IL IL - The Unidentified Victims of John Wayne Gacy

[Cubby]

Interesting. I didn't know the one guy had done work for Gacy.

Copied from a PTV link verifying one of the "Ripper Crew" worked for Gacy.

TRAIL'S END GRUESOME CLUES LED TO AN ALTAR IN AN ATTIC

‎
Pay-Per-View - Chicago Tribune - Oct 12, 1987
[Robin Gecht], convicted in the attack on the 18-year-old prostitute in ... Authorities learned that Gecht twice had done construction work for John Wayne Gacy, ...


ETA: (and will be adding more shortly)

Of the three, Gecht is the only one not sentenced to death.

Ripper Crew - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


ETAA: Both of the Gecht's, father and son are still alive. Robin (the father) is still in Menard Correctional Center. http://www.idoc.state.il.us/subsections/search/inms.asp

David Gecht, the son (born in 1980 so too young to have participated in any Gacy crimes) is still in Pontiac Correctional Center. http://www.idoc.state.il.us/subsections/search/inms.asp

Thomas Kokoraleis is still in Indian River Correctional Center http://www.idoc.state.il.us/subsections/search/inms.asp

and Andrew Kokoraleis was executed in 99.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/crime/4216443-418/andrew-kokoraleis-executed-despite-late-appeals.html



These guys are in for life and one already executed. Even if it was proven Robin Gecht was an accomplice of Gacy's what would it really do to benefit the families this many decades later? IMO, the defense attorney's who represented Gacy are just looking to get another 15 minutes of fame due to the recent exhumtions and attempts to identify the last 7 unnamed victims. It would be much different, imo, if there were any possible accomplice's free and not already behind bars.

 

[Gretchen21]

Cubby I agree.

 

[Claudette]

Their reasons:

http://www.suntimes.com/news/10562413-417/sheriff-to-investigate-possible-gacy-accomplice-theory.html

"recently examined Gacy’s work and travel records and suspect he was out of town when victims Russell Nelson and Robert Gilroy disappeared"

"think Gacy didn’t have enough time to abduct and kill victim John Mowery because he disappeared about 10 p.m. in Chicago and Gacy’s work records show he showed up at a job in Michigan at 6 a.m. the following day"


Some other interesting info:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/john-wayne-gacy-accomplices-investigators-article-1.1020824?localLinksEnabled=false

“There is significant evidence out there that suggests that not only did John Wayne Gacy not operate alone, he may not have been involved in some of the murders, and the fact that he was largely a copycat murderer,”

"Their findings echo claims made by a victim who got away, who said another man was present when Gacy raped him in the 1970s. And they also dovetail with claims Gacy made from jail that he was not in Illinois when 16 of the victims vanished, and that he had accomplices as well."

 

[Claudette]

Snipped for space

These guys are in for life and one already executed. Even if it was proven Robin Gecht was an accomplice of Gacy's what would it really do to benefit the families this many decades later? IMO, the defense attorney's who represented Gacy are just looking to get another 15 minutes of fame due to the recent exhumtions and attempts to identify the last 7 unnamed victims. It would be much different, imo, if there were any possible accomplice's free and not already behind bars.

One of the above articles I linked to has the theory that Gacy was a copycat killer, and states that he also claimed that 16 of his supposed victims disappeared when he was out of state...if either one is true then there are probably many more victims out there.

 

[Cubby]

Snipped for space



One of the above articles I linked to has the theory that Gacy was a copycat killer, and states that he also claimed that 16 of his supposed victims disappeared when he was out of state...if either one is true then there are probably many more victims out there.

IF Gacy was out of town when 16 victims disappeared - how did their corpses get into the crawl space beneath his home?

Gacy, was FOS. He lied. Gacy would have said anything. If somekind of travel documents exist, at best, I'd think he sent someone else with info in his name as a way to create an alibi for himself if he was getting worried LE was onto him. There was no photo id's or anything to prove identify of the person traveling back then.

No, I don't believe a word of it. Though I do believe he likely had victims in/from area's outside of Chicago due to his travels. However, since he didn't have a place to conceal them outside of his home (or later the Des Plaines river), I'd lean towards his conning them to come back to his home and then killed out of towners or out of staters at his residence in IL.

 

[Claudette]

Oh, I agree with you 100%. He probably was FOS. I was posting some interesting clips. Really, the only reason why I'm interested in this at all is that one of the survivors (WGN yesterday stated the name but I couldn't find the article, the other news articles did not state the name) said that there was another man at the house when he was attacked.

