IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #164

[girlhasnoname]

You have more faith in the system than I do. I'm not convinced it was a "complete fabrication." I wish we could have heard the exact words the prison officials said about his treatment. Did they say 'it was all fabricated' or did they say 'RA has clean clothes, etc'?

If he was treated as his atty stated, how likely is it that the prison officials would admit it?

See my Joshua McLemore thread and know why I have deep concerns about how prisoners are sometimes kept. This is an awful case.

IN Joshua McLemore, 29, Died After 20 Days in Solitary Confinement at Jackson Co. Jail 08/ 2021. Fed. Lawsuit Filed

LE was called to his home for a welfare check. They ended up taking him to the hospital, where he pulled the nurse's hair, resulting in an arrest. It went downhill from there. There are truly disturbing pictures at this link...

www.websleuths.com

I believe it is part of the spin from the Defense in order to help paint the picture of a mentally ill man whose 5 confessions to killing Abby & Libby could not be believed.

<snipped>
Galipeau testified to Allen’s conditions at the Westville Correctional Facility.

He explained that while it was evident that Allen had lost weight, he had been eating, showering and utilizing recreation time at the prison.

Allen is housed in A-pod, according to Galipeau, which is the same cell he has been in since the day he arrived at the facility. That cell was described as being 12’ by 8.5’ and is in the segregated, maximum-security section of the prison.

Because of his location, Allen has been on watch since the day he arrived and due to his additional ‘suicide watch’ status, he has 24-hour surveillance video (without audio), according to Galipeau. He is also on companion watch, which means that someone – either an inmate or a guard – stands outside of his cell 24 hours per day.

Allen is allowed three showers per week and three sets of clothing. He also has access to commissary, where he has bought clothing, socks and shoes, Galipeau told the judge. He also has a tablet, which accesses music, movies and phone calls and he is afforded 1 hour of recreation time, five times per week.

Testimony: Richard Allen made incriminating statements in jail

MOO

 

[Salah11]

I know when the pages drop im gonna come back to 35 pages on here.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I believe it is part of the spin from the Defense in order to help paint the picture of a mentally ill man whose 5 confessions to killing Abby & Libby could not be believed.

<snipped>
Galipeau testified to Allen’s conditions at the Westville Correctional Facility.

He explained that while it was evident that Allen had lost weight, he had been eating, showering and utilizing recreation time at the prison.

Allen is housed in A-pod, according to Galipeau, which is the same cell he has been in since the day he arrived at the facility. That cell was described as being 12’ by 8.5’ and is in the segregated, maximum-security section of the prison.

Because of his location, Allen has been on watch since the day he arrived and due to his additional ‘suicide watch’ status, he has 24-hour surveillance video (without audio), according to Galipeau. He is also on companion watch, which means that someone – either an inmate or a guard – stands outside of his cell 24 hours per day.

Allen is allowed three showers per week and three sets of clothing. He also has access to commissary, where he has bought clothing, socks and shoes, Galipeau told the judge. He also has a tablet, which accesses music, movies and phone calls and he is afforded 1 hour of recreation time, five times per week.

Testimony: Richard Allen made incriminating statements in jail

MOO

You could be right about RA's atty's claims. We can probably debate it endlessly.

If it was our loved one who was sent to prison and held in solitary confinement before having a trial, do you think most of us would be ok with that?

 

[Salah11]

You could be right about RA's atty's claims. We can probably debate it endlessly.

If it was our loved one who was sent to prison and held in solitary confinement before having a trial, do you think most of us would be ok with that?

Yes if it’s was a crime like this that involved minors and was for their own protection.

Let’s not forget what he has been charged with here. It doesn’t get much higher on the spectrum for crimes imo

 

[rebelchild]

You could be right about RA's atty's claims. We can probably debate it endlessly.

If it was our loved one who was sent to prison and held in solitary confinement before having a trial, do you think most of us would be ok with that?

As for me personally .. I would be thankful that my loved one was in solitary so I didn't worry constantly about someone else hurting him while he was awaiting trial. I've heard so many stories about prison, I think that would be my biggest concern. MOO

 

[Falling Down]

You could be right about RA's atty's claims. We can probably debate it endlessly.

