IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #54

[WebSight]

"Also in her blood was a knack for photography, a passion her mother also shared.

Abby would run off with her mom’s camera when they were at weddings or other events.

She loved the outdoors and had an eye for the world around her, finding details most would miss.

“I do have pictures when she was little and our friend had a beautiful garden and I let her take it. It occurred to me how much at a foot and a half shorter – how different she did see things,” said Anna.

Abby’s last photo would feature her on the majestic Monon High Bridge, enjoying another of her and her best friend’s favorite things to do."

http://www.theindychannel.com/longform/delphi-daughters-the-untold-story-of-abby-libby

I wonder if Abbey had her mum's camera with her that tragic day. It makes sense that Abbey would take photos on her mum's camera if she didn't have a mobile phone.

BBM I have always wondered that myself. It seems to me that two girls really into photography who, according to Mike Patty, went to the trail that day to "take pictures" would have a camera or at least a tablet (my daughters have tablets that take stunning pictures) with them to do just that.

I have often also wondered if a camera / tablet is one of the missing pieces of the puzzle (evidence) that LE has been looking for.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

BBM

"For them to get from there to all the way here with that rough territory they had to walk, you couldn’t carry them in a million years or drag them or drop them off,” said Logan. “They had to walk.”

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...e-bodies-of-two-missing-teen-girls-were-found

 

[Idareyato]

Somewhere in these 54 threads (it was a while ago) there was an exceptionally useful post by a member who does have a SAR dog and who does take part in SAR.
He/she explains in detail that having a SAR dog doesn't mean that said dog will simply lead you to a body just because it's in the vicinity. There are loads of variables. It's not an exact science, and these dogs - incredible as they are - are not robots that are guaranteed to find whatever it is they need to find.

You may know an answer for this--the estimated time to deliver a dog specifically trained to a location. It isn't as easy as Pizza. Variables depend on other cases, the last use of the dogs, how far away, etc. I do see the quick recovery with that advantage. I can only guess people were posted at specific points after midnight and to 5 a.m..in case they appeared, like at an all-night gas station, trail heads, center square...

 

[whiskers]

I'm not sure why people tend to believe Abby didn't have a phone. Is it because LE only talks about Libby's phone?

Abby spent that Sunday night at Libby's house. I wouldn't be surprised if she texted her mom to check in from time to time while she was away. Many 13 year olds have their own phones- especially if all of their friends have one.

High probability Abby had her own phone.

 

[Shiressleuth]

i agree. i think they were looking for something specific in their search. I would not be surprised if their was a SW for RL's phone as well.

He was seen using it on camera so I don't think they would need a SW for that would they? MOO.

 

[Idareyato]

I'm not sure why people tend to believe Abby didn't have a phone. Is it because LE only talks about Libby's phone?

Abby spent that Sunday night at Libby's house. I wouldn't be surprised if she texted her mom to check in from time to time while she was away. Many 13 year olds have their own phones- especially if all of their friends have one.

High probability Abby had her own phone.

I have heard no mention made of Abby's phone. A question mark...????

 

[Jo in Calif]

He was seen using it on camera so I don't think they would need a SW for that would they? MOO.

IMO Yes, if they were wanting to ck ping times. Phone prob wouldn't show that.

 

[Shiressleuth]

You may know an answer for this--the estimated time to deliver a dog specifically trained to a location. It isn't as easy as Pizza. Variables depend on other cases, the last use of the dogs, how far away, etc. I do see the quick recovery with that advantage. I can only guess people were posted at specific points after midnight and to 5 a.m..in case they appeared, like at an all-night gas station, trail heads, center square...

And I believe SAR dogs and cadaver dogs are different with SAR tracking a live scent so they would not necessarily find a dead body IMO.

 

[HockeyMom330]

Were there other photos taken/posted by the girls that day besides the one of Abby on the bridge at 2:07pm? It seems odd to me that if the girls were there for the purpose of taking photos (and I'm not suggesting that they weren't) that there wouldn't have been more photos from between 1:00pm and 2:07pm. Most teens are constantly taking selfies and posting updates to their SM accounts.

 

[Idareyato]

And I believe SAR dogs and cadaver dogs are different with SAR tracking a live scent so they would not necessarily find a dead body IMO.

