GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #11

[Bootsctr]

OBE, that killer was Matthew Hoffman. His victims were Tina Hermann, her 11-year-old son Kody Maynard and Hermann's friend Stephanie Sprang. He kept the 13-year-old young woman in his home that was filled with leaves. He had serious mental issues. His home was filled with leaves and he was obsessed with trees. There is an official diagnosis for his obsession, but for the life of me I can't find the medical term. He killed squirrels in the neighborhood to eat and the only thing they found in his freezer was squirrel meat and popsicles.

 

[Bootsctr]

I'm watching cases now that involve parents murdered by their children. Came across the Justice Channel, channel 252 on Dish. This case occurred in Jefferson County, Wisconsin on 07/02/1998.

Three members of the Krnak family AND the family dog disappeared.

The eldest son, Andrew Krnak, reported the family missing. They didn't return from a 4th of July vacation -Thomas 21 y/o brother, Donna (mother) and Allen (father).

When Andrew was questioned by the sheriff as to what he thought could have happened to the family, he offered up 3 reasons:

1. Random biker gangs in the area could have murdered them.
2. Satanic cults could have murdered them.
3. Alien UFO abduction.

The family truck was finally found. Truck was clean, spotless. Sheriff said it was "too clean."

One year after disappearance, remains (a skull) was found in the North Carolina Smoky Mountains. A wedding ring with AFK initials was also found. Skull ID'd as Allen Krnak. COD was blunt force trauma to the head. Truck was found only five miles from where Andrew Krnak went to school.

Sheriff had a strong circumstantial case, but not a single shred of physical evidence. No smoking gun. Motive was money, home, vacation home and $600,000 in insurance money.

Sheriff speculated Andrew lured his family back home and he killed them one at a time as the family returned. It was a 2 year investigation. Trial was 1 week. 2 days of deliberation. Guilty verdict and life w/o parole. The bodies of mother and brother had not been found at the time this show was filmed.

I just found this case interesting because it was a son who killed his family and the reasons he gave as to what could have happened to the family sound vaguely similar to what we heard could have happened to the Dermonds - just insert female alligator for the UFO alien abduction.

Here is a link to the Krnak family case here at Websleuths: https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...52-amp-Thomas-Krnak-21-Helenville-2-July-1998

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Doesn't seem like it lawdog.

I also would like to know what the local people believe happened and especially those from the homes in the community. There is always those "Now that I think about it, looking back, this or that was a sign." But not much participation as far as locals pushing for this to be solved. JMO

 

[WausauCate]

"I" think the beheading was the biggest part of this whole mess that confuses the investigation as well as MRs D being hauled off making it confusing as to whether it was a kidnapping or not.........it's hard to believe the kids would have their parents killed much less have one beheaded, but whoever was hired to do this surely made it confusing so no one looks at the children or or as a simple robbery gone bad or hardly anyone for that matter because it's hard to fathom that anyone other than a CULT (bingo) or terrorist/mafia group would do this and WHY would a the latter 2 have any ties to the quiet unassuming dermonds...............didnt keith say a cult..........HMMM. THAT IS WHAT PEOPLE MAY FATHOM AND as before.....who is leading the investigation, pointing to this or that.........so many things make sense but like evyerone has said, you ahve to follow the money, since they weren't poor folk especially

Not buying the whole robbery gone bad theory. Any killer who has the audacity to stick around and do all of the work they did to prep and hide the bodies surely would have at least slammed his hand in the cookie jar and grabbed what he could on the way out the door...like the Rolex, for instance. Also not buying it because do you mean to tell me they just happened to find, either in their trunk or at the Dermonds home; Cinder blocks and fishnet? Nope. This doozy of a murder was planned. My guess is the killer did not necessarily know about the Derby party. Why risk people calling or coming to find your intended victims thereby having possible witnesses or more bodies to get rid of?

