IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #167

[sunshineray]

I don’t have any idea about ballistics. But do have a question about marks from ejecting. Given the bullet from the scene was ejected from a gun six years ago, would the same gun make the same marks all this time later? Let’s say the gun had been used regularly- perhaps this usage would wear the chamber somewhat? Could this Invalidate the bulls tics evidence?

Good question. I look forward to hearing about this, new to me, side of ballistics, in the courtroom.

 

[girlhasnoname]

RA will plea.

If the State offers one, I agree.

 

[FromGermany1]

Taking it one step further...my tin foil hat theory is that LE would rather people assume that conflict means rift...because conflict(s) of interest might tip LE's hand somehow on something related to the investigation that LE wants/needs kept confidential.

I would like to know the exact conflict. Btw: Is the FBI neutral and the ISP "pro" Indiana?

 

[girlhasnoname]

<modsnip - off topic>

RA = BG = GUILTY of 2 counts of kidnapping and murder.

I think we the public will be shocked at the totality of evidence against RA when this goes to trial, which won't be in Jan '24 IMO.

I want RA to pay (and any other person involved in any way, if there is one) for his crimes against these 2 innocent girls.

MOO

#Justice4Abby&Libby

 

[CGBSpender]

I would like to know the exact conflict. Btw: Is the FBI neutral and the ISP "pro" Indiana?

No, just different jurisdictions (See: https://www.fbi.gov/investigate). The FBI is a federal agency (investigates Federal crimes), and ISP is a state agency (investigates State crimes). It isn't unusual for them to help each other out with cases that fall under the jurisdiction of one or the other. There was some speculation by folks on the internet that the FBI was initially interested in the Delphi case because they were working a certain cross border cybercrime case under their own jurisdiction at the time, that they may have thought was related (it was not related as far as I know and the perp in that case was apprehended in another State).

JMO

 

[sunshineray]

I would like to know the exact conflict. Btw: Is the FBI neutral and the ISP "pro" Indiana?

My guess would be that KAK/anthony_shots universe had something to do with it?

 

[Bergmann]

<modsnip - off topic>

RA = BG = GUILTY of 2 counts of kidnapping and murder.

I think we the public will be shocked at the totality of evidence against RA when this goes to trial, which won't be in Jan '24 IMO.

I want RA to pay (and any other person involved in any way, if there is one) for his crimes against these 2 innocent girls.

MOO

#Justice4Abby&Libby

<modsnip - off topic>

All I hope is that the whole truth comes out as part of this, as the truth is what underpins justice.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Looking through the document dump, IMO, the SW confirms what a lot of people thought about BG's footwear: that he was wearing boots. Of all the items they took, shoes and undergarments are not listed among them. The only footwear listed are boots. They apparently didn't find the black Carhartt jacket with a hood. I wonder if the blue one also had a hood. Pg 117

I also came across NMcL's statement regarding the times of the search:
Pg 105: #19 ...executed the SW around 5 pm and the search was complete around 7:09 pm
Pg 109: Diener signed the SW at 6:37 pm
Pg 115: Liggett confirms he executed the SW on Oct. 13 @ 7:09 pm
Pg 116-120: Property Records and Receipts 10/13 @ 1900 , 21:47 and 10:14 @ 13:54

Doc Dump:

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

 

[mrjitty]

The only things I thought were interesting/new in the latest murdersheet review with defence attorney

1. much of the Odinist stuff is likely inadmissible at trial

2. the timeline is problematic for the defence - so they likely need to put RA on the stand. Otherwise how else do they 'prove' he left at 1.30

3. All the westville/odinist guards stuff should have come up at the last hearing - so questionable why it is coming up now when they already lost that motion

BTL - feels like they simply constructed a new excuse for the confession when the mental health one failed

 

[zh0r4]

I also came across NMcL's statement regarding the times of the search:
Pg 105: #19 ...executed the SW around 5 pm and the search was complete around 7:09 pm
Pg 109: Diener signed the SW at 6:37 pm
Pg 115: Liggett confirms he executed the SW on Oct. 13 @ 7:09 pm

I’m confused. The initial comment on p.105 states the SW was executed around 5pm and the search was complete around 7:09pm, but the judge didn’t sign the SW until 6:37pm. Does this mean between 5-6:37pm they were executing an unauthorized SW? Then Liggett confirms he executed (I assume this means began?) the SW @ 7:09pm, when the other statement says it was completed? Or am I misunderstanding?

 

[FrostedGlass]

I’m confused. The initial comment on p.105 states the SW was executed around 5pm and the search was complete around 7:09pm, but the judge didn’t sign the SW until 6:37pm. Does this mean between 5-6:37pm they were executing an unauthorized SW? Then Liggett confirms he executed (I assume this means began?) the SW @ 7:09pm, when the other statement says it was completed? Or am I misunderstanding?

