ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 62

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I just watched today's hearing again and noticed there was absolutely no interaction between BK and his attorney. Neither one even looked at the other the entire hearing. Not even at the beginning or the end of it. IMO Taylor appeared strained and looked ill at ease. Just an observation fwiw
I noticed too they didn’t interact but interpreted it differenty. No doubt Tayor is aware of the many comments made regarding the short smile he gave her as he sat down at his first ID court appearance. LOTS of comments and speculation from the public and pundits that he was leering at her, manipulating her, in love with her and would kill her if he ever got out of jail. Not the kind of things you want perspective jurors to be exposed to.

This was a short hearing and no doubt she was able to prep him in advance as to what would happen, what woud be said and the questions he’d be asked by the judge. No need to interact at all during the procedings. And I expect she instructed him not to look at her or interact with her unless necessary.

It’s very early, but so far I’m impressed with Taylor. Not so much so yet w/the prosecutor. I hope that changes soon!
 
[…]

Moscow Police Chief James Fry attended Thursday’s hearing and sat quietly during the proceeding. About 50 members of the media were also present. The attorney for the Goncalves family, Shanon Gray, attended on behalf of the family. No members of the other victims’ families appeared to be present at the hearing.

Gray did not immediately return an Idaho Statesman email requesting comment.

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article271078862.html
 
I find it interesting when I hear the statements about how this was meticulously planned. I don’t think it was at all.
There is no way a careful plan for a hands on murder lands a calculated killer in a house full of people.
The more I think of the evidence that is present the more it looks to me like one or more of these situations-

1) BK didn’t care if he got caught, as he was eager to seek the fame and live the life of a killer, so while he deliberately did not place evidence, he was not as diligent as we would expect him to be

2) BK obsessed over some details of the crime planning, and failed to consider some details that were vitally important to preventing forensic evidence

3) BK placed evidence on purpose thinking LE would need a hand, and they located him quicker than he expected

4) BK is not at all as bright as people think, he has some book knowledge that seems a smoke screen for his lack of common sense, scatterbrained ness, and mental health issues that prevent high order detailed/ focused planning for that day as well as broad planning in time.
I'd pick 2), 4) and 1) in that order of importance and totally skip placing evidence (IMO the steath was his, was left on accident and belonged to the murder weapon; I do not discount that he might have done something evidence-altering with his electronics, though, but we know nothing about any of that).
I have a MA in criminology. It is more sociology based than science. I wouldn't have the foggiest about how routers work. I also wouldn't have the foggiest about the science of forensics beyond the basics. The MA in criminology is more about the behaviours and social aspect of criminals and CJS.
MOO: while BK might have some extra knowlegde about phones and computers, I think his education is very far from a forensic experts and I also believe he was not acting rationally as he entered a house with 6 people and a dog to stab 4 people. Just saying. Even the smartest people in the world do stupid mistakes due to emotions/conditions/being caught off guard etc.
IMO, remember that a fight or disagreement may have occurred at the frat house before the murders.
This actually gave me interesting thoughts. While we know that BK departed towards Moscow from his home at ~2.40, we have no idea where he was and what he was doing before that. By 2.40, all victims were home, too. Could they have met during that day or night, followed by BK going home and starting preping for the attack, full of emotion? It has been stated how many times he was near the home, but nothing about how many times he could have been near any of the victims (though it is hinted that they don't know the connection - but this does not really rule it out). Or maybe entering the house was attempt2, as an attempt to get the target on her own failed that night?
Throughout the investigation, before the arrest, LE was asking for tips and telling people they were interested in information to gain context into the events. They repeatedly posted : "Our focus is the investigation, not the activities."
Looking back now, what do you make of this?
They could have been looking for a motive. They could have been just distracting BK. There could be an unrelated incident that night, that had to be ruled out. The activities is most likely hinting at some illegal activities they don't care about, be it alcohol use, drug use, academic theft or a physical argument.
The neighbor told Fox News this week that the front door — which opens to the level where two other roommates were unharmed — was wide open around 8:30 a.m. on Nov. 13.
I am still interested if that info was true or not and if it is connected to BKs return or not. But I kinda feel like had the door been open for a longer period at that late, more people would have seen that and AFAIK, none have came forward.
Im sure this means nothing but just an observation, BCK was an HVAC trainee in High School and we all were curious why only a couple of days after the murders there was a the was an HVAC repair truck at victime house.
I am still interested in what was up with that, too.
Not sure why. They are also holding the car for one of the triplets. Defense froze evidence so that may be why, but it’s odd if some of the other cars had already been taken.
I have a theory. Has any other car than KGs been returned? Hers was a new car. If they suspect/found that any of the victims cars might have tracking devices or have had BK in it during the stalking, then it would make sense to keep these for evidence, while KGs new car might have been ruled out from evidence quickly. Just MOO.
'Premature public disclosure of the details of this law enforcement investigation will create serious and imminent threat to effective law enforcement and could result in the premature end of this investigation which could create a threat to public safety."
translates to me as "If we have to end this investigation before we get all our ducks in a row, then this guy could go free and that is a threat to public safety".
Honestly, I have no idea what that means. It might be just to get the public to calm down. It might be they found something like trophies (items, body parts, anything) or the murder weapon and they don't want it out there atm. It might also be that they found evidence that hints at other evidence not yet collected/analysed, so it is important to keep that safe from prying individuals. Still just MOO.

