing the article and this one is a zinger. '''Also unknown is whether the time between exposure to Ebola and the appearance of symptoms depends on which bodily fluids someone contacted. If it does, then someone exposed through, say, saliva rather than blood might incubate the virus for longer than the 21 days officials have repeatedly said is the outer limit of the incubation period.''''
''But penetration through intact skin has not been definitively ruled out, said hemorrhagic-fever expert Thomas Ksiarek of the University of Texas Medical Branch (UTMB), who co-led a session on Ebola's transmission routes.
"Does bleach or hand sanitizer," which people in West Africa are using to protect themselves from Ebola, "make the skin more susceptible" to being penetrated by the virus?, Peters wondered. "It's a question that has to be asked."'''
ETA When you get bleach on your hands, it makes them really slick. So now this has me thinking and hopefully someone here will know the answer. Does bleach remove the outermost protective layer of skin? Open the pores up wider? Anyone know ? TIA
ETA Oh UGH! In my haste , I posted before finishing the article and this one is a zinger. '''Also unknown is whether the time between exposure to Ebola and the appearance of symptoms depends on which bodily fluids someone contacted. If it does, then someone exposed through, say, saliva rather than blood might incubate the virus for longer than the 21 days officials have repeatedly said is the outer limit of the incubation period.''''
SCHMAE
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2011
- Messages
- 13,142
- Reaction score
- 2,916
The last non medical personnel to have contact with Mr. Duncan are on day 37, very close to the absolutely outside number of possible incubation days ever recorded. Others who were around him prior to the day he was admitted are even closer to that threshold.
All of Amber Vinson's airplane contacts and bridal shop customers have passed the 21 days. Nina Pham's fiance is at day 25.
All remaining HCW at PHD involved with ebola patients will hit their 21 day mark on November 7.
It appears that Texas will have been very fortunate to have had only 2 infections from Mr. Duncan, in spite of the large numbers of people he exposed. When I heard about the 2nd nurse coming down with ebola, I feared that we were going to have very many more, possibly in the dozens.
All of Amber Vinson's airplane contacts and bridal shop customers have passed the 21 days. Nina Pham's fiance is at day 25.
All remaining HCW at PHD involved with ebola patients will hit their 21 day mark on November 7.
It appears that Texas will have been very fortunate to have had only 2 infections from Mr. Duncan, in spite of the large numbers of people he exposed. When I heard about the 2nd nurse coming down with ebola, I feared that we were going to have very many more, possibly in the dozens.
SCHMAE
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2011
- Messages
- 13,142
- Reaction score
- 2,916
I was thinking about this a lot. I have been loudly critical of the handling of Dallas/ Texas with the whole matter. It all seemed lazy and confused and non urgent. Well, it seems Dallas handled it much better than I ever thought possible. Did Dallas contain Ebola? Or was Dallas super lucky? Or is it time to spray glitter on my tinfoil hat ?
I was thinking about this a lot. I have been loudly critical of the handling of Dallas/ Texas with the whole matter. It all seemed lazy and confused and non urgent. Well, it seems Dallas handled it much better than I ever thought possible. Did Dallas contain Ebola? Or was Dallas super lucky? Or is it time to spray glitter on my tinfoil hat ?
I would say that Presbyterian Dallas had the misfortune to be the "test case" for the US health care system, and for a random hospital being able to treat ebola. They weren't a so-called designated ebola hospital, they were just a place where Duncan walked in the door, and they were forced to work on a learn-as-you-do basis using CDC instructions that proved to be flawed. How could they anticipate the fact that the PPE instructions were inadequate, or even evaluate them without seeing the massive amounts of fluids that were spewed by their first ebola patient?
Some hospital had to be the first, to be the guinea pigs to find the flaws in the setup, so mistakes were inevitable. Those mistakes made them look bad, but I'd say an objective look probably shows they did an admirable job under impossible conditions. The whole country is now much more alert, and better prepared, by the lessons learned at Dallas' Presbyterian.