FL FL - Adam Walsh, 7, Hollywood, 27 July 1981

[azmama]

I was 10 years old when Adam was killed, I remember it vividly, scared the daylights out of me! I think that was what propelled me into being afraid of.....well, pretty much everything!

My Mom never talked to me about safety and stuff, just used incidents such as this to scare me into staying close when we were out etc.

I am happy for the Walshes and hope they are relieved and comforted by the case being closed.

 

[CuriousCity]

For those who missed John and Reve's statement to the public, it is here:
http://www.myfoxspokane.com/myfox/M....jsp?contentId=8084825&version=1&locale=EN-US

 

[mysteriew]

I had questions when I first heard this announced. After all this time, no new evidence, and a suspect who was dead it would be too easy to 'close' this case and put the blame on Toole.

But looking at John and Reve's faces at this announcement, I believe it is true. No parent looks like they did at the PC if they didn't believe it was true.

At that time period, if they had a killer in prison for another case, they wouldn't prosecute others. So no prosecutor had motivation to take Toole to trial. And I would guess that except for John and Reve's attention, not much legal attention was paid to the case. Legally it was probably just another one of the 'solved not prosectuted cases.'

While it is true that John recently believed that Toole was the one, years ago John had a lot of questions about whether he was the one who did it. He had a lot of doubt because of Toole's confessions/recanting and lying. Since then he has leaned more and more about toward Toole. And that would make sense if he was learning more about him and the likelyhood of his crimes.

I believe that Toole did it. I am just so sorry it took this many years to formally acknowlege it. But I am also thankful that Toole died in prison.

 

[Bobbisangel]

Didn't the killer send John and his wife a cassette of Adam being murdered or was that just a part of the TV movie?

 

[thefragile7393]

Im not 100 percent sure about this iam just going back in memory here from what i seen on american justice with bill curtis but when otoole started killing people did he not have a partner for a little while i dont recall his name and i dont think he stayed till the end either but i do recall him having a partner in crime for the first while...If so i wonder if he is still alive ..

Would that be Henry Lee Lucas?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Im not 100 percent sure about this iam just going back in memory here from what i seen on american justice with bill curtis but when otoole started killing people did he not have a partner for a little while i don't recall his name and i don't think he stayed till the end either but i do recall him having a partner in crime for the first while...If so i wonder if he is still alive ..

Yes, he ran with another killer, Henry Lucas. Henry Lucas, if still alive, was on death row and when President Bush was Governor of Texas he commuted his sentence to LWOP.

imoo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Here is a link about Toole and Lucas.

http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/lucas.html

 

[kevmob77]

Henry Lee Lucas died in prison in 2001. He was originally given the death penalty but his sentence was commuted to life in prison. When Ottis Toole initially "confesssed" to Adam's abduction, he at first said that Henry Lee Lucas was with him when they drove down from Jacksonville, FL to Hollywood, FL. This was proven yet another lie by Toole as Lucas was in prison at the time. Both Lucas and Toole once claimed to have murdered hundreds of people in their killing spree. This was proven false as well. Both of them seemed to get real enjoyment playing games with different police departments across the U.S., mainly for attention but also for the food and other luxuries they normally didn't get while locked up... as long as they just talked. Although Toole's IQ hovered around 71 and was considered to have the brain capacity of an 8 year old, he definitely was street-wise and knew how to play games with the police.

I found the statement by the Police Chief of the Hollywood PD on Toole's guilt Tuesday to be somewhat aggravating: ""If you're looking for that magic wand, that one piece of evidence, it's not there."

 

[kline]

I hope this is the solution for the Walshs sake.
I cant help but feel uneasy-Toole has lied about so much over the years.
He and Lucas confessed to half the unsolved murders here in the Clearwater Valley of Idaho too.
Then later admitted they were lying.

 

[southcitymom]

I hope this is the solution for the Walshs sake.
I cant help but feel uneasy-Toole has lied about so much over the years.
He and Lucas confessed to half the unsolved murders here in the Clearwater Valley of Idaho too.
Then later admitted they were lying.

Help me out here, ya'll. What new evidence do they have that allows them to close this case? Like Kline, I can't help but feel uneasy. Toole may well have done this but it doesn't seem like there is any hard evidence to confirm that. Additionally, given Toole's history of deceit, the evidence of his confession is not tremendously strong.

