FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #3

[Adrienne37]

Arrest zimmerman now!!

 

[momshrink]

respectfully snipped

I'm not African American but I can clearly see that it exists, and it still exists and this case reeks of it.

ETA: I do think it's great that there are so many non African Americans who are just as outraged.

JMHO

Imo, Trayvon was killed because he was a black teen. I am sad and outraged because black males are at risk just because of their skin color. I am not black, but Trayvon was every mother's son walking along doing nothing wrong when approached by a man who may have been a sex offender or a robber or any of the people we warn our kids about. This case has angered the majority of people because Trayvon, every mothers child was killed based on his skin color. Yes, crimes are committed by blacks, but not all blacks commit crimes.
The majority of financial crimes are committed by white males. Should we assume they are
all suspect?
I have seen police community relations van driving around all day. I will not go to the rally because of safety concerns, but I will hold love and peace in my heart for this mother's boy and for all of our boys who are so innocent and so vulnerable with their love of iced tea and skittles. I will hold my son as close as he will allow and, yes, I will buy him skittles tonight. He loves them.
JMO

 

[JeannaT]

Zimmerman is very well protected by Fl self-defense law (despite what people who wrote it now say). If he is considered an aggressor, he would not be protected-but for that they would have to prove he is the one that started the fight. There are no witnesses as far as I can tell that can prove it one way or the other. And authorities don't seem to think that they can consider him following Trayvon an act of aggression in itself. So what exactly should be done in this situation?

I don't know. I feel like right now we are on top of a powder keg that's about to explode.

I really think the less live feed of the protests, the better. I just see this exploding into a riot that would match the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict.

 

[Omachka]

respectfully snipped

I'm not African American but I can clearly see that it exists, and it still exists and this case reeks of it.

ETA: I do think it's great that there are so many non African Americans who are just as outraged.

JMHO

Thank you Annalia. You took the words right out of my mouth. I'm not African American either and neither is the friend I was speaking with this afternoon. She does, however, have 4 children. Two of them are adopted African American. They are all in their early teens. She says that she worries from the moment her adopted children leave the house until they are safely home. She said she feels that a case like this could have easily happened to either of her two children and is very afraid that it will at some point.

I have Trayvon's family in my prayers. They are going through an unimaginable situation right now. It is sad that they have lost their son but I hope that this will, at least, show that there is a real perception problem in this country. In a perfect world our justice system would protect us all equally. We should all be concerned that it doesn't.

The chief has stepped down "temporarily" but what they need to do is issue an arrest warrant and then let the courts do their job.

 

[LambChop]

None of the witnesses can say with any degree of certainty which one of the two was screaming. And one of the witnesses (it was posted on the thread somewhere) seem to suggest it was in fact Zimmerman that was screaming.

Why would he scream, he had the gun and the shot rang out right after the "whimpering", not screams right, and then a call for help? TM was walking away from GZ according to what his girlfriend could hear. I did not hear the recording myself but it seems to me GZ might have yelled but I can see a child whimpering in fear, certainly not a grown adult who has a gun and knows he can defend himself. That would make no sense. Of course no one heard GZ yell, stop I have a gun, did they?

But the only thing that matters is that GZ had no business going after this young man, none. The very fact that he did not know who this child was does not give him the right to pursue him. That was the job of the police. GZ is 100% responsible for his actions. jmo

 

[Boytwnmom]

brought in for questioning, his car wasn't searched, his gun wasn't taken or tested, he wasn't drug or alcohol tested despite finding him with a gun after killing an unarmed boy walking back home to his family.

This seems like the most blatantly incompetent excuse for an investigation I've ever heard of. It almost defies belief. I've never heard of anyone involved in a shooting that is not interrogated afterward-this guy just takes his gun and goes merrily on his way.

I wonder if,
Since Trayvons family doesn't have the cell phone, which I believe,
The police claiming not to have it, which I don't really believe,
I wonder if, weird crazy idea, if GZ took it and still has it... I don't know how that would be possible, but whit all the incompetency, you never know....

Would be really interesting to watch the police car videos to see if GZ was even properly searched and how they handled the crime scene....

And yes my opinion only....

Micci

 

[Adrienne37]

I don't know. I feel like right now we are on top of a powder keg that's about to explode.

I really think the less live feed of the protests, the better. I just see this exploding into a riot that would match the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict.

Yep, just brush it under the rug, it will all come down out in the wash. The life of a 17-year-old child is nothing.

