GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 # 3

[Harry Potter]

Sorry to have posted and left. I don't have any official source for the drugging other than statements from classmates that he was already on some sort of medication that has either been changed or ramped up since his arrest.

Also, as for the BearCard, at Mercer it is indispensable for law students as it grants access to the school itself at any entrance except the main door, including the side entrance directly next to Lauren's home. That said, it has no real purpose other than access and there is likely a log that has been looked at by Mercer police. Further, it is a huge process to get the bearcard replaced as the office responsible for its replacement, which you have to go to in person, has weird hours and isn't even open most days during the summer.

 

[GeorgiaSunshine]

There's always the possibility that she didn't leave home without her personal items, and that the killer put them back in her apartment.

Or again, the killer was already in her apt, by way of her hidden key or a skeleton key, and he did not attack until later, so she had put down her zaxbys, cellphone etc. He could have even been hiding and hit her from behind or chloroformed her, tazed her??

From an earlier thread question, were her running shoes gone? From a very respected source, they were in apt, and that is why I have a hard time with McDs lengthy interview, where he repeatedly says she could've been snatched while running. If he helped on the search, he would have seen her shoes, was this a red herring he was trying to throw out there?

http://www.wmac-am.com/includes/news_items/6/463/7oclockhour.mp3

 

[PsychoMom]

Or again, the killer was already in her apt, by way of her hidden key or a skeleton key, and he did not attack until later, so she had put down her zaxbys, cellphone etc. He could have even been hiding and hit her from behind or chloroformed her, tazed her??

From an earlier thread question, were her running shoes gone? From a very respected source, they were in apt, and that is why I have a hard time with McDs lengthy interview, where he repeatedly says she could've been snatched while running. If he helped on the search, he would have seen her shoes, was this a red herring he was trying to throw out there?

http://www.wmac-am.com/includes/news_items/6/463/7oclockhour.mp3

Seeing shoes wouldn't mean anything. I have more than one pair of shoes. Heck, I have more than one pair of running shoes. So, just seeing a pair of shoes wouldn't mean she couldn't have been out with another pair on.

And in all fairness, we do not know the attacker was in the apartment. We simply know she made it back from Zaxby's before disappearing from the apartment.

 

[GypsiesTramps&Thieves]

About the night of rage/terror thing....I was hanging out with a group of friends in VERY close vicinity to lauren's apartment on the night of June 25 (which is the last night she had contact with anyone) and I have to say that I didn't hear any of the "hooping and hollering" that was reported by someone else. We ate outside and stayed outside until fairly late and I remember it as a perfectly nice evening in that neighborhood. My friend and I walked home about three blocks away walking right past lauren's apartment never seeing or hearing anything out of the ordinary. We never encountered anyone else. And believe me....I am always on high alert walking in downtown Macon at night. If we had seen even another person walking I would have paid attention to it.

 

[SouthernKate]

The night of rage theory is very far fetched, the dismemberment of a victim is not a normal gang initiation, that I can locate on line.
The serial theory May have some legs. There are a lot of similarities to the teacher that went missing a few years back. Locked door. Car left, keys at home. The difference is the teachers purse was not in the home. the teacher Tara Grinstead was her name and she lived in ocillia ga. I don't have a link you can just Google her name and teacher and ga and it should come up.
Of course it could be as simple as a jilted person, taking out their anger.
We will more than likely hear something this week as school is about to be back in secession in a week or so.

Tara's case has a thread here:

Tara Grinstead - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

(if that link doesn't work, just put her name in the search function)

I really don't think the two cases are related in any way.

 

[bessie]

I am not trying to scare you PsychoMom, just want you to know that. But these random ideas just keep coming to me, and I'm sure they do to you, too.

I was mainly trying to think why would a young woman leave her home on a Saturday night without her cell phone, especially. Yes, you would think she would have screamed in this scenario, unless they put their hand over her mouth.

IF, if, if, if SMD did NOT do this (and I'm trying not to make a judgment there), I'm just saying it does not necessarily mean a serial killer is loose in Macon. It could just be your run-of-the-mill "gansta" types, which is not exactly more comforting, I know. Someone without a car IMO, because otherwise you would logically think they could have found ANYWHERE to dump her torso besides on the very property she disappeared from!

