GBC Trial General Discussion Thread #4

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Greg said:
I think they should take a closer look at OW as well, in fact i think that they are all in on it to a certain degree... either during or after the fact, but my views wouldn't be a surprise to any old timers on here

:newhere:
Click to expand...

OLD TIMERS? I resemble that remark!!

:floorlaugh:
 
Liadan said:
One thing I did like about the defense Psychiatrist Witness dr. Mark, was that he said lariam was a red herring. (the malaria drug they took while in SthAmerica)

He said the drug would have caused those depressive anxious episodes while she was on it. Hence early in the piece Gerred was saying Allison couldn't leave her Hotel room - well that is because they probably took the drug the day before. And at its top dose level gave Allison those problems. Then as it wore off ....

By his own admission Gerred said the next day Allison was totally fine. It probably didn't dawn on GBC that these episodes were linked with taking this drug.

As for that drug being the catalyst for her longitudinal (ongoing) depressive mood - Dr mark Schramm said this was not likely.


I will shut up now - 3 in a row is very embarrassing!
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I had wondered about the long term effects of Larium. Thanks for sharing that info.
 
Aliwonders said:
I really don't think anyone else was involved. I think that his Father didn't take long to realise that this was not looking good for his son considering the scratches and set about to make sure he had the best possible legal advice. That just tells me that his father has spent all his life promoting the "family name" and was going to make sure it was protected. Yes they are proud people. I don't believe Olivia was involved. I just think they are a family who can't get their head around the idea that Gerard was responsible. It's true that pride comes before a fall. Gerards parents would know also if he had a propensity to lie as a young person. They may know more than they are letting on but their family loyalty is strong. They will fight to keep their son out of jail because that is just not an acceptable option for a Baden Clay!!
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That's how I feel too. We have seen no evidence or suggestion of even the remotest possibility that anyone else was involved either during or immediately after.
 
Bobbie Elliott said:
Sorry if this has been covered but, did the police examine NBC/EBC's or OW's cars?
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We're not certain but there were pics of tje Forensics van parked near NBC's car on the morning Allison was reported missing, all four doors were open so we're guessing yes.
 
possumheart said:
Yes, but I mean really, seriously, malignantly wrong - my brother has schizophrenia and I remember the feeling i got in my stomach as I got to know him once he had been medicated after his first major psychosis. All the nice bits of his personality fell away to this shell which just was self consumed and black. Gerard reminds me of my brother, when first medicated. Reading about his behaviour inhabits my body in the same way.

If Gerard was medicated for schizophrenia, would this be kept from us?
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There is nothing in evidence or reports which state he had/has any form of mental illness.

IF there was he would have been sent off for mental assessment by now....a la pistorious.

So we'll leave "mental illness" out of it thanks everyone.
 
Bobbie Elliott said:
Sorry if this has been covered but, did the police examine NBC/EBC's or OW's cars?
Click to expand...

Police conducted a couple of searches at the parents house...

April 26, 2012

Earlier, eight police officers spent an hour at a house in Brisbane's west where Mr Baden-Clay and his three daughters have been staying.

Three police cars arrived at 9am and eight officers entered the house, which is home to the parents of Mrs Baden-Clay's husband, Gerard.

The officers left at 10am with several evidence bags, including one containing an Apple laptop computer and a hard-drive.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...lison-baden-clay/story-e6freoof-1226338602877
--------------------------------------------------

And also on the evening of the first aborted bail hearing...

June 22, 2012

DETECTIVES investigating the alleged murder of Allison Baden-Clay returned last night to her in-laws' home where they conducted further searches of their property.

The Courier-Mail can reveal the car owned by Gerard Baden-Clay's parents was searched. Police rifled through the boot and back seat of the couple's silver Holden Statesman about 6pm.

After Nigel and Elaine Baden-Clay walked their dog, they were intercepted by five detectives who spent about an hour with them, mostly inside the house, only coming out briefly about halfway through with Mr Baden-Clay to search the vehicle before leaving about 6.20pm

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...lays-parents-car/story-e6frg6n6-1226404830587
 
BJsleuth said:
We're not certain but there were pics of tje Forensics van parked near NBC's car on the morning Allison was reported missing, all four doors were open so we're guessing yes.
Click to expand...

If NBC's car was parked and the house and yard were declared a crime scene wouldn't that mean they could do what ever forensic tests.
NBC said he walked to the school to pick up OW's car.
 
