FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #12

[htiff]

Drew has made numerous statements regarding the phones powered down and the batteries presumably removed at 10:40 pm on JenniferKesse Guestbook.....Also, he has stated the same on various interviews that he has done....I don't know why Joyce says they were not told about the phones and Drew is saying something different ....Don't have a clue which version is correct ....

I tried to find this, can you provide a link?

 

[scadagirl28]

rd, There is a new podcast called Unconcluded. On episode two, Two Endpoints, Mrs.Kesse retracts the 10.40 time for the phones. She says she was never told that by LE. However she does restate that the phones were powered down together and her last ping may be a glitch in the tower. This may be due to it not pinging the tower closest to Mosaic. Otherwise why question it ? If the possibility exists that Travis's phone did ping the tower closest to Mosaic , roaming for Jennifer's phone is possible.

 

[rd_jfc]

rd, There is a new podcast called Unconcluded. On episode two, Two Endpoints, Mrs.Kesse retracts the 10.40 time for the phones. She says she was never told that by LE. However she does restate that the phones were powered down together and her last ping may be a glitch in the tower. This may be due to it not pinging the tower closest to Mosaic. Otherwise why question it ? If the possibility exists that Travis's phone did ping the tower closest to Mosaic , roaming for Jennifer's phone is possible.

well, first of all it was Mr. Kesse that posted this in the Guestbook. We all know that anything said to one is said to both of them but nevertheless it was Mr. Kesse doing the posting.

I quite frankly don't think it's possible to take something as specific as both phones powered off manually and presumably batteries removed and say hmmm, well we were never told that. You can say we no longer consider the source reliable, I have no idea if that could be the case, or you could say what I saw posted that Mrs. Kesse said, which is that they were never told this by law enforcement, which is a perfectly fine clarification, but the post with very specific information they were told was posted in the Guestbook.

Now is it still there? Postings are saying wasn't found with a search. I could take a look.

 

[rd_jfc]

I tend to find that the more recent the report, the more accurate. Sometimes it isn't the interviewee that gets things wrong, but the person interviewing who makes an error.

Maybe we should pull up the Drew interviews on this and compare them with UnConcluded...Do you have links?

I looked on the Find Jennifer Page and I don't see anything about when the phones being powered down:

http://jenniferkesse.com/

Is this the page you are referring to?



Question: if you believe that Jennifer was abducted at night, as opposed to morning, what is your reasoning around when the car was moved, why it was moved, and why it never traveled or got very far?

A post in their own Guestbook with a bunch of details of what they were told isn't same category as two conflicting vague statements in interviews. Goodness knows I wrote a book dealing with innumerable conflicting information in Chandra Levy's case to sort it out. It happens, but most recent isn't the overriding criteria. Most detailed with best sourcing and ideally corroborating information is the overriding criteria.

I will look for the post but I don't know state of their Guestbook and retention in search access.

I believe Jennifer was abducted at her car just like everyone thinks happenedin the morning, but not in the morning going to work. It could be in her parking lot leaving to take the phone somewhere, it could be the mall parking lot if she was taking the phone over to the Blue Martini, it could be anywhere close she was at at 10:40pm. Whoever powered off the two cell phones was not a novice.

It's a big assumption that no gas was put into the car. A lot of it stems from abducted a little before 8, parked 4 hours later, didn't get gas, didn't go far. Everything changes with a nighttime abduction. And what would we expect? Not going far means that Jennifer and all her cases and bags were hidden in the area of her condo between 8 and 12 and never found all these years. That's not even taking into account why a woman is abducted to start with. I mean this isn't cozy murders territory. (Actually a crime genre believe it or not.) I have no interest in delving into the mind of someone like this but an abduction and disappearance is for a reason.

 

[scadagirl28]

It used to be on page 14 of the Discussion thread but they have since removed it .

 

[rd_jfc]

It used to be on page 14 of the Discussion thread but they have since removed it .

no, I just found it, the pages renumber it looks like and links are no good after another page added.

 

[rd_jfc]

I tried to find this, can you provide a link?

