General Gun Violence/Gun Control #2

[Lexiintoronto]

Please let us know your potential legislative solution to this one:

Inland Empire gang member goes on shooting spree of current, former girlfriends: SBDA

A San Bernardino man faces multiple murder charges after he allegedly went on a shooting spree of his current and former girlfriends in Riverside and San Bernardino counties. Louis Peter Hernandez …

ktla.com

Yet another California gang member, felon in possession of a firearm, violating both his parole & probation conditions.

Readers here already know that I prefer a solution that does not reduce my civil rights or the civil rights of other law-abiding taxpayers here in the USA.

jmho ymmv lrr

Your quote: “Readers here already know that I prefer a solution that does not reduce my civil rights or the civil rights of other law-abiding taxpayers here in the USA.”

Everyone needs to be involved with the solution, imo.

There are firearm issues in the US and Canada, more so in the US. One issue they’ve found in the US is that the majority of illegal firearms have been stolen from vehicles. So *part* of the solution is to either make strict vehicle storage requirements for firearms or prohibit storage in vehicles.

Would that impact you? Yes, possibly. But the goal is to reduce the amount of illegal guns on the street.

And there’s legislation in place that already prohibits what gang criminals do. The threat of being arrested doesn’t deter them from breaking the law. So try to cut off their source of weapons and ammo, imo.

Enforcing the existing laws would be great as well. It was against US laws for the American(s) who supplied weapons to a Canadian mass-murderer. But three years later and there haven’t been any charges and as far as I know he ( possibly ‘they’re’ ) still permitted to own firearms. (One American admitted to the crime once he was caught.)

We’ve had a mass shooting here recently (four deceased, one injured), plus an uptick in gun crimes. So we’re facing the same battles, and searching for solutions.

 

[housewife]

Please let us know your potential legislative solution to this one:

Inland Empire gang member goes on shooting spree of current, former girlfriends: SBDA

A San Bernardino man faces multiple murder charges after he allegedly went on a shooting spree of his current and former girlfriends in Riverside and San Bernardino counties. Louis Peter Hernandez …

ktla.com

Yet another California gang member, felon in possession of a firearm, violating both his parole & probation conditions.

Readers here already know that I prefer a solution that does not reduce my civil rights or the civil rights of other law-abiding taxpayers here in the USA.

jmho ymmv lrr

IMHO I don't feel like my civil rights are being reduced by enforcing a "well-regulated" right to bear arms.
I know we all have different interpretations of what "well-regulated" means today, in 2023.
I guess I don't understand the reasoning of one person owning many killing tools if personal protection is the only goal.
How many intruders are you expecting if you feel you need more than one firearm?
What kind of intruders are you expecting if you feel the need to own a weapon of war assault rifle for "home defense"?
How many killing tools are enough? 3 guns? 4 guns? A single person realistically can't use all 4 at the same time when someone breaks into their home. John Wick is a fictional character, but I think some people really believe they will be able to magically handle a dangerous situation because they bought multiple killing tools.
Just my two cents on the quantity of firearms owned per person.

Most Americans believe they are safer with a gun in the house, but it actually increases suicide risk by 300%.

60% of gun deaths are suicides.

 

[PrairieWind]

IMHO I don't feel like my civil rights are being reduced by enforcing a "well-regulated" right to bear arms.
I know we all have different interpretations of what "well-regulated" means today, in 2023.
I guess I don't understand the reasoning of one person owning many killing tools if personal protection is the only goal.
How many intruders are you expecting if you feel you need more than one firearm?
What kind of intruders are you expecting if you feel the need to own a weapon of war assault rifle for "home defense"?
How many killing tools are enough? 3 guns? 4 guns? A single person realistically can't use all 4 at the same time when someone breaks into their home. John Wick is a fictional character, but I think some people really believe they will be able to magically handle a dangerous situation because they bought multiple killing tools.
Just my two cents on the quantity of firearms owned per person.

Most Americans believe they are safer with a gun in the house, but it actually increases suicide risk by 300%.

60% of gun deaths are suicides.