70. Gerard has a public face which is ethical, moral and upstanding. A lot of that is legacy fuelled due to his great grandfather. He is involved in all the right groups but it's always about what's in it for him. He is politically saucy. I know that Bruce Flegg and Gerard have a relationship where they talk. I don't think these are genuine interactions with persons. He would lecture staff about lying but would continue this long term affair. I didn't appreciate how he could talk to me about being deceptive when he was living a lie.

71. Gerard's relationship is very unique. His mother is very protective of Gerard. They are a family where what you see isn't what you et. The family is very much about the legacy. I was told that when they came to Australia they came with a surname of CLAY and had it changed to BADEN-CLAY. His father Nigel is a great guy but I think there is a very manipulative side to him. When I returned to Australia I received a phone call from Nigel looking for some signs. He made a comment like I hope this is the end of the shenanigans. At the time that comment seemed strange to me. If your son had an affair why would you call it shenanigans? I was lead to believe that he had borrowed money against a property he and Allison had on the Gold coast in order to pay his parents back.

72. The only time he made a weird statement to me about cheating on Allison was when I was in the office with possibly Ben. I asked him how he got into this situation and he said something like its alot like being a baby shaker you don't think you are a baby shaker until your caught shaking a baby.
 
marlywings said:
Police conducted a couple of searches at the parents house...

April 26, 2012

Earlier, eight police officers spent an hour at a house in Brisbane's west where Mr Baden-Clay and his three daughters have been staying.

Three police cars arrived at 9am and eight officers entered the house, which is home to the parents of Mrs Baden-Clay's husband, Gerard.

The officers left at 10am with several evidence bags, including one containing an Apple laptop computer and a hard-drive.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...lison-baden-clay/story-e6freoof-1226338602877
--------------------------------------------------

And also on the evening of the first aborted bail hearing...

June 22, 2012

DETECTIVES investigating the alleged murder of Allison Baden-Clay returned last night to her in-laws' home where they conducted further searches of their property.

The Courier-Mail can reveal the car owned by Gerard Baden-Clay's parents was searched. Police rifled through the boot and back seat of the couple's silver Holden Statesman about 6pm.

After Nigel and Elaine Baden-Clay walked their dog, they were intercepted by five detectives who spent about an hour with them, mostly inside the house, only coming out briefly about halfway through with Mr Baden-Clay to search the vehicle before leaving about 6.20pm

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...lays-parents-car/story-e6frg6n6-1226404830587
Click to expand...

Thanks Marly
I hadnt seen that.

After Nigel and Elaine Baden-Clay walked their dog, they were intercepted by five detectives...
Click to expand...

Confronting and Interesting way to meet up with them.
They may have been expecting them at some point, but they intercepted them together out of the house.

.
 
BJsleuth said:
If you read this statement. Ben Bassingthwaite says that EBC was always protective of GBC.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Bail Hearing Documents *No Discussion*
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Thank you for the link BJ, reading it again after GBC's time in the stand leads to more questions.

GBC had no qualms telling a friend, BB, that he loved Toni and it was sacrifice staying with his wife for the kids. He didn't have to lie to BB, so my thoughts are he lied in court about this relationship (it was just sex) or, there was a reason to lie to BB, GBC worried TM might hear if he said anything but that he loved her. jmo
 
These are the tweets from Day 14 in order of appearance on the thread – posted bt Websleuths Re-Tweet team.
:loveyou:

Timeline GBC Day 14 Tweets Listed in Order of Appearance
Link to GBC Trial Day 14 Websleuths Thread

--------------------------
MSM Tweeters:
Caroline Overington ‏@overingtonc
Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou
David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 39s
Sarah Elks ‏@sarahelks
Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton
Tessa Scott ‏@TessaScott9 23s
Leonie Mellor ‏@leoniemellor
Katrina Blowers ‏@katrinablowers 44s
Louisa Rebgetz ‏@louisarebgetz 40s


Tweets in order of appearance on thread:

