IL - Sonya Massey Shot To Death In Her Own Home by Sangamon County Deputy After Calling to Report a Prowler, Springfield 6 July 2024

[bombardier]

I want to add; some commentors on YT were saying to slow the video down so I did, and for full case transparency I want it known that when the officer started yelling and advancing w/ gun drawn, while she was crouched down, on video you can see her raising the pot and throwing it. The pot hits the side of the counter and water flows down towards the floor. The officer seems to start shooting after the pot has already been thrown but may have started while it was airborn.



I think it may become a problem that she is not a """perfect""" victim here. She did throw something that could be a weapon, and self defense* is probably what the officer will go for in terms of the trial. BUT the officer clearly instigated the confrontation. They know she's mentally unwell, vulnerable, and paranoid, and he made the decision to scare her and draw his weapon. I wish she had not throw that pot, but I understand why, in that situation, she would have, given her current state and the fear. I 100% do not believe she would have thrown that pot if the officer had not instigated.
I am interested in how the trial will go. Have there been cases on the books before, like this, where cops instigated a negative interaction, the person acted out of fear, and then got hurt? It adds a cushioning layer between the cop and the person who was harmed, and I worry that the law can twist that.

*I think there is also a question about what level of threat needs to be present to justify deadly force. I think many of us do not believe that hot water thrown by someone very frail rises to that level. The DOJ keeps it vague in their description; it seems up to LE discretion if they feel that serious physical injury would be incurred.

 

[georgiajean]

I want to add; some commentors on YT were saying to slow the video down so I did, and for full case transparency I want it known that when the officer started yelling and advancing w/ gun drawn, while she was crouched down, on video you can see her raising the pot and throwing it. The pot hits the side of the counter and water flows down towards the floor. The office seems to start shooting after the pot has already been thrown but may have started while it was airborn.
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I think it may become a problem that she is not a """perfect""" victim here. She did throw something that could be a weapon, and self defense* is probably what the office will go for in terms of the trial. BUT the office clearly instigated the confrontation. They know she's mentally unwell, vulnerable, and paranoid, and he made the decision to scare her and draw his weapon. I wish she had not throw that pot, but I understand why, in that situation, she would have, given her current state and the fear. I 100% do not believe she would have thrown that pot if the officer had not instigated.
I am interested in how the trial will go. Have there been cases on the books before, like this, where cops instigated a negative interaction, the person acted out of fear, and then got hurt? It adds a cushioning layer between the cop and the person who was harmed, and I worry that the law can twist that.

*I think there is also a question about what level of threat needs to be present to justify deadly force. I think many of us do not believe that hot water thrown by someone very frail rises to that level. The DOJ keeps it vague in their description; it seems up to LE discretion if they feel that serious physical injury would be incurred.

Thank you for this. I went back, on super slow mode, and you can only see the pot being dumped/thrown in the short video from Camera 2 (the shooter). In the other LE's camera, the shooter steps in front, blocking the view of the pot. It's around min.28 in the video.

She falls down onto her knees, both hands in the air, holding pot holders and the pot sitting on the edge of the counter/sink. The shooter advances and demands she drop the pot. It isn't clear how she gets the pot in her hands (shooter blocks view). He advances, She throws the pot which lands on the black trash bag, and you can see steam rising off the water.

Now I understand why when the medics were there, everyone kept saying to leave the bag alone, that it was evidence. The Medics took her out the back door in order to not mess with the bag/water/pot evidence.

 

[stoptheviolence]

I want to add; some commentors on YT were saying to slow the video down so I did, and for full case transparency I want it known that when the officer started yelling and advancing w/ gun drawn, while she was crouched down, on video you can see her raising the pot and throwing it. The pot hits the side of the counter and water flows down towards the floor. The officer seems to start shooting after the pot has already been thrown but may have started while it was airborn.
View attachment 519842

View attachment 519843
I think it may become a problem that she is not a """perfect""" victim here. She did throw something that could be a weapon, and self defense* is probably what the officer will go for in terms of the trial. BUT the officer clearly instigated the confrontation. They know she's mentally unwell, vulnerable, and paranoid, and he made the decision to scare her and draw his weapon. I wish she had not throw that pot, but I understand why, in that situation, she would have, given her current state and the fear. I 100% do not believe she would have thrown that pot if the officer had not instigated.
I am interested in how the trial will go. Have there been cases on the books before, like this, where cops instigated a negative interaction, the person acted out of fear, and then got hurt? It adds a cushioning layer between the cop and the person who was harmed, and I worry that the law can twist that.

*I think there is also a question about what level of threat needs to be present to justify deadly force. I think many of us do not believe that hot water thrown by someone very frail rises to that level. The DOJ keeps it vague in their description; it seems up to LE discretion if they feel that serious physical injury would be incurred.

