Has the defense created reasonable doubt?

[GeekyGirl]

Maybe to one juror...eh hem...but the others should be able to hold that one juror to the facts only, lest they be swapped for an alternate.
AZLawyer posted something so brilliantly worded that I have referred to now twice-but I cannot find it to post it verbatim...about how it is reasonable for a jury to believe that one coincidence can happen to a person, but that several coincidences, or aggravating factors, must lead a jury to believe reasonably that the defendant is guilty.
To me, the defense would have to prove a massive conspiracy theory in order to negate the evidence and tesimony that the state presented. They have not done that, IMO. And the state is not done by a stretch, they left so many goodies out that can still come in and not be overkill.

Respectfully, IIRC AZLawyer has also posted numerous times that she thinks the jury will come back with aggravated manslaughter of a child which I think the state has made an extremely solid case for. I would also keep in mind that a lot of the people on here were convinced of Casey's guilt before the trial even started, so what may seem obvious or clear to you may not appear that way to the jury. MOO

 

[Kenziema]

IMO yes. The only things I'm 100% sure of right now are
1. Casey is a liar
2. Caylee's body was in her trunk
3. There was duct tape around Caylee's mouth.

Why was there duct tape on the baby's mouth?

Who put her in Casey's trunk?

Why did someone kill her?

IMO

 

[Just Jayla]

Respectfully, IIRC AZLawyer has also posted numerous times that she thinks the jury will come back with aggravated manslaughter of a child which I think the state has made an extremely solid case for. I would also keep in mind that a lot of the people on here were convinced of Casey's guilt before the trial even started, so what may seem obvious or clear to you may not appear that way to the jury. MOO

She has, which is why I didn't mention the DP in my post. But I did mention specifically the case the state is presenting, not everything that we know.

 

[katydid23]

Today reminds me of the 'Shock and Awe' of the Dt's Opening Statements. People were saying ' wow, what a game changer.' But then upon further review, it imploded. And now most people feel that his DT opening Fairy Tale was perhaps Baez's biggest mistake yet.

That is how Cindy's big "Shock and Awe' will turn out as well, imo. There are some huge problems with her testimony. And I am supremely confident that LDB will have this conversation with Cindy again, but will be loaded for bear this time. imoo

 

[Etiana]

Well, nothing that the defense has produced has changed my mind that ICA is guilty. After what CA pulled today it's clear that the Anthony's are willing to do whatever it takes even if it means lying to get what they want.

I'm new to the case so I often think about the jurors and how they're processing all this information. I'd like to think they're reasonable people and can see right through the likes of JB and his slimey tactics and Casey's lies. Sadly, I think it's possible that with today's testimonies the defense may have created reasonable doubt

I hope not.

 

[Etiana]

Today reminds me of the 'Shock and Awe' of the Dt's Opening Statements. People were saying ' wow, what a game changer.' But then upon further review, it imploded. And now most people feel that his DT opening Fairy Tale was perhaps Baez's biggest mistake yet.

That is how Cindy's big "Shock and Awe' will turn out as well, imo. There are some huge problems with her testimony. And I am supremely confident that LDB will have this conversation with Cindy again, but will be loaded for bear this time. imoo

I pray that you're right katydid!

 

[RSDhoping for a cure]

No!


As related to the chloroform, even IF CA searched for the word on the 17th to check about her dogs, that doesn't explain how the HIGH levels of it were found in ICA's trunk.

For me, it might be a way for the SA to link ICA to the chloroform by saying ICA saw it in her history decided to check it out and then used it on Caylee.

We also still don't know what is on those Home Depot tapes. They are in evidence for a reason, I'm just not sure why yet but am hopeful it relates to ICA buying ingredients for Chloroform.

 

[JustMeDeb]

I don't think so. Mainly, they haven't proven a thing they have said in their opening statement. Of course, they plan to do that in the next couple of days.

I am convinced the jurors saw right through CA today. Between the comment about the pop up on her computer and not knowing what her computer searches for when she is not there, they knew she wasn't telling the truth.

I also think the tapes with ICA, the 31 days knowing Caylee was already dead, wiped reasonable doubt away.

