IL - Lt. Charles 'Joe' Gliniewicz, 52, found dead, Fox Lake, 1 Sep 2015 - #2

[vestigare]

So, you were mistaken here as far as this being a 100% sure thing?

No, if you have no blood pressure you are not going to remain conscious; what I was saying there is that certain drugs will elevate your blood pressure so that under normal circumstances when your BP would have dropped from extreme pain or sudden blood loss the drugs will keep it up just enough to keep you going longer than average.

Drugs are not going to keep blood pumping when there is no blood to pump, or the heart is so damaged it no longer receives impulses to beat, or the brain stops sending messages to pump. That is just fact. Well I guess we could get pedantic and discuss heart lung machines etc... but we aren't.

And I never said 100% for anything. I am a scientist and not that stupid.

 

[Cubby]

I didn't say the dogs would be too confused to find drugs there, if they were looking for drugs IMO they still would've found them. And yes I know these are specially trained dogs and I know their capabilities as well as their limitations. I am speaking from experience and familiarity with training and I respectfully disagree.

Are you a verified poster?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...essional-Posters-and-Verified-Locals-Insiders

 

[Japple]

BBM. MSM. Have you read any of the links?

Forgive me, but I don't know what BBM or MSM means. I have read many links. Which links are you referring to? I have not seen anything but speculation as to why LT would be suicidal.

 

[vestigare]

I think that falls under "Victim Friendly" in WS TOS http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?65798-Etiquette-amp-Information

I thnk my post was removed mostly because it was in reply to someone who had their post removed and everyone who responded was removed. Especially now that I read the rules again I can't see how what I said violated any of that. But if it does they can remove it again. I was only pointing out the obvious way LE investigate other murders. I wasn't speculating on this woman.

 

[Tillicum]

Are you a verified poster?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...essional-Posters-and-Verified-Locals-Insiders

No and I'm speaking of past experience not current. I guess I'm a nobody with an opinion

 

[vestigare]

No and I'm speaking of past experience not current. I guess I'm a nobody with an opinion

I am still interested in what dogs you train. whether verified or not.

 

[browncat]

Found while scrolling fb earlier today, not sure if it has already been posted.
http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...pute-in-Fox-Lake-Investigation-327949911.html

 

[Cubby]

Forgive me, but I don't know what BBM or MSM means. I have read many links. Which links are you referring to? I have not seen anything but speculation as to why LT would be suicidal.

BBM means bolded by me. MSM means main stream media. There are no links to indicate he was suicidal. There are links indicating the coroner can not rule out suicide and can not rule in homicide. There are numerous links throughout the thread where this being investigated as a possible suicide in MSM.

 

[Cubby]

On Tuesday, for the first time, officials with the task force investigating the officer’s death conceded they are considering both homicide and suicide. While Gliniewicz said on his radio that he had been pursuing three individuals just prior to his death, police have revealed no leads or even a description of who those individuals might have been.

Source: http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loca...ke-Investigation-327949911.html#ixzz3m1rA1VX9
Follow us: @nbcchicago on Twitter | nbcchicago on Facebook

 

[Tillicum]

I am still interested in what dogs you train. whether verified or not.

I prefer not to put my anonymity at risk by going into detail. The point I was trying to make earlier is that there are many conditions that can thwart an excellent dog's progress or success whether S&R, HR, air/ground scent, drugs or explosives IMO.

 

[cady]

No and I'm speaking of past experience not current. I guess I'm a nobody with an opinion

Join the club! We all have opinions based on our experiences, and even professionals disagree on proof, depending upon their own experience. If we can't speculate, the there is not much to talk about. I guess just wait for a trial (if homicide) and let justice do it's thing. But everyone even has a different definition of justice. So, what's left? Just Us. JMO

 

[Cubby]

For those who are new:

Link to the Websleuths lingo/abbreviations
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?276298-Websleuths-Lingo

 

[vestigare]

I prefer not to put my anonymity at risk by going into detail. The point I was trying to make earlier is that there are many conditions that can thwart an excellent dog's progress or success whether S&R, HR, air/ground scent, drugs or explosives IMO.

Okay, I get it. I like to keep my anonymity too.

I was just trying to determine which sort you trained. Because Tracking dogs can get rather confused depending on things and I could discuss that with you.

I respect your opinion. I just respectfully disagree that 49 dogs from various depts would have picked up nothing from 3 people.

 

[Keefer]

I prefer not to put my anonymity at risk by going into detail. The point I was trying to make earlier is that there are many conditions that can thwart an excellent dog's progress or success whether S&R, HR, air/ground scent, drugs or explosives IMO.

I would imagine that a specifically trained individual would be privy to these weaknesses and seek to exploit them? I guess it would matter greatly how much lead time they had. What preparations they had made beforehand, etc.

 

[vestigare]

Join the club! We all have opinions based on our experiences, and even professionals disagree on proof, depending upon their own experience. If we can't speculate, the there is not much to talk about. I guess just wait for a trial (if homicide) and let justice do it's thing. But everyone even has a different definition of justice. So, what's left? Just Us. JMO

Don't you wish you had people like the people on this forum at every trial?

 

[vestigare]

There was an early report that a K9 had found a trail but it turned out to be an animal they were tracking.

 

[lonetraveler]

But we do not know if they picked up any scent trails or not. I have not seen anyone say there were no signs of any scent trails. All we know is that they didn't corner anyone or find anyone hiding. but they could have trailed a scent that stopped--perhaps where a car was waiting?

Was the pepper spray ever found? At the beginning of this case it was reportedly missing. Could it have been used to put the dogs off of a trail?

 

[vestigare]

I would imagine that a specifically trained individual would be privy to these weaknesses and seek to exploit them? I guess it would matter greatly how much lead time they had. What preparations they had made beforehand, etc.

There are instances particularly when drug dog handlers have been shown to "alert" to a vehicle or person when the dog didn't really alert but was responding to a finger command by the handler. They then use the alert as reason to search the vehicle.

This is where dogs fall down because humans have to interpret their behavior in court and you can't cross examine a dog.

But if a dog is trained to smell something it can smell it pretty well through and around a lot of stuff. It is the handlers job to keep him on task and figure out where the dog wants to go.

I don't know what anyone in this case would gain by making their dogs not follow the path of the three suspects.

 

[vestigare]

Was the pepper spray ever found? At the beginning of this case it was reportedly missing. Could it have been used to put the dogs off of a trail?

I answered this way earlier so I will happily answer again.
The pepper spray would not have stopped the dogs. If anything the person who was sprayed or did the spraying would be able to be followed easier because of that scent now on him.

I don't know though if the spray was used. It was reportedly found though.

 

[cady]

Don't you wish you had people like the people on this forum at every trial?

Errr, as in hung jury? numerous mistrials..... I'd have to think about that! JMO