Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #159

[MistyWaters]

I don't know enough about the subject to know one way or another, but if I had to guess, I'd assume maybe he (RA) thought an older phone with older tech, wouldn't be trackable so that's why he used that one to have with him that day.

Bearing in mind this is a man with (allegedly) no social media of his own. While not unheard of (my pastor and son-in-law both deleted all social media some time ago) I suspect he probably does have accounts in places under a totally different name, but it seems as though he likes to stay off the radar.

And ironically, he's done a pretty dang good job of it. Until now.

jmo

I wouldn’t be surprised if RA doesn’t use SM at all given the majority of users are in the 20-29 age group, typically female and he’s much older than those younger users who grew with online interaction being a part of their daily life. It’s a joke, but maybe not always, that if one isn’t on SM they must not exist. lol!

What Age Group Uses Social Media the Most?

Globally, what age group uses social media the most? Here’s a closer look at the age demographic of social media users worldwide.

www.oberlo.com

 

[Hapworth]

Yes

I suppose his main goal was not to pass anyone on foot on the trails

I am not sure you'd be so worried about passing cars. Not surprising he took the most direct route

I think he stayed close to tree line while exiting , then entered the main road near the same spot he entered . jmo

 

[MistyWaters]

I have an LG that is unlocked (can use any carrier) and it has IMEI.

With all that said, I think the original point was whether a phone could be tracked (by LE) using the IMEI and that may have been the reason his was lacking one.

Is there a source that states phones with IMEI can’t be tracked or is this speculation? Prior links stated different service providers just use different technology, nothing about traceable vs untraceable. And often it’s the app that is tracked as opposed to the actual cellphone (ie google). If tracking via cell tower dump is used, the cellphone has to ping with the tower leaving a record of such or it wouldn’t be in service.

How to Track a Phone Using an IMEI Number Online – AirDroid

Have you tried to locate your lost Android phone or iPhone to no avail? Here are tried and tested methods you can use to track your lost phone using the IMEI number.

www.airdroid.com

 

[CNYDarkStar]

Just my opinion, but from everything I have seen thus far, the police and investigators badly bungled this case and the defense attorneys for RA or anyone else arrested are going to have a field day with that fact.

I don't really see how or why you have come to this conclusion...

 

[TL4S]

3. Regards catfishing - there is a common profile of sex offender who brags but does 'precrime' i.e they talk big but do not actually physically meet/assault victims though it is their fantasy. So the difficulty LE have connecting catfish guy to the crime may be that he never did intend to follow through - but this could lead to 'coincidence' if he shared the info online. I find this idea quite interesting. In other words, the risk of this catfishing is someone else follows through ... It may seem unlikely, but however we look at it, only unlikely explanations are left IMO.

RSBM

When I heard this part of the podcast, I immediately thought back to the 194 pg KAK interview when one of the officers asked KAK if maybe he simply mentioned the girls going to the bridge to someone else, who then might have gone to the bridge himself.

MS seems to imply that their source is saying LE is still trying to connect RA to KAK, and/or KAK to the murders, but as of yet has not. I know there are plenty here who will say LE is just trying to cover their own behinds, to make it look like they weren't on the wrong trail for the last 3 years, but who knows. One thing that LE probably knows, that we don't, is whether or not L communicated their plans to anyone (including a_shots), or posted it on SM, before they left that afternoon. If, let's say, she posted something that day, at any point before maybe 1:15 pm, then that would leave enough time for somebody who lives nearby to grab their weapons, drive to the trail, and get to the bridge to wait. The timeframe of RA's 1:27 arrival seems to fit well within this idea, but that's JMO.

 

[Prime8]

RSBM

When I heard this part of the podcast, I immediately thought back to the 194 pg KAK interview when one of the officers asked KAK if maybe he simply mentioned the girls going to the bridge to someone else, who then might have gone to the bridge himself.

MS seems to imply that their source is saying LE is still trying to connect RA to KAK, and/or KAK to the murders, but as of yet has not. I know there are plenty here who will say LE is just trying to cover their own behinds, to make it look like they weren't on the wrong trail the last 3 years, but who knows. One thing that LE probably knows, that we don't, is whether or not L communicated their plans to anyone (including a_shots), or posted it on SM, before they left that afternoon. If, let's say, she posted something that day, at any point before maybe 1:15 pm, then that would leave enough time for somebody who lives nearby to grab their weapons, drive to the trail, and get to the bridge to wait. The timeframe of RA's 1:27 arrival seems to fit well within this idea, but that's JMO.

I'm very interested in him arriving at 1:27. Obviously, he could have just arrived then and decided he was going to commit a crime that day at the first opportunity. The other option is that he arrived knowing they would be there shortly.