• more legal discussion going on..... before trial commences for the day.
• Fuller says it was not an option for Toni not to go to the real estate conference the next day. #badenclay
• Gerard is being asked about any contact between Allison and Toni McHugh if Allison had his phone each night. #badenclay
• Fuller starts by saying there was risk Toni could have called Gerard's phone night of 20th. He agrees #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard had set rules with Toni to make sure Allison didn't know they were communicating. #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard did not tell police he had spoken to Toni the afternoon before he reported Allison missing. #badenclay
• David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 21s
• Fuller: part of your subterfuge, set rules so Allison didn't find out you were in contact with Toni #badenclay
• Gerard says it didn't enter his mind to tell police about his conversations with Toni. He says he just wanted to find Allison. #badenclay
• Gerard says he told his family after someone in the media said they were running a story on his affair. #badenclay
• Fuller: At no stage after you dealt with police on the morning of the 20th did you disclose to your family about Toni McHugh. #badenclay
• Gerard says he told police about the affair, he didn't anticipate they would tell the media, "but they did". #badenclay
• #badenclay only told his family about affair when media approached him with the story. @9NewsBrisbane
• Fuller: when did you tell your family about affair with McHugh. Gerard: when media told me they would publish #badenclay
• Gerard says he can't remember if he spoke to police after they'd spoken to Toni. #badenclay
• He has confessed the affair to police and 'didn't anticipate' that police would tell the media #badenclay
• Gerard: I spoke to police numerous occasions, asked every question asked #badenclay

• Gerard says he answered that question. Says they asked him to provide a statement, his answer was no. #badenclay
• Gerard says he answered every question police asked. Fuller says he refused to give them a statement. #badenclay
• Fuller: they asked you to make a formal statement, you did not #badenclay @couriermail
• He agrees that he refused to give police a formal statement #badenclay
• Gerard: pleaded with police, said I'd been given legal advice #badenclay
• He says he pleaded that he had been given legal advice not to give a formal statement #badenclay
• Gerard says he believes he spoke to homicide. Reiterates he didn't know what CIB meant, didn't know what a crime scene was. #badenclay
• He says one of the police officers was quite aggressive about wanting him to give a formal statement #badenclay
• Fuller asks where he'd met Sgt Narelle Curtis before. He says in a siege situation relating to his real estate business #badenclay
• Gerard agrees he was thankful police were dealing with the investigation seriously and committed resources to it. #badenclay
• #badenclay thinks he spoke to homicide detectives: "I wasn't sure what CIB stood for, didn't really know what a crime scene was."
• Fuller: you'd had a positive previous dealing with this officer. Gerard: yes #badenclay
• He agrees that he knew one of the police officers #badenclay
• "To be perfectly honest, I wasn't thinking homicide." #badenclay
• Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou • 8s
• Fuller suggests to Gerard that police were in contact with him every day. #badenclay
• Gerard says police "probably" kept in contact every day and were at first very responsive. #badenclay
• Gerard says once a day wasn't enough. He was desperate for information from police. #badenclay
• Fuller: you'd had a positive previous dealing with this officer. Gerard: yes #badenclay
• He had been involved with police in community activities #badenclay
• Fuller: You knew some police. You were kept up to date about the investigation #badenclay
• He says he desperately wanted to know what was going on #badenclay
• Gerard says he met with his lawyer on that first night. #badenclay
• Gerard says there was nothing stopping him from talking to police, other than the advice of his lawyer. #badenclay
• G #badenclay says he answered every question police asked incl when they asked him to make a formal statement. He told them No.@abcnews
• Fuller: when you first speak to lawyer. Gerard: middle of that day, 20th #badenclay
• He agrees there was nothing to stop him going to see police #badenclay
• Fuller: where did you meet your lawyer. Gerard: BP police station #badenclay
• Fuller says the first call to Gerard's parents address was at 6.44am. #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard's first call to Allison was at 6.32am on the morning she went missing. #badenclay
• A search headquarters had been set up #badenclay
• G #badenclay first spoke to his lawyer midday on Fri April 20th, met him that night at service station between Bris and GC. @abcnews
• Fuller: your first call to Allison's phone was at 6.32am. Gerard: correct, sent text first #badenclay

