General Discussion and Theories #3

[Sillybilly]

Wasn't it posted here early on that he was interrogated for many hours before he was allowed to have his attorney present? Isn't that one of the bizarre differences between the Canadian and American justice systems?

While a detained person can invoke their right to remain silent AND their right to speak with a lawyer, there is no right to have the lawyer present during custodial interrogation. The detained person can continue to invoke his right to remain silent:

Regina v Sinclair and the Right to Counsel:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...police+interrogation&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca


(judgment of the 5 member majority)

Chief Justice McLachlin and Charron J. delivered the judgment of

the five-member majority.42 They rejected the proposition that section

10(b) requires defence counsel to be present during custodial interroga-

tion.43 Instead, the majority explained, the right to counsel that arises

upon detention is normally satisfied by the police doing two things: first,

offering an initial warning informing the detainee of his or her right to

counsel, and second, affording a reasonable opportunity to consult with

counsel when the detainee invokes the right. After this initial consulta-

tion, section 10(b) does not guarantee the detainee the right to consult

further with counsel in the course of the interrogation unless develop-

ments in the investigation indicate the need.

(dissenting reasons delivered by J. Binnie acknowledging that section 10(b) does not guarantee the right to have one’s lawyer present during custodial interrogation)

Dissenting reasons were delivered by Binnie J., who took the view

that, together with the Supreme Court’s interpretations of the confessions

rule and the right to silence in Oickle and Singh, the Sinclair majority’s

analysis of the right to counsel improperly favoured the state interest in

criminal investigations over individual rights.47 Justice Binnie agreed

with the majority that section 10(b) does not guarantee the right to have

one’s lawyer present during custodial interrogation.

 

[Sillybilly]

Further to the above, a Tor Star article re the Canadian vs American system:

from:
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...lawyer_during_questioning_says_top_court.html

They said the Canadian and U.S. systems differ.


“Miranda came about in response to abusive police tactics then prevalent in the U.S. and applies in the context of a host of other rules that are less favourable to the accused than their equivalents in Canada.”


The judges warned about grafting rules from other countries onto the Canadian system.


“Adopting procedural protections from other jurisdictions in a piecemeal fashion risks upsetting the balance that has been struck by Canadian courts and legislatures.”


There is nothing to prevent having a lawyer present if all sides agree, however.


McLachlin and Charron said suspects can’t interrupt questioning with demands for more legal advice except in certain, limited circumstances.

I will hazard a wilda$$ guess that it was LE who would not have agreed

 

[Snoofo]

While a detained person can invoke their right to remain silent AND their right to speak with a lawyer, there is no right to have the lawyer present during custodial interrogation. The detained person can continue to invoke his right to remain silent:

Regina v Sinclair and the Right to Counsel:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...police+interrogation&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca


(judgment of the 5 member majority)





(dissenting reasons delivered by J. Binnie acknowledge that section 10(b) does not guarantee the right to have one’s lawyer present during custodial interrogation)

True. What we don't know is whether DM sat silent for four hours, whether he offered some or all of what he knew (whatever that may be), or if he lied the whole way through.

If he was silent, he knew the basics (maybe he used to follow a case on WS and was directed to the youtube lecture on Maranda rights - that's how I learned it! Lol).

If he told them what he knew and could not tell them what he didnt know (very important!), then he was cooperating with the investigation up to a point where he retained DP. The only thing is LE can use that information in whatever way they wish, and use it against him, when all the while he may have thought he was helping himself and LE's case. Just because they reject information does not mean he wasn't cooperating.

If he was as egotistical and controlling as some here believe him to be (with no factual basis, IMO), then there is no way he kept his mouth shut. People like that believe they can talk their way out of anything. All accounts I have read describe him as the low-key, casual, soft-spoken, nice, polite type of guy. Even AS who had the least favourable comments didn't paint him as an a-hole manipulator. And if he made any representation to that effect, I am sure AB would not have edited it out.

 

[Blomquist]

bbm

However he did plead his innocence and did over qualify his statement of innocence by writing about going out of his way to avoid stepping on ants.......

He is actively pleading his innocence to a total stranger, from a jail cell, when he and DP don't have the sense to simply tell the "story" to the Crown and walk out? Hmmm....non sequitur, there either is no story, or the story is damning enough to warrant Trial and he must try to convince a Judge or Jury of his antless antics.....