There is just too much evidence.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

Goodness yes. I think it's clear now that Ricardo posted that chloroform thing, and then days later, Cindy decided that the reason her dog was sleepy might be because of plants in the backyard. So she googled chlorophyll, a substance found in almost all plants, on the off chance that the entire natural world had suddenly become toxic to small dogs. (I think it's likely that Roy Kronk wiped any reference to a chlorophyll search off her computer to make ICA look more guilty.) Anyhow, when chlorophyll came up, she noticed a reference to chloroform, and decided she didn't really care what was making her dog sleepy, and settled in for some riveting reading about chloroform.

I guess the only part I'm not clear on is when Cindy and ICA were playing musical chairs every 20 seconds doing their separate internet searches, who was watching Caylee?

 

[OneLostGrl]

I can't say the defense has given me reasonable doubt but the prosecution hasn't succeeded in getting rid of the doubts I came into the trial with.

 

[shgrbkr]

I think it's only natural for any human being to be focusing on what's being presented on that particular day, or several days. We are getting farther away from the SA case but we cannot forget the 911 calls by a desperate Cindy, the jailhouse videos, the audio of her phone calls from jail, the 31 days, the convincing testimony of Dr.G, and most certainly the duct tape. I'm sure the jury is quite involved with what's being presented this week, but I'm trying to have faith that the prosecution still has closing argument, AND they get to go last, which means the SA summation will be the last thing the jury hears before the judge instructs them. JB has NOT made a convincing case thus far, has presented no evidence supporting his ridiculous opening statement. Bits and pieces of doubt here and there....maybe, but not enough to create reasonable doubt. Any reasonable person could see right through this mess.

 

[Nali87]

NOT. If it were someone else who testified about doing the searches, it might have created reasonable doubt. But this is a mother. I hope the jury realizes she was probably lying to save her daughter's neck. In the grand scheme of things, there's still no one else who had the motive/opportunity to kill Caylee, than Casey. And no one else lived the beautiful life during those 31 days than Casey. At the end of the day, someone did Chloroform searches. A child was found murdered or by chloroform alone or chloroform/ducttape. Even if they doubt Casey/Cindy did the searches (CINDY A FREAKING NURSE, LOOKING AT HOW TO MAKE CHLOROFORM? REALLY? REALLY?), only one of the two was hysterically looking for Caylee during those 31 days.


Unless George gets on stand and starts confessing to sh-t, in my opinion, this hasn't created reasonable doubt.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

All of us have read and reread the documents and depo's we know this case like the back of our hands but what if you were a juror and only knew whats been presented. Yes, the defense has done a pretty crappy job in my opinion, and some things have been laughable like " a dog could have buried the bones" but if I was on the jury and only knew what has been presented, Cindy stating that she made the computer searches for chloroform would definately have me thinking. From a jurors point of view I would be like if Cindy made the searches but Casey supposedly killed Caylee with Chloroform, how could that be if Cindy was the one searching what would be the chance...ya know????? I think the defence won some points today in creating doubt, not sure it is reasonable doubt but, doubt regardless... do you think the defense has created reasonable doubt... now rememeber only one person has to doubt. What say you?

I do know. But is possible that the jury could think that ICA was making a habit of looking at CA's web history as a way to see what CA was thinking if ICA felt CA was starting to be suspicious of ICA.

I think that very specific and reliable evidence refutes that, but ya know I'm wondering how juries are affected by LE technical evidence.

Is there anyway to know how the jury is going decide? It freaks me out, not just how it relates to Caylee's death but what that means about how juries in general digest information and come to conclusions very obviously go against what they here from very reliable objective scientific type evidence.

Why are so many people saying that ICA will be found innocent. People have told me that since the trial started, and I've looked at polls on the internet. I am constantly questioning possible holes in my logic as a result and I don't understand it.

Do people have so little faith in justice, LE etc?

 

[barbtries]

there's more doubt as to CA's veracity. maybe a little more apple not far from the tree as far as casey's psychology. but not reasonable doubt as to who killed caylee. 31 days. the 911 calls, the jail visits, the pictures and the testimony of dozens of people have made the case and they didn't go away.

 

[Money Girl]

The defense has not created reasonable doubt, IMO.