 

[kevmob77]

Help me out here, ya'll. What new evidence do they have that allows them to close this case? Like Kline, I can't help but feel uneasy. Toole may well have done this but it doesn't seem like there is any hard evidence to confirm that. Additionally, given Toole's history of deceit, the evidence of his confession is not tremendously strong.

The police chief of the Hollywood, FL basically said Tuesday that there was not any new evidence that pointed to the guilt of Toole. All of the evidence came from his 1983/84 confessions, circumstances, etc. Personally, I don't buy it (see my above posts). But I fully understand John Walsh wanting the Hollywood PD to acknowledge Toole as the likely killer.

 

[daisy7]

Adam Walsh murder revisited: The case against Jeffrey Dahmer
A Miami Herald investigation into the murder of Adam Walsh has found that in naming Ottis Toole as Adam's killer, authorities overlooked evidence and witnesses pointing toward Jeffrey Dahmer.

BY DAVID SMILEY AND ARTHUR JAY HARRIS
dsmiley@MiamiHerald.com

Investigating one of the nation's most prominent unsolved murders, a Hollywood detective pitched softball questions and homemade muffins to a serial killer.

He asked: Did you kidnap freckled 6-year-old Adam Walsh from a Sears in 1981?

``Nothing to do with it,'' Jeffrey Dahmer answered, taking another muffin.

The word of Dahmer, a sociopath who stashed severed heads in his refrigerator, was instrumental in Hollywood police deciding he was not Adam's killer despite contradictory statements from two witnesses.

In December 2008, Chief Chadwick Wagner called a press conference to say deceased drifter Ottis Toole -- long suspected but never prosecuted -- killed Adam. Adam's parents believed it and Broward prosecutors said Toole was the only valid suspect. Case closed.

But had authorities fully explored Dahmer's time in South Florida, they would have found more evidence implicating him than Toole, The Miami Herald found.

Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/03/27/1551541/adam-walsh-murder-revisited-the.html#ixzz0jU04LKn5

 

[Wise Old Owl]

Thanks Daisy - I just got up and saw this and did a search on here to get it in the right place - that's when I saw you had done it already.

I more than vividly remember Adam and the case. I even went out on searches for Adam. I was in my early 20's.

This article was very interesting. I never knew Dahmer was in South Florida - that kinda unnvered me a little. Seems we're (FloridDUH) connected to almost any big news story that hits anywmore. That is, unless its passed the Mississippi River and in California - those usually stay westward.

Anyway, back to Adam and Dahmer. I will not share what swirled around down here when all that went down. Some of it is controversial and some not so much. My father had a store in the heart of Hollywood at the time and many Hollywood PD detectives frequented it. While they didn't really "talk out of school" they gave some interesting insights into the investigation. Again, I will not post on here what I was told, heard, etc. during that time (it would probably get me exiled). Whether or not I believe any or all of it - I still don't know.

I don't think it was Dahmer - he collected the heads - so why would he leave this one?
Plus, being that his body was never found.....

But, again, I never thought it was Toole either. Toole was a "tool" that LE used to put an end to that case and close the book.

Very interesting read, I'll have to ponder on this new info for a while.

 

[Penelope]

IMO -- it is probably psychologically "safer" for Adam's parents to believe he was killed by O'Toole than to consider the possibility that Jeffrey Dahmer -- the ultimate boogy man who actually consumed the flesh of the people he killed -- was the real perpetrator. That would be too horrific to accept. As for the disposal of the head -- perhaps this was one of Dahmer's earlier killings and his MO was not quite developed yet. (Sorry to be so descriptive -- just want to get across how one would not ever want to believe ones child could be killed by such a monster as Dahmer.)

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I remember reading somewhere a few years back, which covered some of the very things in this article. Gosh I wish I could remember the name of it or where I read it. One thing that was mentioned that was not mentioned in the above article...and this was long ago so apologies if my memory is vague.......was that there was evidence of blood in the 'can wash' room of the sub restaurant where Dahmer worked. Also a tool was found in there which could have been the murder weapon. I can't remember the tool though. Also, Dahmer allegedly made a statement (can't remember to who) that he wouldn't admit to killing Adam even if he did because of what happens to child molesters in prison. (coward) I'll check around and provide a link if I can locate it because none of this is verbatim.

Thanks Daisy7. Very interesting article. I don't discredit the witnesses who saw Dahmer. There's just something about him that is creepy and I think I would recognize him. So I think he was in Sears that day. Whether he kidnapped Adam or not we'll never know. Dahmer did have a penchant for severing heads. Perhaps he didn't have a private place in FL to store such things.


