Finding Katherine and Sheila--Before it's 40 Years Since They Have Been Missing!!!

[j123]

What's the point of 20-30+ year age progressed pictures then? What purpose do they serve if people aren't allowed to even speculate that those who have been missing past an arbitrary amount of time may be alive?

 

[MrMustardinthestudy]

What's the point of 20-30+ year age progressed pictures then? What purpose do they serve if people aren't allowed to even speculate that those who have been missing past an arbitrary amount of time may be alive?

Age progression is done to be thorough, but in this case (as in many others) it's clear that LE doesn't expect to ever find these girls matured to adulthood. Neither does their family.

 

[Richard]

I do not wish to debate whether or not the Lyon sisters are living today. Everyone has their own opinion at this point, but arguing about it will not determine the truth.

There have been some statements about how it is not possible for a missing person to still be alive after 40 years, and I wanted to mention and link a very recent Websleuths thread in the "Missing in the 70's" topic. It is about a Pennsylvania girl named Roxann Deihl who went missing in July 1975 at the age of 14. She has just been located alive after almost 40 years.

So it is possible. I do not have many details on the Roxann Deihl case, and I do not know if there are any connections to the Lyon sisters.

LINK:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?270076-PA-Roxann-Deihl-14-Stroudsburg-July-5-1975

 

[Tap Dancer]

I do not wish to debate whether or not the Lyon sisters are living today. Everyone has their own opinion at this point, but arguing about it will not determine the truth.

There have been some statements about how it is not possible for a missing person to still be alive after 40 years, and I wanted to mention and link a very recent Websleuths thread in the "Missing in the 70's" topic. It is about a Pennsylvania girl named Roxann Deihl who went missing in July 1975 at the age of 14. She has just been located alive after almost 40 years.

So it is possible. I do not have many details on the Roxann Deihl case, and I do not know if there are any connections to the Lyon sisters.

LINK:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?270076-PA-Roxann-Deihl-14-Stroudsburg-July-5-1975

Exactly. It's unlikely that they're still alive, but not impossible. It's always amazing when people who were kidnapped turn up years (or decades) later. Until we learn otherwise, there is hope.

 

[MrMustardinthestudy]

I do not wish to debate whether or not the Lyon sisters are living today. Everyone has their own opinion at this point, but arguing about it will not determine the truth.

There have been some statements about how it is not possible for a missing person to still be alive after 40 years, and I wanted to mention and link a very recent Websleuths thread in the "Missing in the 70's" topic. It is about a Pennsylvania girl named Roxann Deihl who went missing in July 1975 at the age of 14. She has just been located alive after almost 40 years.

So it is possible. I do not have many details on the Roxann Deihl case, and I do not know if there are any connections to the Lyon sisters.

LINK:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?270076-PA-Roxann-Deihl-14-Stroudsburg-July-5-1975

This girl wasn't abducted by a predator. Different kettle of fish.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I do not wish to debate whether or not the Lyon sisters are living today. Everyone has their own opinion at this point, but arguing about it will not determine the truth.

There have been some statements about how it is not possible for a missing person to still be alive after 40 years, and I wanted to mention and link a very recent Websleuths thread in the "Missing in the 70's" topic. It is about a Pennsylvania girl named Roxann Deihl who went missing in July 1975 at the age of 14. She has just been located alive after almost 40 years.

So it is possible. I do not have many details on the Roxann Deihl case, and I do not know if there are any connections to the Lyon sisters.

LINK:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?270076-PA-Roxann-Deihl-14-Stroudsburg-July-5-1975

The odds of two little girls taken by a predator and still alive after 40 years had ridiculous odds. I don't believe that anyone believes these girls are alive. I believe they were killed not too long after taken because as a rule that is what the research holds up to be.
I think that there is a difference in saying, These two could still be alive and trying to point to one person and say THAT IS HER!

 

[Richard]

The girls are missing. They have never been proven or declared dead. It has not yet been proven that they were actually abducted, although that is the current theory of LE - and perhaps the most logical conclusion.

But all speculation beyond that is pure guessing. You have to go with the evidence, and at this point there isn't much to go on.

One could base a theory on "odds" but mathematics just cannot explain a lot of things. This case in particular seems to have defied the "odds" in so many ways. The odds were that when the girls were first reported missing that they were going to come home momentarily after staying away late for any number of reasons. But they did not come home. Then the odds were that police would turn something up. Besides a lot of publicity and community involvement, very little has ever turned up. Odds were that this case would have been resolved within days, weeks, or months - but here we are 40 years later.

One thing that is certain is that this has remained an open and unresolved tragedy for the Lyon family for 40 years. There has been no closure, regardless of how family members may have dealt with the loss of their girls.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

The girls are missing. They have never been proven or declared dead. It has not yet been proven that they were actually abducted, although that is the current theory of LE - and perhaps the most logical conclusion.