Possible, except that would mean that not only did they dispose of the remains on the property, the perp carried out the dismemberment right there, as well, then placed the remains in the trash can before leaving. I think it's very unlikely the remains could have gone undetected in the trash can for four days.

The other alternative is that the perp returned to the apartment to dispose of the torso, which is extremely unlikely. Anyone worried about being caught, enough that he took the time to dispose of the remains, would not return to the scene of the crime with the remains in hand.

Then there's the refrigerator LE removed from the downstairs apartment. Some reason exists for them to do that. How would a complete stranger know the former tenants wouldn't return if some of their belongings were still there?

No forced entry, dismemberment, the location of the remains, all indicate that Lauren was acquainted with her killer, and the killer lives on or nearby the property, or spends enough time there to be familiar and comfortable with the surroundings. Besides McD, a few possibles are another resident in the complex, a frequent visitor to one of the residents, or a maintenance person.

 

[PsychoMom]

I still get hung up on the refrigerator being removed from the apartment below. Several initial stories indicated the residents of that particular apartment were moving out the week LG was missing. It did not indicate they were already moved out that week, only that they were moving out during that week. It was empty when the torso was found. Everyone keeps saying SM was using that apartment, but I think not. The people who were living there were in and out if they were moving out that week. To me, that means either they were involved in anything that happened in their apartment or the apartment was not used. I am leaning towards it not being used.

Now, if we have evidence they were completely out of the apartment before June 25th, then it changes things. I do have a hard time thinking the woman in the apartment next to that one wouldn't have noticed someone going in and out of the empty apartment next to her if they didn't have a reason to go in and out. Like, as I have seen mentioned, a maintenance man, or someone doing physical repairs on the apartment. Weird little boy from upstairs would have stood out to her. And she would have been screaming it to the moon and back.

 

[Backwoods]

Seeing shoes wouldn't mean anything. I have more than one pair of shoes. Heck, I have more than one pair of running shoes. So, just seeing a pair of shoes wouldn't mean she couldn't have been out with another pair on.

<snip>
Though wondering if running shoes were there is a good line of inquiry (and now we know that a pair was, at least), I agree she could have had more than one. Also -- in the kind of hurried lookabout that would have been going on while the friends were searching, that might not have come to mind -- look how long it took for the question to pop up on here.

 

[Givsmetheshivers]

Hi Everyone,
I have been following the case and everyone's comments on WS.

I wonder if there are more cases like this one:
http://www.doenetwork.org/hot/hotcase21.html
that inspired the FBI to get involved in the first place.

 

[Destini]

I am just so afraid we are going to find out the FBI determined no conclusive evidence of a crime in those apartments. And I am an impatient person. What is the holdup??

If that happens, what then? What if the police clear all the POI's? Will they go back to doing searches in the area? Will they ask for the public's help? My guess is there are many people in Macon that would be glad to help with a search for the rest of poor Lauren.

Matter of fact, why aren't they doing that anyway? Are they just hoping for a confession & that the perp will tell them where he put the rest of her?

This is all just making me sick. Her poor family. How can they cope?

 

[bessie]

I still get hung up on the refrigerator being removed from the apartment below. Several initial stories indicated the residents of that particular apartment were moving out the week LG was missing. It did not indicate they were already moved out that week, only that they were moving out during that week. It was empty when the torso was found. Everyone keeps saying SM was using that apartment, but I think not. The people who were living there were in and out if they were moving out that week. To me, that means either they were involved in anything that happened in their apartment or the apartment was not used. I am leaning towards it not being used.

Now, if we have evidence they were completely out of the apartment before June 25th, then it changes things. I do have a hard time thinking the woman in the apartment next to that one wouldn't have noticed someone going in and out of the empty apartment next to her if they didn't have a reason to go in and out. Like, as I have seen mentioned, a maintenance man, or someone doing physical repairs on the apartment. Weird little boy from upstairs would have stood out to her. And she would have been screaming it to the moon and back.

Late Wednesday afternoon, investigators removed a refrigerator from the ground-floor apartment next door to Spencer’s for further forensics testing. That apartment, No. 1, is directly below Giddings’, and police have now sealed it.
Its tenant was in the process of moving during the time Giddings was missing, Bush said. Most of the furnishings had been removed before Giddings’ body was found, and the tenant has since finished moving out.