I've never understood the difference in NMcL's times and the times noted and served by Diener and Liggett. Some of the witness (to the search) statements didn't agree, either. I don't have those handy. The receipts seem to agree with Diener's and Liggett's times.
1900 hrs = 7 pm. 21:47 hrs = 9:47 pm

 

[girlhasnoname]

I've never understood the difference in NMcL's times and the times noted and served by Diener and Liggett. Some of the witness (to the search) statements didn't agree, either. I don't have those handy. The receipts seem to agree with Diener's and Liggett's times.
1900 hrs = 7 pm. 21:47 hrs = 9:47 pm

Wasn't there an additional SW that they had to wait on? I seem to be recalling they made their first search and then had to wait until they got another one signed off on (maybe to tow the car?)

Or I could just be dreaming all this because this case has sucked the life out of me lately. Ha

MOO

 

[FrostedGlass]

Wasn't there an additional SW that they had to wait on? I seem to be recalling they made their first search and then had to wait until they got another one signed off on (maybe to tow the car?)

Or I could just be dreaming all this because this case has sucked the life out of me lately. Ha

MOO

That sounds familiar but I don't know if it's true. I've only seen one SW and it lists the car so I don't know why they would need another one.

This receipt is for the car but we don't know anything about it from the time they took it until the time shown. I assume that would be on the Chain of Custody sheet.
Pg 116-120: Property Records and Receipts 10/13 @ 1900 , 21:47 and 10/14 @ 13:54

I still have some life left in me but my brain is giving up the ghost.

 

[Boxer]

Wasn't there an additional SW that they had to wait on? I seem to be recalling they made their first search and then had to wait until they got another one signed off on (maybe to tow the car?)

Or I could just be dreaming all this because this case has sucked the life out of me lately. Ha

MOO

Wasn't the first SW about stolen tools?

 

[girlhasnoname]

There were 2 searches on RA's property and one on his vehicle:

<snipped & BBM> I didn't include all the items found for the sake of copyright rules.

The search, which court documents show began just after 7 p.m. on Oct. 13, 2022, yielded numerous weapons including a gun and several knives (which have been bolded below). Clothing, electronics and shoes were also seized by ISP.

In total, over 75 items were taken by police during two separate searches of Allen’s home on Oct. 13. The first search, which began at 7:09 p.m., yielded the following:

<snipped & BBM>

Later into the night of Oct. 13, around 9:45 p.m., police returned to the 1900 block of Whiteman Drive for a second search.

<snipped & BBM>

The search warrants continued the following day on Oct. 14, 2022, when ISP troopers searched a Ford Focus at ISP District 14’s post in West Lafayette. The search, which docs show occurred around 2 p.m., yielded three items:

Boots, knives and car carpeting: What police seized from Delphi murder suspect’s home

 

[steeltowngirl]

2. the timeline is problematic for the defence - so they likely need to put RA on the stand. Otherwise how else do they 'prove' he left at 1.30

Unless RA has a solid alibi for his whereabouts from 1:30 - 3:30 on 2/13/17, I would not expect him to take the stand. I would like to see the LE interviews with him. We know that the initial interview with the DNR CO was informal and later misplaced. We have heard that RA said in that interview that he was on the trail from 1.30 pm to 3.30 pm.

Do we know if the October 13, 2022 interview was taped?

 

[FrostedGlass]

Looking at Liggett's Affidavit for the SW, he doesn't include the car. He lists handguns, ammo, electronic devices, including cell phones. Diener included the auto in the SW.

Why didn't they take his wife's panties and socks? Shouldn't they have been on the list?

 

[girlhasnoname]

Looking at Liggett's Affidavit for the SW, he doesn't include the car. He lists handguns, ammo, electronic devices, including cell phones. Diener included the auto in the SW.

Why didn't they take his wife's panties and socks? Shouldn't they have been on the list?

Are you thinking they should have taken the wife's undergarments because of what they found at the scene?

 

[mrjitty]

Unless RA has a solid alibi for his whereabouts from 1:30 - 3:30 on 2/13/17, I would not expect him to take the stand. I would like to see the LE interviews with him. We know that the initial interview with the DNR CO was informal and later misplaced. We have heard that RA said in that interview that he was on the trail from 1.30 pm to 3.30 pm.

Do we know if the October 13, 2022 interview was taped?

What the Public Defender MS interviewed was getting at is that the 1.30-3.30 pm note is the contemporaneous record. Sure you can attack it at trial. e.g why wasn't it on tape, other mistakes in the note... but at the end of the day, to dispute the time, only RA can do this

The prosecution meanwhile will call the note taker, and point to multiple corroborating data points as to the noted time being correct.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Are you thinking they should have taken the wife's undergarments because of what they found at the scene?

Yes; on second thought, though, she surely would have noticed if there were strange ones mixed in with hers.

But still, I'm surprised undergarments weren't on the list of items to search for. Why would they leave missing items off?