ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 63

[BelleIsle]

Does anyone else feel like the media is really reaching when it comes to painting a picture of BK's "behavior" towards women? As a 12 year old he says to a girl, " Oh, you're so pretty" and other "weird" comments. Seriously??? Since when is complimenting someone weird or creepy?!

I feel like the media, and SM in particular, is desperate to portray BK as some sort of woman hating dude. I'm just not buying it! Why can't he just be a deranged lunatic who wanted to kill?

We will never get to the bottom of why he resulted to this crime, so why even bother trying to figure it out?

I think that trying to understand the nature/nurture aspect of these crimes is important, but I agree with the rest of what you've stated here.

 

[SRWCF]

I think that trying to understand the nature/nurture aspect of these crimes is important, but I agree with the rest of what you've stated here.

Yes, but the media has settled on the incel theory and they keep trying to build their weak stories around that.

 

[Shamrock1]

This is not correct. Try calling any doctor's office and ask if so-and-so is a patient there. Let us know what they say. A patient's name is protected health information under HIPAA and that information cannot be divulged without prior authorization from the patient.

And I think I'm now officially exhausted from explaining this here on WS. Signed, a legal assistant in the healthcare industry!

You are correct. HIPAA prohibits the unauthorized disclosure of PHI by a CE. Name is PHI and a medical office is a CE. (Not directed at you: (1) merely asking the question is not a violation and (2) there’s no private cause of action for a violation).

Summary of the HIPAA Privacy Rule

Summary of the HIPAA Privacy Rule

www.hhs.gov

 

[BelleIsle]

Yes, but the media has settled on the incel theory and they keep trying to build their weak stories around that.

Agreed!

 

[Diogenetic]

I have to say that the big HIPPA discussion is cracking me up. I can't wait to see how long a discussion goes on when the judge makes a ruling on something that seriously impacts his case.

So, as watched his hearing yesterday, I suddenly realized that he never says "Your Honor" or "ma'am" to the female judge. Only yes, no, I understand. I also noticed what others have said about his attorney not even looking at him. I was interested that she didn't suggest he be more respectful to the judge, but maybe I'm making too much of that. It must be just killing him to have a female judge and a female attorney. I hope it is keeping him up nights, internally seething that he is being both defended and judged (at least currently) by women. I really do.

I believe this this judge is not going to try this case. I think it gets kicked up to another jurisdictional level in the case of felony murder for actual trial. Perhaps someone here knows more precisely.

I think there is obviously a level of misogyny here, but he does have a mom and sisters. So I don't think he has some impediment to interaction. And it is likely his attorney told him nothing but rehearsed "yes" and "no" answers to anything.

 

[smileyface516]

Does anyone else feel like the media is really reaching when it comes to painting a picture of BK's "behavior" towards women? As a 12 year old he says to a girl, " Oh, you're so pretty" and other "weird" comments. Seriously??? Since when is complimenting someone weird or creepy?!

I feel like the media, and SM in particular, is desperate to portray BK as some sort of woman hating dude. I'm just not buying it! Why can't he just be a deranged lunatic who wanted to kill?

We will never get to the bottom of why he resulted to this crime, so why even bother trying to figure it out?

I think accounts of his behavior toward women in *recent* years, as a grown man, could be telling, but reaching back to 12-year-old behavior is really silly. When my daughter was 12, she had boys who paid her compliments like that where she found it weird, and a couple did come off as somewhat awkward. We talked about how to kindly but firmly turn down this sort of attention, but I hardly think anyone should be judged by what is probably their first fumbling attempts to demonstrate interest in someone.

 

[SharonNeedles]

My thoughts are that a sharp strong knife can be a quiet, quick and very intimate murder weapon choice for a person who may seem fascinated with "how it feels when you are committing a serious crime".. And, as such a murderer, plunging it into sleeping people gives the intimacy with greatly reduced personal risk.

MOO

But we know at least some of the victims were not sleeping. And we know one of the victims was a six foot tall male athlete with golf clubs. There's definitely a high degree of personal risk when one brings a knife to a golf club fight.

 

[jepop]

Does anyone else feel like the media is really reaching when it comes to painting a picture of BK's "behavior" towards women? As a 12 year old he says to a girl, " Oh, you're so pretty" and other "weird" comments. Seriously??? Since when is complimenting someone weird or creepy?!

I feel like the media, and SM in particular, is desperate to portray BK as some sort of woman hating dude. I'm just not buying it! Why can't he just be a deranged lunatic who wanted to kill?

We will never get to the bottom of why he resulted to this crime, so why even bother trying to figure it out?