Read more: http://www.macon.com/2011/07/14/1630766/refrigerator-removed-from-apartment.html#ixzz1T4qkQWsl
​

There was a reason the refrigerator was removed. "Further forensics testing" means something found in the initial forensics testing suggested the refrigerator was used in the crime.

The tenants had removed most of their furnishings. I would speculate that they used a truck to move furniture and large items, and planned to return to pick up the smaller items left behind that would fit in a car. We don't know where they were in the meantime, but they might have an alibi. It's also possible that they mentioned to neighbors that they were leaving and would be back the following week to pick up the rest of their things.

As for the lady downstairs, she might've noticed someone going in and out of the apartment next door during the day or evening, but probably not in the late night/early morning hours.

 

[Harry Potter]

Also, a few notes of interest:


1. There are multiple easily accessible trash bins within quick walking distance to Lauren's apartment.

A. There is a huge trash bin, including multiple smaller ones 200 feet away in the law school parking lot.

B. There is a second huge trash bin behind the ATT building next door to the apartments: georgia ave, macon, ga - Google Maps

C. There is plenty of tree coverage and darkness along the alley behind Orange street, where many of the houses keep their trash bins.

2. During his first year of law school, SM sent out an email to the entire student body that was very strange and caused him to become significantly more of an outsider than he may have otherwise become. It was a "political hypothetical" that attacked Barack Obama and he received significant rebuking from the rest of the school.

3. Despite being ostracized by his classmates, SM continued to seek ways to participate in school and even ran for a school-wide elected position (honor court)--something that he never did during undergraduate.

4. It is my understanding that McDaniel 'intercepted' the student search team when they arrived at Lauren's apartment and did not play any meaningful role in going through her apartment or have any personal knowledge of the email that was sent out.

5. The notion that SM 'crashed' the graduation party at Fish n' Pig is silly. There are very few 'nice' restaurants in Macon and Fish n' Pig is the best one for a family that doesn't want to spend a ton of money and there were likely several families there celebrating.

6. SM is an incredibly pleasant and smart person based on my personal experiences and based on everything I have heard from everyone else who knows him.

 

[SmoothOperator]

I agree with MaconTime about "the night of rage" in the air that night of the 25th.. And psychomom I had been meaning to ask you about your daughter's knowledge of this.. Thanks for letting us know she has heard nothing about this night of rage either.. IMO that says alot for the reasons you stated, that she lived within feet of Laurens apt and still has friends that presently still live there.. That means that without a doubt they would have heard this night of rage if we are to believe what is being stated happened with the hooping, hollering and screaming.. Complete madness with car windows being shattered and entire gps units ripped from these cars and In a maniacal rage thrown about and destroyed left there on the ground.. Without a shadow of a doubt we would have had ATLEAST ONE, IF NOT MORE of the many locals who are posting here would have absolutely known of this maniacal rage that took place right there near downtown Macon, along with news story after news story written.. This would, if it had a grain of truth had that city completely up in arms and it would have been long before now..

Just as many, many rumors are flooding the area.. So too is this nothing but a rumor.. At most I would give it it's possible grain of truth(as we know most lies/rumors are born out of a kernel or grain of truth)and say it's possible that somewhere around the time that Lauren was murdered there may have been a car broken into and MAYBE a gps stolen or broken..

But if it's anything in the least like Memphis and it's surrounding areas and suburbs there's not a weekend that goes by that there is not atleast one of those areas that has a rash of car burglaries.. Smash and grab as many cars as the perps can hold the stolen goods they can find.. And many weekends it's multiple areas that get hit with these car break ins..

So I must say that even at it's worst case scenario that there infact be a rash of car break ins in Laurens area with gps units stolen and smashed.. Even still that is a gigantic leap to go from smash and grab car break ins to psychotic heinous murder complete with full dismemberment..