 

[WausauCate]

Interesting. I remember that interview and had forgotten it.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

The Derby party was a big thang Wausau! They had to know but it did occur to me, how risky it was, someone may have stopped by....but think about a party...they are all preparing, arriving, laughing drinking and getting ready to see the winner....would anyone really go check on the Dermonds DURING all this? I would guess not but as far as we know, NO ONE left to check on the D's and why they didnt show but it was only under 2 miles away...risky for the killers but then again, just dont answer the door.....and my thing is this...who the heck would have EVER imagined they'd been murdered, much less beheaded.....probably thought they had a cold or just changed their minds? they weren't spring chickens...IDK but I did think about the party and it being a risk..........

you've gone WAY back in the threads my friend! You are hooked ! LOL

Not buying the whole robbery gone bad theory. Any killer who has the audacity to stick around and do all of the work they did to prep and hide the bodies surely would have at least slammed his hand in the cookie jar and grabbed what he could on the way out the door...like the Rolex, for instance. Also not buying it because do you mean to tell me they just happened to find, either in their trunk or at the Dermonds home; Cinder blocks and fishnet? Nope. This doozy of a murder was planned. My guess is the killer did not necessarily know about the Derby party. Why risk people calling or coming to find your intended victims thereby having possible witnesses or more bodies to get rid of?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

NO I think the perps BROUGHT with the, the blocks AND the fishnet

The Derby party was a big thang Wausau! They had to know but it did occur to me, how risky it was, someone may have stopped by....but think about a party...they are all preparing, arriving, laughing drinking and getting ready to see the winner....would anyone really go check on the Dermonds DURING all this? I would guess not but as far as we know, NO ONE left to check on the D's and why they didnt show but it was only under 2 miles away...risky for the killers but then again, just dont answer the door.....and my thing is this...who the heck would have EVER imagined they'd been murdered, much less beheaded.....probably thought they had a cold or just changed their minds? they weren't spring chickens...IDK but I did think about the party and it being a risk..........

you've gone WAY back in the threads my friend! You are hooked ! LOL

 

[WausauCate]

yes and i wondered WHO was doing the investigating, SS himself or a deputy? Should it be someone with a bit more knowledge? I'd like to know also WHO was looking at the accounts and yes WHICH ones if he still held any business accounts, you can find them on the computer if no paper trail

Sheriff Sills is quite capable of a thorough investigation. He is a shark. There is not one cell in his body that could be labeled as stupid, including his decision to NOT call in the GBI. He had a forensic accounting agent look over the finances. They are skilled at spotting money laundering. And in the state of GA, he would have access to a pretty decent one.
I am not totally convinced the beheading was planned. Lets say this person had a beef with Mr. Dermond personally. There may never have been a confrontation. People are capable of loathing others at a distance. And lets even go so far as to say the person knew the family and didn't like them either. It's possible. And they knew nothing about the Derby party. (I can't imagine a person knowing about that and risking a knock on the door.) Maybe it was loosely planned and some things came up that were not expected. And what if...Mrs. Dermond was killed FIRST. Maybe took an early morning coffee boat ride with someone she knew. Coming back to take care of Mr. Dermond would be far less work. OR...maybe they were both taken for a ride. This would explain the lack of blood spatter in the garage from a GSW. Taken back into the garage by the cover of night. This is an angle I have not heard yet. Not saying SS hasn't thought of it. Just saying there are other ways this could have played out besides the obvious. Might explain the foot being dragged through blood?

 

[WausauCate]

No kidding he had mental issues. Most people would figure out how to pitch a tent or build a treehouse and just go live outside.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Yes others have suggested similar....but the foot dragged thru the blood....his head was removed already, why turn the body, I can't see them beheading him then bringing him back in...IDK so confusing!