I own a dozen fire arms. Half of which were handed down from my father. The other half I have purchased over the years. Rifles, shot guns, a couple handguns. The shotguns are various gauges for bird hunting. I have two rifles for big game hunting (which I rarely do anymore) and one is a collectable, I have two .22 for small game and just target shooting. And a couple of handguns for defense and just sport shooting (and one collectable). I can only fire one at a time, so what difference does it make how many I own? There is an incredible disconnect in this country between gun owners and non-gun owners I feel.

 

[cocomod]

I own a dozen fire arms. Half of which were handed down from my father. The other half I have purchased over the years. Rifles, shot guns, a couple handguns. The shotguns are various gauges for bird hunting. I have two rifles for big game hunting (which I rarely do anymore) and one is a collectable, I have two .22 for small game and just target shooting. And a couple of handguns for defense and just sport shooting (and one collectable). I can only fire one at a time, so what difference does it make how many I own? There is an incredible disconnect in this country between gun owners and non-gun owners I feel.

Thank you! You verbalized my situation exactly. My boys all hunt, and there are different calibers for different species they hunt. They also have collectibles passed down from both grandparents. They have been taught from a very young age to respect guns and gun safety. My middle son just purchased a shotgun because he wanted to own his own and not use mine. IMHO People who have been around guns their who lives feel differently than people who have not.

 

[Laughing]

Thank you, @PrairieWind and @cocomod !

People have different hobbies. Ours doesn't need any additional legal limits.

Unless a state/locality needs to change hunting regulations.

This taxpaying citizen used his legally-held firearm to protect his family:

Granada Hills resident shoots, kills intruder during home invasion, LAPD says

A Granada Hills homeowner shot and killed one of two intruders during an early-morning home invasion, authorities said.

abc7.com

A grandmother and a toddler were at home during the break-in though none of the residents were reported injured. Neighbors who spoke with Eyewitness News said this type of crime has been happening often.

"We've been having burglaries every day in this neighborhood, so I'm not surprised," said Pat Walsh. "I'm not surprised at all this has happened. It's been a real problem here, and the residents here are fed up."

Officers believe the suspects involved in the break-in are connected to other home invasions. Anyone with information is urged to contact police.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[DFWNF]

IMHO I don't feel like my civil rights are being reduced by enforcing a "well-regulated" right to bear arms.
I know we all have different interpretations of what "well-regulated" means today, in 2023.
I guess I don't understand the reasoning of one person owning many killing tools if personal protection is the only goal.
How many intruders are you expecting if you feel you need more than one firearm?
What kind of intruders are you expecting if you feel the need to own a weapon of war assault rifle for "home defense"?
How many killing tools are enough? 3 guns? 4 guns? A single person realistically can't use all 4 at the same time when someone breaks into their home. John Wick is a fictional character, but I think some people really believe they will be able to magically handle a dangerous situation because they bought multiple killing tools.
Just my two cents on the quantity of firearms owned per person.

Most Americans believe they are safer with a gun in the house, but it actually increases suicide risk by 300%.

60% of gun deaths are suicides.

It's very scary imo. You raise great points imo. Just read another unsecured gun case with a baby, apologies if I already posted. Can DCF or whatever assist with something like this? They need to, imo.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Thank you, @PrairieWind and @cocomod !

People have different hobbies. Ours doesn't need any additional legal limits.

Unless a state/locality needs to change hunting regulations.

This taxpaying citizen used his legally-held firearm to protect his family:

Granada Hills resident shoots, kills intruder during home invasion, LAPD says

A Granada Hills homeowner shot and killed one of two intruders during an early-morning home invasion, authorities said.

abc7.com

A grandmother and a toddler were at home during the break-in though none of the residents were reported injured. Neighbors who spoke with Eyewitness News said this type of crime has been happening often.

"We've been having burglaries every day in this neighborhood, so I'm not surprised," said Pat Walsh. "I'm not surprised at all this has happened. It's been a real problem here, and the residents here are fed up."