Yes, I rolled through the guestbook and found it. Pages renumber with 1 being most recent it looks like so this link good for only a limited time (but it will be on a nearby page)

http://jenniferkesse.123guestbook.com/?page=27

3rd post down, 7:00pm 07-23-2014, replied on 7:23am 07-24-2014

I just want to say once again how painful I realize this is for the Kesses. This is their missing daughter. They handle the awfulness of this with a grace that does Jennifer's memory proud.

rd

 

[rd_jfc]

rd, There is a new podcast called Unconcluded. On episode two, Two Endpoints, Mrs.Kesse retracts the 10.40 time for the phones. She says she was never told that by LE. However she does restate that the phones were powered down together and her last ping may be a glitch in the tower. This may be due to it not pinging the tower closest to Mosaic. Otherwise why question it ? If the possibility exists that Travis's phone did ping the tower closest to Mosaic , roaming for Jennifer's phone is possible.

How specifically does he retract this information, if you could summarize?

 

[Connected]

If you think about the timeline, Blink got involved with the Kesses and contacted them in 2012. Drew made the comment about the 10:40 powering down of Jenn's phone after that. Did he retract it because so much of what Blink published has been called into question?

 

[scadagirl28]

Thank you for finding that rd ! I went back to my original post and it wasn't there. I am going to paraphrase the phones were powered off they were useless. We have never been told by LE the time.

 

[Connected]

scadagirl28, you're right. Drew DID state that on the guestbook. However, as you guys have said, Joyce said something different on the podcast. Until we know, 10:40 is a non-starter

 

[rd_jfc]

If you think about the timeline, Blink got involved with the Kesses and contacted them in 2012. Drew made the comment about the 10:40 powering down of Jenn's phone after that. Did he retract it because so much of what Blink published has been called into question?

It's a good question, and probably something to it, however, the quote from Mrs. Kesse that LE never told them the time is not the same as retracting the information. It just means that it's not official LE information.

For that matter, all LE would be able to do is pass on carrier analysis without garbling it. They have no input into carrier log analysis.

But, it is possible that whoever told them this info they consider less reliable now, and the statement is the safe summary of the current situation. I would consider that recognizing powered down together as LE information is still somewhat helpful and informative.

My opinion is that the time wasn't dreamed up but not confirmed by LE, i.e. withheld as evidence, but practically every scenario is viable except for I think abduction by a technical novice.

 

[JnRyan]

It's a good question, and probably something to it, however, the quote from Mrs. Kesse that LE never told them the time is not the same as retracting the information. It just means that it's not official LE information.

For that matter, all LE would be able to do is pass on carrier analysis without garbling it. They have no input into carrier log analysis.

But, it is possible that whoever told them this info they consider less reliable now, and the statement is the safe summary of the current situation. I would consider that recognizing powered down together as LE information is still somewhat helpful and informative.

My opinion is that the time wasn't dreamed up but not confirmed by LE, i.e. withheld as evidence, but practically every scenario is viable except for I think abduction by a technical novice.

The 10:40 PM time of the phones being powered down is something I can't ignore after Mr. Kesse's post on the guestbook. I can't reconcile that with the retraction on Unconcluded. What does remain is BOTH were supposedly powered off at the same time. That does 2 things for me - the abductor got possession of both phones and he knew enough to power both down so he won't be tracked. I would imagine even the most sophisticated cell phone user would have stopped searching for a phone after he found hers so how did come across both? The fact that he would power both down leads me away from the workers, who in 2005, probably aren't knowledgeable enough to know that about cell phones.

With the bathroom situation, her clothes laid out and both phones being found I can see a morning abduction. Then again the workers stated they surely didn't see her and they apparently noticed her from her complaints about the workers. She was apparently a person of habit and she wasn't seen walking to her car at 0730-0745 that morning so something prior to her leaving interrupted her routine? I tend to lean toward a morning abduction. A morning abduction is not out for me as look what happened with Kelsey Smith in the Kansas City area: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kelsey_Smith And if the abductor came back at 10:00 AM - 11:00 AM to get the car and move it only a mile he may have not left much forensic evidence in the car that he needed to remove.

But I can't rule out an evening abduction. The 10:40 time still bothers me. Did Jennifer ever put her briefcase in her car the evening before? Was this an opportunistic event where she went to the car to put the briefcase in and take the DVD player out? Or was she lured out of her condo. A local call to her landline would not show in phone records so could she have been called and she went to her car? If this was a planned event, that might have worked and night time would seem to be preferable to a morning abduction. Easier to hide in the dark and blitz attack her. Easier to do whatever it is the abductor had planned in the dark. More time to thoroughly clean the car of forensic evidence. And coming back to get Jennifer's car in mid morning leaves a chance that the workers might have seen him.