• Fuller asks which of Allison's friends he called at that time of the morning. Gerard says none. #badenclay
• Fuller: Concerned enough to call your parents? Gerard says that's correct. #badenclay
• Fuller: your first call to parents was at 6.44am. Gerard: I was starting to get concerned #badenclay
• He agrees that he then called his parents #badenclay
• Gerard: my initial call was to say had you heard from her #badenclay
• He didn't call any of Allison's friends at that time #badenclay
• Gerard says her best friend lived beyond walking distance. He says it "was a possibility" she'd walked to his parents at Kenmore. #badenclay
• He says he didn't have a number for one of her closest friends #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard's father Nigel came over and Gerard and his sister Olivia went looking. #badenclay
• Fuller: did you call Allison's friend Kerry-Anne Walker. Gerard: didn't anticipate Allison would have walked that far #badenclay
• Fuller: your dad came over, you and sister searched streets, why take the Captiva. Gerard: my car had been in an accident #badenclay
• Gerard says the Prado was a bigger car, had been in an accident. #badenclay
• Fuller asks why Gerard took the Captiva instead of his own Prado, which was in the way and parked in an easier spot. #badenclay
• #badenclay did not call any of Allison's friends for information until after he reported her missing to police.
• He agrees that he took the little car - Sparky, the Captiva - out to search
• Fuller: but your Prado was parked in the driveway, there wasn't significant damage to it #badenclay
• Fuller says there wasn't significant damage to the Prado. He'd been driving it since the accident. #badenclay
• Fuller suggests to Gerard the Captiva had been reversed in when he took it. Gerard says this wasn't true. #badenclay
• Fuller: you'd been driving the Prado Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, but drove Captiva Friday. Gerard: agrees #badenclay
• But he says Snowy - the sex car with Toni - had been side swiped a few days earlier #badenclay
• Gerard says he first noticed the toys in the back of the Captiva on Friday morning when he took it to look for Allison. #badenclay
• Fuller: when did you first notice the items in the back of the Captiva. Gerard: Thursday morning, no Friday morning #badenclay
• He agrees he had been driving Snowy since the side-swipe #badenclay
• The court is being shown a picture of the Prado with panel damage to the front. It is part blocking the driveway. #badenclay
• But he thought the Captiva was zippier to get around as he searched, too #badenclay
• Court shown photo of the Prado parked in the front driveway, Captiva reverse parked into carport behind it #badenclay
• Gerard agrees there was nothing stopping him taking the Prado. #badenclay
• Fuller asks whether Gerard put the toys in the back to make it look "normal". #badenclay
• Gerard says he and Allison had had conversations about packing away the toys. He was not surprised to see them. #badenclay
• They filled nearly the whole boot #badenclay
• Fuller: Allison was going to be at the conference #badenclay
• Fuller: you didn't put those items in there, to make it look normal. Gerard: no I did not put them there #badenclay
• Gerard says he called them later on. He thought she'd gone for a walk. #badenclay
• Fuller asks why Gerard didn't call Allison's parent when she went missing. #badenclay
• Gerard says they would be unusual items to put in there to "look normal". #badenclay
• Fuller: you called police 7.15am. Gerard: yes, was getting very worried #badenclay
• Fuller: why didn't you call her parents. You didn't call them to 9.30am #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard called all his own friends first before calling Allison's friends. #badenclay
• Fuller says he didn't call them until 9.30am. Gerard says yes, after he'd been interrogated by the police for a couple of hours. #badenclay
• Fuller: you called your closest friends, Christs, Crannas, Cheesmans, before you called her two closest friends #badenclay
• Gerard agrees he was not prevented from making any calls when he was speaking to police that morning. #badenclay
• Fuller: you had a call from the P & C, police let you take that, there were other staff calls #badenclay
• In the meantime he had called or taken calls from business partners and staff #badenclay
• Fuller: police didn't prevent you taking calls, or getting kids to school
• Fuller says Gerard took work calls that morning while speaking to police. #badenclay
• Fuller says as the morning progressed Gerard became more concerned about the nature of police questions. He denies this. #badenclay
• Gerard: I wasn't concerned about the nature of the questions #badenclay
• Gerard: I didn't sense what others did. Agrees he's referring to his father and sister #badenclay
• Gerard says his father and sister became concerned about the questions but he wasn't. #badenclay
• Fuller asks why he didn't let her parents know as the questioning continued. Gerard says he did, that's when he called them. #badenclay
• Fuller: weren't you concerned to let her parents know #badenclay
• He says he wasn't concerned about police questions, but his father and sister were. Neither were present for first cop chat #badenclay
• Fuller asks if he thought to call Toni McHugh to see if she'd contacted Allison. Gerard says he didn't even think about it. #badenclay
• "My informing them was not necessarily for them to drop everything and come up" #badenclay on telling Allison's parents. They did.
• Gerard says time that morning seemed to travel very quickly. #badenclay
• Fuller: you didn't think to call Toni McHugh. Gerard: No. Kept anticipating Allison would walk through the door #badenclay
• Fuller: police turn up 8am, wife more than an hour overdue #badenclay
• Gerard says he can't remember some times #badenclay
• He agrees that it was well after police arrived that he called Allison's parents #badenclay
 
