Germany/Portugal - Christian Brueckner, 27 @ time of 1st crime (2004), charged with sexual assault crimes, Praia de Rocha, Portugal. #5

[UK Girl]

Yes that story about the mother and daughter raped and murdered was part of the information found on the murder email account linked to MM death... I guess only time will tell what else was on there.

Wasnt that pretty much discounted? and a British news group sent a cease and desist letter? about the "murder email account linked to her death"?

 

[Denis R Tandib]

Wasnt that pretty much discounted? and a British news group sent a cease and desist letter? about the "murder email account linked to her death"?

Yes, it was. There was no mention at all from the BKA or prosecutors that the emails contained information about MM - it was made up by MSM.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

There has to be some measure of restraint from highly trained professionals interviewing lay people. Which Chief public prosecutor U L highlights as being missing from the Braunschweig court.
She sums up who she is and her aims in this trial in comparison with defence aspirations when she said

• 'The defence lawyer said in an interview it is all about winning for him.​
• My job is to make sure to find out what happens and then to hold those involved to account.'​

That says it all.

Neither does she hold back regarding the abominable treatment of one witness probably safe in the knowledge that irrespective of what she had to say she was convinced the chamber had already made up its mind and does not share her passion to find the facts and thus deliver justice. I sincerely hope she has got that one wrong, but we shall see.
The chief prosecutor did not disdain to express how shocked she had been by the judge's interrogation of a police witness by putting on record that, 'you sometimes had the impression that the police officer was sitting on the bench for the accused'.

Christian Brueckner labelled a 'sadistic psychopath' in court

Convicted paedophile and rapist Christian Brueckner , 47, is the man who German investigators believe abducted Madeleine McCann in 2007

www.dailymail.co.uk

The conduct of this trial has been a fiasco and it remains to be seen what will come of it.
My opinion

It’s FF’s job to win the case for his client. Winning also enhances his reputation as a capable criminal defence lawyer. This is his profession and winning makes him good at it.

The prosecution must prove the accused is guilty. The defence must defend the accusation. Based on these arguments, a judgement is made on what actually happened.

UL can think she is getting to the bottom of what actually happened but other people and especially the defence can disagree.

Do you really think that FF should do a half-arsed job of defending his client so that the prosecutor’s view can easily be proven?

 

[Denis R Tandib]

There has to be some measure of restraint from highly trained professionals interviewing lay people. Which Chief public prosecutor U L highlights as being missing from the Braunschweig court.
She sums up who she is and her aims in this trial in comparison with defence aspirations when she said

• 'The defence lawyer said in an interview it is all about winning for him.​
• My job is to make sure to find out what happens and then to hold those involved to account.'​

That says it all.

Neither does she hold back regarding the abominable treatment of one witness probably safe in the knowledge that irrespective of what she had to say she was convinced the chamber had already made up its mind and does not share her passion to find the facts and thus deliver justice. I sincerely hope she has got that one wrong, but we shall see.
The chief prosecutor did not disdain to express how shocked she had been by the judge's interrogation of a police witness by putting on record that, 'you sometimes had the impression that the police officer was sitting on the bench for the accused'.

Christian Brueckner labelled a 'sadistic psychopath' in court

Convicted paedophile and rapist Christian Brueckner , 47, is the man who German investigators believe abducted Madeleine McCann in 2007

www.dailymail.co.uk

The conduct of this trial has been a fiasco and it remains to be seen what will come of it.
My opinion

Last para - looks like your view of the PJ. Is it that both are bad or that they perhaps have different opinions to you?

 

[Mex]

Yes that story about the mother and daughter raped and murdered was part of the information found on the murder email account linked to MM death... I guess only time will tell what else was on there.

That evidence was far, far too gruesome too be shared in open court but the prosecutor made reference to it when summing up events at the trial.
That was exactly the right course of action because people need to know what CB is capable of not only fantasising about but what he actually does in real life.

One had heard about these sexual fantasies but this was the first time I had read them in any sort of detail.
To say I was shocked and sickened is an understatement and far too graphic to bring the content to this forum.

Having read what the prosecutor imparted I formed the very firm opinion

• that CB's 'fantasy' was turned into reality in the bestial rape inflicted on HB to the exact description of his dress code as she described it and the degradations inflicted were exactly as he wrote them
• when one bears in mind this creature was describing what he wanted to inflict on a child is more than chilling!
• based on this evidence alone there is absolutely no way ever that CB should ever be released from custody. One doesn't need to be an expert to know the truth of that!

The evidence was allowed late in the case. One wonders if the judges may rethink earlier opinions as a result.

 

[Davieson]

Wasnt that pretty much discounted? and a British news group sent a cease and desist letter? about the "murder email account linked to her death"?

There's so much dis-inform floating about that I'm disinclined to believe anything that isn't confirmed by a reliable none-UK tabloid source. I leave such to the gullible.

 

[RichardKimble]

Hopefully it'll be clearer next Tuesday or a fortnight later at the latest.

landgericht-braunschweig.de

Proceedings before the 2nd Criminal Division in connection with five offenses against sexual self-determination - Ref. 2 KLs 213 Js 52790/18 (15/22) - expected verdict on October 8 or 21, 2024

In the proceedings of the 2nd Criminal Division in Ref. 2 KLs 213 Js 52790/18, both the public prosecutor and the co-plaintiff pleaded on October 2, 2024. The defense's plea is now to follow on October 7, 2024.

The 2nd Criminal Division has announced that the verdict will be pronounced on Tuesday, October 8, 2024, or Monday, October 21, 2024.

 

[Davieson]

Given that the defence only speaks on 7th October, Verdict on 21 sounds more likely, as the 8th only gives the prosecution more to complain about. Undue haste and all that.

