IL - Sonya Massey Shot To Death In Her Own Home by Sangamon County Deputy After Calling to Report a Prowler, Springfield 6 July 2024

[tlcya]

Absolutely agree.

On the racism point; from what we know and have seen, I cannot see how anyone arrives at the conclusion that this was a racially motivated act. The media are getting out of hand with their click-bait nonsense, quite honestly.

I mean, perhaps it'll come out that he's the biggest racist in the department but there's nothing in the video that shows that so it's just people whipping up a storm as far as I can see.

I agree with you. Nothing I saw in the footage tells me if Grayson's motivations were based in race. He may well have been biased against Sonya but I think given what we currently know it is a reach to say this was racially motivated rather than just a dude on a power trip who should never be in law enforcement because psychologically he is not a good candidate.

as this case proceeds w may hear or see evidence that he was racially motivated but it is entirely too soon to make that allegation.

 

[Marantz4250b]

“We don’t need a fire while we’re here,”

Is this potentially evidence that the boiling water actually posed very little danger to anyone? I mean, it tends to suggest that it was potentially about to boil dry as pans full of water don't often take fire.

 

[tlcya]

more about Grayson's prior history with the law, both as defendant and LEO at this link
Although driving under the influence is not a disqualifying misdemeanor under ILETSB rules, Macoupin County court records showed that Grayson was also charged in 2015 and 2016 with DUI.

A 2015 report by the Virden Police Department showed that he had a firearm and marijuana in the vehicle at the time of his DUI arrest.

In the 2015 case, he pleaded guilty, was fined $750 and placed on seven days of court supervision. His firearm was returned in 2017, according to a court record.

Virden hired Grayson as a part-time police officer six years after that arrest.

In 2016, two months after he pleaded guilty on the first charge, Grayson was stopped by Macoupin County Sheriff's deputies and refused a breathalyzer. During the arrest, he told the deputy to "hurry up" because he needed to urinate. He threatened to urinate in a trash can or his pants, according to the report. At one point, he told the arresting officer that he was "too small to make him mad," according to the police report.

ByBETH HUNDSDORFER, Capitol News Illinois
Tuesday, July 23, 2024 8:56PM

 

[Cryptic]

I’m not very familiar with the story but how did they know that she was mentally unwell, paranoid etc? How many times did the officer tell her to put the pot of boiling water down on the stove?

Its important to note that the officer first orders her to take the pot of water off the stove. He then goes ballistic at a perceived threat when she actually follows his command and picks up the pot.

As to the officers knowing that she was mentally unwell, they probably did not know specifically that she was unwell.

But.... they knew that being an police officer involves responding to a certain number of calls made by a dazzling variety of: attention seekers, bored humans, people whose predicament is their own fault, and..... a certain number of people who are unwell and acting mildly erratically.

In the end, encountering a mentally unwell person should not have been a surprise.

 

[sds71]

Reminded me of this

Groubert, was given credit for 17 months he served after pleading guilty to aggravated assault and battery last year. Dashcam video shows Groubert shot Jones, as he reached into his truck to get his driver's license after Groubert asked to see the license.

The video showed Jones was being polite and was trying to comply with the officer's commands when he was shot. The Highway Patrol fired Groubert shortly after Jones was shot.

Ex state trooper who shot unarmed black man reaching for wallet gets 3 years in prison

A former South Carolina Highway Patrol trooper who shot an unarmed man during a traffic stop in 2014 was sentenced to more than three years in prison Tuesday.Circuit Judge Casey Manning sentenced Sean Groubert to five years in prison and three years of pro

abcnews4.com

 

[Mack the Knife]

Absolutely agree.

On the racism point; from what we know and have seen, I cannot see how anyone arrives at the conclusion that this was a racially motivated act. The media are getting out of hand with their click-bait nonsense, quite honestly.

I mean, perhaps it'll come out that he's the biggest racist in the department but there's nothing in the video that shows that so it's just people whipping up a storm as far as I can see.

Without outright racial slurs etc. or a history of such, it is extremely difficult to identify a single incident as being due to racism. And typically, I’d say there’s no conscious thought like “this person is black and therefore more likely to be a criminal.”