Oddsocks said:
I want to show my support to Allison's family. I am always broke, so I can't donate to the girls but what I can do is art. If I were to do a portrait and have it laminated is there any kind person here that I could post it to and they could place it at Al's memorial please?
I would be super greatful :)
Click to expand...

That's a beautiful idea Oddsocks. I'm happy to oblige.
 
continued:
• Fuller says police were called at 7.15am. Police arrived at 8am. He says Allison was by then more than an hour overdue. #badenclay
• Gerard says he can't remember what time Allison was supposed to leave for work. Says it was 7am or 7.30am. #badenclay
• Fuller says for Allison to not have come home, it was signficant. She was normally very punctual. #badenclay
• Fuller: completely out of character for your wife, always met her commitments. Gerard agrees #badenclay
• Fuller: something dramatic had happened, yet you don't call her parents #badenclay
• #badenclay refers to questioning by police the morning he reported Allison missing as 'interrogations'. @7NewsBrisbane
• Fuller: why did you ring your friends ahead of her friends. Gerard: called the Christs because we had sleepover plans #badenclay
• Fuller points out police had been at the house for an hour and a half before he called Allison's parents. #badenclay
• Gerard: I honestly can't remember the thought process. #badenclay
• Fuller: Why did you ring your friends ahead of her friends? #badenclay
• Fuller: But you had no anticipation that she wasn't coming home, did you? #badenclay
• Gerard says he called the Christs because the children were having a sleepover. He says he wanted them to know she was missing.
• Fuller: why did that matter. Gerard: didn't think she would have gone to anybody's house #badenclay
• He agrees that he didn't call Allison's parents until well after he'd spoken to his own father #badenclay
• He didn't call her close friends because he didn't think she would go there #badenclay
• Fuller: The Cheesmans. Gerard: their house was launching onto the market that day #badenclay
• Gerard says if she was found and was in hospital, he needed to let them know. Fuller: So you were planning ahead? #badenclay
• Gerard says he rang the Cheesmans because he was supposed to go around to prepare for their open house that day. #badenclay
• Fuller: so that was about managing your business. Gerard: was concerned about my wife but had business too #badenclay
• For example, he says, he made calls to re-arrange his appointments #badenclay
• He also called other friends about a house for sale. #badenclay says he was worried about his wife, but also his business.
• Fuller: So that was about managing the business? Gerard says he was concerned about his wife but had a business to manage too. #badenclay
• Fuller asks why he rang the Crannas. Gerard says he doesn't know. Possibly because he was close by. #badenclay
• Fuller is asking about the couple's insurance and superannuation policies. Says they'd been discussing reducing them. #badenclay
• Fuller: Mr Cranna . Gerard: I don't know, probably just to ask if his staff knew anything, he was close by #badenclay
• Fuller asks about Gerard calling about Allison's life insurance on May 1, the day after she was found. #badenclay
• Fuller asks how he found out a body had been found. Gerard says he was at the office and a media report came through. #badenclay
• He was thinking: if I have to take Allison to hospital or something, I might not get to these appointments #badenclay
• So it was normal enough to try to get things organized #badenclay
• Fuller: when did you find out Allison was found. Gerard: 30th, we were at the office, a media report came through #badenclay
• Gerard says he must have called his lawyer Darren Mahony, who recommended they meet in the city #badenclay
• Gerard says police confirmed to him that the body was Allison's. Fuller asks if he is confident police confirmed it was Allison. #badenclay
• Gerard says he called his lawyer when he heard. They met in the city and police came to his barrister's office. #badenclay
• Gerard: they met at Peter Davis's office, the barrister Mahony was 'thinking of using' if needed #badenclay
• He says he spoke to his lawyer and went to the office of a barrister #badenclay
• Fuller asks whether they told him it was possibly Allison, or likely Allison. Gerard says he was told definitely. #badenclay
• It was a barrister he thought he might use if he needed legal assistance #badenclay
• #badenclay was at a barrister's chambers, Peter Davis, when police told him wife's body had been found. His criminal lawyer was there too.
• He was with this barrister when he was told that the body was Allison's #badenclay
• Fuller is asking about Gerard's first doctor's visit on April 21. He asks why Gerard didn't show her the rest of the injuries. #badenclay
• Gerard insists police told him that day it was definitely Allison's body found #badenclay
• Testimony has now turned to injuries on Gerard's body immediately after Allison disappeared #badenclay
• Gerard says maybe the second doctor asked him if he had any other concerns. #badenclay
• Fuller says the first photos police took were just of his face. He asks why Gerard didn't tell police about scratches on chest. #badenclay