 

[malaika]

He might be one of the eight UID's. Reading that article, I thought it a coincidence that the UID who I have compared to Orin Anderson above also has a healed fracture of the collarbone. Collarbone fractures are not particularly common. I'm wondering if with all these victims, they might be some sort of mixup with the descriptions of identified victims with those of the unidentified.

In browsing this thread, I didn't see any previous mention of this MP, so I thought I would throw it out there for discussion and whatever/whatnot:

Randy Maciuba, 18, missing Oct 1977 from NY: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/6337/0/
possible broken left collarbone


To be compared to UID Case File 957UMIL: http://doenetwork.org/cases/957umil.html
"Prior fractured left collarbone"

Y'all's thoughts?

 

[CarlK90245]

Could be. He's a little taller than the estimate, and Western New York is about 500 miles from Chicago.

The facial shape is fairly close, though his chin seems a little larger. I wouldn't rely on that one way or the other though.

 

[Cubby]

Malaika, good possibility, imo. It's worth an inquiry and possibly submitting.

To date, Cook County has still not entered these UID's into NamUs. I don't know if that is due to the problems at the Cook Cty morgue, budget cuts or what.

Anyhoo, It looks like the form at the Cook Cty site for family to request DNA might work for submitting a possible match. There are a few questions, but there is also an area to indicate if a missing persons report was made elsewhere.... I think you could add the MP's info here at the Cook site, and then send a copy or the same info to LE on the MP's side.

It would be nice to know one way or the other if the DNA for these UID's has been entered into the national Codis database, even though these UID's are still not in NamUs. (which frustrates me to no end.)

It's late, I'm exhausted, but wanted to reply to this tonight rather than tomorrow sometime.

Here is the link to the Cook Cty site for the UID's:
http://cookcountysheriff.org/sheriffs_police/gacy/gacy.html

and I think Victim #10 is the one which matches the DoeNetwork case file you posted above. (Can't be for sure, but I think so...)

Good luck, let us know what you decide to do. I'll check the thread again tomorrow when I am not so tired.



ETA: Even with the low rating for the estimated date missing, your possible match is closer to the estimated time of the date of last contact than the most recently identified victim. Your MP missing Oct '77, the dates for this UID are Mar 15 - July 5, 77.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

Wondering about this man:

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/4984/72/

for this UID:

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/958umil.html

Age, height, and time of disappearance are all within the estimates. Also, although he was from Ohio, he disappeared while traveling from Las Vegas to PA. There's nothing listed about his method of travel, whether by car or bus, but if you Google map a trip from Las Vegas to the state of Pennsylvania, I80/I90 seems to be the most direct route, which could put him near Chicago. Thoughts?

I just went back to try and click the link for the MP I submitted for the above victim. I didn't submit it to the Gacy task force at the time, but to the Ohio AG's office who had the case file. The link says he has been identified! I haven't tried the link in at least 6 weeks, so I don't really know when he was identified, and I think if it was connected to this case we would have heard. I don't know if my call had anything to do with him being found after all this time, but I'm happy nonetheless. I think his name was Gerald Davis, and he was from Ohio. Since this was my first ever submission I didn't keep good notes...( CarlK any chance he is on one of your lists?

 

[CarlK90245]

Since this was my first ever submission I didn't keep good notes...( CarlK any chance he is on one of your lists?

He is on my list, but my only link is to the closed NamUs casefile.

It listed him as a Caucasian male missing from Lucasville OH on 01-Feb-1977 at the age of 27, and he was between 5'7" and 5'9" tall.

 

[malaika]

Thanks Cubby, I appreciate the link. Going to try to submit today if it's not too busy at work [haha, I'm busted]

 

[malaika]

Hello All,
I submitted the possible match Randy Maciuba/Victim #10 to the Cook County site, however when I tried to find email info for the local LE department or detective listed on NAMUS there was none, only contact phone numbers; I can't call at the moment, the boss might not like that too much! I'm also 3 hours behind New York, and unfortunately today I am booked solid, all day and night [previous engagements]; the earliest I could call LE would be tomorrow between 5:30-6:00am my time [when I am getting ready for work.] Assuming I don't snooze the alarm

That said, I invite anyone who might be more seasoned in this to contact Lackawanna P.D. in New York [Det. Daniel Cardi, (716) 827-6411] and pass on the MP's info? Here is his NAMUS link: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/6337/0/

Essential info:

Randy Maciuba, age 18, missing Oct 1977 from NY [Lackawanna PD Case #NCPS0018]

