GUILTY GA - Ahmaud Arbery, 25, jogger, fatally shot by former LEO and son, Brunswick, Feb 2020 *Arrests* #5

[Cryptic]

What is known is that Ahmaud Arbery was shot and killed after a confrontation with two suspects. There are evidently two very different versions of what led to the confrontation and shooting:

Ahmaud Arbery case will go to grand jury - CNN

A. Ahmaud Arbery was jogging while black. He was then chased down and murdered pursuant to the racist "a black male is a suspected criminal" line of "thinking".

B. Arbery resembled a burglar who had struck the neighborhood in the past / was in the act of fleeing from an attempted burglary. He then attacked an individual who tried to stop him and was shot only after repeatedly trying to get control of a weapon.

It appears that even with the suspects own admission, the chase was initiated because Arbery simply peered into a home under construction. In Georgia, private citizens, can only make citizens arrests for felonies that they have exact knowledge of.

Thus, even giving credence to possibility "B", the suspects had no lawful ability to detain Arbery.

IMO, this case is vitally important to Georgia as the olde school notion that one class of citizens has extremely broad rights of "self defense" over other classes of citizens and that they have some kind of endowed arrest / command authority over this group needs to end.

In short, these two men need to be prosecuted..... .

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GA - Ahmaud Arbery, 25, Brunswick, 23 Feb 2020 *MEDIA, MAPS &TIMELINE *NO DISCUSSION*

 

[Tiff23fr]

Please continue here….

 

[tara83]

You just never know with juries.Will some of the people on it have some of the same beliefs that the neighbors seemed to have?Some really seemed to have jumped to the conclusion that the black man had to have been up to no good in their view.All it takes is one.

 

[Jax49]

Don't forget these three defendants are also facing Federal charges.

The three men are also facing federal hate crimes charges. In April, the Justice Department returned an indictment alleging that Gregory McMichael, Travis McMichael and William "Roddie" Bryan used force and threats of force to intimidate and interfere with Arbery's right to use a public street because of his race. It also alleges all three defendants attempted to unlawfully seize and confine Arbery and detain him against his will.

What to know about the trial of three men charged with killing Ahmaud Arbery

 

[Kaley Smith]

I agree it's a different case. Far more evidence of self defense in the Rittenhouse case.

 

[tlcya]

Jury instructions still being wrangled. It's been going on all day. This, while boring, is super important and I am trying to hang with it for that reason.

 

[Hope4More]

Defense argument: if we were NOT executing a lawful citizen's arrest & executing it lawfully, then we were the aggressors, and had no right to threaten/harm/kill AA with a shotgun. If we were, then what happened in front of the truck was lawful self defense, because AA had no legal right to attack Travis.

 

[tlcya]

judge: we are dancing on the head of a pin here.

I agree, this nailing down of the appropriate language for these instructions is no small feat.

 

[Cryptic]

I agree it's a different case. Far more evidence of self defense in the Rittenhouse case.

I agree- far more evidence of self defense and the evidence for self defense was the primary reason for the aquittal.

But.... portions of the that evidence could be seen two different ways. In the end, I think there is another component to the aquittal besides the evidence of self defense:

"Ordinary Joe" prosecutors take on top notch defense attorneys- and are out classed from day one. Rittenhouse trial featured:

- Prosecutors claiming to have misunderstood or "forgotten" the judges previous rulings. As with Gough's antics in this case, I strongly suspect these claims are signs of being out classed- and grasping at straws.

- Prosecutors appearing not to have studied all the available video evidence in its entirety and unable to respond to changes in testimony by key witnesses (man who had been shot) regarding when he pointed a pistol at "R".

In short, I think "A team" prosecutors would have studied all the physical evidence extensively. They would also be well aware that witnesses for the prosecution might be presenting uhmmm...... "spun" versions of the events- and have planned / reacted better.

 

[Cool Cats]

I agree- far more evidence of self defense and the evidence for self defense was the primary reason for the aquittal.