IMO, the media is just speculating with scraps of anecdotal evidence as regards motive. In this situation any scrap can be squeezed to fit the desired view It is possible there will not be answers, either because BK himself has no idea why he is driven or he chooses to clam up for ever, revealing nothing. Then again, we cannot know this atm...it is early in the investigation so who knows. IMO truly only BK knows his motive and even then he may not be able to express it or have much self understanding. We simply just don't know atm and have very little, if any knowledge into his psychology, drives, and the forces that have helped shape him. Hell, it's hard enough trying to understand ourselves (IMO) let alone others, especially others who have revealed nothing about themselves. Psychiatric and and other psych and behavioural professionals might gain some understanding in the future, some idea of BK's inner world if he is willing/able to talk to them. MOO

 

[SteveP]

I believe the house these students lived in was a private rental residence, not university housing, so they likely would not be subject to any sort of rules against having a firearm. JMO

These kids were not living in some high-crime, urban area. They were attending school in a small, college town, that had not seen a murder in about seven years. I really doubt that either the kids or their parents felt the need for them to head to school, packing firearms for their safety. JMO

 

[Fargo]

<modsnip: personalizing/offering diagnosis> I think BK began to see others, maybe more so women, or his parents, or peers, or siblings as objects, and certainly in many ways himself above them.
The paradox is that he seemed to struggle with self esteem issues. So his ability to harm others he perceived to be ’better’ than himself- made him ’better’ ??
Maybe attempting to rationally think through a motive is not possible.

What is ironic, is how anger toward him for these murders could allow me to justify him no longer being human- but instead a monster. In a sense I’ve done the same to him. Is that ok? No, to me it is troubling

JMO

There is a great deal of insight in this post. I've seen many posts where people view Kohberger as a monster, less than human - or not human at all - and have no qualms about executing him on the spot like a rabid dog. And feel absolutely justified, without any kind of remorse.

This is how Kohberger viewed his own victims. How and why he got into that state of mind is anyone's guess. But it's likely he felt just as justified killing these people as we feel about killing him. So yes, in a sense, that makes us no different than him. We are justifying killing him just as he felt justified in killing them. That's an uncomfortable place to be when viewed from that perspective.

The only difference is that we've made it legal for us (ie the "state") to kill him without remorse. It's legal for us to commit the same action he did and even feel satisfied about it, just like he did. I'm not personally comfortable either being in the same state of mind as he was - killing a human without feeling or remorse. It's frightening and not a road I want to be on. My opinions only.

It's too early in the morning to dissect this. I haven't even had my coffee yet!

 

[ktm44]

Yes, but the media has settled on the incel theory and they keep trying to build their weak stories around that.

It's also human nature to try assign a reason to why this happened in such a way that causes them to believe that it can't happen to any one of us instead of realizing these things are rare but we all need to take daily precautions.

I'm so happy that WS keeps such tight control of discussion but if you venture into SM, you'll find a long ugly list of innocents who were literally crucified so masses of humans could feel safer by using their CSI super sleuthing skills.

I believe the FBI profilers have likely done a great job but I think it's short sighted to try and use other profiles to fit someone we know very little about and individual comments shared in the media do not give us a realistic or well rounded opinion of someone to form any credible profile.

 

[SteveP]

Yes I do think they probably do give them a razor and take it back when they are done.

Other than pulling your face off, I doubt that a dull plastic disposable razor can do much harm to anyone, and especially with someone monitoring basically your every move. JMO

 

[Diogenetic]

The murderer(s) knew the students well enough to know there was not a gun threat? Or the murderer(s) could have also had a gun? JMO

Why wasn't the murderer(s) worried that two, four, or six people might be up or wake up and attack, call 911, or run out screaming? JMO

While it is not a good idea to bring a knife to a gun fight, his plan seems to have been: no fight.

it is rational to think going in, he is expecting:

• one person per room
• victims being asleep at 4am
• victims being petite females he knew to live there
• victims may possibly be partially or residually inebriated
• little to no noise from killing them to rouse others.
• weapon perfect to leave least forensics
• Given Idaho stats on gun ownership by household, and also national stats on gander and age of firearms owners, a random Idaho home probably has a 2/3 chance of having a firearm, while a house with women in early 20's would have lowest chance of firearm present compared to all idaho homes

Then there is what changed:

• Two victims in every room where he conducted an attack. Possibility there were up to ten persons in house
• Miltary age male in house, perhaps more, male in home also increases chance of roused people with firearm
• shouting
• some persons awake

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

There is a great deal of insight in this post. I've seen many posts where people view Kohberger as a monster, less than human - or not human at all - and have no qualms about executing him on the spot like a rabid dog. And feel absolutely justified, without any kind of remorse.