 

[TL4S]

I think he stayed close to tree line while exiting , then entered the main road near the same spot he entered . jmo

Yes, it is not clear in the PCA as to where along W 300 N this "muddy and bloody" guy was seen, only that he was walking west, away from the bridge, on the north side of the road. The fact that he was on the north side of the road (opposite the trail side) is strange, to me. The only area that him crossing the road might make sense is on the curve just west of the Hoosier Harvestore, because there are a couple of houses on the south side of the road there, but I think the Harvestore camera would have captured him, unless it was aimed more towards the east. Was he captured on the Harvestore camera and that just wasn't listed in the PCA? Because if not, I think it's clear he came out of the woods either to the west of Harvestore, out of view of the cameras, or he came out farther to the east and walked the fields behind Harvestore. In any case, the fact that someone saw him does not necessarily say he walked along W 300 N the entire length of the road. It's lucky he was seen. If LE has footage of him walking by, then that's all the better (but I don't think they do). JMO.

 

[Yvettea]

The man walking on the north side of the road could have been attempting to distance himself from the crime (on the south side).

 

[Justice101]

I don't really see how or why you have come to this conclusion...

Agree, many people do not have a firm understanding of how the legal system works day in and day out.

Prosecution will have all it's evidence in proper order and ready to go prior to Discovery.

Defense will probably recommend a plea agreement once all is said and done. Everything up to now and the trial is largely un-important and just throwing bones to us in the public. Have some faith.

 

[candlemaker808]

I’m a little confused by his route back to his car (assuming BG left through the cemetery). The muddy/bloody man was spotted on W 300 N, and from looking at online maps he absolutely would be - that stretch of land is almost ludicrously open.

And yet to reach his car, he also had to have passed the parking spot where the girls were dropped off, and then the camera at Hoosiers, and there is no evidence he was spotted or recorded at either location. Did he move into the tree line at/before those points?

This question has probably already been answered, but is there a reason he couldn’t have stayed in the trees all the way from the crime scene back to his car?

 

[AC4RD]

I wonder what the odds are of people close to BG are now new members?

Edit: Because I am always cautious and hesitant to believe anything that new members say, who’ve joined right before LE has dropped a huge bomb in this case. And even those who’ve joined soon after.

mOO ymmv JMVHO

I'd say it's a big positive for us old-timers! Hey, friends of Ricky, what's YOUR take on it? Do you think the unspent .40 cartridge was planted? Was he really just out for a walk that day? Do you have other people who should be looked at with regard to the murders?

Really, if you ARE here, new members who know RA, we'd love to hear what YOU think. A few people may be snippy or even rude but most of us will be very glad to hear what you have to say about it.

 

[CCJD]

Just my opinion, but from everything I have seen thus far, the police and investigators badly bungled this case and the defense attorneys for RA or anyone else arrested are going to have a field day with that fact.

From the first page of this thread:

Found Deceased - IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #159

Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread. On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek...

www.websleuths.com

 

[TL4S]

I’m a little confused by his route back to his car (assuming BG left through the cemetery). The muddy/bloody man was spotted on W 300 N, and from looking at online maps he absolutely would be - that stretch of land is almost ludicrously open.

And yet to reach his car, he also had to have passed the parking spot where the girls were dropped off, and then the camera at Hoosiers, and there is no evidence he was spotted or recorded at either location. Did he move into the tree line at/before those points?

This question has probably already been answered, but is there a reason he couldn’t have stayed in the trees all the way from the crime scene back to his car?

Well, we do know that L's father called her at 3:11, got to the trail parking at 3:14, and after not getting a hold of her, entered the trails to look for them. Originally, I figured the killer to be gone before L's father's call at 3:11, but after the PCA, my impression is the killer was with them longer than that, so now I have been curious if L's phone ringing at 3:11 maybe prompted her to tell him that her dad was there looking for them. She could have hoped that would spook him off. IMO, if this did happen, he likely killed them soon after that call.

It makes sense to me because then the killer would have had reason to avoid the entire trail and park area, knowing a father was there looking for his daughter and her friend, and maybe going to the bridge, or off trail to do so. The killer could have exited out the cemetery, or any point from the woods east (as far as RL's) or west (as far as west of Hoosier Harvestore, but that would have taken him awfully close to the trails) and crossed to the north side of the street to avoid the parking lot across from Mears (where L's father was parked), and all the buildings between that lot and the CPS lot. We don't know if he was seen on the Harvestore cameras, but it certainly wasn't listed in the PCA.

I don't know if I'm making it very clear, but I feel like the killer wanted greatly to avoid the entire trail area, including the woods that run along the trails, because he knew L's father (or other people in general) could spot him. But in order to get back to his car, he had to do something. Would he just walk the road? IDK...I think the field behind Harvestore makes the most sense, but even that would have brought attention to him...some guy walking through the field. My best guess, though.

 

[WildHuncher]

I’m a little confused by his route back to his car (assuming BG left through the cemetery). The muddy/bloody man was spotted on W 300 N, and from looking at online maps he absolutely would be - that stretch of land is almost ludicrously open.

And yet to reach his car, he also had to have passed the parking spot where the girls were dropped off, and then the camera at Hoosiers, and there is no evidence he was spotted or recorded at either location. Did he move into the tree line at/before those points?