 

[mikeysmommom]

Zimmerman is very well protected by Fl self-defense law (despite what people who wrote it now say). If he is considered an aggressor, he would not be protected-but for that they would have to prove he is the one that started the fight. There are no witnesses as far as I can tell that can prove it one way or the other. And authorities don't seem to think that they can consider him following Trayvon an act of aggression in itself. So what exactly should be done in this situation?

From what I have read the dispatcher asked are you following him he said yes she replied you don't need to be doing that.She never said he had to stop.

 

[JeannaT]

Imo, Trayvon was killed because he was a black teen. I am sad and outraged because black males are at risk just because of their skin color. I am not black, but Trayvon was every mother's son walking along doing nothing wrong when approached by a man who may have been a sex offender or a robber or any of the people we warn our kids about. This case has angered the majority of people because Trayvon, every mothers child was killed based on his skin color. Yes, crimes are committed by blacks, but not all blacks commit crimes.
The majority of financial crimes are committed by white males. Should we assume they are
all suspect?
I have seen police community relations van driving around all day. I will not go to the rally because of safety concerns, but I will hold love and peace in my heart for this mother's boy and for all of our boys who are so innocent and so vulnerable with their love of iced tea and skittles. I will hold my son as close as he will allow and, yes, I will buy him skittles tonight. He loves them.
JMO

I certainly think he was suspected, and followed because he was Black.

I don't think that's why he was killed. I believe he was killed because GZ was in fact in real danger of serious injury or death.

And that's it, in a nutshell. For all the discussions of whether it's right to follow someone, what the reasons were the GZ suspected Trayvon of wrongdoing, all those things are extraneous details IMHO.

The nutshell. Did GZ have reason to believe he was in serious danger at the moment he pulled his gun and shot Trayvon? I say it's likely.

 

[princesspjs]

If you listen to the 911 call that recorded Tray's screams http://audioboo.fm/boos/717346-911-call-screaming-and-gunshots-audible#t=0m0s it is clearly a child screaming for help. He is begging for his life. His last word is "help" before you hear him being murdered in cold blood.

In my opinion, IF - and I repeat - IF it were Zimmerman doing the screaming, the anxiety that he was feeling wouldn't just stop. IF it were Zimmerman putting up that struggle and screaming for his life, he would have continued to be hysterical until he could collect himself after supposedly coming so close to being killed. He wouldn't just casually ask the neighbor to call the cops.

It is unbelievable to me that anyone who has listened to that recording would even consider that it is not Trayvon doing the screaming.

 

[JeannaT]

Yep, just brush it under the rug, it will all come down out in the wash. The life of a 17-year-old child is nothing.

How much are the protesters lives worth, and others who happen to be in proximity when riots break out?

Trayvon's life is worth as much as anyone's but he's gone now. There's no bringing him back. It would be a horrid tragedy to have MORE deaths follow his.

Prayers for peace. I'm waiting to hear what happens in the GJ.

 

[jjenny]

Arrest zimmerman now!!

Lets say they arrest him. But when he comes at trial there is no enough evidence to prove anything and he is let go. Is that going to make anyone happy?

 

[princesspjs]

I certainly think he was suspected, and followed because he was Black.

I don't think that's why he was killed. I believe he was killed because GZ was in fact in real danger of serious injury or death.

And that's it, in a nutshell. For all the discussions of whether it's right to follow someone, what the reasons were the GZ suspected Trayvon of wrongdoing, all those things are extraneous details IMHO.

The nutshell. Did GZ have reason to believe he was in serious danger at the moment he pulled his gun and shot Trayvon? I say it's likely.

Tray can be heard on a recording screaming "HELP!" less than a second before Zimmerman shot him dead.

Does that mean that you think Tray was beating Zimmerman up to the point that Zimmerman felt his life was in danger....but all the while that Tray is supposedly beating the crap out of Zimmerman he is screaming "NO, NO, HELP, NO, HELP!"

Interesting viewpoint....and I can't even fathom it.

 

[jjenny]

If you listen to the 911 call that recorded Tray's screams http://audioboo.fm/boos/717346-911-call-screaming-and-gunshots-audible#t=0m0s it is clearly a child screaming for help. He is begging for his life. His last word is "help" before you hear him being murdered in cold blood.

In my opinion, IF - and I repeat - IF it were Zimmerman doing the screaming, the anxiety that he was feeling wouldn't just stop. IF it were Zimmerman putting up that struggle and screaming for his life, he would have continued to be hysterical until he could collect himself after supposedly coming so close to being killed. He wouldn't just casually ask the neighbor to call the cops.