 

[Mex]

Wasnt that pretty much discounted? and a British news group sent a cease and desist letter? about the "murder email account linked to her death"?

Apparently that is just one of the factoids in circulation. As you will see the supposedly discounted evidence features in this court case..
Here is the link containing material to which it is too graphic to make reference.
Snip
The most chilling moment during the hearing was when the prosecutor revealed explicit and gruesome quotes from twisted rape fantasies CB is alleged to have written, some of which had been found in his email inbox.

The details are so graphic that in the last hearing, the forensic psychiatrist Dr CR said they could not even be read out in court, but today the prosecutor referred to two of them in detail.

Christian Brueckner labelled a 'sadistic psychopath' in court

Convicted paedophile and rapist Christian Brueckner , 47, is the man who German investigators believe abducted Madeleine McCann in 2007

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[RichardKimble]

Given that the defence only speaks on 7th October, Verdict on 21 sounds more likely, as the 8th only gives the prosecution more to complain about. Undue haste and all that.

The prosecution have had their say, only took a day so the defence shouldn't be any longer should it, but a verdict on the Tuesday looks to be tight unless they have already made their minds up irrespective of the lifting of the arrest warrant.No point speculating really the German system is totally alien to most of us I'd venture.

 

[RichardKimble]

There's so much dis-inform floating about that I'm disinclined to believe anything that isn't confirmed by a reliable none-UK tabloid source. I leave such to the gullible.

There's going to be even more after a verdict I suspect.

 

[Davieson]

There's going to be even more after a verdict I suspect.

Oh yes, if he's acquitted then the pitchforkers will be out in force and if convicted , there'll be complaints over the length of the sentence - short of it being locked up for ever.

 

[UK Girl]

There's so much dis-inform floating about that I'm disinclined to believe anything that isn't confirmed by a reliable none-UK tabloid source. I leave such to the gullible.

This for me is a major issue. Many seem to only read the British papers and ignore the German newspapers who put forward a very different view of the proceedings and ofc the prosecutors/witnesses come to that

 

[johnlair]

Wasnt that pretty much discounted? and a British news group sent a cease and desist letter? about the "murder email account linked to her death"?

I believe you, is there a sauce for this.....eye must have missed it?

 

[UK Girl]

I believe you, is there a sauce for this.....eye must have missed it?

I doubt it would have been in the Uk paper that it was discounted as they only want headine grabbing news. The day after that appeared it was all made clearer via statements in court

 

[Mex]

I doubt it would have been in the Uk paper that it was discounted as they only want headine grabbing news. The day after that appeared it was all made clearer via statements in court

Apparently that is just one of the factoids in circulation. As you will see the supposedly discounted evidence features in this court case..
Here is the link containing material to which it is too graphic to make reference.
Snip
The most chilling moment during the hearing was when the prosecutor revealed explicit and gruesome quotes from twisted rape fantasies CB is alleged to have written, some of which had been found in his email inbox.

The details are so graphic that in the last hearing, the forensic psychiatrist Dr CR said they could not even be read out in court, but today the prosecutor referred to two of them in detail.

Christian Brueckner labelled a 'sadistic psychopath' in court

Convicted paedophile and rapist Christian Brueckner , 47, is the man who German investigators believe abducted Madeleine McCann in 2007

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Mex]

Oh yes, if he's acquitted then the pitchforkers will be out in force and if convicted , there'll be complaints over the length of the sentence - short of it being locked up for ever.

Currently there is a continuing debate going on in Germany about the leniency of sentences for sexual offences.

Sexual offences and justice​

A guest article by Tatjana Hörnle
There is a debate among lawyers as to whether the penalties for sexual offences should not be higher in general. But the restraint of German courts in sentencing is an achievement.

Since the reform of sexual offences in 2016, the German Criminal Code covers all variants of punishable injustice, from a brief sexualised touch to the most brutal attacks. The range of penalties is wide: it ranges from a fine (for sexual harassment) to 15 years imprisonment for serious sexual offenses.

Werden Sexualstraftaten zu milde bestraft? – Gastbeitrag

Unter Juristen wird debattiert, ob die Strafen für Sexualdelikte nicht generell höher sein müssten. Aber die Zurückhaltung deutscher Gerichte bei der Strafzumessung ist eine Errungenschaft.

www.spiegel.de

The balance is sobering​

Massive loophole in the criminal code​

Only minimal increase in judgments​

Poorly trained investigators, lawyers and judges​

Acquittal because woman did not defend herself enough​

Victims are expected to behave in a certain way​

Improvements demanded​

Fünf Jahre Reform des Sexualstrafrechts - Die Bilanz fällt ernüchternd aus

2016 wurde das Sexualstrafrecht reformiert. „Nein heißt Nein“ war der Leitgedanke. Opfer sollten besser geschützt und Täter konsequenter bestraft werden. Nach fünf Jahren hat sich für Betroffene aber nur wenig verbessert.

www.deutschlandfunkkultur.de

 

[C.greek]

This for me is a major issue. Many seem to only read the British papers and ignore the German newspapers who put forward a very different view of the proceedings and ofc the prosecutors/witnesses come to that

Interestingly the prosecution mentioned the misrepresentation of the trial in the German media...

 

[Davieson]

Interestingly the prosecution mentioned the misrepresentation of the trial in the German media...

Always in the eye of the beholder.
Given that there is no jury, does it matter ?

 

[UK Girl]

Interestingly the prosecution mentioned the misrepresentation of the trial in the German media...

thats understandable. The British ones simply fawned over it all. The German press was more critical of the prosecution calling their work "sloppy".