The location or lack thereof of the car at 0730-0745 is lacking for me in all this. The workers noted Jennifer due to her striking good looks so would they noticed her car being gone that morning from its designated spot? Wasn't the property manager notified at mid to late morning that day? Did he wait for the Kesse's who didn't arrive till 3:00 PM or did he go to the condo and knock on her door that morning? Since I've seen from other shows (Disappeared, Van Susteren?) that the parking places were marked with the condo's number would he have checked her spot to see if a car was there?

I have too many unanswered questions about the phones and the car.

 

[htiff]

The 10:40 PM time of the phones being powered down is something I can't ignore after Mr. Kesse's post on the guestbook. I can't reconcile that with the retraction on Unconcluded. What does remain is BOTH were supposedly powered off at the same time. That does 2 things for me - the abductor got possession of both phones and he knew enough to power both down so he won't be tracked. I would imagine even the most sophisticated cell phone user would have stopped searching for a phone after he found hers so how did come across both? The fact that he would power both down leads me away from the workers, who in 2005, probably aren't knowledgeable enough to know that about cell phones.

With the bathroom situation, her clothes laid out and both phones being found I can see a morning abduction. Then again the workers stated they surely didn't see her and they apparently noticed her from her complaints about the workers. She was apparently a person of habit and she wasn't seen walking to her car at 0730-0745 that morning so something prior to her leaving interrupted her routine? I tend to lean toward a morning abduction. A morning abduction is not out for me as look what happened with Kelsey Smith in the Kansas City area: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kelsey_Smith And if the abductor came back at 10:00 AM - 11:00 AM to get the car and move it only a mile he may have not left much forensic evidence in the car that he needed to remove.

But I can't rule out an evening abduction. The 10:40 time still bothers me. Did Jennifer ever put her briefcase in her car the evening before? Was this an opportunistic event where she went to the car to put the briefcase in and take the DVD player out? Or was she lured out of her condo. A local call to her landline would not show in phone records so could she have been called and she went to her car? If this was a planned event, that might have worked and night time would seem to be preferable to a morning abduction. Easier to hide in the dark and blitz attack her. Easier to do whatever it is the abductor had planned in the dark. More time to thoroughly clean the car of forensic evidence. And coming back to get Jennifer's car in mid morning leaves a chance that the workers might have seen him.

The location or lack thereof of the car at 0730-0745 is lacking for me in all this. The workers noted Jennifer due to her striking good looks so would they noticed her car being gone that morning from its designated spot? Wasn't the property manager notified at mid to late morning that day? Did he wait for the Kesse's who didn't arrive till 3:00 PM or did he go to the condo and knock on her door that morning? Since I've seen from other shows (Disappeared, Van Susteren?) that the parking places were marked with the condo's number would he have checked her spot to see if a car was there?

I have too many unanswered questions about the phones and the car.

2006 phone ping evidence was not nearly as sophisticated or as well understood as it is now. And phones back then were dinosaurs to what we have now . My understanding is that you can't know whether a phone is not pinging or connecting with a cell tower, because it is out of range, or turned off or in airport mode, or the battery died, unless you have the phone itself in your possession. I have a feeling this whole bit about the batteries being taken out is conjecture.

What I suspect on this, is that Jennifer's phone pinged a tower on the night of the 23rd that made it appear as if she made the call while traveling away from her apartment--which is where the theory that she was going to mail the cell phone that night evolved from. The police liked this theory, the family never bought it.

And what Jennifer's mother explained on UnConcluded was that due to the tower nearest her apartment being damaged, Jennifer's phone pinged a tower farther away, because the one nearest to her apartment, wasn't fully operational, so her phone searched out the next nearest. This gave the appearance of her going out that night, but all the other evidence points away from this occurring.

Interviews with the Kesses have it that there was actually a discussion Jennifer had with someone, not sure who, that she would be sending the brother's friend his phone from work.

Regarding the car and the gas, that's the most concrete information we have. And even if there is some discrepancy regarding gas used, the fact remains, Jennifer's car never got very far.

Why would anyone bring the car back to HOTG if they had managed to drive it far, far away?

