General Discussion and Theories #2

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Why on earth would OC give a chite about a "two-bit" player like DM? What power did he yield? (None.) Substantial monies? Nothing near an interest for OC. Why they would be interested in him or want to set him up is the question...
 
Why on earth would OC give a chite about a "two-bit" player like DM? What power did he yield? (None.) Substantial monies? Nothing near an interest for OC. Why they would be interested in him or want to set him up is the question...

In the world of OC...money is power.... or in some cases money is GOD IMO

If OC is interesting in getting the portion of profit from a bakery...they will definitely be interested in Millard Holdings JMO MOO
 
IF you read the links you will find that OC has been in that area for eons.... I may not have 'swayed' you...but that doesn't deter from the fact that OC is VERY VERY active in the area.... I live close by there myself so locale is not a key to anything IMO. If MSM is deemed to be accurate enough to base our sleuthing on then its accurate enough for people (maybe not yourself) to base their views and facts on.... IMO JMO MOO

EVERY link is about OC in the area...regardless of whether its spanning years (which is actually one of my points) /// different types of criminal activity (which is actually another one of my points). There are barely any 'opinion pieces' save for the one comment that I mentioned....... so please take a good read and maybe you could find a few yourself, that might interest you.... there are so many I could do with some help. Thank you

As you have just kindly pointed out, you have used the links to help form your opinions. They do not prove that OC is rampant Hamilton and Ancaster. <modsnip> I understand your opinion and have read the articles that you've put forward. For good or for bad, I have come to my own conclusion that the articles do not equal proof about OC being rampant in the area and therefore, it doesn't sway my opinion.
 
In the world of OC...money is power.... or in some cases money is GOD IMO

If OC is interesting in getting the portion of profit from a bakery...they will definitely be interested in Millard Holdings JMO MOO

You think organized crime is interested in going after a 27 year old who might be worth 5 million tops?

(BTW - I'm not sure he is even worth that much...)
 
As you have just kindly pointed out, you have used the links to help form your opinions. They do not prove that OC is rampant Hamilton and Ancaster.<modsnip> I understand your opinion and have read the articles that you've put forward. For good or for bad, I have come to my own conclusion that the articles do not equal proof about OC being rampant in the area and therefore, it doesn't sway my opinion.

Of course i will use links...especially links from RCMP and such.... They do prove it and you are free to believe whatever you like.... frankly I only care what I think and about things that pass the sniff test.. This case currently does not do that for me. <modsnip>.... either MSM and links back something up or it doesn't. Right now I am quite content that what i have provided is adequate. <modsnip>

I will be sticking with mine..... :moo::moo::moo::moo::moo::moo::moo::moo::moo:
 
In any case, we can take the term OC and speculate, conjecture, and extrapolate 'til the cows come home to form a theory that could include it.

What is it about Tim&#8217;s case, compared to the following random examples, that causes you to infer the involvement of OC?

Elisa Lam
Perry Wong and Eloise Fendelet
Lyle and Marie McCann
Audrey Gleave, Sonia Varaschin, Shelley Loder
Emma Fillipoff
Luka Magnotta
Mariam Makhniashvili

Etc etc etc

None of the above are considered to be connected to OC, so why/how does Tim's case differ?

As for OC in the Hamilton area, of course it exists, and has for years, just as it has in numerous other major cities. IMO &#8230; what you are doing is akin to taking a stolen truck in Montreal, a murder victim named Jean Pierre who worked as stonemason in Montreal and saying OC must be involved because he worked in the construction industry. Now, if it was fact that Jean Pierre&#8217;s brother was head of the construction industry in Montreal, or he was known to be involved in biker gangs and related to Mom Boucher, or the son of one of the many disgraced mayors known to have connections to OC, then we might consider OC involvement. However, if Jean Pierre's father lived in France, would we then be considering it somehow related to Francois Mitterand with nothing in between to substantiate it?

Sorry, but IMO the WSrs who aren&#8217;t buying the involvement of OC aren&#8217;t understanding how you are making such a giant leap in this case until we have specifics.
 
You think organized crime is interested in going after a 27 year old who might be worth 5 million tops?

(BTW - I'm not sure he is even worth that much...)


Yeah sure. A 27 year old who also owns an airplane hangar at a low-key but international airport, one who can fly a plane and a helicopter too, and maybe even owns one of each IMO, which would be a true bonus. I'm sure they would have some use for a guy like that and I am sure they would have some real trouble if a guy like that bailed on them at the wrong time.
Which reminds me....
does anybody remember this story? http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/03/24/bc-smuggling-operation-busted.html

IMO there's always been a market for cool guys that can fly. I watched a film about this Samuel Brown which was excellent - quite the story. A promising mind and very loved person, he had looks, personality, the works ... Even when he wanted out of crime, he was pursued for his skills. Tragic ending though. Some people would rather die than have their freedom taken.
 