Even a law clerk could see that faux pas of the letter and contents and it shows DP has no control over his client or that DP is too inept to represent DM. What lawyer let's his client write a self incriminating letter from a jail cell? I wouldn't would you?

What about his gf? Must be a "real open relationship" for her to accept that letter.

....and you know for sure he wrote this letter??? How?

 

[Blomquist]

Somehow he got involved enough to be there and he and his solicitor have determined he is tangled up enough in the web that it will take a long and complex detangling process to get him out.

If LE is in no way interested in looking beyond DM now that they feel their evidence is sufficient, he and his family will have probably hired their own detectives if he is going to try to prove his innocence. That could explain selling some assets if MB feels confident enough to foot the bill for it.

I dont know his intent was to be criminally involved in anything but perhaps he was asked to participate under the guise of it not being a crime, i.e. a test drive. It may have been easy to talk him into anything, I'm afraid.

One thing I found interesting on friends' FB accounts over the last couple years at least was a lot of showboating of the hangar and its cool contents, talk of flying, one throwing himself a birthday bash at the old hangar, all without credit or mention of DM. Kind of acting like it's theirs. He wasnt respected IMO. A dupe through and through, for years. I dont think he controlled anyone, but was led to believe he was in control so they can continue to use him.

Funny how that letter reinforces each of our existing opinions. If it is him that wrote it, it completely solidifies my opinions in this post. Dupe of the Century.

This does not signify he could not be intelligent or successful. Some people cannot see the forest for the trees. They miss the big picture. They lack certain type of skills that are not easily attained in the same way one learns to fly a plane for instance. Social instinct could be weak. Anyway I shall leave it at that and wont speculate into that aspect any further right now because I've never met him, just forming opinions based on what I see just like everybody else here.

Lets hope the pretrial hearing comes quick.

Hence his statement via DP that he feels USED !!!!

I sincerely hope his family are using PI's...... and I hope his real friends will provide all they can to dig into this as thoroughly as possible.

The not so real friends will already have taken their vow of silence IMO...so that in and of itself will be a clue... imo. Sometimes its not what is said but what is not said....jmo

And before I get the slew of responses about someones right to remain silent.... I am talking about a vow of silence between 'those in the know' not someones right whilst holed up against their will.

 

[Sillybilly]

None of us knows for sure if DM did or did not write the letter. I think our discussion can only be based on AB having stated that she authenticated it; if AB is wrong or lying through her teeth (which I highly doubt) and he didn't write it, then what is there to even discuss about it?

Maybe someone would like to find out who else wrote the letter and let us know, and we could then discuss it from that point of view.

 

[Blomquist]

None of us knows for sure if DM did or did not write the letter. I think our discussion can only be based on AB having stated that she authenticated it; if AB is wrong or lying through her teeth (which I highly doubt) and he didn't write it, then what is there to even discuss about it?

Maybe someone would like to find out who else wrote the letter and let us know, and we could then discuss it from that point of view.

How can AB verify who wrote it? Unless her alias is "Dee" ???

She cannot even authenticate it IMO.... all she can authenticate is that someone claims to have received a letter from DM. Even if letter exists....no-one knows who wrote it unless they witnessed him writing it.

We can dissect the letter all we want...but at the end its just a letter with no obvious evil intonation....... any maliciousness attached to the letter appears to come from those criticizing it....JMO

 

[SnooperDuper]

Well here's a theory

DM doesn't want to park in any industrial area or near a nearly constructed home for fear of nails/metal...may have been annoyed to have to do a recent tire repair and vows to walk, not drive, into such areas. He wasn't hiding the Yukon, just keeping the tires safe.

DM, MS and TB are in the truck when DM decides to do some burn outs leading TB to fall from the truck and be killed.

DM and MS take the truck in a panic. In the end they burn TB's body (indignity to a human body?) and try and hide the truck.

The chop shop is DM's buddy's business and DM has not stolen anything himself and had no intent to steal TB's truck. He is, however, harbouring his buddy's operation, for which he feel used.