OT Hollywood Beach is one of the coolest, most beautiful beaches I've ever visited! MOre than the Bahamas and Hawaii! Both are beautiful in their own respect but Hollywood Beach has such character!

 

[RLynne]

I remember reading somewhere a few years back, which covered some of the very things in this article. Gosh I wish I could remember the name of it or where I read it. One thing that was mentioned that was not mentioned in the above article...and this was long ago so apologies if my memory is vague.......was that there was evidence of blood in the 'can wash' room of the sub restaurant where Dahmer worked. Also a tool was found in there which could have been the murder weapon. I can't remember the tool though. Also, Dahmer allegedly made a statement (can't remember to who) that he wouldn't admit to killing Adam even if he did because of what happens to child molesters in prison. (coward) I'll check around and provide a link if I can locate it because none of this is verbatim.

Waltzingmatilda, I remember reading a lot of this info before, too, but also can't remember where! I thought it was maybe in the Milwaukee newspaper (www.jsonline.com), but just did a search and couldn't find it. I grew up near Milwaukee, and was in high school when Dahmer was first arrested--I remember the media coverage vividly.

Slightly off-topic, but Dahmer's father, Lionel Dahmer, wrote a book--"A Father's Story". It was an amazingly honest book, and horrible, and heart-wrenching all at once, and I recommend it highly.

 

[Spangle]

Thanks Daisy - I just got up and saw this and did a search on here to get it in the right place - that's when I saw you had done it already.

I more than vividly remember Adam and the case. I even went out on searches for Adam. I was in my early 20's.

This article was very interesting. I never knew Dahmer was in South Florida - that kinda unnvered me a little. Seems we're (FloridDUH) connected to almost any big news story that hits anywmore. That is, unless its passed the Mississippi River and in California - those usually stay westward.

Anyway, back to Adam and Dahmer. I will not share what swirled around down here when all that went down. Some of it is controversial and some not so much. My father had a store in the heart of Hollywood at the time and many Hollywood PD detectives frequented it. While they didn't really "talk out of school" they gave some interesting insights into the investigation. Again, I will not post on here what I was told, heard, etc. during that time (it would probably get me exiled). Whether or not I believe any or all of it - I still don't know.

I don't think it was Dahmer - he collected the heads - so why would he leave this one?
Plus, being that his body was never found.....

But, again, I never thought it was Toole either. Toole was a "tool" that LE used to put an end to that case and close the book.

Very interesting read, I'll have to ponder on this new info for a while.

I some times watch "Criminal Minds". Just a show, I know. But the writers do try to make it as realistic as possible. The stories generally point out that the unsub (sp) follows a set pattern. But it has been mentioned that in the beginning, they haven't 'found' themselves yet. So the patterns might not be all there. Or a little different. Walsh would have been early days for JB, would he not?

 

[Spangle]

I ran into the article and was brining it here as well. But several folks all ready beat me to it. Tee hee.. I so love this place!

Anyway, The article really stresses that if the witness say they didn't see O'tool, they were dismissed. On the last 2 pages of the article it tells of a kid (now grown man) who played a video game with Adam, right before he walked out with a man. Who did not look like Tool, but of possibly JD. The people report says the kid wasn't even sure it was Adam. The Man says he was positive it was Adam.

Very, very interesting article.

 

[kbl8201]

you know first they said a dead guy killed adam.......then later last summer they said a dead killer killed amber garcia in california. was there a sudden rush to put an end to decades old cases or something? even if it means not getting to the truth?

well after jaycee turned up alive i doubt will see this trend continue

 

[jjenny]

I ran into the article and was brining it here as well. But several folks all ready beat me to it. Tee hee.. I so love this place!

Anyway, The article really stresses that if the witness say they didn't see O'tool, they were dismissed. On the last 2 pages of the article it tells of a kid (now grown man) who played a video game with Adam, right before he walked out with a man. Who did not look like Tool, but of possibly JD. The people report says the kid wasn't even sure it was Adam. The Man says he was positive it was Adam.

Very, very interesting article.

I think the whole investigation was so messed up, there is no way to know for sure who killed Adam.
It might be easier for John Walsh to accept it was O'tool, rather than think it was someone else who could possibly still be out there. At least if it were Dahmer, he is also dead, it'd be much worse if it were someone else.