Sheriff Sills is quite capable of a thorough investigation. He is a shark. There is not one cell in his body that could be labeled as stupid, including his decision to NOT call in the GBI. He had a forensic accounting agent look over the finances. They are skilled at spotting money laundering. And in the state of GA, he would have access to a pretty decent one.
I am not totally convinced the beheading was planned. Lets say this person had a beef with Mr. Dermond personally. There may never have been a confrontation. People are capable of loathing others at a distance. And lets even go so far as to say the person knew the family and didn't like them either. It's possible. And they knew nothing about the Derby party. (I can't imagine a person knowing about that and risking a knock on the door.) Maybe it was loosely planned and some things came up that were not expected. And what if...Mrs. Dermond was killed FIRST. Maybe took an early morning coffee boat ride with someone she knew. Coming back to take care of Mr. Dermond would be far less work. OR...maybe they were both taken for a ride. This would explain the lack of blood spatter in the garage from a GSW. Taken back into the garage by the cover of night. This is an angle I have not heard yet. Not saying SS hasn't thought of it. Just saying there are other ways this could have played out besides the obvious. Might explain the foot being dragged through blood?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

and FWIW, I have changed my ideas about SS in the past month or more....with different views of my own, some things make more sense now

Sheriff Sills is quite capable of a thorough investigation. He is a shark. There is not one cell in his body that could be labeled as stupid, including his decision to NOT call in the GBI. He had a forensic accounting agent look over the finances. They are skilled at spotting money laundering. And in the state of GA, he would have access to a pretty decent one.
I am not totally convinced the beheading was planned. Lets say this person had a beef with Mr. Dermond personally. There may never have been a confrontation. People are capable of loathing others at a distance. And lets even go so far as to say the person knew the family and didn't like them either. It's possible. And they knew nothing about the Derby party. (I can't imagine a person knowing about that and risking a knock on the door.) Maybe it was loosely planned and some things came up that were not expected. And what if...Mrs. Dermond was killed FIRST. Maybe took an early morning coffee boat ride with someone she knew. Coming back to take care of Mr. Dermond would be far less work. OR...maybe they were both taken for a ride. This would explain the lack of blood spatter in the garage from a GSW. Taken back into the garage by the cover of night. This is an angle I have not heard yet. Not saying SS hasn't thought of it. Just saying there are other ways this could have played out besides the obvious. Might explain the foot being dragged through blood?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Kathy Griffin? LOL, was reading some old posts and ran across some discussions about your avatar...

:goodpost:

Yes, hockey! My thoughts exactly. I have heard the Dermond children were cleared by polygraphs, but what about the grands? Have always thought inheritance was the motive, and wasn’t one of the grands entitled to it?

IMHO

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

and ........Sills called it “the absolute most confounding thing I’ve ever dealt with in my entire career.”..

Sheriff Sills is quite capable of a thorough investigation. He is a shark. There is not one cell in his body that could be labeled as stupid, including his decision to NOT call in the GBI. He had a forensic accounting agent look over the finances. They are skilled at spotting money laundering. And in the state of GA, he would have access to a pretty decent one.
I am not totally convinced the beheading was planned. Lets say this person had a beef with Mr. Dermond personally. There may never have been a confrontation. People are capable of loathing others at a distance. And lets even go so far as to say the person knew the family and didn't like them either. It's possible. And they knew nothing about the Derby party. (I can't imagine a person knowing about that and risking a knock on the door.) Maybe it was loosely planned and some things came up that were not expected. And what if...Mrs. Dermond was killed FIRST. Maybe took an early morning coffee boat ride with someone she knew. Coming back to take care of Mr. Dermond would be far less work. OR...maybe they were both taken for a ride. This would explain the lack of blood spatter in the garage from a GSW. Taken back into the garage by the cover of night. This is an angle I have not heard yet. Not saying SS hasn't thought of it. Just saying there are other ways this could have played out besides the obvious. Might explain the foot being dragged through blood?

 

[Razz]

Sheriff Sills is quite capable of a thorough investigation. He is a shark. There is not one cell in his body that could be labeled as stupid, including his decision to NOT call in the GBI. He had a forensic accounting agent look over the finances. They are skilled at spotting money laundering. And in the state of GA, he would have access to a pretty decent one.
I am not totally convinced the beheading was planned. Lets say this person had a beef with Mr. Dermond personally. There may never have been a confrontation. People are capable of loathing others at a distance. And lets even go so far as to say the person knew the family and didn't like them either. It's possible. And they knew nothing about the Derby party. (I can't imagine a person knowing about that and risking a knock on the door.) Maybe it was loosely planned and some things came up that were not expected. And what if...Mrs. Dermond was killed FIRST. Maybe took an early morning coffee boat ride with someone she knew. Coming back to take care of Mr. Dermond would be far less work. OR...maybe they were both taken for a ride. This would explain the lack of blood spatter in the garage from a GSW. Taken back into the garage by the cover of night. This is an angle I have not heard yet. Not saying SS hasn't thought of it. Just saying there are other ways this could have played out besides the obvious. Might explain the foot being dragged through blood?