I don't see it as any possibility that OC has developed this elaborate scheme in this situation, given that with the overall small nature of the airport itself, little air traffic in and out of the airport, and a non-operational business as yet at the hanger, the potential gain by OC just do not fit the circumstances. MOO

There are many links posted throughout this forum verifying statements made directly by LE, in both print and video, as well as many, many links to articles in MSM. Throughout all of this there is not one link has been provided that makes reference to any involvement by DM, MS or Millardair to any sort of OC. MOO


I would tend to disagree, I think many an OC would try to think ahead and plan schemes, I don't think that they rely on improvisation as often as it looks like in the movies. The name Organized Crime leads me to believe that they may actually organize plans and work together as an organization.

I really think that a small yet international airport would be preferable to a large international airport where there is less control and are more opportunities for mishaps and detection. And getting in on the ground floor as it were, while it is not yet operational but in the planning and hiring stages would be an advantage over coming in to an operating business with all the employees already in place, then having to leverage control over all of them. Much better to hand pick your own crew from the beginning, if you have a choice. To me that just makes sense.

And, yes, I believe there are plenty of media links tying DM to organized crime, what is a "chop shop" if not an organized form of crime? Unless you believe that one person would be scoping out, stealing, striping entire vehicles to parts and then fencing and delivering those parts as a one man crime business? I think if that were the case, there wouldn't have been time for him to chop so many vehicles as some MSM articles describe. Has it been shown that DM owns a black pick-up matching the surveillance video of the one vehicle we have confirmation on being stolen yet anyway?

Maybe one of the legal experts or LE here can answer this: how many people does it take working in concert in a non-improvised way for it to be considered organized crime? Or is it more about your country of origin or gang affiliation?
 
Maybe one of the legal experts or LE here can answer this: how many people does it take working in concert in a non-improvised way for it to be considered organized crime? Or is it more about your country of origin or gang affiliation?
<rsbm>

I'm not a legal expert, but have worked in law, and am very familiar with organized crime. I had the misfortune of growing up surrounded by it and have researched it for many years.

Here's the RCMP definition of OC:

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/soc-cgco/what-quoi-eng.htm
 
Yeah sure. A 27 year old who also owns an airplane hangar at a low-key but international airport, one who can fly a plane and a helicopter too, and maybe even owns one of each IMO, which would be a true bonus. I'm sure they would have some use for a guy like that and I am sure they would have some real trouble if a guy like that bailed on them at the wrong time.
Which reminds me....
does anybody remember this story? http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/03/24/bc-smuggling-operation-busted.html

IMO there's always been a market for cool guys that can fly. I watched a film about this Samuel Brown which was excellent - quite the story. A promising mind and very loved person, he had looks, personality, the works ... Even when he wanted out of crime, he was pursued for his skills. Tragic ending though. Some people would rather die than have their freedom taken.

Respectfully BBM. We have no idea of DM's financial situation. And from what I gather from this article, it does not sound promising. This is the point I tried to make in comparison with MJackson financial situation. Worth more dead than alive. Just because reports have claimed DM owned the hangar, properties, planes ect., does not mean he has wealth, money in the bank per se. To say DM owned whatever is just a figure of speech IMHO. Simple explanation. Someone borrows money from the bank to purchase a house known as a mortgage. That house does not belong to them until they have paid the money back to the bank. The bank owns that house. You fail to make mortgage payments; bank takes house away. At this point it is pure speculation regarding DM financial situation. From this article it appears the new business never got off the ground, a lot of money was poured into it and IMO, if WM had the money, he would have went ahead on his own and funded the runway improvements himself instead of taking, who know how long, maybe years waiting for approval for funding from Waterloo Counsel. MOO he had no choice but to turn to Waterloo Regional Counsel for further funding to try and get the business off the ground. Did WM commit suicide because he finally realized he had put himself in financial dire straits and had the hounds at his door and couldn't deal with it? Was he deeply depressed realizing DM would never make the business amount to anything? Is that why he turned to alcohol? Stress, depression set in and he buried himself in the bottle?

So with all that to take into consideration, why would OC bother to go after someone who may not have money? And IMO again, according to AS, DM had no idea of the value of the company in November of 2012. So did this supposed OC just come into play when, November, December, May? For someone supposedly as intelligent and humble as DM, does it seem logical he would allow some OC to walk in and take over his future and turn it into a corrupt affair? They only way I figure that could happen is if he himself was the king pin who started this particular OC. In that case there would still have to be that third person involved. That would be the only way I would believe OC had any part in TB's murder. DM, MS and the third, maybe fourth, fifth suspects. That's JMH&OO.

why his 71-year-old father, Wayne Millard, should continue to fund a venture whose costs already far exceeded the original estimates. &#8220;He advised [me] that the family coffers were running low and that he was very apprehensive to keep pouring money into the facility,&#8221;

Although the Millard family is often described as an aviation dynasty, in reality, neither Wayne nor Dellen &#8212; both of whom were their parents&#8217; only children &#8212; had been heavily involved in Millardair,

It was an unusual, bold move for Wayne, who apparently spent much of his life uninterested in the family business, or business at all, for that matter,

Wayne Millard seemed to envision a more stable life for Dellen than the one he had led.