 

[robynhood]

Curious of above post #68???...Why would D.M decide to do a burn out so badly that it would KILL T.B....that would have to be a HUGE TURN or burn out ...IMO...Unless you are going to now say he is a race car driver with a RED Mowalk hair style....JMHO I do not get this one...and am saying this in RESPECT to your views....robynhhood....kind of strange as someone than did an indignity to a human body..as a result...TB

 

[SnooperDuper]

Curious of above post #68???...Why would D.M decide to do a burn out so badly that it would KILL T.B....that would have to be a HUGE TURN or burn out ...IMO...Unless you are going to now say he is a race car driver with a RED Mowalk hair style....JMHO I do not get this one...and am saying this in RESPECT to your views....robynhhood....kind of strange as someone than did an indignity to a human body..as a result...TB

Yes he entered the Baja 500 a couple of times I think, he is a racecar driver

I'm just imagining the door latch opened...maybe TB fell into it in such a way the door popped open or whatever. Former premier Jack Tobin's son was drunk and doing donuts in his truck and his best friend flew out of his truck and was killed. He didn't lose control or crash but there was a death, and he did get jail time.

 

[robynhood]

ok Snooperduper if that occurred and DM lost control of TB truck and it was that simple...IMO ..I think he should explain it...however there still remains an inginity ti a human body..TB whio as we all know was burned beyond recognition....I still maintain IMO...there needs to be so explaining to do....as Rickey used to say to LUCILLE in" I love lucy.....' robynhood

 

[robynhood]

JMO..this is completely my opinion as to what happened....I need to post a song here....I think PANic broke out as they saw TB news spread all over the media ..social networks....etc....I think the GROUP OF friends that knew what happened clamed up....shut up everyone or we will end up all in the slammer as this songs goes....respectfully posting....http://youtu.be/g1cBK3kF2bs

....robynhood..theme song from COPS show....

 

[Snoofo]

Yes he entered the Baja 500 a couple of times I think, he is a racecar driver

I'm just imagining the door latch opened...maybe TB fell into it in such a way the door popped open or whatever. Former premier Jack Tobin's son was drunk and doing donuts in his truck and his best friend flew out of his truck and was killed. He didn't lose control or crash but there was a death, and he did get jail time.

I suppose it is possible. I would actually even wish the truth is as harmless as this, even though Iit is so ridiculous it borders on embarassing.

The only thing is I feel the "used" comment of DP's is meaningful and there is no bigger story behind your theory, in fact it is quite a little story! Ha! Imagine if after all this debate it came down to reckless donuts? Good grief.

I dont think it is this simple but your theory isnt impossible "SnooperD".

 

[Snoofo]

JMO..this is completely my opinion as to what happened....I need to post a song here....I think PANic broke out as they saw TB news spread all over the media ..social networks....etc....I think the GROUP OF friends that knew what happened clamed up....shut up everyone or we will end up all in the slammer as this songs goes....respectfully posting....http://youtu.be/g1cBK3kF2bs

....robynhood..theme song from COPS show....

Great. Maybe the prosecutor could put his closing arguments into song.

:facepalm:

 

[SnooperDuper]

I suppose it is possible. I would actually even wish the truth is as harmless as this, even though Iit is so ridiculous it borders on embarassing.

The only thing is I feel the "used" comment of DP's is meaningful and there is no bigger story behind your theory, in fact it is quite a little story! Ha! Imagine if after all this debate it came down to reckless donuts? Good grief.

I dont think it is this simple but your theory isnt impossible "SnooperD".

Well reckless donuts deserve jail time, just not 25 years. So why not do two years right away waiting for the trial, be sentenced to time served, and walk away?

Maybe that's the reason DM is willing to keep quiet. It's a complicated story and his decision to pull a stunt in the truck cost someone their life.

???

 

[Archangel7]

How can AB verify who wrote it? Unless her alias is "Dee" ???

She cannot even authenticate it IMO.... all she can authenticate is that someone claims to have received a letter from DM. Even if letter exists....no-one knows who wrote it unless they witnessed him writing it.

We can dissect the letter all we want...but at the end its just a letter with no obvious evil intonation....... any maliciousness attached to the letter appears to come from those criticizing it....JMO

bbm
....and you know for sure he didn't write this letter??? How?

Several experienced people and some of DM's acquaintances also state it's genuine.