This question has probably already been answered, but is there a reason he couldn’t have stayed in the trees all the way from the crime scene back to his car?

Good question. Hard to know without trying it, which might involve a bit of trespassing. MOO

 

[mrjitty]

Well, we do know that L's father called her at 3:11, got to the trail parking at 3:14, and after not getting a hold of her, entered the trails to look for them. Originally, I figured the killer to be gone before L's father's call at 3:11, but after the PCA, my impression is the killer was with them longer than that, so now I have been curious if L's phone ringing at 3:11 maybe prompted her to tell him that her dad was there looking for them. She could have hoped that would spook him off. IMO, if this did happen, he likely killed them soon after that call.

It makes sense to me because then the killer would have had reason to avoid the entire trail and park area, knowing a father was there looking for his daughter and her friend, and maybe going to the bridge, or off trail to do so. The killer could have exited out the cemetery, or any point from the woods east (as far as RL's) or west (as far as west of Hoosier Harvestore, but that would have taken him awfully close to the trails) and crossed to the north side of the street to avoid the parking lot across from Mears (where L's father was parked), and all the buildings between that lot and the CPS lot. We don't know if he was seen on the Harvestore cameras, but it certainly wasn't listed in the PCA.

I don't know if I'm making it very clear, but I feel like the killer wanted greatly to avoid the entire trail area, including the woods that run along the trails, because he knew L's father (or other people in general) could spot him. But in order to get back to his car, he had to do something. Would he just walk the road? IDK...I think the field behind Harvestore makes the most sense, but even that would have brought attention to him...some guy walking through the field. My best guess, though.

This is a good theory!

 

[mrjitty]

Murder Sheet also discussed something we've mentioned before - that the PCA does not appear to disclose enough PC for the search warrant. PC for search warrants needs to be fresh i,e, you need grounds to believe there is evidence of the crime at the location today based on timely intel.

So I wonder if they also have something else, or potentially, the PCA came from his police interview - e.g. he could not explain things well enough, and that created sufficient suspicion for PC e.g that they would find the murder weapon or bloody clothes at his house.

I tend to agree there must be something more there, that isn't in the PCA,

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

the defense is probably in this forum

Most definitely! Which is why, IMO, we should watch what we say on the this thread.

I think it's too late to close the barn door and we aren't going to now influence/impact the case for the prosecution or defense with anything said here. For years it's been passionately argued that various people are responsible for the murders. Some have given lists of "evidence" as to why each should be the suspect. And some are now maintaining that RA had assistance from RL, KK, and/or TK. Podcasters have claimed to have inside sources and that LE was building a case (only) against KK/TK, and arrest was coming soon after the river search. I don't think any of this will affect a trial, even if the defense uses the argument that they just couldn't pin it on the real suspects.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Is there a source that states phones with IMEI can’t be tracked or is this speculation? Prior links stated different service providers just use different technology, nothing about traceable vs untraceable. And often it’s the app that is tracked as opposed to the actual cellphone (ie google). If tracking via cell tower dump is used, the cellphone has to ping with the tower leaving a record of such or it wouldn’t be in service.

How to Track a Phone Using an IMEI Number Online – AirDroid

Have you tried to locate your lost Android phone or iPhone to no avail? Here are tried and tested methods you can use to track your lost phone using the IMEI number.

www.airdroid.com

I didn't say that phones with IMEI cannot be tracked. I'm saying I think they can be tracked by using the IMEI number and that may be why his does not have one. He possibly removed it?

It was also being said that it determined whether you are using Verizon or AT&T. I believe that's only partially true because mine unlocked, it has IMEI but I can use either = GSM or CDMA

 

[EOA]

Why are you giving the defense ideas?

Respectfully, I do not look at any counter-posts as giving the defense ideas or automatically implying that's in favor of the defendant. The defense's job is to cast doubt - and I find it much easier to cast subjective doubt than show positive proof, unless the prosecution has rock-solid DNA, video, motive, etc kind of proof. Especially if the prosecution's strategy is to accumulate multiple pieces of circumstantial, or less-than-100%ideal, evidence to paint the 98% guilty picture.

Maybe analyze the counter-posts as - Prosecution considers certain paths of questioning and then, after reading counter-posts here on WS decides... hmm maybe yes they could successfully shoot holes in that argument so let's re-calibrate with different wording or different approach - thus the counter-posts at this stage work to benefit the Prosecution not pursuing fruitless efforts. Though certainly one could post counter-arguments here such that they aren't convinced yet beyond a shadow of doubt that RA is the guy and would rather just get the right perp(s) instead of just locking someone up.

 

[Barbieshell]

If the crime photos end up online, I will be extremely upset. Especially knowing the likes of KK have a habit of searching for images such as this for their sick fantasies.

I think he's talking about the clothes in the water rather than the actual bodies, either way he's a despicable piece of crap. This is the same dude that's written a book apparently with the premise that Ron Logan was BG ffs.