Which leads me to my final point of gangs.. Memphis has had more *than it's fair share of gang activity in the last 15-20yr especially.. And I have lived through many nights of gang initiations taking place.. Some of them very scary and some warned in advance in these last years.. And of all of the violent and disgusting gang related death that I have seen I have never seen nor even heard of this type of initiation.. Especially with main body parts still hidden.. They commit crimes and yes, even murders at times during these initiations and they are not only done to prove to their gang but it's also to send a msg to the that town or city that you don't want to mess with their specific gang.. They are left easily found and/or seen and 90+% of the time it is gun shot wounds..

The only thing that I have ever heard of as far as gang initiation that is any more heinous in a way is when a couple years in a row a specific gangs initiation was targeting young white females 20-30yoa.. As rape victims.. Not murder.. And as heinous as that was it still was not even in the same ball park as what was done to Lauren..

IMO it's not some young gangsters that on a maniacal rage night of initiation they randomly chose Lauren to murder and dismember(along with several other assaults pre and post mortem) and then keep and hide several of her missing body parts while taking her torso back to her apt complex and putting it in her trash bins for Thursday garbage pick up day..

IMO I agree with the several professionals on last nights shows investigators/FBI profiler this was someone who knew this victim and likely had been rebuffed or atleast felt they were rebuffed therefor had an inner rage of hatred that was unleashed on Lauren in a very violent sexual manner, as well as wanting to degrade her in the absolute most heinous of ways imaginable.. The profiler also made mention of cases where the perp had successfully gotten rid of as in disposal, destroying, hiding, burying certain parts of the remAins and would keep specific part such as the torso for sick reasons.. Then for reasons such as rushing, fear of getting caught(e.g. Knowing LE have been informed the victim is missing and are going to be conducting searches).. For reasons such as this they then are forced to dispose of the remaining body parts(torso in this case)as quickly as possible via the trash bins(lucky enough tho that it was garbage pick up day)..

So, I definitely am leaning more towards something along these type lines.. Someone that was known to Lauren.. Motive *such as rebuffed or felt rebuffed.. And Even if not McD whoever this perp is the murder and dismemberment took place somewhere extremely close to the apts with the torso ending up in Laurens exact garbage bins for her 4apt complex..

Just my opinions, though!!

 

[3doglady]

<snip>
Though wondering if running shoes were there is a good line of inquiry (and now we know that a pair was, at least), I agree she could have had more than one. Also -- in the kind of hurried lookabout that would have been going on while the friends were searching, that might not have come to mind -- look how long it took for the question to pop up on here.

Didn't LG's mom say she died doing something she loved? That statement led me to believe that the mom thought LG was running when she was attacked. But if she was running, why would her torso be in the apartment trash can? I've been following this case since the beginning but I'm on the fence about SMD. According to the actions of LE it makes sense that SMD is the killer, but there are things that just don't add up.

 

[SouthernKate]

Didn't LG's mom say she died doing something she loved? That statement led me to believe that the mom thought LG was running when she was attacked. But if she was running, why would her torso be in the apartment trash can? I've been following this case since the beginning but I'm on the fence about SMD. According to the actions of LE it makes sense that SMD is the killer, but there are things that just don't add up.

Yes, her mom did say that. It could mean that...or, the law (since she was in the midst of studying for the bar). Her mom also said, in that same interview, that LE thought/told her that Lauren didn't know what hit her. How would they know that?

 

[bessie]

Also, a few notes of interest:


1. There are multiple easily accessible trash bins within quick walking distance to Lauren's apartment.

A. There is a huge trash bin, including multiple smaller ones 200 feet away in the law school parking lot.

B. There is a second huge trash bin behind the ATT building next door to the apartments: georgia ave, macon, ga - Google Maps

C. There is plenty of tree coverage and darkness along the alley behind Orange street, where many of the houses keep their trash bins.

2. During his first year of law school, SM sent out an email to the entire student body that was very strange and caused him to become significantly more of an outsider than he may have otherwise become. It was a "political hypothetical" that attacked Barack Obama and he received significant rebuking from the rest of the school.

3. Despite being ostracized by his classmates, SM continued to seek ways to participate in school and even ran for a school-wide elected position (honor court)--something that he never did during undergraduate.

4. It is my understanding that McDaniel 'intercepted' the student search team when they arrived at Lauren's apartment and did not play any meaningful role in going through her apartment or have any personal knowledge of the email that was sent out.