I think you have kind of answered by question which is does someone who throws hot water justify being shot and killed. I don't understand why these ridiculous situations are escalateing mostly by LE and there is always a victim who was the person that called the police in the first place. Why can't these officers deescalate a situation before it becomes a life and death situation.

 

[Artis]

Ben Crump, already the mouthpiece. That didn't take long.

Very unfortunate but expected. This was outrageous on the part of that psycho cop <modsnip> The fact is that lots of people - and their dogs - are murdered by cops (unjustified shootings), <modsnip> and it's a danger to all of society. \This poor lady was, obviously, a tad off upstairs and he had a paranoid hair trigger personality. It's like police departments select for dangerous personalities instead of screening them out. Good people are afraid to call the police as a result of it. God bless this woman. Rebuking him in Jesus' name really triggered him. Maybe she saw for him what he was.

 

[Artis]

I want to add; some commentors on YT were saying to slow the video down so I did, and for full case transparency I want it known that when the officer started yelling and advancing w/ gun drawn, while she was crouched down, on video you can see her raising the pot and throwing it. The pot hits the side of the counter and water flows down towards the floor. The officer seems to start shooting after the pot has already been thrown but may have started while it was airborn.
View attachment 519842

View attachment 519843
I think it may become a problem that she is not a """perfect""" victim here. She did throw something that could be a weapon, and self defense* is probably what the officer will go for in terms of the trial. BUT the officer clearly instigated the confrontation. They know she's mentally unwell, vulnerable, and paranoid, and he made the decision to scare her and draw his weapon. I wish she had not throw that pot, but I understand why, in that situation, she would have, given her current state and the fear. I 100% do not believe she would have thrown that pot if the officer had not instigated.
I am interested in how the trial will go. Have there been cases on the books before, like this, where cops instigated a negative interaction, the person acted out of fear, and then got hurt? It adds a cushioning layer between the cop and the person who was harmed, and I worry that the law can twist that.

*I think there is also a question about what level of threat needs to be present to justify deadly force. I think many of us do not believe that hot water thrown by someone very frail rises to that level. The DOJ keeps it vague in their description; it seems up to LE discretion if they feel that serious physical injury would be incurred.

Thanks for that. I watched the video a few times and did not catch that pot in the air like that. It may be enough to get him acquitted, depending on the make up of the jury.

 

[Mack the Knife]

I want to add; some commentors on YT were saying to slow the video down so I did, and for full case transparency I want it known that when the officer started yelling and advancing w/ gun drawn, while she was crouched down, on video you can see her raising the pot and throwing it. The pot hits the side of the counter and water flows down towards the floor. The officer seems to start shooting after the pot has already been thrown but may have started while it was airborn.
View attachment 519842

View attachment 519843
I think it may become a problem that she is not a """perfect""" victim here. She did throw something that could be a weapon, and self defense* is probably what the officer will go for in terms of the trial. BUT the officer clearly instigated the confrontation. They know she's mentally unwell, vulnerable, and paranoid, and he made the decision to scare her and draw his weapon. I wish she had not throw that pot, but I understand why, in that situation, she would have, given her current state and the fear. I 100% do not believe she would have thrown that pot if the officer had not instigated.
I am interested in how the trial will go. Have there been cases on the books before, like this, where cops instigated a negative interaction, the person acted out of fear, and then got hurt? It adds a cushioning layer between the cop and the person who was harmed, and I worry that the law can twist that.

*I think there is also a question about what level of threat needs to be present to justify deadly force. I think many of us do not believe that hot water thrown by someone very frail rises to that level. The DOJ keeps it vague in their description; it seems up to LE discretion if they feel that serious physical injury would be incurred.

Thanks for pointing that out…definitely hard to see, and the video I’ve seen from the other officer’s body cam doesn’t have audio when Deputy Grayson starts yelling, so it has been hard to line up what happened.

I think from Dep. Grayson’s body cam, it’s clear that Ms. Massey puts the pot down as soon as he draws his gun, even before he instructs her to. He keeps yelling even when the pot has been set down, and her hands are in the air. I can’t imagine how terrifying that would be—hands in the air, LEOs pointing guns, yelling at you, advancing on you—she had complied with what they wanted (putting the pot down) but they were escalating anyway. What did they want her to do? They gave no further instructions, and if I were her I might well have grabbed the pot of water and thrown it because it didn’t seem like there were any other options.

I already don’t think there is any chance of acquittal here, but I’m curious what the other deputy will testify to. Or what he has already said in interviews. I know that the LE unions have very strict rules when it comes to officer involved shootings, and there can be an instinct to hold the thing blue line and all that, but it doesn’t look like his department is backing (former) Deputy Grayson at all.

 

[sunflowermomma]

IMO, if anything, she was pulling the pot in front of her face in a panic to protect her from the deadly weapon pointed in her face by the cop screaming that he was going to shoot her in the face.