 

[rd_jfc]

The 10:40 PM time of the phones being powered down is something I can't ignore after Mr. Kesse's post on the guestbook. I can't reconcile that with the retraction on Unconcluded. What does remain is BOTH were supposedly powered off at the same time. That does 2 things for me - the abductor got possession of both phones and he knew enough to power both down so he won't be tracked. I would imagine even the most sophisticated cell phone user would have stopped searching for a phone after he found hers so how did come across both? The fact that he would power both down leads me away from the workers, who in 2005, probably aren't knowledgeable enough to know that about cell phones.

With the bathroom situation, her clothes laid out and both phones being found I can see a morning abduction. Then again the workers stated they surely didn't see her and they apparently noticed her from her complaints about the workers. She was apparently a person of habit and she wasn't seen walking to her car at 0730-0745 that morning so something prior to her leaving interrupted her routine? I tend to lean toward a morning abduction. A morning abduction is not out for me as look what happened with Kelsey Smith in the Kansas City area: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kelsey_Smith And if the abductor came back at 10:00 AM - 11:00 AM to get the car and move it only a mile he may have not left much forensic evidence in the car that he needed to remove.

But I can't rule out an evening abduction. The 10:40 time still bothers me. Did Jennifer ever put her briefcase in her car the evening before? Was this an opportunistic event where she went to the car to put the briefcase in and take the DVD player out? Or was she lured out of her condo. A local call to her landline would not show in phone records so could she have been called and she went to her car? If this was a planned event, that might have worked and night time would seem to be preferable to a morning abduction. Easier to hide in the dark and blitz attack her. Easier to do whatever it is the abductor had planned in the dark. More time to thoroughly clean the car of forensic evidence. And coming back to get Jennifer's car in mid morning leaves a chance that the workers might have seen him.

The location or lack thereof of the car at 0730-0745 is lacking for me in all this. The workers noted Jennifer due to her striking good looks so would they noticed her car being gone that morning from its designated spot? Wasn't the property manager notified at mid to late morning that day? Did he wait for the Kesse's who didn't arrive till 3:00 PM or did he go to the condo and knock on her door that morning? Since I've seen from other shows (Disappeared, Van Susteren?) that the parking places were marked with the condo's number would he have checked her spot to see if a car was there?

I have too many unanswered questions about the phones and the car.

Really good questions. Sums up exactly how I feel too.

 

[rd_jfc]

2006 phone ping evidence was not nearly as sophisticated or as well understood as it is now. And phones back then were dinosaurs to what we have now . My understanding is that you can't know whether a phone is not pinging or connecting with a cell tower, because it is out of range, or turned off or in airport mode, or the battery died, unless you have the phone itself in your possession. I have a feeling this whole bit about the batteries being taken out is conjecture.

What I suspect on this, is that Jennifer's phone pinged a tower on the night of the 23rd that made it appear as if she made the call while traveling away from her apartment--which is where the theory that she was going to mail the cell phone that night evolved from. The police liked this theory, the family never bought it.

And what Jennifer's mother explained on UnConcluded was that due to the tower nearest her apartment being damaged, Jennifer's phone pinged a tower farther away, because the one nearest to her apartment, wasn't fully operational, so her phone searched out the next nearest. This gave the appearance of her going out that night, but all the other evidence points away from this occurring.

Interviews with the Kesses have it that there was actually a discussion Jennifer had with someone, not sure who, that she would be sending the brother's friend his phone from work.

Regarding the car and the gas, that's the most concrete information we have. And even if there is some discrepancy regarding gas used, the fact remains, Jennifer's car never got very far.

Why would anyone bring the car back to HOTG if they had managed to drive it far, far away?

Just a couple of things to add to your good thoughts.

Regarding an inoperative tower, this would be the situation from the time she got home. It would be the tower where she made her cell phone calls that evening. What would be significant is if the primary tower changed at any time, especially up to the phone ceasing pinging. Which tower was primary all evening wasn't significant, a change in towers is significant. I have no idea how many towers might have been within cell phone signal range, I have read usually about a mile and a half.

The comment about can't be in two places at once indicates to me a cell phone switching from tower A to tower B and then back to tower A way in a relatively short amount of time. But this isn't rocket science and no it wasn't any less exact and unknown in 2006. A tower recording a ping is not a vague inexact science. There is nothing complicated about interpreting the results. A cell phone ID is either in a tower's logs or it isn't, and the timestamp when it is is not open for interpretation.