Fractured left collarbone [UID #10 has fractured collarbone]
DNA available only [no dentals]
Slight height disrepancy

 

[Ambercat]

I was wondering if Michael Mansfield who was 19 years old when he went missing from Rolling Meadows, IL on December 31, 1975 could have been a victim of John Wayne Gacy.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12723/16?current_page=case_information

 

[Cubby]

Hello All,
I submitted the possible match Randy Maciuba/Victim #10 to the Cook County site, however when I tried to find email info for the local LE department or detective listed on NAMUS there was none, only contact phone numbers; I can't call at the moment, the boss might not like that too much! I'm also 3 hours behind New York, and unfortunately today I am booked solid, all day and night [previous engagements]; the earliest I could call LE would be tomorrow between 5:30-6:00am my time [when I am getting ready for work.] Assuming I don't snooze the alarm

That said, I invite anyone who might be more seasoned in this to contact Lackawanna P.D. in New York [Det. Daniel Cardi, (716) 827-6411] and pass on the MP's info? Here is his NAMUS link: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/6337/0/

Essential info:

Randy Maciuba, age 18, missing Oct 1977 from NY [Lackawanna PD Case #NCPS0018]

Fractured left collarbone [UID #10 has fractured collarbone]
DNA available only [no dentals]
Slight height disrepancy

It would probably be best for you to submit. However, if you would like, I can call and get an email address for you. I'd send the LE's email address to you via pm, since posting email addy's here on the forum tend to generate a lot of spam due to the web crawlers.

Let me know if you would like me to. I usually call and leave a vm letting both jurisdictions know I am submitting the possible via email.

hth


ETA: I tried calling, was a voice mail for a different detective. Kiddo is home and I get too many interuptions after school to make calls. Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Perhaps you can try calling tomorrow. If you need any additional help let me know.

 

[Cubby]

I was wondering if Michael Mansfield who was 19 years old when he went missing from Rolling Meadows, IL on December 31, 1975 could have been a victim of John Wayne Gacy.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12723/16?current_page=case_information

I can't copy info over from Charley Project, but according to CP Michael went missing 4 days before he was to testify as a witness against his former college roommate. There is also another missing person who was to testify against this former roommate in a different case. The former roommate was convicted of murdering two other persons, so that leads me to believe it's likely Michael was murdered by the former roommate.

I think LE is pretty sure Michaels disappearance is related to the former roommate and he has probably already been compared to the Gacy uid's.

Here is a link to Michael Mansfield's Charley Project page:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/mansfield_michael.html

 

[Ambercat]

I can't copy info over from Charley Project, but according to CP Michael went missing 4 days before he was to testify as a witness against his former college roommate. There is also another missing person who was to testify against this former roommate in a different case. The former roommate was convicted of murdering two other persons, so that leads me to believe it's likely Michael was murdered by the former roommate.

I think LE is pretty sure Michaels disappearance is related to the former roommate and he has probably already been compared to the Gacy uid's.

Here is a link to Michael Mansfield's Charley Project page:

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/mansfield_michael.html

Thanks for the information. The info on his NamUs page was quite brief and I thought that he bore a strong resemblance to one of John Wayne Gacy's victims who is still unidentified. I guess the resemblance is a coincidence.

 

[Cubby]

Thanks for the information. The info on his NamUs page was quite brief and I thought that he bore a strong resemblance to one of John Wayne Gacy's victims who is still unidentified. I guess the resemblance is a coincidence.

You're welcome, Ambercat. Charley Project usually has the best write ups regarding circumstances of a disappearance when the circumstances are available. I always try to check both NamUs and CP, since NamUs rarely has as detailed info as CP. CP on the other hand, rarely lists information on dentals or DNA so checking both has the most info.

 

[Gretchen21]

I found this article this morning, it was a very confusing article.....(i thought)...why can't they just leave this poor family alone, The Mowery Family has had enough heartache, two kids killed in a matter of 6/7 years, and I believe the sister's murders is still unsolved?


A pal of serial killer John Wayne Gacy roomed with a victim who vanished in 1977 and later told the victim’s friends he knew where bodies were buried, two witnesses revealed to the Chicago Sun-Times.

<modsnip>

The female witnesses spoke to the Sun-Times earlier this week at the request of the attorneys, saying they were teenage friends with 19-year-old Gacy victim John Mowery of Chicago.

<modsnip>

http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/...-of-links-between-gacy-friend-and-victim.html

 

[Claudette]

Too weird to be a coincidence imo