 

[sparkysmom]

I have been trying to put myself in the juror's shoes for the last few days, mainly because some the stuff that has been going on has angered me so much. Besides the fact that I can't get past the 31 days of partying, the jailhouse demeanor, and documented "death smell" in the car, I tend to wonder if the jury will look at Cindy's testimony as a desperate, last-ditch effort to save her daughter's life. Her demeanor has changed from when she took the stand for the prosecution. She was a basket case then, and today she acted very belligerent IMO.

I can envision a scene between her and the DT, where they paint a very grim picture for Casey unless she throws herself on the sword for her daughter. That may be what the gleeful look was between her and Baez the other day.

 

[Cailin Rua]

At this point, possibly for first degree murder but the trial is only about half over and I think the state is very competent and will produce some sort of info to rebut the testimony.

Even if they acquit on first degree, as a human being it defies logic to me to say that you lied about a child's whereabouts and drove around with their decomposing remains in your trunk but that you somehow have no involvement with how that child got dead in the first place. The story the defense tells to explain how that all came to be is frankly unbelievable. To me that equals aggravated manslaughter at the least.

 

[little_miss_smart]

No, I don't think so. I'm not even too worried about what Cindy said yesterday because when the SA recall her to the stand for their rebuttal, they are going to rip her testimony to shreds.

I have a question. Can the DT rebut the SAs rebuttal?

The judge told the jury this would over this weekend, I can't see this being over until the end of next week at the earliest.

 

[pipkins]

When I watched Cindy on the stand I felt as if my heart was being ripped out of my chest. I actually felt genuine upset that she was lying BUT after a restless nights sleep and pondering on whats been said I now believe that Cindy might have done the Prosecution a favour

Why? Everytime I've seen CA on the stand she's looked like a grieving grandma but yesterday she looked like a defensive mother and not all soft and fuzzy as I've seen her before, and I am so sure that the jury will see this too. She admitted that she had NOT searched for how.to.make.chloroform. and folks the timelines just dont add up and the formidable LDB will make this crystal clear and no doubt prove that CA's testimony regarding work is false. We all remember her going into great detail about her Monday schedule at work and voila the date in question .... is a Monday!

Cindy was very rehearsed in her testimony and at one point asked to have what she said read back to her (alarm bells!) Cindy, I believe was attempting to spare her daughter the DP by causing doubt...The only thing I ended up doubting was her credibility and I have ALWAYS been on her side.

Dont get me wrong I totally do not agree with what she did yesterday, I am upset, angry, disappointed, but folks we can all sleep well at night and I doubt that Cindy will ever get that luxury again. I've got a very bad feeling that CA has totally given up on life and doesnt care about anything anymore, she doesnt care what people think because she is numb, totally numb. Iv'e seen deep depression and loss before and I see it in CA - We all know in our hearts that ICA guilty and I'm sure that the jury do too -

ICA has no soul and if the reports are true that Cindy still believes her daughter is innocent then I feel even more sorry for her as the impact on her remaining sanity when she eventually has her 'lightbulb moment' ...and it may be years down the line...will be fatal for her.

I have no doubt that Cindy loved Caylee with all her being but yesterday she thought only of saving Casey.

On an end note and I'm sorry if this is a confusing post as my emotions at this time are confusing even myself - The state are now the guardians and the voice of Caylee. I have never seen LDB/JA so emotional and I hope I am not alone in the feeling that they feel genuine anger and hurt about Caylees death. They have now 'known' Caylee as long as ICA did and believe me they will fight tooth and nail for Caylee. When the prosecution stand up they stand up for Caylee, they are strong, they are firm, they are just and right....on the other hand when the defence stand up they make yet more excuses for ICA, more weak ramblings, more fluffed up excuses.

The jury are not stupid, they will have families, They have heard facts from the prosecution and boy oh boy the 31 days, the jail tapes, the decomposition, DR G, the tattoo, the duct tape and sadly the tiny skeleton of Caylee herself will speak louder than any amount of puffed up pomposity that comes out of the mouths of JB and his whiney gang

Rest in Peace Caylee Marie

 

[Donjeta]

It was clear to me that Cindy was lying but the 84 times is a problem in that if the state misunderstood or had errors in the computer records about myspace they could have other errors there. I'd probably think someone googled "how to make chloroform" if one or both of the programs found it but if it turns out that 84 visits to the chloroform site end up being 84 myspace visits it lessens the impact. Even so, only once could be enough... but only if the jurors trust the computer records that much.