But.... portions of the that evidence could be seen two different ways. In the end, I think there is another component to the aquittal besides the evidence of self defense:

"Ordinary Joe" prosecutors take on top notch defense attorneys- and are out classed from day one. Rittenhouse trial featured:

- Prosecutors claiming to have misunderstood or "forgotten" the judges previous rulings. As with Gough's antics in this case, I strongly suspect these claims are signs of being out classed- and grasping at straws.

- Prosecutors appearing not to have studied all the available video evidence in its entirety and unable to respond to changes in testimony by key witnesses (man who had been shot) regarding when he pointed a pistol at "R".

In short, I think "A team" prosecutors would have studied all the physical evidence extensively. They would also be well aware that witnesses for the prosecution might be presenting uhmmm...... "spun" versions of the events- and have planned / reacted better.

Georgia judge denies defense motion for mistrial in Ahmaud Arbery case

A Georgia judge denied a motion for a mistrial on Friday in the Ahmaud Arbery murder case from a defense lawyer who claimed that Black pastors outside the courthouse were a "woke left mob" that influenced the jury in the trial of three white men.

More than 200 pastors gathered on Thursday outside the Glynn County courthouse in coastal Brunswick, Georgia. Organizers said it was a response to defense attorney Kevin Gough's previous comments that he "didn't want any more Black pastors" in the courtroom.

Kevin Gough, the defence attorney for William “Roddie” Bryan, in Glynn County Courthouse (AP)

Several nationally known Black clergy and civil rights leaders including Rev. Al Sharpton, Rev. Jesse Jackson and Martin Luther King III have sat with Arbery's family in the courtroom at various times.

Gough showed the court photographs of the large gathering on Thursday and said it was an unfair influence or perhaps intimidated the jury. "This is a trial that's been infected by a woke left mob," he said.

"This is what a public lynching looks like in the 21st Century," Gough said. "There is pressure being exerted on the jury."

Prosecutor Linda Dunikoski countered that Gough, a "brilliant" and "calculating" lawyer, made the courtroom comment about Black pastors with the intention of provoking the gathering.

 

[sds71]

@MarilynParkerTV

https://twitter.com/MarilynParkerTV/status/1461823835842490379
We are still on the defense charge sheet. Here is Judge Walmsley.

 

[Cryptic]

Prosecutor Linda Dunikoski countered that Gough, a "brilliant" and "calculating" lawyer, made the courtroom comment about Black pastors with the intention of provoking the gathering.

I am thinking that Dunikoski is either:

A: Too modest and too kind to describe Gough as: The pompous and marginally competent lawyer that is way out of his league.

B: Sarcastic.

Or.... maybe she is "C" - a little of both "A" and "B".

 

[Cool Cats]

I am thinking that Dunikoski is either:

A: Too modest and kind to describe Gough as the: The pompous and marginally competent lawyer that is out of his league.

B: Sarcastic.

Or.... "C" - a little of both "A" and "B".

I'm guessing B.

Depends on how she stated it. Voice inflection, eyeroll, facial expression, body language, that kind of thing.

 

[Hope4More]

I am thinking that Dunikoski is either:

A: Too modest and too kind to describe Gough as: The pompous and marginally competent lawyer that is way out of his league.

B: Sarcastic.

Or.... maybe she is "C" - a little of both "A" and "B".

Or D. None of the above. Her point was that Gough knew exactly what he was doing, what he'd done was to create an issue he could argue was the basis for mistrial and/or an appeal, and lo, here he was doing just that. It was simply good lawyering for her to tell the Court/put on the record, that hey, if there's actually an issue here (and there's no reason to believe it impacted the jury) it's because Gough created it wholecloth & he/the defendants can't be rewarded for his doing so.

 

[Cryptic]

Defense argument: if we were NOT executing a lawful citizen's arrest & executing it lawfully, then we were the aggressors......

Looks like they were undoubtably the aggressors:

- Georgia law states that there is no trespass in open construction sites unless the person has been told not to enter, or it is marked with no trespassing signs, behind a fence etc.