If it was our loved one who was sent to prison and held in solitary confinement before having a trial, do you think most of us would be ok with that?

Westville is a really bad prison, I've met folks who did time there. It opened in 1945 as an asylum, and then was transformed into a prison by 1979. The conditions folks live in within some parts of the facility are horrific, IMO. Where Allen is probably rates as the better or best part of the prison.

People who are what I'd describe as frequent flyers in IN prisons and jails don't mind it much, basically to them even Westville would be considered a party atmosphere among inmates in general population.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Westville is a really bad prison, I've met folks who did time there. It opened in 1945 as an asylum, and then was transformed into a prison by 1979. The conditions folks live in within some parts of the facility are horrific, IMO. Where Allen is probably rates as the better or best part of the prison.

People who are what I'd describe as frequent flyers in IN prisons and jails don't mind it much, basically to them even Westville would be considered a party atmosphere among inmates in general population.

Can you describe the worst part of a really bad prison?

I've seen the lengthy criminal records of people who obviously don't mind being in prison. I asked a fellow once why he kept doing things that would send him back. He said he didn't mind going back; he had more friends on the inside, he knew what was expected of him and didn't have all the pressure of keeping a job and supporting his family.

But that's not RA. There's a county jail that can take good care of him and IMO, that's where he belongs. There's no reason for him to be in prison.

 

[Falling Down]

No need to apologize - there is nothing to apologize about. When it comes to this case frustration is the normal emotion, unfortunately. I don’t even want to imagine what Abby's & Libby’s families go through. I’m sure it does not get better or does not lessen or go away for them. A pain that is there forever.

I’ve been around this case since day one but didn’t stick around for long because I never had a good feeling about Indiana LE and the handling of the case. A lot of lurking. Of course I know nothing about how LE handle cases but my gut feeling told me differently. Yes, there were red flags with how LE handled this case.

The judge gave a sorry excuse. You’re on par and I agree with your comments. Judge needed to do better for the taxpayers. I am grateful for Kevin Greenlee, Esq and MS.

Yes! Abby & Libby are the most important children in this case. I agree with you 100% and thank you for posting their photo. MSM choses to post RA pics over Abby & Libby - the victims. It’s about Abby & Libby, two young girls who took a simple trail walk-on a day off from school and who lives ended so tragically. Senseless. What a sad world we live in that these children never made it back home.

All moo

I knew the April 2019 PC was a hail mary pass by LE. In 2017 and 2018 I looked at hundreds of cases here in IN and in surrounding states, nothing came even close to this one in victim stats and location. So I was convinced the perp was local. Why the FBI comandeered over 6,000 digital billboards to spread awareness of the case is beyond me, LE efforts should have been directed inwards towards Delphi and the surrounding countryside and all eyewitness accounts should have been scrutinized and leads followed. It's plainly obvious that didn't happen.

My opinion of local and state LE and their handling of this case at this point is they royally screwed up right out of the gate. They not only had RA saying he was there, when he told a DNR officer the day after the murders, LE sat on vehicle descriptions, while simultaneously asking the public if they had seen any vehicles parked at the abandoned county building. Why ask if anyone had seen a vehicle parked there, when you already have surveillance video of vehicles driving on C.R. 300, which gets light traffic anyway? IIRC, this was two years after the murders.

At this point I just want justice served, like many I went down endless rabbit holes, when the perp was right there in Delphi and LE had dropped a huge ball by not investigating him. The sensationalism and secrecy in this case has been nauseating.

JMO

 

[photographer4]

You could be right about RA's atty's claims. We can probably debate it endlessly.

If it was our loved one who was sent to prison and held in solitary confinement before having a trial, do you think most of us would be ok with that?

If he was accused of murdering two young children? YES. I'm alright with that, even without the conviction. Why? Because that is what is probably keeping him from being KILLED by fellow inmates.

 

[FrostedGlass]

If he was accused of murdering two young children? YES. I'm alright with that, even without the conviction. Why? Because that is what is probably keeping him from being KILLED by fellow inmates.

Well then, if he's convicted he's dead, too. If he was your loved one, I'd think you would want him close where you could visit often and keep your eye on things.

Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?