This is how Kohberger viewed his own victims. How and why he got into that state of mind is anyone's guess. But it's likely he felt just as justified killing these people as we feel about killing him. So yes, in a sense, that makes us no different than him. We are justifying killing him just as he felt justified in killing them. That's an uncomfortable place to be when viewed from that perspective.

The only difference is that we've made it legal for us (ie the "state") to kill him without remorse. It's legal for us to commit the same action he did and even feel satisfied about it, just like he did. I'm not personally comfortable either being in the same state of mind as he was - killing a human without feeling or remorse. It's frightening and not a road I want to be on. My opinions only.

It's too early in the morning to dissect this. I haven't even had my coffee yet!

No one here knows whether or not BK felt "justified" in allegedly killing the victims or felt any remorse afterward.

 

[Ceska]

I'm curious about the preliminary hearing scheduled for June 26. Will BK enter a plea at that time?

What to expect at Idaho murders suspect Bryan Kohberger's next court hearing

Bryan Kohberger's next court appearance is scheduled for June 26 — a move meant to give his defense team more time to prepare.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[steeltowngirl]

Does anyone else feel like the media is really reaching when it comes to painting a picture of BK's "behavior" towards women? As a 12 year old he says to a girl, " Oh, you're so pretty" and other "weird" comments. Seriously??? Since when is complimenting someone weird or creepy?!

I feel like the media, and SM in particular, is desperate to portray BK as some sort of woman hating dude. I'm just not buying it! Why can't he just be a deranged lunatic who wanted to kill?

We will never get to the bottom of why he resulted to this crime, so why even bother trying to figure it out?

I feel the same way. I can only guess that people being people are desperate to understand the “why” and try to make sense of the senseless.

A jury won’t require motive, but it would help. if he’s eventually found guilty, defense could latch onto BK’s past (alleged) bullying as some type of mitigating factor. Prosecution could take it the other direction and say that BK harbored a deep hatred of women, and he wasn’t really bullied. Women and even younger girls were just instinctively reacting to his off-putting manner.

I am leaning in your direction. Thrill kill. I don’t know if he was deranged, but he’s not right in the head. I think BK was likely emulating Bundy. He was on the path to being a perennial student - not fully employable due to his issues. His failure to fully launch and thrive in society, coupled with anger towards socially successful people that he deemed seemingly “less than” him intellectually, triggered him to take action to immortalize himself.

Maybe he did also have a deep disdain of women ..“you have good birthing hips”… so his natural target would be a house full of likely inebriated and vulnerable women to commit a mass murder.

jmo

 

[jepop]

It's also human nature to try assign a reason to why this happened in such a way that causes them to believe that it can't happen to any one of us instead of realizing these things are rare but we all need to take daily precautions.

I'm so happy that WS keeps such tight control of discussion but if you venture into SM, you'll find a long ugly list of innocents who were literally crucified so masses of humans could feel safer by using their CSI super sleuthing skills.

I believe the FBI profilers have likely done a great job but I think it's short sighted to try and use other profiles to fit someone we know very little about and individual comments shared in the media do not give us a realistic or well rounded opinion of someone to form any credible profile.

Too early for armchair comparative profiling, I agree. Just my opinion.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Does anyone else feel like the media is really reaching when it comes to painting a picture of BK's "behavior" towards women? As a 12 year old he says to a girl, " Oh, you're so pretty" and other "weird" comments. Seriously??? Since when is complimenting someone weird or creepy?!

I feel like the media, and SM in particular, is desperate to portray BK as some sort of woman hating dude. I'm just not buying it! Why can't he just be a deranged lunatic who wanted to kill?

We will never get to the bottom of why he resulted to this crime, so why even bother trying to figure it out?

Actually I think LE took it in that direction intentionally. Before BK's arrest when they supposedly had no suspects but were working leads (but we now know they absolutely had a suspect). There's a lot of psychology involved when a profile is released knowing that the perp will see it.

 

[Diogenetic]

But we know at least some of the victims were not sleeping. And we know one of the victims was a six foot tall male athlete with golf clubs. There's definitely a high degree of personal risk when one brings a knife to a golf club fight.

None of which he knew or might have expected.
We all engage sometimes, I do as well, so dont take it personally. But that is hindsight fallacy. The presumption he knew a miltary age male was there is not supported. presumption he knew golf clubs were there

if you think about it he picked among the most ideal place, time and weapon. All petite females living there. lowest statistical likelihood of having a firearm. weapon less likely to leave forensic trace (knife with handguard/large hilt).

 

[maskedwoman]

Agreed - and - that’s also where the risk comes in too - what if everyone is not sleeping? (and they were not all sleeping - door dash delivery etc)
And very good point about the personal/intimate factor - I agree.

Yes but, sadly, it didn't affect the outcome. He still killed everyone he came into direct contact with.