For an SAR dog to be following a live scent here is valid---cadaver dogs are for decomposition, very little having taken place in this occurrence. I would guess clothing would suffice.

 

[whiskers]

Were there other photos taken/posted by the girls that day besides the one of Abby on the bridge at 2:07pm? It seems odd to me that if the girls were there for the purpose of taking photos (and I'm not suggesting that they weren't) that there wouldn't have been more photos from between 1:00pm and 2:07pm. Most teens are constantly taking selfies and posting updates to their SM accounts.

That's a good question. But maybe they planned to post them later if cell reception was slow.

 

[whiskers]

I have heard no mention made of Abby's phone. A question mark...????

Mike Patty is the one who mentioned Libby's phone, but Abby's mother hasn't spoken to the press as much.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

For an SAR dog to be following a live scent here is valid---cadaver dogs are for decomposition, very little having taken place in this occurrence. I would guess clothing would suffice.

Thread #38 Post #67

finine

Registered User


My husband volunteered several years ago with a local SAR team with our German Shepherd. SAR dogs are trained to search on a specific scent and this would follow a trail to that person (if it exists), or to the end of the scent trail. Typically what happens is that an item from the missing person is placed into a ziploc bag and then the ziploc bag is opened and the dog sniffs it. If there is a scent trail from that person, the dog should be able to find and follow it. SAR dogs are not trained to identify the scent of decomposing flesh, that is what cadaver dogs do.

 

[Etilema]

According to the petition to seal the autopsies, both girls were murdered on the 13th.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-47&p=13298390#post13298390

THANK YOU for this definitive info.

 

[Scout12]

Random thought - sorry. I was just wondering if there was some gentler way of expressing victims bodies being taken and left somewhere rather than the term, "dumped." It always bothers me to read "his/her body was dumped..." Just seems like a poor word choice. Anyone have any ideas of another way that could be expressed?

 

[JudgeJudi]

According to the petition to seal the autopsies, both girls were murdered on the 13th.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-47&p=13298390#post13298390

Thanks for that. What possible explanation can there be for her obituary to have a different date. All articles gave the date of death as the 13th. I'm simply amazed that there can be a mistake of this nature. Flabbergasted.

 

[Jax49]

THANK YOU for this definitive info.

Thank you and thanks to Beer for originally posting it.

It is about as definitive as can be, none of the "on or about" legal speak. moo

 

[MAVLEY]

"Also in her blood was a knack for photography, a passion her mother also shared.

Abby would run off with her mom’s camera when they were at weddings or other events.

She loved the outdoors and had an eye for the world around her, finding details most would miss.

“I do have pictures when she was little and our friend had a beautiful garden and I let her take it. It occurred to me how much at a foot and a half shorter – how different she did see things,” said Anna.

Abby’s last photo would feature her on the majestic Monon High Bridge, enjoying another of her and her best friend’s favorite things to do."

http://www.theindychannel.com/longform/delphi-daughters-the-untold-story-of-abby-libby

I wonder if Abbey had her mum's camera with her that tragic day. It makes sense that Abbey would take photos on her mum's camera if she didn't have a mobile phone.

IMO I doubt the girls had set plans to go walking on the trail. I could be wrong but I know when I was that age my friends and I would get bored and go beg our parents to take us somewhere or do something. Their exploring could have been a spur of the moment idea. Also, if Abby was staying the night with Libby she most likely wouldn't have went back to her house first to get the camera. Also, if it was an expensive camera (I'm assuming) then mom probably didn't want Abby taking it to a friends house so it wouldn't get broke or lost.

 

[Jax49]

Thanks for that. What possible explanation can there be for her obituary to have a different date. All articles gave the date of death as the 13th. I'm simply amazed that there can be a mistake of this nature. Flabbergasted.

It was suggested earlier that some families use the date that the body was discovered.

 

[Idareyato]

I am sure many people are addressing their own grief with 'If we had only done this or that'. It is a dead-end alley. We all need to remember how unusual this crime was for Delphi, and realize the stakes involved in solving it could save another life. To learn from our mistakes is more important than criticism, especially now. No particular post or member prompted this message, it is just the discouragement we all feel reflected in our own thoughts. Libby was able to identify the best she could to point the finger at the suspect, and to overcome the fear of the moment was heroic on her part. Our part is to follow the lead in humility for her sake, so any other victims that surface might be saved.