IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #4

[BetteDavisEyes]

I agree about Chloe's mother being the one who should have been with her all the time on the cruise ship.

One thing I keep thinking about this case is the following:

SA is the father of Chloe's mother - correct? Because I have to wonder what his parenting skills were like. Hopefully sharper when he was a young father, compared to what he is like now.

SA is not the biological father of Chloe's mother. SA is Kim Weigand's stepfather - married to her mother but not a blood-relative. SA was Chloe's step-grandfather.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

SA is actually not a blood relative, he was a step-grandfather to Chloe. I don't know if he actually has any children.

I've also wondered whether SA was married previously - prior to his marriage to Kim's mother?

 

[they'll get you]

I’m sure the legal eagles have researched all his history, like any cruelty when he was young up till now.

I’m now looking beyond stupidity and towards sadism as just can’t get my head around what he did.

 

[SuziQ]

I’ve said this many times and will say it again...Anyone who has seen this video, whether family or lawyer, and still says SA is colorblind and didn’t know the window was open is flat-out lying. He clearly leaned through the window before picking up Chloe. They have no civil case and Puerto Rico has a slam dunk guilty verdict. Why are they keeping up this pretense?

I

I know right?!!!

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I’ve said this many times and will say it again...Anyone who has seen this video, whether family or lawyer, and still says SA is colorblind and didn’t know the window was open is flat-out lying. He clearly leaned through the window before picking up Chloe. They have no civil case and Puerto Rico has a slam dunk guilty verdict. Why are they keeping up this pretense?

I guess they figure they can fool some of the people some of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but they can't fool us!!

 

[Lilibet]

I’m sure the legal eagles have researched all his history, like any cruelty when he was young up till now.

I’m now looking beyond stupidity and towards sadism as just can’t get my head around what he did.

I think there are people who are thoughtlessly and stupidly cruel and sadistic without realizing their “fun” is going too far. Tickling children beyond the child saying “stop,” suddenly throwing them up in the air and catching them, etc. Maybe they liked those “games” as kids and think it’s just part of how you interact with little ones. But it really is cruel and sadistic to enjoy a child’s fear or discomfort. I suspect this is who SA is and that his scary “game” with Chloe was intended to be ”fun” but ended tragically.

I would feel better if he could just admit that what he was doing was wrong and take responsibility for it.

 

[SuziQ]

I think it is very possible, due to the angle of his body, that he sat Chloe on the window ledge. Then the back and forth motion that we saw him doing was him trying to pull Chloe back in. And also when his right arm was visible, he was maybe trying to brace himself on the safety rail to pull on her harder - with the left hand.

But likely her legs were dangling down, and maybe she was also leaning forward - meaning he had to lift her back in, and he couldn't physically do that from 18" away and the high safety rail between them. Then he lost his grip on Chloe.

Because Chloe was dressed in a swimsuit, there was not even a bunch of clothing material to grab to yank her back off the window ledge and into the ship.

what got me is from the behind video, you can see her head fall backwards
And then her little legs follow up in the air and she is gone. Kills me.

 

[SuziQ]

I think there are people who are thoughtlessly and stupidly cruel and sadistic without realizing their “fun” is going too far. Tickling children beyond the child saying “stop,” suddenly throwing them up in the air and catching them, etc. Maybe they liked those “games” as kids and think it’s just part of how you interact with little ones. But it really is cruel and sadistic to enjoy a child’s fear or discomfort. I suspect this is who SA is and that his scary “game” with Chloe was intended to be ”fun” but ended tragically.

I would feel better if he could just admit that what he was doing was wrong and take responsibility for it.

a version of Stockholm syndrome.

 

[MsMarple]

I believe RCCL has 20 days to answer to the civil suit under Florida Rules of Civil Procedure. That would put it at December 31 or the first business day around that time. So we might be hearing more about the case in the next couple of weeks.

SA's next court appearance is January 17, right?

At this point I doubt the family will withdraw the suit; if they do then they'll be responsible for all expenses incurred by the law firm so far and that could be pricey.