Batteries presumably removed appears to reference some unknown models that were said to continue pinging after shutdown. The whole area is murky and rife with CIA hysteria, so searches on solid information worthless. The gist of it appears to be that no more pings were seen. And of course this was in a time battery removal was still a thing. (I have a Blackberry and not the popular things and can still remove the battery, but I don't keep up with popular stuff.)

The car returned to HOTG from wherever is to return the abductor to an area where he can get home but not back to the Mosaic where he could be seen. Obviously an abduction just 4 or so hours earlier doesn't leave a lot of time for an abduction and disappearance of Jennifer and all her cases and bags in her car. But someone doesn't do all this in a short amount of time. There is no matchup with the crime and criminal behavior.

 

[htiff]

BBM

Just a couple of things to add to your good thoughts.

Regarding an inoperative tower, this would be the situation from the time she got home. It would be the tower where she made her cell phone calls that evening. What would be significant is if the primary tower changed at any time, especially up to the phone ceasing pinging. Which tower was primary all evening wasn't significant, a change in towers is significant. I have no idea how many towers might have been within cell phone signal range, I have read usually about a mile and a half.

The comment about can't be in two places at once indicates to me a cell phone switching from tower A to tower B and then back to tower A way in a relatively short amount of time. But this isn't rocket science and no it wasn't any less exact and unknown in 2006. A tower recording a ping is not a vague inexact science. There is nothing complicated about interpreting the results. A cell phone ID is either in a tower's logs or it isn't, and the timestamp when it is is not open for interpretation.

Batteries presumably removed appears to reference some unknown models that were said to continue pinging after shutdown. The whole area is murky and rife with CIA hysteria, so searches on solid information worthless. The gist of it appears to be that no more pings were seen. And of course this was in a time battery removal was still a thing. (I have a Blackberry and not the popular things and can still remove the battery, but I don't keep up with popular stuff.)

The car returned to HOTG from wherever is to return the abductor to an area where he can get home but not back to the Mosaic where he could be seen. Obviously an abduction just 4 or so hours earlier doesn't leave a lot of time for an abduction and disappearance of Jennifer and all her cases and bags in her car. But someone doesn't do all this in a short amount of time. There is no matchup with the crime and criminal behavior.

We really don't know what the ping data is on this case. It would appear that the family hasn't received full disclosure on this either, or if they have they are keeping this information close to the vest.

And actually ping data is not an absolute science. There are a number of court cases overturned in the last decade, due to misinterpretation of this data.

There are a lot of reasons why we might ping off of a tower, reasons that are not directly related to geographical proximity. Our phones might bypass the nearest tower to us because of ---subscriber overload; a damaged tower; there could be something in the phone itself or the service provider's lease arrangements that dictate where our individual phone might ping. Also, back in 2006 you had to agree to pay roaming charges if you were out of reach of your server's leased towers. And cell phones have been known to ping towers as far as 30 miles away from the caller.

And I don't agree that if there was a damaged tower near to her, Jennifer would have hit the same tower each time. Jennifer lived near a shopping mall and a busy intersection with freeways close by, depending on the number of subscribers in use at any given time, her calls could bounce around.

In regard to the theory that phones can still be traced, even when off, but only if the battery is in place--there's some controversy around this. I for one, have never known of a case where the battery was removed, and LE knew about the removal before they located the phone. And we don't even know what kind of phone Jennifer had. And though I am by no means an expert, I just completed a fairly extensive research project looking for this very event. Couldn't find any examples of this occurring. I may have missed it, though.


There are so many unknowns for us in the public.

But I'm not sure it matters whether she was abducted at night or in the morning. She never got far, according to both where her car was found and the amount of gas used. These two little facts, seem to be the only evidence we have at this point that has been unwavering and never contradicted publicly.

Maybe this info isn't accurate, but it seems the most reasonable place to focus. But you are right, there is just so much we don't know for certain.

This article gives a rough overview of how and why cell phones ping where they do:

http://www.diligentiagroup.com/lega...g-cell-phone-location-cell-tower-information/

 

[rd_jfc]

BBM

We really don't know what the ping data is on this case. It would appear that the family hasn't received full disclosure on this either, or if they have they are keeping this information close to the vest.

And actually ping data is not an absolute science. There are a number of court cases overturned in the last decade, due to misinterpretation of this data.