I am happy to hear a very positive review about SS. That makes me feel a tad better.

Somehow I don't imagine any boat rides that morning. I think getting Mrs. D down to the dock while alive would have been tough. I suspect she was already deceased and had to be carried.

I still like the idea of a car with a big trunk.

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[Deleted member 162919]

SS might be a good investigator but this case will be his defining case as much as the cult case was. I sure hope he concentrates more on the case than he does misleading the public on the investigation. Using a controlled media to throw out small nuggets of info once or twice per year is getting real old

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Gotta agree with that! ..and lets not forget the Cult case fact is that SS KNEW who he was dealing with.....Maybe he does here too but just needs that one piece of the puzzle.....pretty bad when all the possible suspects and theories have been cleared........Would be nice if that mean the D's were still alive but unfortunately somebody killed them.............so like the Tara case, someone went under the radar, that one for 10 years, this one coming up on 4

SS might be a good investigator but this case will be his defining case as much as the cult case was. I sure hope he concentrates more on the case than he does misleading the public on the investigation. Using a controlled media to throw out small nuggets of info once or twice per year is getting real old

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I'm not convinced he cleared all suspects he has lied before and i'm sure he lied when he said all suspects were cleared. He wouldn't want anyone he suspected to know he suspected them that would give the murderer time to clean up his mess . SS is playing chess with the suspect he has in mind and I think he got real close when the cold case team looked into the case which as you know I already am convinced was SS way of calling on local LE to keep and eye on his suspect for anything unusual . Maybe he didn't get the info he needed but he sent a message. Almost 4 years and no suspect tells me he either botched the crime scene or he knows who is responsible but can't convict. 2 more months until our annual update with no real information or should I say INFO but none of it will connect the dots.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Yeah I thought it odd, EVERYONE was cleared...lol....kinda being facetious...everyone cleared as if no one died......yeah he's said he'd lie if thats what it took....so there we have it! Anxious about anything forthcoming...Hoping Justice is sooner than later!

I'm not convinced he cleared all suspects he has lied before and i'm sure he lied when he said all suspects were cleared. He wouldn't want anyone he suspected to know he suspected them that would give the murderer time to clean up his mess . SS is playing chess with the suspect he has in mind and I think he got real close when the cold case team looked into the case which as you know I already am convinced was SS way of calling on local LE to keep and eye on his suspect for anything unusual . Maybe he didn't get the info he needed but he sent a message. Almost 4 years and no suspect tells me he either botched the crime scene or he knows who is responsible but can't convict. 2 more months until our annual update with no real information or should I say INFO but none of it will connect the dots.

 

[Deleted member 162919]

Don't expect much and even if he gives a lot of useful information you have to wonder if it's true. his credibility is very low after all his lies about evidence and such. They need a new sheriff in town

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Wondering why they only dumped SD in lake oconee and not to another lake or woods or even buried somewhere.... Remembering the cinder blocks were solid 30 lbs each, wrapped in netting..... The area of tree stumps is not considered a fishing spot but areas around and in nearby coves are,
Accor ding to map I found...... They came and left by boat..... The cinder blocks and netting were in the boat and they dumped her where they did because they didn't want to take the boat out and back in another lake or take her by car, they left by boat from a dark ramp on oconee middle of the night, didn't think fishermen would find her in that area, didn't expect her to rise and those blocks weighed more than hollow cinders.... Amateurs......

I am happy to hear a very positive review about SS. That makes me feel a tad better.

Somehow I don't imagine any boat rides that morning. I think getting Mrs. D down to the dock while alive would have been tough. I suspect she was already deceased and had to be carried.

I still like the idea of a car with a big trunk.

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