- Even if trespass occurred, only the owner and his agent (Perez) truly had authority to determine who had, or did not have permission to enter the property.

- And.... even if the Ms and R had permission to act against trespassers and the victim was actually trespassing, the Georgia Supreme Court has ruled that a citizens arrest must use force proportionate to the offense (case involved shooting a shoplifter). Chasing a trespasser after the fact with weapons is not proportional force.

In short, the Ms and R cannot even "get past go". And,... even if given a wildly favorable review regarding "getting past go", they still used hugely disproportionate force for an after the fact trespasser.

 

[Cryptic]

Her point was that Gough knew exactly what he was doing, what he'd done was to create an issue he could argue was the basis for mistrial and/or an appeal, and lo, here he was doing just that.

Crafty lawyers create sustainable issues and present well articulated arguments that a judge needs to ponder before rejecting. The arguments then have a chance of actually winning at the appellate level.

They dont just toss things out in desperation. Gough has apparently not won a single legal argument at the trial. Thus, the odds of him presenting a sustainable (as opposed to a tossed out) argument to an appellate court seem very small.

In short, Gough is not crafty-he is pompous, desperate, in over his head- and tossing stuff out. Nothing even comes close to sticking though.

 

[Hope4More]

One of the most important issues argued today during the charge conference is whether or not the jury would be instructed on the possible applicability of the citizen's arrest law, and if so, the precise wording of that instruction.

Here's a portion of the discussion, with LD at her very best, IMO, dissecting the legal context & background of the phrase that citizens have a DUTY to make a citizen's arrest if they have knowledge a felony has been committed.

 

[Hope4More]

If this charging decision holds & the jury follows the law as instructed, it's very likely Travis & Greg will be convicted.

Defense says ruling by judge in Ahmaud Arbery trial over citizens arrest law guts their case

 

[Cool Cats]

Ahmaud Arbery trial: Defense attorney claims 'public lynching' of man accused in the killing

The Rev. Jesse Jackson, left, sits with Ahmaud Arbery’s mother, Wanda Cooper-Jones, center, during the trial on Monday.

Defense attorney Kevin Gough called the murder trial of Ahmaud Arbery, an unarmed Black jogger, a "public lynching" of his client -- who is one of three white men accused of chasing and killing Arbery.

He claimed that the trial has been "infected by mob violence by the woke-left mob," and asked the judge for a mistrial once again. His request was denied by the judge.

Defense attorney Kevin Gough speaks during the trial.

"Third parties are influencing this case," Gough said, referring to the "spectator activity" and "media frenzy" concerning public figures attending the trial and gathering outside of the courtroom. "This is what a public lynching looks like in the 21st century."

Prosecutor Linda Dunikoski had argued that "there's absolutely no evidence here that the jurors have been influenced in any way by the first and only larger crowd that came yesterday. No evidence that they even knew it was out there."

Pastor Jamal Bryant, bottom center, leads a group prayer for to nearly 750 pastors, supporters and family of Ahmaud Arbery gathered outside the Glynn County Courthouse Nov. 18, 2021, in Brunswick, Ga.

 

[Niner]

here's the tweets for yesterday, Friday, Nov. 19th:

Veronica Waters
@MissVWaters
·
13h
At charge conf. in #AhmaudArbery shooting case, Judge Walmsley's heard ~20 mins of arguments on citizen's arrest language re: "contemporaneous detentions." He said, "Y'all have argued my brain into mush. We're going to take a short recess while I clear my head & figure this out”



Next reports on @wsbradio
The defense lawyer who moved for a mistrial in the #AhmauArbery shooting case based on a "public lynching," and the Court decision that made one lawyer say the judge was handing a victory to the other side.



The charge conference is a wrap. The judge agrees to add lesser charges on Count 7--the Aggravated Assault with Trucks count. Lawyers argue whether there's evidence of attempted carjacking by #AhmaudArbery. Gough contends that should put citizen's arrest back in.

link: https://twitter.com/MissVWaters