 

[BeachSky]

When I was onboard, for Chloe I sat and studied parents with children, I did not see one toddler unsupervised as all were being held on a hip. In fact I saw parents straddling their children while laying on a deck chair.
There are many people walking and looking around a new environment on the first day and are not looking down for children at foot, their eyes up and around.
Stupidity on all levels until he reached the window and then it became murderous.


.

I really appreciate the great photos and observations you post back to us!
I imagine it was not easy when you stood there & reflected on the reality of it all.

 

[SuziQ]

For those who have not seen it, here is a tour of the deck/area in question. We arrive outside at 0:31, and can very CLEARLY see which windows are open. (In case anyone actually believed he thought it was closed. lol) Stop at 1:22, and you get a good view out an open window, with the railing in the frame. You can see the distance between the railing and the window. In the leaked video, it's clear he lifted her over the railing and held her on, or outside of the window ledge.

.

thank you for sharing this. It can't be shared enough.

 

[SouthAussie]

what got me is from the behind video, you can see her head fall backwards
And then her little legs follow up in the air and she is gone. Kills me.

Maybe he did start to get her leaning back into the ship, but the rocking motion of him pulling to get her back in, made her bum slip off the ledge and then she went down.

 

[justbreathe]

thank you for sharing this. It can't be shared enough.

I remember there being talk of SA standing her on “the metal railing.” I thought the guardrail may have been metal, but it is definitively wood. So where ever I saw that - early press report or was it the criminal complaint itself? - it looks like he was standing and sitting her on the metal window ledge. Another example of early reports being correct?

 

[al66pine]

Copy of Criminal Complaint?
Seems this should have been publicly released.
Maybe it has been and I've forgotten reading it.
Link to a pdf translated to English anyone? Thx in adv.

 

[MsMarple]

I remember there being talk of SA standing her on “the metal railing.” I thought the guardrail may have been metal, but it is definitively wood. So where ever I saw that - early press report or was it the criminal complaint itself? - it looks like he was standing and sitting her on the metal window ledge. Another example of early reports being correct?

Like many cases here that we follow early reports are sometimes wrong, like the report that Chloe was with two siblings (we know that's not true). So it could just be an error. But it does make me wonder if the ship railings are actually metal painted to look like wood and not actually wood. @they'll get you can you help answer?

 

[MsMarple]

Copy of Criminal Complaint?
Seems this should have been publicly released.
Maybe it has been and I've forgotten reading it.
Link to a pdf translated to English anyone? Thx in adv.

I haven't found a copy and have been looking.

 

[they'll get you]

I guess they figure they can fool some of the people some of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but they can't fool us!!

No verbal diarrhoea in that video.
Just visual facts.

 

[they'll get you]

I really appreciate the great photos and observations you post back to us!
I imagine it was not easy when you stood there & reflected on the reality of it all.

Thank you BeachSky
Aprox. 2.30 on the first day I went to the 11th floor where Chloe was. My heart became strangely heavy with anxiety so I sat and studied the people around and noticed how noisy it was, the people were not facing the windows but toward the centre of the ship so I’d understand if there weren’t too many witnesses until SA yelled.
I did look down to the wharf at Sydney and, knowing what we know now, the height took my breath. I wouldn’t put my phone beyond that rail let alone a baby.

F*$&#* stupid galoot!!!
(I was on the Voyager)

 

[Aydrianna523]

I think I posted wrong tweet.
Deleted.

 

[jeena]

When I was onboard, for Chloe I sat and studied parents with children, I did not see one toddler unsupervised as all were being held on a hip. In fact I saw parents straddling their children while laying on a deck chair.
There are many people walking and looking around a new environment on the first day and are not looking down for children at foot, their eyes up and around.
Stupidity on all levels until he reached the window and then it became murderous.


.

How can an adult male take care of a toddler with no supplies like diapers, water, tissues, band-aids,etc. SA was walking around with CW with nothing, no tote bag with supplies, nothing. Suppose she needed a diaper change? Are their changing stations on FOS? Would SA need to go into the men's room or ladies room to change her diaper, or just change her on a deck chair? Did KW leave a diaper bag on a deck chair for them to use? Point being, the supplies SA wasn't carrying with him probably means KW wasn't planning on being gone very long, she might have figured they would never leave the pool until she came back, too bad for Chloe they didn't stay there.