Officers believe the suspects involved in the break-in are connected to other home invasions. Anyone with information is urged to contact police.

jmho ymmv lrr

Two arrested in Dec. 6 Jeanerette home invasion

On Dec. 9, KLFY reported on an attempted home invasion in which one suspect was killed and two others were wanted for their role in the crime that occurred on Dec. 6 at 900 Old Jeanerette Rd.

www.klfy.com

This one hits near and dear and happened last December. The homeowners are close friends of my entire extended family. They are great people, the salt of the earth.

I am thankful he had the right to defend himself and his wife against these thugs.

 

[scapa]

Not posting an opinion, just a recent article from The Guardian on mass shooting events in the US this year:

US breaks record for most mass shootings in single year after weekend murders

Country has had 38 mass shootings – in which at least 203 people have died – so far this year, passing previous high of 36

www.theguardian.com

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Refreshing positive news about Detroit and their efforts to reduce crime, including gun violence.

Detroit is close to recording its fewest homicides in nearly 60 years​

“The coordinated effort targeted seven key areas: Reducing felony gun case backlogs in Wayne County Circuit and 36th District courts; increasing staffing for the Wayne County Prosecutor's and Sheriff's offices, as well as the Detroit Police Department; increasing coordination between the Wayne County prosecutor and DPD on shooting and homicide cases; increasing accountability for defendants released on tether to the Wayne County Sheriff's Office; increasing accountability from the Michigan Department of Corrections for those on probation and parole; and the implementation of the FAST unit, a joint fugitive apprehension unit of DPD and the Sheriff's Office, which apprehended nearly 1,000 individuals with outstanding felony warrants this year, prioritizing those wanted for gun crimes.”

Detroit is close to recording its fewest homicides in nearly 60 years

Gun violence reduction partnership between Detroit and Wayne County officials announced the news Monday.

www.freep.com

 

[Laughing]

Refreshing positive news about Detroit and their efforts to reduce crime, including gun violence.

Detroit is close to recording its fewest homicides in nearly 60 years​

“The coordinated effort targeted seven key areas: Reducing felony gun case backlogs in Wayne County Circuit and 36th District courts; increasing staffing for the Wayne County Prosecutor's and Sheriff's offices, as well as the Detroit Police Department; increasing coordination between the Wayne County prosecutor and DPD on shooting and homicide cases; increasing accountability for defendants released on tether to the Wayne County Sheriff's Office; increasing accountability from the Michigan Department of Corrections for those on probation and parole; and the implementation of the FAST unit, a joint fugitive apprehension unit of DPD and the Sheriff's Office, which apprehended nearly 1,000 individuals with outstanding felony warrants this year, prioritizing those wanted for gun crimes.”

Detroit is close to recording its fewest homicides in nearly 60 years

Gun violence reduction partnership between Detroit and Wayne County officials announced the news Monday.

www.freep.com

All without reducing my civil rights or the civil rights of other law-abiding taxpaying citizens!!! Including @BayouBelle_LA 's friends, and the California homeowner & family.

Good news for Detroit, perhaps other cities will notice & implement the plan to protect their own citizens!

@BayouBelle_LA , so sorry that your friends had this experience -- and oh-so glad they were ready!

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[housewife]

I own a dozen fire arms. Half of which were handed down from my father. The other half I have purchased over the years. Rifles, shot guns, a couple handguns. The shotguns are various gauges for bird hunting. I have two rifles for big game hunting (which I rarely do anymore) and one is a collectable, I have two .22 for small game and just target shooting. And a couple of handguns for defense and just sport shooting (and one collectable). I can only fire one at a time, so what difference does it make how many I own? There is an incredible disconnect in this country between gun owners and non-gun owners I feel.

I grew up around guns, actually.

Hunting for food makes sense, I was honing in on solely self-defense purposes.

To me the term "gun owner" typically means someone in a metro-area who buys a gun on an emotional whim of fear and plans to use it against other humans for self defense. In my mind, the typical owner is not experienced, not trained, does not handle their firearm safely, and does not store it properly.

I would consider you more than just simply a gun owner, more like a gun hobbyist and collector with resources like land on which to hunt and time to practice your skills (based on the quantity, variety, and usage of your firearms). Which is cool, you sound informed, experienced, and probably have safe storage habits.