• Fuller: you went to see two doctors on Saturday, police took photos of your injuries in between that #badenclay
• #Badenclay talks about moment he was told by police they had found Allison's body.. he says he remembers being physically shocked @abcnews
• At first, police took photographs only of his face #badenclay
• He also had injuries to his chest and arm #badenclay
• He didn't say anything about these injuries to police #badenclay
• He didn't tell his doctor either #badenclay
• Gerard says no, they were self inflicted. It just didn't seem relevant. #badenclay
• Gerard agrees he gave his business card to the first doctor he visited and offered to help her find a new house. #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard went to a second doctor that afternoon and showed her the injuries on his chest, as direction of lawyer. #badenclay
• Police did ultimately take photographs of his chest injury #badenclay
• He also had injuries to his chest and arm #badenclay
• Fuller is asking Gerard about the money Gerard owed and the interest he had to pay. #badenclay
• Fuller raises the payment due for Gerard to buy out his partners in the rental side of the business #badenclay
• #badenclay says he gave a GP his card on April 21, 2012, day after wife vanished, offering her help to find real estate in the area.
• Turning now to financial matters if Allison and Gerard had separated #badenclay
• Fuller: you'd lose money if you couldn't pay. Gerard: you've done the maths #badenclay
• Allison had joined the business #badenclay
• She had three young children #badenclay
• They has some shares - and some were hers #badenclay
• Fuller says Allison had taken the role of someone Gerard had been paying $100,000. Gerard says he was not paying Allison a salary.#badenclay
• Gerard says no, they were self inflicted. It just didn't seem relevant. #badenclay
• Gerard says Fuller is asking a lot of hypothetical questions he has never thought about in detail. #badenclay
• Fuller says a separation with Allison would have had a significant financial impact on him and the business. Gerard agrees. #badenclay
• The cars were owned by the business, or leased through them #badenclay
• Gerard agrees separation may have caused his business 'to go to the wall' #badenclay
• Gerard says it is all hypothetical #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard had told Toni McHugh he would separate. Gerard says yes "and I told you that was a lie". #badenclay
• Fuller says as of April 19 he was indeed under a number of pressures. #badenclay
• Fuller: You were under pressures from your wife? Gerard: How do you mean? #badenclay
• Fuller tells Gerard he knows how to turn the tracking app off. He says both he and Allison knew how to turn it off. #badenclay
• Gerard wants to clarify re the conditions Allison had put on him. He says the tracking app was his idea. #badenclay
• Gerard: did you tell Toni you would sell your business to leave your wife. Gerard: seemed to placate her #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard was under pressure night of April 19. Gerard says otherwise #badenclay
• Gerard now says it was his suggestion to use the tracking app on their phones #badenclay
• #badenclay admits it was his suggestion to put location apps on his and Allison's phones. @abcnews
• Gerard says he spoke to Allison about Toni, but not about "any of the other women I had a relationship with". #badenclay
• Gerard says yes, there were "a number" of people he went to for sex "and we've talked about some of them". #badenclay
• Gerard says he and Allison went through a period of nine years with hardly any intimacy. #badenclay
• Fuller: it didn't stop you meeting Toni McHugh. Gerard: correct #badenclay
• Fuller: you wanted to be with Toni McHugh, she offered you things you couldn't get from your wife. Gerard: not true #badenclay
• Gerard: almost no intimacy nine years except children #badenclay
• Gerard tells his murder trial he was with other women, has only talked about some of them #badenclay @couriermail
• Fuller says that's what the start of 2012 was all about - Gerard and Toni organising to be together. Gerard says not true. #badenclay
• Gerard: We wanted to put the past behind us (re counselling with Allison). Fuller: You wanted to put the past behind you. #badenclay
• Fuller: your wife was watching your every move, no longer trusted you, you wanted to wipe the slate clean #badenclay
• Fuller: if those two women came together your double life would have been exposed #badenclay
• Fuller: You were living a double life, weren't you? Gerard: No, I did not believe I was living a double life at that stage. #badenclay
• Fuller says the facade that was Gerard Baden-Clay would fall if Toni McHugh had confronted Allison at the conference. #badenclay
• Gerard: Sorry, is there a question there? #badenclay
• Fuller says if Allison had found out that he had been seeing, emailing Toni, he'd be exposed. #badenclay
• Fuller says he had sought Allison's forgiveness, made promises to her and then "gone and done it again with the same woman". #badenclay
• Fuller says he'd gone to counselling, made promises, but his behaviour hadn't changed at all. Gerard says it had. #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard's business was failing. All things were coming together. #badenclay