But all speculation beyond that is pure guessing. You have to go with the evidence, and at this point there isn't much to go on.

One could base a theory on "odds" but mathematics just cannot explain a lot of things. This case in particular seems to have defied the "odds" in so many ways. The odds were that when the girls were first reported missing that they were going to come home momentarily after staying away late for any number of reasons. But they did not come home. Then the odds were that police would turn something up. Besides a lot of publicity and community involvement, very little has ever turned up. Odds were that this case would have been resolved within days, weeks, or months - but here we are 40 years later.

One thing that is certain is that this has remained an open and unresolved tragedy for the Lyon family for 40 years. There has been no closure, regardless of how family members may have dealt with the loss of their girls.

The odds that they would turn up and then didn't change the whole dynamic. I would bet with the technology we have now, That they would have most likely been found even if it was too late based on the ease that it has developed over the years for tracking people.
But I don't think anyone involved in this case personally, the family and LE believe they are alive. And to me what they know is more than we know even if we think we know it all here we don't.
Again, we always want to believe they will be found alive and it will be an amazing miracle if they were but I think in this case we all have seen this too many times and the reason that neither of them have been found before is not because they are living lives somewhere but because they have passed.

I really hope and pray that they find the girls so they can give them back to their parents and they can have their chance to say their goodbyes properly. I can not imagine what it would be like to have your children missing. It is one thing to lose one child, But 2 the same day??? I can not fathom.

 

[j123]

Age progression is done to be thorough, but in this case (as in many others) it's clear that LE doesn't expect to ever find these girls matured to adulthood. Neither does their family.

Creating an age progression to be thorough but then telling people not to bother discussing it is the equivalent of sending a search team to a location and telling them not to actually look.

No one (here) is harassing the Lyon family. This discussion will likely never leave WebSleuths. This community is partially built upon giving users the opportunity to discuss and explore as many avenues as possible, including (and especially?) those which law enforcement can't afford to spend resources on. Debunking a theory is great, but what's the point in asking for it to just disappear?

 

[siriunsun]

The odds that they would turn up and then didn't change the whole dynamic. I would bet with the technology we have now, That they would have most likely been found even if it was too late based on the ease that it has developed over the years for tracking people.
But I don't think anyone involved in this case personally, the family and LE believe they are alive. And to me what they know is more than we know even if we think we know it all here we don't.
Again, we always want to believe they will be found alive and it will be an amazing miracle if they were but I think in this case we all have seen this too many times and the reason that neither of them have been found before is not because they are living lives somewhere but because they have passed.

I really hope and pray that they find the girls so they can give them back to their parents and they can have their chance to say their goodbyes properly. I can not imagine what it would be like to have your children missing. It is one thing to lose one child, But 2 the same day??? I can not fathom.

I so agree. In fact, the only party(s) I can see who would benefit from unproven speculation that the girls might be alive are the perpetrators. Lets look at where this rumor probably originated and ignore it until we have actual information.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Creating an age progression to be thorough but then telling people not to bother discussing it is the equivalent of sending a search team to a location and telling them not to actually look.

No one (here) is harassing the Lyon family. This discussion will likely never leave WebSleuths. This community is partially built upon giving users the opportunity to discuss and explore as many avenues as possible, including (and especially?) those which law enforcement can't afford to spend resources on. Debunking a theory is great, but what's the point in asking for it to just disappear?

I hope that no one is harassing them. That would be hideous. But no one is telling anyone not to discuss them being missing.

 

[simplifymylife2014]

The girls are missing. They have never been proven or declared dead. It has not yet been proven that they were actually abducted, although that is the current theory of LE - and perhaps the most logical conclusion.

But all speculation beyond that is pure guessing. You have to go with the evidence, and at this point there isn't much to go on.

One could base a theory on "odds" but mathematics just cannot explain a lot of things. This case in particular seems to have defied the "odds" in so many ways. The odds were that when the girls were first reported missing that they were going to come home momentarily after staying away late for any number of reasons. But they did not come home. Then the odds were that police would turn something up. Besides a lot of publicity and community involvement, very little has ever turned up. Odds were that this case would have been resolved within days, weeks, or months - but here we are 40 years later.

One thing that is certain is that this has remained an open and unresolved tragedy for the Lyon family for 40 years. There has been no closure, regardless of how family members may have dealt with the loss of their girls.

Well said Richard. We have to look at the odds of a lot of things and you're right, there are so many things which are unordinary about this whole case.

That is one reason I believe it MAY have been WELL planned out.

 

[simplifymylife2014]

I so agree. In fact, the only party(s) I can see who would benefit from unproven speculation that the girls might be alive are the perpetrators. Lets look at where this rumor probably originated and ignore it until we have actual information.