All in all, I am still leaning towards there being a specific motive. IMO, as soon as people heard "a phd student in criminology" they jumped into "serial killer", "well planned", "psychopath", "just wanted to kill". If we could just for a moment ignore what he did in academia and think afresh. Like what would you think with the same evidence had it been told that the prep was a 28 year old male who had perviously worked at a pizza place, possibly had a history of drug abuse and other mental illness and recently moved cross-country from his family; he drives to crime scene with his own car, enters the home of 5 young females while a visitor is obviously over, looses the cover of his murder weapon next to a victim, leaves DNA, video and phone evidence and even an eye witness. Would your first thought still be "serial killer mastermind human hunter very well planned and killed because he wanted to kill and to commit a perfect crime"? Because mine sure is not. I would think he wanted one of the females, either to date or to rape, and lashed out. Or that there was some specific motive I don't know. Or that he had a mental episode.

What I am trying to say is, he is a first year phd student. This basically just means that he was willing to work for 30-50% of the salary he could have had outside of the academia while getting 200% of the stress. It does not make him a genius, he's not even graduated with that phd (MANY drop out), and even having it would not make him a mastermind. Sincerely, a I-will-hopefully-graduate-in-a-year phd student.
 
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To me the scratches looked to be from one of those cheap razors they give you in jail but that's just a guess. I did notice his cheek twitch one time. It happened several times in previous hearings. I've seen this happen with a few other men in the past and they were either nervous or angry. IMO I think BK is nervous and scared.
Agreed. I don't know what I expected to see from him today, but what I did see surprised me. He looks scared, as you said, and I wonder if this just isn't how even he himself thought it would be. IDK...today's hearing was unsettling to me.
 
The surviving roommate didn't mention hearing a dog barking, which I think would have been much louder in the home where the dog lived than outside at the neighbor's ring camera, so I have to wonder if a different dog in the neighborhood was barking.

All MOO.

I suspect that the PCA is not including everything DM reported hearing. If she heard the dog barking before the 4:17 bark on camera but after she thought she heard sounds of him being played with, she might have just assumed that the dog was barking was still part of him playing.

Another thought that I had was that when you have a pet in the house, especially if it is one who tends to bark/meow a lot, you just kind of get used to it. I have very very talkative cats, and a lot of times my brain doesn't actively register it because it becomes background noise. My cats may wake me up meowing at 3 a.m. but because I have an illusion of safety in my own house, my brain figures they are just fighting each other or have the middle of the night crazies I just sigh and go back to sleep without really thinking about it.
 
And there's Ms. Taylor's name, right on the most recent version of the roster. So no need for him to change counsel.

It's against Idaho law, AFAIK, to use anyone other than an attorney on that roster - and for a DP case (if the DA asks for it in June), they will need *two." Right now, wisely, the State has assigned one of these essential attorneys, just in case.

No legal missteps here.
IIRC from the Daybell case, in ID if the client is funding their own legal defense they can use whatever criminal defense attorney they want. But if a public defender has been assigned they must be on the Stare’s qualified death-penalty attorney list.

That said, a good private attorney without death penalty experience should solicit the help of someone who is DP qualified, as I believe John Prior (Chad Daybell’s attorney) is doing.
 
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Just read Ethan's Mam's statement.
They're one classy family, gracious, respectful and so many other things in what must be the worst period of their lives.
Just wanted to say that and more but can't find the right words.

moo
 
<snipped for focus>

I agree that he may have wanted to study under Ramsland or because of the quality and reputation/ranking of its online Master's program in Criminology. Or just because it was close by.

Even though DeSales is a private university with a Christian identity, most similar privates are ecumenical in nature, admitting students of all faith backgrounds or no faith backgrounds, same with faculty and staff. Think University of Notre Dame, definitely a strong reputation and also a Catholic university.

Was there an online program in criminology? I don't think so.

It's Criminal Justice, which is distinctly different. The program at WSU is criminology (where sociology and psychology meet lawbreaking). Criminal Justice is the study of how our system deals with criminality and while there's some sociology and psychology, it deals more with rules of court, how justice is achieved in the courts, what law enforcement's role is, and so on. Most people in the CJ programs want to get a job in LE. Criminologists want to teach or be profilers.

DeSales has no sociology or anthropology departments. Just psych. Dr Ramsland is their criminal psychology professor, who teaches within the Criminal Justice program. She has a master's in psychology and another in criminal psychology. Her Ph.D. is in philosophy.