• Fuller's voice rising #badenclay
• Fuller: your business wasn't going well, you had to rely on your friends, they could lose money #badenclay
• Fuller: smothered her, took her life from her #badenclay
• Fuller: You killed your wife Mr Baden-Clay. Gerard: No I did not. #badenclay
• Fuller accuses #badenclay of killing his wife. "That is not true".
• Fuller: You killed your wife Mr #badenclay, probably as you smothered her and you took her life from her. He denies. @9NewsBrisbane
• Fuller says he put her body in the garden, in the leaves. He put her in the car. Gerard: I had nothing to do with anything. #badenclay
• Gerard says Fuller's suppositions are absurd. He can't answer them. #badenclay
• Gerard says the suggestion he would leave his children alone for any time in the middle of the night is absurd. #badenclay
• Fuller says he dumped her unceremoniously. #badenclay
• "I never did anything to physically harm my wife in any way, ever." #badenclay
• Fuller: "You killed your wife didn't you Mr Baden-Clay? G #badenclay: No I did not." @abcnews
• Her head came into contact with fallen leaves in your garden #badenclay
• Gerard: I did not have anything to do with what you are asking #badenclay
• Fuller: you transported her to Kholo Creek and dumped her #badenclay
• Gerard says let alone to do the dastardly things Fuller is suggesting. #badenclay
• Fuller: then you told everybody they were shaving cuts #badenclay
• Fuller says he let police search the house because he knew there would be nothing they'd find. #badenclay
• Fuller says Gerard loaded the toys in the back of the car, then cut himself with a shaver at the bottom edges of the scratches. #badenclay
• Gerard: I had nothing to hide. Fuller: because you knew there was nothing to be found #badenclay
• Fuller: you kept up the facade of a concerned husband #badenclay
• Fuller says he put on the facade of a worried husband then called a lawyer. #badenclay
• Crown: all that was done by 1:58am when you put your phone back on the charger #badenclay
• Fuller says despite the flashbacks Allison had from seeing Toni. #badenclay
• Fuller: You're certain you never told Allison she was going to run into Toni McHugh the next day. #badenclay
• Fuller says he put on the facade of a worried husband then called a lawyer. #badenclay
• Fuller says he let police search the house because he knew there would be nothing they'd find. #badenclay
• Fuller: thank you, Your Honour. Cross examination ends #badenclay
• G #badenclay says he would never have left his children alone at night let alone to do the "dastardly" things being suggested. @abcnews
 
alioop said:
That's how I feel too. We have seen no evidence or suggestion of even the remotest possibility that anyone else was involved either during or immediately after.
Click to expand...

I agree and thats perhaps why the Baden Clay family aside from Gerard should not be so continually judged and ripped to shreds on this site. Perhaps they are just a family that has values such as loyalty, pride, unity and support of each other. In other circumstances these values would be admired and supported. These values are what makes strong communities and societies. Strong family values are the pillars of society. The Baden Clays too loved and respected Allison I am sure. Gerard has made some very very poor choices as evidenced in court over the past few days. His family on the other hand have stood by their values. How would they be judged if they had not supported him? A parent loves unconditionally even when they don't like or approve of choices or behaviours their children make.
 
sosocurious said:
If NBC's car was parked and the house and yard were declared a crime scene wouldn't that mean they could do what ever forensic tests.
NBC said he walked to the school to pick up OW's car.
Click to expand...

You'd think so. I have to say I'm surprised OW was allowed to leave to take the girls to school.
 
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