However a look at other letters written from the same jail confirmed that the paper, standard Staples stock, is what prisoners use as is the pencil.

As for this specific letter, Millard was known by a group of people who worked with him as someone who liked to do little drawings of planes, making the fact that he would doodle a speeding truck or SUV on his letter slightly less odd, although still disturbing given the context. Members of the group also said they recognized his handwriting even though they did not keep any samples of it.

One member of the group said that the lines where Millard invites his correspondent to visit him in jail jumped out and were typical of the controlling behaviour Millard often exhibited:

I’d like very much to continue to write to you: to have your support, and to have a proper conversation, once I make bail.

(Which I hope will happen in September).

But for that to happen, I’m going to have to meet you in person first.

A businessman who had dealings with Millard and still has handwriting samples said in his opinion the handwriting was an “exact match.” (Since I first wrote about this letter, a number of people have pointed out that this businessman is not a handwriting expert, which is true but somewhat beside the point given that even the courts don’t require a handwriting expert to authenticate documents.

Per AB, whom would risk her career and finances if she was lying about these different people's statements of authenticity, including a statement from a Profiler with another Agency whose name I've omitted.

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/2013/07/the-dellen-millard-jailhouse-letter-part-ii.html

The letter has some interesting anomalies as stated before. That and the above proof trumps no info or even answering only with another question.

So I have presented the assertion that the letter is authentic based on the evidence I have presented.
Please submit your evidence that the letter is fake. TIA, if the letter is absolutely fake and you can prove it, I'd like to take the letter out of my "evidence" file.

 

[Blomquist]

bbm
....and you know for sure he didn't write this letter??? How?

I am not sure and have never said I was.... but equally I am not sure he did...so was asking you how you knew !! ?

Several experienced people and some of DM's acquaintances also state it's genuine.

Experienced in what? and which acquaintances ?.... do acquaintances allege to have seen him writing the letter?

However a look at other letters written from the same jail confirmed that the paper, standard Staples stock, is what prisoners use as is the pencil.

As for this specific letter, Millard was known by a group of people who worked with him as someone who liked to do little drawings of planes, making the fact that he would doodle a speeding truck or SUV on his letter slightly less odd, although still disturbing given the context. Members of the group also said they recognized his handwriting even though they did not keep any samples of it.

Ohhh well I have known a quite a few people and I would never be able to say that something written definitely belonged to any of them.... and many people have similar writing to the writing in that letter JMO

One member of the group said that the lines where Millard invites his correspondent to visit him in jail jumped out and were typical of the controlling behaviour Millard often exhibited:

I’d like very much to continue to write to you: to have your support, and to have a proper conversation, once I make bail.

(Which I hope will happen in September).

But for that to happen, I’m going to have to meet you in person first.

This looks like someone answering something that someone wrote to them ie. He was probably told that he had this 'Dee's' support and that she wanted to write to him....what on earth is controlling about saying you hope that can be the case ???

A businessman who had dealings with Millard and still has handwriting samples said in his opinion the handwriting was an “exact match.” (Since I first wrote about this letter, a number of people have pointed out that this businessman is not a handwriting expert, which is true but somewhat beside the point given that even the courts don’t require a handwriting expert to authenticate documents.

And if it is an exact match ??? What is actually wrong with the letter? IMO it is not controlling at all...merely an answer to anothers letter. I think any way its spun its a benign piece......JMO

Per AB, whom would risk her career and finances if she was lying about these different people's statements of authenticity, including a statement from a Profiler with another Agency whose name I've omitted.

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/2013/07/the-dellen-millard-jailhouse-letter-part-ii.html

AB's has no credibility with me...and I would never base my opinion on a member of MSM MOO

The letter has some interesting anomalies as stated before. That and the above proof trumps no info or even answering only with another question.

So I have presented the assertion that the letter is authentic based on the evidence I have presented.
Please submit your evidence that the letter is fake. TIA, if the letter is absolutely fake and you can prove it, I'd like to take the letter out of my "evidence" file.

I dont have to present anything..... my stance was that no-one can really know....much like this whole case...people are trying to taint everything and put a negative spin..... be it media or onlookers looking for their 15 minutes....