It is unbelievable to me that anyone who has listened to that recording would even consider that it is not Trayvon doing the screaming.

Unless they can do a voice analysis none of this is convincing to me. None of the witnesses on 911 call could say which one was screaming.
If Zimmerman was the one screaming he could have stopped because there was no longer a fight.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Zimmerman is very well protected by Fl self-defense law (despite what people who wrote it now say). If he is considered an aggressor, he would not be protected-but for that they would have to prove he is the one that started the fight. There are no witnesses as far as I can tell that can prove it one way or the other. And authorities don't seem to think that they can consider him following Trayvon an act of aggression in itself. So what exactly should be done in this situation?

He states they always get away and then goes after him to make sure he did not get away.

Why else did he follow him?

He followed him to make sure he did not get away. He armed himself, he got out of his truck to make sure he did not get away.

He had no evidence he had done anything but he was going to make sure he did not get away.

There was evidence of a scuffle.

Evidence points to CZ going after the kid to make sure he did not get away.

 

[JeannaT]

He states they always get away and then goes after him to make sure he did not get away.

Why else did he follow him?

He followed him to make sure he did not get away. He armed himself, he got out of his truck to make sure he did not get away.

He had no evidence he had done anything but he was going to make sure he did not get away.

There was evidence of a scuffle.

Evidence points to CZ going after the kid to make sure he did not get away.

Yes. Which is legal.

 

[Marshmallow]

Especially May 4th, 1970.

I mean no dishonor to the past and the lessons sadly learned, especially since I am old enough to remember it but to compare this recent event to that is really not relevant.
Yes, the past is always with us but we must take this event as it is and hopefully focus some good from it. A young man's life was stolen from him and wrongfully so. Perhaps new legislation, new awareness, and new education can bring some tribute to young Mr Martin. He did not need to die, he should not have died, and we cannot blind ourselves with the past to avoid fixing whatever is wrong now.

 

[jjenny]

He states they always get away and then goes after him to make sure he did not get away.

Why else did he follow him?

He followed him to make sure he did not get away. He armed himself, he got out of his truck to make sure he did not get away.

He had no evidence he had done anything but he was going to make sure he did not get away.

There was evidence of a scuffle.

Evidence points to CZ going after the kid to make sure he did not get away.

I agree the evidence points to GZ following Trayvon. But is that in itself an act of aggression? He did ask Trayvon "what are you doing here" according to the girlfriend of Trayvon's, right? So he followed him and asked him a question. Is that enough for it to be an act of aggression?

 

[tlcya]

Lets say they arrest him. But when he comes at trial there is no enough evidence to prove anything and he is let go. Is that going to make anyone happy?

Not at all, but I can guarantee it will be the catalyst for changes to the stand your ground law as written now. It would spur an outcry until legislators tighten that law up til it makes some sort of sense and is no longer a license to manufacture a confrontation, kill a person in cold blood and get away with it claiming self defense.

My friend said to me yesterday, anyone looking to off their spouse should simply vacation in Florida, instigate a fight/confrontation, shoot said spouse and claim self defense. Sadly, I believe she may be right. It may indeed be just that easy to get away with murder in the state of Florida.

Maybe that is Trayvon's legacy. I hope that GZ is tried and that he is held accountable. But if he is not then the failure of the system to address this case will only spearhead the push for change.

 

[LambChop]

Zimmerman is very well protected by Fl self-defense law (despite what people who wrote it now say). If he is considered an aggressor, he would not be protected-but for that they would have to prove he is the one that started the fight. There are no witnesses as far as I can tell that can prove it one way or the other. And authorities don't seem to think that they can consider him following Trayvon an act of aggression in itself. So what exactly should be done in this situation?

It takes two people to have a fight. The minute GZ disobeyed directions from LE to hold his position until LE arrived he took matters into his own hands and essentially he caused the incident. How do you go from a perfectly innocent person walking to his family's condo into a planned assault by this young man? He was on he phone with a witness who said he was trying to get away from this man. GZ carried a gun and pursued him.

Maybe someone should have warned this so called "aggressive teen" not to bring a bottle of ice tea to a gun fight.

Plus GZ was not in his home. He was in what is referred to in gated communities as a common area. GZ wasn't even on his own property so how does the castle law even a consideration. How many times do police officers tell citizens not to take the law into your own hands? Call LE and let them handle it. GZ chose not to do that with deadly results. jmo