But like iamshadow pointed out, it’s a statistics issue. I see it as similar to climate change: was this hurricane caused by climate change? was this wildfire made worse by climate change? It’s maybe impossible to say for an individual event, but with the progression of climate change, we see a higher volume and greater severity of such natural disasters. Similarly, with biases by law enforcement against people of color and particular black people, we see a higher volume of interactions with law enforcement and more adverse outcomes, all the way up to the murder of civilians.

 

[MollyDDD]

Its important to note that the officer first orders her to take the pot of water off the stove. He then goes ballistic at a perceived threat when she actually follows his command and picks up the pot.

As to the officers knowing that she was mentally unwell, they probably did not know specifically that she was unwell.

But.... they knew that being an police officer involves responding to a certain number of calls made by a dazzling variety of: attention seekers, bored humans, people whose predicament is their own fault, and..... a certain number of people who are unwell and acting erratically.

In the end, encountering a mentally unwell person should not have been a surprise.

I agree with what you’re saying and he definitely could have chosen a less lethal solution to the situation. And while I am not condoning his actions I think that law enforcement individuals need better training in handling situations as well as requiring them to attend regular psychological counseling sessions throughout the year. The stress, emotions and fear our police officers must face every second of their day absolutely takes a huge toll on them physically, mentally and emotionally and they need relief, support and professional oversight. IMO

 

[UrsulaWrenn]

Possibly, but from a police officers point of view, he could have feared that she had hidden a loaded gun on the floor behind that counter top and shot him. They want to go home to their family too.

She would have needed to remove the potholders first. I think by the time she put down the pot of water, removed the potholders and grabbed the gun he could've found a way to de-escalate. Also, common sense kinda dictates that if she had a gun on the counter next to the stove she would not have been so fearful of an intruder she was willing to call the police in spite of a premonition she was going to die at the hands of police officers.

 

[spyblond]

Possibly, but from a police officers point of view, he could have feared that she had hidden a loaded gun on the floor behind that counter top and shot him. They want to go home to their family too.

I'm sorry, Are we willing trying to offer justification for this murder? It doesn't matter how you feel about the police, there was no justification for this. If we are keeping this a victim friendly space as designated by websleuths we certainly don't want Sonya's family members finding this forum and seeing people trying to justify their why a police offer would shoot their family member THREE times.

 

[spyblond]

Absolutely agree.

On the racism point; from what we know and have seen, I cannot see how anyone arrives at the conclusion that this was a racially motivated act. The media are getting out of hand with their click-bait nonsense, quite honestly.

I mean, perhaps it'll come out that he's the biggest racist in the department but there's nothing in the video that shows that so it's just people whipping up a storm as far as I can see.

MOO I think if you look at the track records of when police shoot and kill people there is racial motivation. While it may not seem readily apparent to us as outsiders there very well could be racially motivated component. Police perpetuated racist violence is a very real thing and dubbing it "click-bait nonsense" is grossly irresponsible.
In this specific case I would recommend researching the tattoos that this officer has and there meaning. MOO

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Her family alleges they were mislead regarding who shot her. If true, that is horrifying and honestly a really big deal.

 

[sunflowermomma]

She would have needed to remove the potholders first. I think by the time she put down the pot of water, removed the potholders and grabbed the gun he could've found a way to de-escalate. Also, common sense kinda dictates that if she had a gun on the counter next to the stove she would not have been so fearful of an intruder she was willing to call the police in spite of a premonition she was going to die at the hands of police officers.

There was no gun or weapon so I don't really understand the speculation. Why would they prolong the call and go into the house if they thought she had a gun? Why would they send her over to somewhere not in their line of sight if they feared for their lives? Cops don't have carte blanche to kill whoever they want.

Speculation about what COULD have happened IF the victim was violent doesn't matter. She didn't have a weapon. She shouldn't be dead after calling the police for help.

 

[sunflowermomma]

MOO I think if you look at the track records of when police shoot and kill people there is racial motivation. While it may not seem readily apparent to us as outsiders there very well could be racially motivated component. Police perpetuated racist violence is a very real thing and dubbing it "click-bait nonsense" is grossly irresponsible.
In this specific case I would recommend researching the tattoos that this officer has and there meaning. MOO

here's more information about his tattoo meaning:

Cop group with matching skull tattoos costs taxpayers $7 million in fatal shooting

skull tattoo police officer meaning - Google Search

 

[sunflowermomma]

Only 13% of the US population is Black, however 27% of people police kill are Black. Source. Here is an astonishing list of unarmed Black people killed by police. Sonya Massey was an unarmed Black woman shot by a white cop. Race is clearly relevant here. Racism is not just saying a slur to a person of color. Racism is also killing someone for no reason, making them and yourself a statistic, and then calling them a crazy f*cking b*tch.