I still don't know who wrote the letter... but if DM did, I can say it is not anything that is a negative matter insofar as he is concerned. If he didn't write it then it's been a real waste of my time even debating it JMO as it fruitless from either angle.... MOO

 

[Snoofo]

bbm
....and you know for sure he didn't write this letter??? How?

Several experienced people and some of DM's acquaintances also state it's genuine.

However a look at other letters written from the same jail confirmed that the paper, standard Staples stock, is what prisoners use as is the pencil.

As for this specific letter, Millard was known by a group of people who worked with him as someone who liked to do little drawings of planes, making the fact that he would doodle a speeding truck or SUV on his letter slightly less odd, although still disturbing given the context. Members of the group also said they recognized his handwriting even though they did not keep any samples of it.

One member of the group said that the lines where Millard invites his correspondent to visit him in jail jumped out and were typical of the controlling behaviour Millard often exhibited:

I’d like very much to continue to write to you: to have your support, and to have a proper conversation, once I make bail.

(Which I hope will happen in September).

But for that to happen, I’m going to have to meet you in person first.

A businessman who had dealings with Millard and still has handwriting samples said in his opinion the handwriting was an “exact match.” (Since I first wrote about this letter, a number of people have pointed out that this businessman is not a handwriting expert, which is true but somewhat beside the point given that even the courts don’t require a handwriting expert to authenticate documents.

Per AB, whom would risk her career and finances if she was lying about these different people's statements of authenticity, including a statement from a Profiler with another Agency whose name I've omitted.

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/2013/07/the-dellen-millard-jailhouse-letter-part-ii.html

The letter has some interesting anomalies as stated before. That and the above proof trumps no info or even answering only with another question.

So I have presented the assertion that the letter is authentic based on the evidence I have presented.
Please submit your evidence that the letter is fake. TIA, if the letter is absolutely fake and you can prove it, I'd like to take the letter out of my "evidence" file.

Have you thought the authenticity was not authentic enough for MSM standards?
AB has written for MSM on this case before. How come nobody picked up this particular story from her? Initially she couldnt show it, couldnt authenticate it. After she authenticated it to her own satisfaction (justified by Courts dont require experts comment) and once she posted a copy on her site, MSM still didnt pick up on this. I would think more than one wanted to but the information was not up to standards. Knowing most MSM standards are quite low, this concerns me.

How come Ann's source didnt give up his/her alleged sample of DM's writing so she could have it compared by a pro? I'm sure she'd get the story in print if that were possible. Maybe Ann trusts this person but why should we?

 

[SnooperDuper]

Have you thought the authenticity was not authentic enough for MSM standards?
AB has written for MSM on this case before. How come nobody picked up this particular story from her? Initially she couldnt show it, couldnt authenticate it. After she authenticated it to her own satisfaction (justified by Courts dont require experts comment) and once she posted a copy on her site, MSM still didnt pick up on this. I would think more than one wanted to but the information was not up to standards. Knowing most MSM standards are quite low, this concerns me.

How come Ann's source didnt give up his/her alleged sample of DM's writing so she could have it compared by a pro? I'm sure she'd get the story in print if that were possible. Maybe Ann trusts this person but why should we?

There is not enough meat to that letter to make a 1,000 word column. That's the most likely reason it's not in the news. Interesting to people who would like a chance to analyze DM and a lot of nothing to everyone else.

I do want to point out DM has rather distinctive f's and really regular form in his letters. The descending strokes of his j and g are jug shaped, while he uses a straight stroke to make his y's. Half the time his I's and t's have a curl to the right at the base. Vertical strokes are quite vertical though d's in particular slant left. In short there are a lot of obvious quirks that would make his writing recognizable.

 

[Blomquist]

Have you thought the authenticity was not authentic enough for MSM standards?
AB has written for MSM on this case before. How come nobody picked up this particular story from her? Initially she couldnt show it, couldnt authenticate it. After she authenticated it to her own satisfaction (justified by Courts dont require experts comment) and once she posted a copy on her site, MSM still didnt pick up on this. I would think more than one wanted to but the information was not up to standards. Knowing most MSM standards are quite low, this concerns me.

How come Ann's source didnt give up his/her alleged sample of DM's writing so she could have it compared by a pro? I'm sure she'd get the story in print if that were possible. Maybe Ann trusts this person but why should we?

precisely