 

[CGBSpender]

Well then, if he's convicted he's dead, too. If he was your loved one, I'd think you would want him close where you could visit often and keep your eye on things.

Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?

Didn't an official from Cass County testify that they don't want him either? I can't really blame them if they don't want him. I don't think any officials want to be in the hot seat if something happens to him on their watch prior to trial.

It would have to be a place where he could be housed in a room alone, so as to protect him from other inmates and/or street drugs...either of which could be deadly to him.

I don't know that many local County jails in Indiana have much experience with the logistics of protecting a high-profile inmate that requires extreme isolation measures for his protection. Certain State facilities, although not ideal...are probably better equipped to do the job. Certain State facilities may also have more in-house medical resources available....this would possibly limit him having to be transported to an outside facility for those needs given the length of time he is likely to be housed.

 

[photographer4]

Well then, if he's convicted he's dead, too. If he was your loved one, I'd think you would want him close where you could visit often and keep your eye on things.

Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?

Nope. I don't think I'd visit him at all if he was accused of murdering two kids. I'd be nauseated at the idea of it to be honest.

I don't know enough about any of the other jails or what may make them better or worse for the accused to answer your second questions fairly. But no, I'm not curious as to why they won't let him go there - it seems as though he is fine where he is.

 

[CGBSpender]

I knew the April 2019 PC was a hail mary pass by LE. In 2017 and 2018 I looked at hundreds of cases here in IN and in surrounding states, nothing came even close to this one in victim stats and location. So I was convinced the perp was local. Why the FBI comandeered over 6,000 digital billboards to spread awareness of the case is beyond me, LE efforts should have been directed inwards towards Delphi and the surrounding countryside and all eyewitness accounts should have been scrutinized and leads followed. It's plainly obvious that didn't happen.

My opinion of local and state LE and their handling of this case at this point is they royally screwed up right out of the gate. They not only had RA saying he was there, when he told a DNR officer the day after the murders, LE sat on vehicle descriptions, while simultaneously asking the public if they had seen any vehicles parked at the abandoned county building. Why ask if anyone had seen a vehicle parked there, when you already have surveillance video of vehicles driving on C.R. 300, which gets light traffic anyway? IIRC, this was two years after the murders.

At this point I just want justice served, like many I went down endless rabbit holes, when the perp was right there in Delphi and LE had dropped a huge ball by not investigating him. The sensationalism and secrecy in this case has been nauseating.

JMO

One theory I have on the billboards...is that...at least one informant (I use that term loosely because I find their credibility questionable) who is alleged to have provided information used to support a search warrant...appears to have been in another State on the run from a local LE arrest warrant at the time. I think it is possible the billboards brought folks out of the woodwork from other places with information not necessarily about the crime...but who were willing to put up historical information (whether true or not) about people in Delphi....and that information could have helped with obtaining search warrants. I also think the billboards were maybe a way to solicit people even within the State to contact the FBI, who were maybe not comfortable speaking to State or local LE for whatever reason.

JMO

 

[M. Kay]

"Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?"
Okay, since it is Frosted Glass asking, I'm curious. (Besides, what else is there to do here today on 'document-release-we-hope' watch?)

 

[CGBSpender]

Nope. I don't think I'd visit him at all if he was accused of murdering two kids. I'd be nauseated at the idea of it to be honest.

I don't know enough about any of the other jails or what may make them better or worse for the accused to answer your second questions fairly. But no, I'm not curious as to why they won't let him go there - it seems as though he is fine where he is.

You raise a good point...who's to say he doesn't need protection from "loved ones" as well? If I believed my "loved one" took part in a heinous crime such as this...I wouldn't just be nauseated...I'd be furious.

Imagine if a spouse comes to believe at some point that their partner took part in a terrible crime like that...realizing your entire marriage has been a lie, and you never really knew that other person who just used you and ruined your life? I'm no psychology expert, but feeling violent might not be an abnormal response for someone in that position.