I wouldn't mind requiring all idiots to take a class or two before buying a gun in this country. Not everyone was lucky enough to have a parent/grandparent/scout leader to teach them correctly. Shouldn't we want others to learn the same standards we already practice? It's so easy to learn the basics!

Edited to add: My condolences to those who suffered in the 10 school shootings since I last posted in this thread on Monday.

 

[Cota332]

Edited to add: My condolences to those who suffered in the 10 school shootings since I last posted in this thread on Monday.

sbm

Just for the sake of clarity, I'd like to state that there were not 10 school shootings between 12/4 and 12/8 (2023).

The majority of these incidents (for this time period) are cataloged by the Gun Violence Archive themselves as instances wherein a student/individual was caught carrying a firearm, with no injuries or even firearms being discharged.

There were only three instances of a firearm being used/discharged within that time period :

• One was very widely reported college shooting at a Las Vegas University, in which three people had tragically died.​
• Another was a firearm negligent/accidental discharge in a parking lot after an after-hours High-School basketball game (one person dead)​
• The final incident involved an individual injuring (shooting) a school resource officer in the leg outside of a school.​

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

There is an incredible disconnect in this country between gun owners and non-gun owners I feel.

I mean, there's a reason for that. Some of us don't want to be killed for buying milk on our way from work. It's incredible to me that we, as a nation, consider gun ownership a right and healthcare not.

 

[Cool Cats]

I mean, there's a reason for that. Some of us don't want to be killed for buying milk on our way from work. It's incredible to me that we, as a nation, consider gun ownership a right and healthcare not.

People have the right to health care if they pay for it.

1.) I went to the hospital after a car accident and they did zero for me. Doctor just sent me home.

2.) I went to the hospital after a fall and they did all kinds of scans and did more than I needed actually.

Because with #1 I didn't have health insurance. With #2 I did.

I didn't have the right to full medical care without insurance.

I had the right to get a full medical work up with insurance.

 

[Laughing]

People have the right to health care if they pay for it.

1.) I went to the hospital after a car accident and they did zero for me. Doctor just sent me home.

2.) I went to the hospital after a fall and they did all kinds of scans and did more than I needed actually.

Because with #1 I didn't have health insurance. With #2 I did.

I didn't have the right to full medical care without insurance.

I had the right to get a full medical work up with insurance.

Full-time jobs are required to provide medical insurance in the USA...that's the law afaik.

Firearms are my Constitutional right -- existing much longer than employer-sponsored health insurance.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

People have the right to health care if they pay for it.

1.) I went to the hospital after a car accident and they did zero for me. Doctor just sent me home.

2.) I went to the hospital after a fall and they did all kinds of scans and did more than I needed actually.

Because with #1 I didn't have health insurance. With #2 I did.

I didn't have the right to full medical care without insurance.

I had the right to get a full medical work up with insurance.

And this type of thinking is exactly my point. If you had returned home after the accident and had a bad outcome due to lack of workup, you'd have a malpractice case, insurance or not.

In emergencies, doctors treat the patient, not the insurance company. "The patient didn't have insurance" is not an excuse for substandard care. My point is that it shouldn't just apply to emergencies.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Full-time jobs are required to provide medical insurance in the USA...that's the law afaik.

Firearms are my Constitutional right -- existing much longer than employer-sponsored health insurance.

jmho ymmv lrr

That is inaccurate. Full-time jobs are not required to carry medical insurance and even with a full-time job, you're not guaranteed medical insurance. You have to pay for at least a portion of it at the vast majority of jobs. Your portion varies, could be hundreds of dollars or even $1000+/month. The unemployed or self-employed have the option of getting their own insurance, but insurance rates outside of Medicaid can be reasonable to astronomical.

How Much Does Health Insurance Cost In 2024?