 

[MollyDDD]

I'm sorry, Are we willing trying to offer justification for this murder? It doesn't matter how you feel about the police, there was no justification for this. If we are keeping this a victim friendly space as designated by websleuths we certainly don't want Sonya's family members finding this forum and seeing people trying to justify their why a police offer would shoot their family member THREE times.

Holy moly, thank you for reminding me of the rules. Honestly, sometimes I get too emotionally involved and speak from my heart. I am in no way, shape or form “victim blaming” here. This woman did not deserve to die and she did nothing wrong imo. I am only speaking about the officers’s point of view, which I have no knowledge of naturally. Again, I apologize to Tricia and the Moderators and this board. I need to learn how to converse properly in here as I tend to discuss all sides of a story.
Thank you.

 

[tlcya]

here's more information about his tattoo meaning:

Cop group with matching skull tattoos costs taxpayers $7 million in fatal shooting

skull tattoo police officer meaning - Google Search

I appreciate the point you are trying to make but the la times is a pay per view site so we can't read it if not subscriber. As to google searches I can do my own but wanted to point out sometimes a skull is just a skull. I wear clothing that features skulls. My husband and I ride motorcycles. Many of our friends have tattoos, some of them skulls, I have friends in LE, who also have tattoos, and or ride motorcycles, and or think skulls look cool.

I am not ready to overthink Grayson's skull tattoo. Others' milage may certainly differ, but that is where I land currently. Further evidence such as complaints against him relating to race, social media postings made by him, etc could easily change my mind. That is simply where I am right now.

 

[sunflowermomma]

I appreciate the point you are trying to make but the la times is a pay per view site so we can't read it if not subscriber. As to google searches I can do my own but wanted to point out sometimes a skull is just a skull. I wear clothing that features skulls. My husband and I ride motorcycles. Many of our friends have tattoos, some of them skulls, I have friends in LE, who also have tattoos, and or ride motorcycles, and or think skulls look cool.

I am not ready to overthink Grayson's skull tattoo. Others' milage may certainly differ, but that is where I land currently. Further evidence such as complaints against him relating to race, social media postings made by him, etc could easily change my mind. That is simply where I am right now.

So skull tattoos on police officers are tied to violent and extremist cops, the cop who killed someone and has been removed from 6 other police positions had the same tattoo, and you are choosing to not see the connection.

This has been going on for nearly 30 years. You should have no trouble accessing the 1999 version of this article as this has been an epidemic for a long time. The Secret Society Among Lawmen

 

[tlcya]

So skull tattoos on police officers are tied to violent and extremist cops, the cop who killed someone and has been removed from 6 other police positions had the same tattoo, and you are choosing to not see the connection.

I am choosing to follow the evidence. You may be proven correct at the end of the day. But I will wait until the evidence leads me there.

ETA btw, I still hit a paywall with the link you added to this one I have quoted.

 

[Shadowtrix]

I'll never understand why a taser isn't a primary weapon in situations like this, and lethal force a last resort. :/

After watching the awful body cam footage, I can’t stop thinking about how EVEN IF she was about to throw hot water at him, and even if he did believe she was about to, his use of force (shooting her) was absolutely excessive and unjustified. A pot of hot water will not kill. A bullet to the head will and did.

 

[UrsulaWrenn]

I don't see the Punisher or other styles of skull tattoos as being the source of problems with violent officers as much as the informal "club" having one inducts them into. I tend to believe it makes them feel united in a desperate fight against an enemy rather than in a protective role over the community.

Also...every newly licensed doctor wants to face off against cases of Ebola and rabies and weird diseases no one has heard of yet. But the days are filled with kids with flu and constipated grandmas, made only somewhat more exciting by being on call at the ER to see bleeding accident victims and catastrophic strokes. I suspect many LEOs sign up for the job because they're adventurers and drama addicts at heart wanting excitement and instead they find themselves with a lot of pent-up adrenaline when even a potential intruder turns out to be a false alarm, but they're not being adequately trained to stand themselves down.