There are a lot of reasons why we might ping off of a tower, reasons that are not directly related to geographical proximity. Our phones might bypass the nearest tower to us because of ---subscriber overload; a damaged tower; there could be something in the phone itself or the service provider's lease arrangements that dictate where our individual phone might ping. Also, back in 2006 you had to agree to pay roaming charges if you were out of reach of your server's leased towers. And cell phones have been known to ping towers as far as 30 miles away from the caller.

And I don't agree that if there was a damaged tower near to her, Jennifer would have hit the same tower each time. Jennifer lived near a shopping mall and a busy intersection with freeways close by, depending on the number of subscribers in use at any given time, her calls could bounce around.

In regard to the theory that phones can still be traced, even when off, but only if the battery is in place--there's some controversy around this. I for one, have never known of a case where the battery was removed, and LE knew about the removal before they located the phone. And we don't even know what kind of phone Jennifer had. And though I am by no means an expert, I just completed a fairly extensive research project looking for this very event. Couldn't find any examples of this occurring. I may have missed it, though.


There are so many unknowns for us in the public.

But I'm not sure it matters whether she was abducted at night or in the morning. She never got far, according to both where her car was found and the amount of gas used. These two little facts, seem to be the only evidence we have at this point that has been unwavering and never contradicted publicly.

Maybe this info isn't accurate, but it seems the most reasonable place to focus. But you are right, there is just so much we don't know for certain.

This article gives a rough overview of how and why cell phones ping where they do:

http://www.diligentiagroup.com/lega...g-cell-phone-location-cell-tower-information/

You are confusing locating the cell phone with what is going on in the thread. No one is talking about locating the cell phone.

Your information is very descriptive and helpful to readers, but mostly is a more detailed rendering of what I wrote. We are in agreement with the details. I did the research for multiple cases 10 to 15 years ago and due to this case still do some research such as on battery removal, etc. The research I did has included cell phone location which is a complex subject. We are nowhere near that with this information.

 

[htiff]

You are confusing locating the cell phone with what is going on in the thread. No one is talking about locating the cell phone.

Your information is very descriptive and helpful to readers, but mostly is a more detailed rendering of what I wrote. We are in agreement with the details. I did the research for multiple cases 10 to 15 years ago and due to this case still do some research such as on battery removal, etc. The research I did has included cell phone location which is a complex subject. We are nowhere near that with this information.

You've obviously done some great research. My comments weren't about finding a cell phone though. They were in relation to understanding where the caller is, or was, based on cell phone pings.

My only comment pertaining to cell phone location was that I just don't know how someone would know why a cell phone was not making contact with a tower, if they don't actually have possession of the phone.

 

[JnRyan]

As far as Jennifer's car there are some things I don't believe we know and LE may not either. As far as how it would be known what distance her car traveled that day, we don't know for sure when she last filled up (there would be no record of a cash transaction if Jennifer merely put in a few gallons), we don't know the odometer readings unless there is a very recent service or safety inspection (I don't know if FL had safety inspections then) or the mpg of that particular car. However, if the CNN/Nancy Grace article is correct there was no forensic evidence of Jennifer being transported in her vehicle. And there was almost no forensic evidence with regard to an unknown driver. I can't see the driver cleaning the car of his DNA, hair and fingerprints that well so maybe the car was only driven 1-2 miles to HOTG. That is what make me believe the car was not driven far.

That means we have another vehicle? When was Jennifer's vehicle moved from the condo complex? And if Jennifer wasn't transported - alive or deceased - in her car why move it? To confuse LE? If this was a morning abduction in a 2nd vehicle the abductor could have driven for an hour, did what he did and driven back to complex. If Jennifer was murdered - and I believe she was - he could have done that quickly and driven back. Then move Jennifer's car to HOTG. Anything further he needed to do at the crime scene he drove to earlier he could have taken his time to go back and clean up - toss the briefcase, purse and cell phones. Considering this scenario, I would hope LE vacuumed the interior for any soil or plant evidence. I've never heard if LE checked traffic cameras or business surveillance cameras on the roads leading to HOTG either. If LE did and saw her car hopefully that can come into play later if they ID a suspect.

And if we have an evening abduction that changes things somewhat. And then I'm back to my question as to whether or not Jennifer's car was there at 0730. In any event, Jennifer's car was somewhere else if only to be driven from her parking spot to HOTG.