Interestingly, she collected two more master's degree from her own institution (usually, profs can do that tuition-free) so she studied creative writing and got an MFA and also got a master's in Criminal Justice.

She's their chief expert in this area that can lead to further studies in criminology. Criminology involves a lot behavioral analysis.

She herself does not hold a doctorate in criminology, but is certainly educated (John Jay's forensic psychology master's program is well-respected).
 
Just to point out, staff uses first names only when calling for you. At least that is my experience. Imo.

What I'm wondering is, can a Drs. Office acknowledge that someone is a patient of theirs at all? If they can, I'm personally disturbed by that. Imo.
I work in the healthcare industry and have to take HIPAA training every year.

Calling out first names in a doctors office is allowed.

However, providers, or anyone working in a providers office, have direct access to patients' personal health information (PHI) and that information is protected by law. A person's name, for example, is considered to be PHI. Therefore, anyone working at a provider's office who divulges to anyone outside that office a patient's name ("Yes, Mr. Kohberger was a patient here.") can face fines and even jail time. It is a very serious issue. I don't think a lot of people realize this.
 
I totally see this dude writing his "memoirs" in jail while he awaits trial. Maybe he'll even try contacting his former professor and see if she's interesting in his story (sarcasm intended). This guy makes me sick!

I totally see that as well. I will eat my hat if Ramsland doesn't try another book based on this case (although, it's possible he'll choose someone else). He wants to write his own memoirs (just like Dennis Rader) and since he can't publish them and receive money for the publication, he will make a deal like Rader did and Ramsland will get paid (and perhaps donate his share to some non-profit or to his family, who knows).

It bothers me too. I do want to know more about the inside of his head, although reading Jesperson's similarly penned book was enough for me, possibly for the rest of my life. I'd like a good psychometric and clinical psychiatric look at BK, something more academic and not 400 pages of the words of BK, which is what we are likely to get (with Ramsland allowing the character under study to invent his own academic terms...like "cubing...")
 
But they said it appeared there wasn’t a break in. I believe that was early police statement. The affidavit doesn’t mention it.
<snipped for focus>
The charges against BK are 4 counts of murder in the 1st degree and 1 count of felony burglary.

Burglary isn't defined as just the common idea of "breaking in", e.g., smashing in a window or breaking a lock on a door to get in and commit a crime. It is defined in the state of Idaho as (BBM):

"TITLE 18
CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS
CHAPTER 14
BURGLARY
18-1401. BURGLARY DEFINED. Every person who enters any house, room, apartment, tenement, store, shop, warehouse, mill, barn, stable, outhouse, or a building, tent, vessel, vehicle, trailer, airplane, or railroad car with intent to commit any theft or any felony is guilty of burglary."
https://legislature.idaho.gov/statutesrules/idstat/Title18/T18CH14/SECT18-1401/

So if BK entered "any house" (by whatever means, it doesn't matter if he "broke in" or "walked in" undeterred through a door or window, open or unopen) "with intent to commit any theft or any felony" (to rob or assault or murder), he committed burglary. IMO

Why Bryan Kohberger Was Charged With Burglary as Well as Murder​

BY KHALEDA RAHMAN ON 1/9/23 AT 7:38 AM EST

"Bryan Kohberger is facing four counts of first-degree murder in the slaying of four University of Idaho students—but he is also facing a count of felony burglary."

Why Bryan Kohberger was charged with burglary as well as murder
 
Just got around to watching the brief hearing.

Tend to agree with what some have said, his demeanor has changed, seems more worried to me. No doubt BK read the PCA and shat himself. Bet he thought they didn't have much on him. Oop. Have fun exonerating yourself.
 
Agreed. I don't know what I expected to see from him today, but what I did see surprised me. He looks scared, as you said, and I wonder if this just isn't how even he himself thought it would be. IDK...today's hearing was unsettling to me.
In what way did you think he looked scared? I’m not trying to be rude or anything I’m just interested what makes you think that.
He gave nothing away in my opinion, apart from saying “yes, yes, no” clear and confidently, the rest of the time he was just looking straight ahead.
 
Just got around to watching the brief hearing.

Tend to agree with what some have said, his demeanor has changed, seems more worried to me. No doubt BK read the PCA and shat himself. Bet he thought they didn't have much on him. Oop. Have fun exonerating yourself.
He read the PCA before the last hearing though, he hasn’t just read it today.
 
No doubt Tayor is aware of the many comments made regarding the short smile he gave her as he sat down at his first ID court appearance. LOTS of comments and speculation from the public and pundits that he was leering at her, manipulating her, in love with her and would kill her if he ever got out of jail.

I have some doubt about that because I never read any of those comments, and never had those thoughts myself neither, and I do read a fair amount of coverage. I doubt she is chronically online enough to have noticed.
 
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