As I have said before, if there is ANYONE who does WANT to question the ORIGIN of this theory,
let them ask John Ervin. He has a public FB account.

You can also message graycat here on Websleuths.

 

[MrMustardinthestudy]

Creating an age progression to be thorough but then telling people not to bother discussing it is the equivalent of sending a search team to a location and telling them not to actually look.

No one (here) is harassing the Lyon family. This discussion will likely never leave WebSleuths. This community is partially built upon giving users the opportunity to discuss and explore as many avenues as possible, including (and especially?) those which law enforcement can't afford to spend resources on. Debunking a theory is great, but what's the point in asking for it to just disappear?

You asked what the purpose of age progression was, and I replied that age progression is done to be thorough--even in cases where LE are convinced the missing are dead. (Of course it's of great benefit if there's a chance the missing individual is still alive, but that's not the case here.)

The woman in question has said she's not Katherine Lyon. I'm of the opinion she would know that better than anyone here.

 

[simplifymylife2014]

You asked what the purpose of age progression was, and I replied that age progression is done to be thorough--even in cases where LE are convinced the missing are dead. (Of course it's of great benefit if there's a chance the missing individual is still alive, but that's not the case here.)

The woman in question has said she's not Katherine Lyon. I'm of the opinion she would know that better than anyone here.

I agree that KW has said she is not Katherine Lyon.
That could very well be the case.

However, in a case like this, where a child may have been traumatized for a VERY LONG period of time
like Jaycee Dugard, WHO WOULD NATURALLY WANT to face what happened in their life?

I respect her choice to state she is not Katherine Lyon.

However, it COULD BE that she does NOT WANT to remember who Katherine Lyon was and what she went through.

Time will hopefully tell and I will have to accept however things turn out.

 

[MrMustardinthestudy]

I agree that KW has said she is not Katherine Lyon.
That could very well be the case.

However, in a case like this, where a child may have been traumatized for a VERY LONG period of time
like Jaycee Dugard, WHO WOULD NATURALLY WANT to face what happened in their life?

I respect her choice to state she is not Katherine Lyon.

However, it COULD BE that she does NOT WANT to remember who Katherine Lyon was and what she went through.

Time will hopefully tell and I will have to accept however things turn out.

Time already did tell--she said she's not Katherine Lyon. LE have said both sisters were murdered. Their family members have said they know the sisters are dead. It's not that it could very well be the case--it is the case.

But we can agree to disagree as it's clear that proving she is being untruthful about her identity is important to you.

Best of luck.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I agree that KW has said she is not Katherine Lyon.
That could very well be the case.

However, in a case like this, where a child may have been traumatized for a VERY LONG period of time
like Jaycee Dugard, WHO WOULD NATURALLY WANT to face what happened in their life?

I respect her choice to state she is not Katherine Lyon.

However, it COULD BE that she does NOT WANT to remember who Katherine Lyon was and what she went through.

Time will hopefully tell and I will have to accept however things turn out.

She is not KL.. Why would she lie?? This is a huge stretch and comes off as someone that wants to make someone fit the mold they have for them. She is Not Katherine Lyons. Katherine Lyons is dead.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I think what upsets me so much about this case is that I am the lyon girls age. I lived in Baltimore as a small girl and but for the grace of God....

I remember being 4 yrs old and missing my bus, I didn't want to tell my mom so I walked the 2 miles to school. How crazy is that?
I want so much for their parents to have answers and not have to visit just a stone but to know that their babies are at rest.

 

[cgoodwin22]

I feel you ScarlettScarpetta - I was only 4 (soon to be 5 that year in August) and i vividly remember my mom being so freaked out. I remember us being in a restaurant and a guy had a briefcase and my mom saying to my Dad 'i wonder if that could be the briefcase man'....little things like that still stick in my head. Also, we lived a few blocks from Iverson Mall when it happened and it was reported that the man with the tape recorder and briefcase was seen at Iverson Mall as well. Both of my parents have since passed away but i know that if my mom was still alive she would be following this case very closely praying for closure for the Lyon family.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I feel you ScarlettScarpetta - I was only 4 (soon to be 5 that year in August) and i vividly remember my mom being so freaked out. I remember us being in a restaurant and a guy had a briefcase and my mom saying to my Dad 'i wonder if that could be the briefcase man'....little things like that still stick in my head. Also, we lived a few blocks from Iverson Mall when it happened and it was reported that the man with the tape recorder and briefcase was seen at Iverson Mall as well. Both of my parents have since passed away but i know that if my mom was still alive she would be following this case very closely praying for closure for the Lyon family.

I loved the open air malls of the 70's we had them when we moved to Jersey too. It was such a great time an innocent time and to think those little girls were taken so long ago and still not been found is just heart breaking. I hope that the prosecutors and DA's are willing to offer near anything to get those babies back.