As for the family company, a former Millardair pilot who did not wish to be named said that, by 1990, &#8220;it wasn&#8217;t much of a business &#8230; and was more of a hobby for Carl.&#8221;

Millardair won the support of the local airport authority and convinced the Waterloo regional council to invest in runway improvements to accommodate larger jets. When things went over budget, bank loans provided funding for the tools and staff needed to obtain key Transport Canada certification,

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...bosma-murder-suspect-started-to-dismantle-it/
 
You think organized crime is interested in going after a 27 year old who might be worth 5 million tops?

(BTW - I'm not sure he is even worth that much...)

That's the problem PP, we have no idea of DM's financial situation. Who knows, DM may have filed for legal aid to fund his case. DM paid cash for a couple of properties he owned, but where did he get that money from? Chop shop, drugs, borrowed money against Millard? For all we know he could have robbed a bank or had a sugar momma, or his own mother. It will all come out in the end. MOO
 
At the end of the day, the most important questions are (IMO), who committed the murder of TB ? and who disgracefully burnt his body ?

RIP Tim Bosma
 

This is nothing but a miscellany of opinion pieces, random articles about OC convictions or suspected involvement (including more than one article about the same incident). Yes, there is OC in Canada. This doesn't connect OC to the TB case in any meaningful way.
 
<rsbm>

I'm not a legal expert, but have worked in law, and am very familiar with organized crime. I had the misfortune of growing up surrounded by it and have researched it for many years.

Here's the RCMP definition of OC:

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/soc-cgco/what-quoi-eng.htm

;''''What is Organized Crime?



Canadian Definition

Within Canadian law enforcement, a legal definition for organized crime has only existed since the late 1990's following the enactment of Bill C-95. Amendments to this area of the Criminal Code have led to the present legal definition found within section 467.1(1) of the Criminal Code of Canada , which states a "criminal organization" means a group, however organized, that:

(a) is composed of three or more persons in or outside Canada; and,
(b) has as one of its main purposes or main activities the facilitation or commission of one or more serious offences, that, if committed, would likely result in the direct or indirect receipt of a material benefit, including a financial benefit, by the group or by any one of the persons who constitute the group.

The various components that comprise this legal definition are based on the exclusion of a group of three of more persons that has formed randomly for the immediate commission of a single offence.



International Definition

Globally, a consensus on a definition for organized crime was reached in 2002. The UN Convention on Transnational Organized Crime , Article 2 defines "organized criminal group" as follows: a group having at least three members, taking some action in concert (i.e., together or in some co-ordinated manner) for the purpose of committing a &#8216;serious crime&#8217; and for the purpose of obtaining a financial or other benefit. The group must have some internal organization or structure, and exist for some period of time before or after the actual commission of the offence(s) involved.

Most of the major international organized crime groups are active within Canada. These groups include: Asian, Eastern European, Italian, Latin American organizations, outlaw motorcycle gangs, and a variety of domestic groups'''''

Even with these Canadian and International definitions it would seem to fefine as follows :

So we need a group of just three or more, however they choose to be organized who can be based inside or outside of Canada . They need only have one of their main purposes or main activities to be the facilitation or commission of one or more serious offences. Said offence(s) if commited would likely result in direct or indirect receipt of a material benefit including (but not limited to ) financial benefit by the group or by just one of the persons who constitute the group... (hmmm)

Although GLOBALLY a consensus was reached that defines an organized criminal group as having at least three members taking action together or in some organized manner for the purpose of committing a serious crime and for the purpose of obtaining a financial or other benefit !!! The group must have some internal or organized structure and exist for some period of time before or after the actual commission of the offence(s) involved.

So basically a group of three people plotting a crime to obtain benefit from an offense and who stay formed as a group for some (unspecified) period time
before OR after the commission of the offence(s) involved.

Seems quite a possibility to me for OC to have been involved judging by this links definition, thanks for the link SillyBilly ..........JMO
 
This is nothing but a miscellany of opinion pieces, random articles about OC convictions or suspected involvement (including more than one article about the same incident). Yes, there is OC in Canada. This doesn't connect OC to the TB case in any meaningful way.

The question was about OC being in the Hamilton Ancaster area....which obviously it is IMO. I differ with you over the possibility that OC may be linked to the TB case..I believe it is a strong possibility.....MOO

thanks for your opinion....
 
This should get you started.... its a wide range of links about OC in the area of Hamilton , Ancaster and Brantford... more to follow...

rsbm
In reading the information at these links, I don't see any information as it relates to this case, specifically no references to DM or Millardair's involvement with OC.
 
It's ironic in the context of this thread, but the thing responsible for most wrongful convictions is tunnel vision, police and prosecutors who refuse to see the actual evidence (or lack of evidence) and can't let go of their pet theories.
 
rsbm
In reading the information at these links, I don't see any information as it relates to this case, specifically no references to DM or Millardair's involvement with OC.

Once again... the question was about organized crime in the Hamilton Ancaster area. It takes a little research to see that there could be a possible connection to the TB case.... I actually do see the possibility. Thanks for your opinion.
 
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