5. The notion that SM 'crashed' the graduation party at Fish n' Pig is silly. There are very few 'nice' restaurants in Macon and Fish n' Pig is the best one for a family that doesn't want to spend a ton of money and there were likely several families there celebrating.

6. SM is an incredibly pleasant and smart person based on my personal experiences and based on everything I have heard from everyone else who knows him.

Are you suggesting remains were placed in those other trash receptacles? They would have been searched. Is there another reason you mention them?

I've read about the e-mail. True Born Sons of Liberty? That's how it was referenced. I'd love to read it. You say it attacked Obama. In which way? It must've reflected an extremist viewpoint if it stirred that kind of reaction.

 

[Backwoods]

I just watched the show.
<snip for focus>
As for the email and LG's sister's response, I don't see it as being different than what SM said, exactly. He was responding after first reading it and knowing she was missing right then. The sister has had time to read it more fully and digest it in connection with the tone and attitude of her sister. He read "break in" and "afraid" the same moment he realized she was really missing. Dots connected in that instant. Her sister heard she was missing and then heard about an email. She was disappointed that it wasn't a big warning because it might have been a clue if it were. Two totally different perspectives based on what was happening when you were presented with the information.

I agree. It makes sense that there were different reactions about the email from different people at different times. I have gone back and listened to the audio of the entire SM interview again and I sure don't hear him say anything about her being terrified and no one doing anything about it, "why didn't they get her out of there?" as was suggested upstream by another poster earlier -- it's all about "If only she had told me --didn't know she was scared -- I would have done something!" Yes, yes, yes, he may have been acting, he may be the perp. But what he is saying is, I wish I'd known, I would have done something.

Another thing: Those who have listened to the audio of the whole interview know that the discussion about the email comes after the reporter informs SM that a body has been found and he gets all shook up. To me, there is a distinct difference in his voice and expression when he comes back, after that, to continue the interview. We all know that this COULD have been because he is the perp and just found out that the evidence he planned to go off with the trash -- didn't.

But it also COULD be the emotional blow starting to hit home on somebody who has been helping look for a missing person, perhaps with the inner feeling that she would be found OK, finding out that events have likely taken a terrible turn. If this turns out to be the case, it is unfortunate that the video segment that was actually aired came from this section of the interview, with no explanation that the speaker had just learned that a body has been found. SM MIGHT not have "looked" so weird to folks and given off such a strange vibe if viewers had understood that.

My daughter, who is a college student in Macon, spent last night with me and we watched the FOX show together, after which I played the audio of the whole SM interview for her. She was struck, as so many of us have been, I think, by the different ways SM's interview comes across, depending on whether you are thinking "he did it" or "he didn't do it". From the one viewpoint, it is supremely creepy -- from the other, it is heart-wrenching. Seems true of so many of the things we have to consider about SM, until we know more.

 

[3doglady]

Yes, her mom did say that. It could mean that...or, the law (since she was in the midst of studying for the bar). Her mom also said, in that same interview, that LE thought/told her that Lauren didn't know what hit her. How would they know that?

I wondered about that too, unless LE was just trying to make this less painful for the mom. The only other thing I can think of would be an injury like a gun wound to LG's back.

 

[bessie]

Hi Everyone,
I have been following the case and everyone's comments on WS.

I wonder if there are more cases like this one:
http://www.doenetwork.org/hot/hotcase21.html
that inspired the FBI to get involved in the first place.

Hello, and welcome, Givesmetheshivers. The locals might be familiar with other recent dismemberment cases in Georgia. I can't think of any off hand, but in general, dismemberment is not that all that uncommon.

:welcome5:

 

[Harry Potter]

Are you suggesting remains were placed in those other trash receptacles? They would have been searched. Is there another reason you mention them?

I've read about the e-mail. True Born Sons of Liberty? That's how it was referenced. I'd love to read it. You say it attacked Obama. In which way? It must've reflected an extremist viewpoint if it stirred that kind of reaction.

Yes, SM refers to himself as a "True Born Son of Liberty." The email itself was not extremist, but his response to critique was extreme. Based on my searches, it appears that it is a reference to the tea party movement.

As for the trashcans, I am saying that even in a hurried frenzy, there are multiple much better options for dumping the body that would not draw any additional suspicion.