JMO

 

[Niner]

"Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?"
Okay, since it is Frosted Glass asking, I'm curious. (Besides, what else is there to do here today on 'document-release-we-hope' watch?)

from notes -

6/15/23 Update: Among the topics expected to be discussed in Thursday's hearing are: Defense's motion to throw out ballistics evidence in the case. Setting a trial date. A request to move Allen from a maximum security prison to a jail for mental and physical health reasons & expert witness approval. The Judge said she will not be deciding on a motion to dismiss key ballistic evidence today. The defense called their 4 witnesses to the stand to testify on moving Allen. Former Carroll County Sheriff Tobe Leazenby, Carroll County Sheriff’s Office, Max Baker, an intern for attorney Rozzi’s office, Gary Lewis from Westfield Correctional Facility. Cass County Sheriff Ed Shroder. The State called to the stand Carroll County Sheriff Tony Liggett & from the Westville Correctional Facility Captain John Galipeau.
Allen’s attorney said he made “incriminating statements,” linking him to the Delphi murders. The prosecutor agreed, saying that he made an “admission.” However, Allen’s attorney said that the incriminating statements couldn’t be trusted because of his current mental state. The State will be calling two witnesses after lunch. One or both witnesses will be testifying to ADMISSIONS OF GUILT allegedly made by RA while being detained. Prosecution & defense both referenced “incriminating statements” Allen allegedly made in prison. Prosecutor said Allen “confessed 5 or 6 times to killing the girls.” Defense team says the vague statements are inconsistent with Allen’s previous statements. The 'confessions' came from conversations that he had with people thru the tablet he uses.
for more info see posts #719 [pg 36], 721, 722, 726 to 729, 731 & 733, 735 & 737 [pg 37], 744, 745, 749, 753, 754, 756 & 769 [pg 38], 767 & 774 [pg 39], 787, 790 & 796 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ers-richard-allen-arrested-163.673635/page-40

 

[FrostedGlass]

Didn't an official from Cass County testify that they don't want him either? I can't really blame them if they don't want him. I don't think any officials want to be in the hot seat if something happens to him on their watch prior to trial.

It would have to be a place where he could be housed in a room alone, so as to protect him from other inmates and/or street drugs...either of which could be deadly to him.

I don't know that many local County jails in Indiana have much experience with the logistics of protecting a high-profile inmate that requires extreme isolation measures for his protection. Certain State facilities, although not ideal...are probably better equipped to do the job. Certain State facilities may also have more in-house medical resources available....this would possibly limit him having to be transported to an outside facility for those needs given the length of time he is likely to be housed.

While Cass Co. did say that they didn't want him, they said they would take him if the judge ordered it.

Off hand, I know of 2 counties who have the ability to isolate prisoners: Elkhart and Jackson. I've never looked into if every county has the ability to isolate an inmate.

 

[FrostedGlass]

@Niner From your notes: The State will be calling two witnesses after lunch. One or both witnesses will be testifying to ADMISSIONS OF GUILT allegedly made by RA while being detained. Did you happen to get the names of those witnesses?

 

[StarryStarryNight]

RA is where he is to keep him safe. He is in danger from other inmates and he is on suicide watch. He receives health and mental health services when he needs it. He is not being mistreated in any way per the last hearing; not sleeping on the floor in a dog kennel and being beaten relentlessly on a daily basis like a POW. How the defense gets away with this misleading, lying rhetoric. No perjury for them I guess. I don’t care personally where he is, I do want him treated well which is happening now.
The question was what I would want if a loved one was accused and jailed like this. First I would be shocked, appalled, angry, sad, tearful, embarrassed, a ton of emotions. Even if I thought they were guilty I would support them, but quietly out of respect for the victims. I would want them to be treated well, just like RA. One thing I wouldn’t be doing is demanding they be moved just for my convenience. I would allow the justice system to do what they needed to do and I would adjust to it.

 

[FrostedGlass]

"Aren't you even the least bit curious why they won't let him go to Cass Co. jail?"
Okay, since it is Frosted Glass asking, I'm curious. (Besides, what else is there to do here today on 'document-release-we-hope' watch?)

This might satisfy our curiosity if we could see it:
04/14/2023 = Response Filed
State of Indiana files Response to Defense's Emergency Motion to Modify Safekeeping Order.
Filed By: State of Indiana

You could join me in patiently waiting for Murder Sheet to drop a podcast telling us all about Robert Baston.