The Affordable Care Act (ACA) marketplace at Healthcare.gov lets you compare health plans that are sold in the marketplace. The cost of health insurance in the ACA marketplace varies by insurance company, where you live, which plan and metal tier you choose, how many people are covered, your age, wh

www.forbes.com

Regardless, gun ownership should have restrictions, limitations, and parameters, IMO.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Gun control advocacy group Everytown for Gun Safety said in a June fact sheet that "data show that 18-to-20-year-olds commit gun homicides at triple the rate of adults 21 and older."

The group’s media office said researchers arrived at that calculation using the FBI’s supplementary homicide report and the U.S. Census American Community Survey from 2016 to 2020. Everytown’s researchers said they considered variables in the FBI data, including crime type, weapon and offender’s age. Researchers then used census population data to estimate each age group’s rates of committing a fatal shooting. (In most datasets, "firearms" includes both long guns and handguns.)

Federal law requires people to be 21 to buy handguns, but some states permit buying long guns as young as 18. Florida’s law, and the proposed bill, is centered on long guns, which include rifles, carbines, shotguns and submachine guns. The AR-15 semi-automatic rifle falls under this category.

Fact-check: What does the data show on deadly shootings by 18-to-20-year-olds?

Lawmakers in 2018 raised the purchase age to 21 following revelations that Stoneman Douglas shooter Nikolas Cruz had legally purchased the AR-15-style weapon he used in the attack.

www.nbcmiami.com

 

[housewife]

US mass shooting victims should receive the Congressional Medal of Honor, because they died for our rights.
Civilians can receive the Medal of Honor, even children:

Young Hero Award Recognizes young Americans aged 17 or younger for their courage in a dire situation.​

I'd like to honor and recognize the sacrifice of children's lives for our freedom. They are conscripted and die of battle wounds.
edit: typo

 

[al66pine]

Private Party Firearms Transfers. Background Checks, Required or Not?

A post on the Feb 11 shooting in Houston TX Lakewood Church stated:
“Non-commercial gun sellers (private citizen to citizen) are not required to be licensed or perform background checks….” That post was deleted.
My post responding was also deleted, as it was “not specific to the case.” In retrospect, agreeing that my post on that thread was not appropriate. So, reposting (w a few edits to clarify) in the interest of maintaining FACTUAL info re laws here.

NINETEEN STATES & DC require varying state-specific checks for handguns & some require checks for some or all long guns as well, for the so-called private party firearm transfers.
They include CA, CT, DE, DC, HI, IL, MD, MA, MI, MN, NE, NV, NJ, NY, OR, PA, RI, VT, VI, WA, per wiki.* If you’re curious about your state or another state, go to wiki link, w a spreadsheet for each state on many aspects of firearm laws.*

Before reading up on this, I was aware of a FEW states mandating background checks for private party transfers. Once I started looking, I was surprised to find nineteen states require them. Nearly half.

Over the years on Websleuths, I’ve learned a lot, often from posts, but sometimes from being prompted to look further, to find authoritative sources on the topic.

_______________________________________________

Houston- Adult, child injured in shooting at Joel Osteen’s Lakewood church

Yes a lot in that article I hadn't read before. I hadn't thought of her being here legally in some capacity so thanks for that. We know she forged her son's birth certificate so perhaps she also had pulled something similar to satisfy requirements for her gun purchases. @Eli9 Good grief. Not...

www.websleuths.com

Examples from two states, w quotes of state statutes & wiki's summary.
"Background checks required for private sales?"
CALIFORNIA § 27545 For long guns & handguns, both. Since 2012.
wiki: "Private party transfers of firearms must be conducted through a licensed dealer, who is required by federal law to conduct a background check and keep a record of the sale.
CA statute: "Where neither party to the transaction holds a dealer’s license issued pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, the parties to the transaction shall complete the sale, loan, or transfer of that firearm through a licensed firearms dealer pursuant to Chapter 5...."
"Law section Mexico, NMSA 30-7-7.1. For long guns & handguns, both.

NEW MEXICO. For long guns & handguns, both. Since 20.
"Effective July 1, 2019. Senate Bill 8, which establishes a requirement for NICS background checks for private-party transfers was signed into law on March 8, 2019. Exceptions will exist for active/retired LEO transfers and transfers between immediate family members.[114][115]"

Gun laws in the United States by state - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org