IN IN - Renee Bruhl, Patricia Blough & Ann Miller, Indiana Dunes SP, 2 July 1966

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
I well remember the Starved Rock State Park murders. Of course, in that case, the bodies were found and evidence obtained which led to the case being solved. To those who say such incidents were not reported on a large scale back then, I remember hearing about it on the news. Life magazine even had an article complete with a photo of two of the womem that had been taken on their hike by the third woman (from a camera that had been recovered where their bodies were found). I well remember the chilling mention that authorities at first wondered if the killer might have been captured on one of the pictures still in that camera - but he wasn't.

I have always felt the best chance authorities have is to obtain information on the boat in question is from the home movie film reportedly taken by a visitor in the park that day. Despite it having been taken all of those years ago, current technology might enable them to possibly see the lettering or numbering on that craft which may enable them to identify who the owner was.

My point is that with exceptions, such as Starved Rock (too young at the time, but did read about it later in an Compton's Almanac), Sharon Percy's Murder, Barbara Mackle Kidnapping, Charles Whitman & Richard Speck, which were picked up by national news and national magazines, a lot of other murders and missing people from the 1960's were never given that type of publicity.

An example would be Robert Smith who on 11/12/66 went into a Mesa Arizona beauty salon and murdered 4 women and a 3 year old child. Wounding several other people. This was the same year as Speck 7/14/66 and Whitman 8/1/66, yet he's not well known, even today.
 
I do remember the Smith case (although I didn't specifically recall his name) on the news but it was like a one day story. It' s one of those half remembered crimes like the ones that supposedly happened after some kook saw the movie Psycho in 1960 - actually, I think there was just one of those.
 
I think, as I believe someone else mentioned, that we should not get too fixated on the boat angle. It may have nothing to do with the disappearance.

I certainly respect your and all opinions expressed here. However, without the boat or boats (as two separate craft have been mentioned), what do you really have in this case? It comes down to three women leaving their personal belongings and the car they came in behind and never being seen again.

To me, the home movie film from that day is very close to what we have now with security cameras in shopping malls, on street corners, etc. It shows what you and I would have seen had we been there that day. Reportedly, it shows the women on board with unidentified males. I just feel you should go with the lead you have been given. What else do you have in terms of physical evidence?
 
If we don't know if it was one or two boats, how can we rely that the women were seen on them?

I think if the camera had been static and only was filming the boat, that would be a clue, but my guess is it was just scanning the beach.

I had said in an earlier post it could have been as easy as Ted Bundy at Lake Sammamish, walked up and asked for help - 3 women together would have felt safe. Maybe they were asked to party with a group - go with him to get some alcohol.

If this was some type of hit, getting them away from the beach would be a whole lot easier in some type of vehicle rather than a boat, which people might notice, especially if you're close to shore and bothering people.
 
While information that I have read did indicate the person using the home movie camera was just scanning the beach, it did mention that on that film the images of the three women and one or two males could be seen. While there may be other things seen on that film, 21st Century scrutiny could be done on that portion of the film. With regards to there being two boats, it was reported that the women may have entered one boat, but they and other men were later seen on board another craft in the beach area. That seems to indicate they left on one craft, but may have switched to another elsewhere and then returned to that location. Could be an error, but both craft might be identified and checked out. As I previously noted, without the boats, what do you really have?

Whether they left the area by boat, car, etc. I am still trying to understand why the women would leave their personal belongings behind. Say what you will about the times, but that really wasn't how things were done in the 1960's nor in earlier decades as well.
 
I'm not a oater. Could someone tell us how likely it would have been for a small craft on the south shore of Lake Michigan on a nice Summer day with good weather and presumably plenty of other boats on the water, to sink without anyone on any other craft to be aware of it?

I think it would be possible for a young man who happened to own a boat, to "disappear" without Law Enforcement making the connection that he was out in his boat when he disappeared. I know of a case where a young man known to go rock climbing, disappeared on weekend. He dropped all contact with his friends, family and girl friend. He abandoned his apartment and his processions and failed to report to work. His car was found "abandoned" near a rock climbing area but it was returned to the bank that held the note without his family being notified. The mystery was solved when his skeletonized body was found at the basepf a cliff years later.
 
Leaving their belonging behind is another thing that makes me think it wasn't a boat, if you're going off on a boat, you'd take everything with you, as you would not know how long you'd be out or if they could drop you off back where you started.

If you're wandering away to a bathroom, or getting something from the car or going down to the water, you would leave your stuff behind.

If we're looking at this as a deliberate planned act. One of the girls could have been approached on her way to a bathroom or getting something to eat/drink - removed to a car and then the other two were approached on the beach and told their friend was sick or needed them some other way and they probably would have gone, leaving everything behind.
 
On-line, I have read a newspaper story from July, 1966 which reported authorities had questioned, then released, two male suspects who claimed they had offered a boat ride to three women at the beach that day, but the women turned them down. The names of the suspects was not given in the article as the authorities had not released their names. The men allegedly stated the last time they spoke with the women, they (the women) were standing "in chin-deep water". At that time, the authorities said they felt the women may have drown and a search for their bodies was underway.
 
On-line, I have read a newspaper story from July, 1966 which reported authorities had questioned, then released, two male suspects who claimed they had offered a boat ride to three women at the beach that day, but the women turned them down. The names of the suspects was not given in the article as the authorities had not released their names. The men allegedly stated the last time they spoke with the women, they (the women) were standing "in chin-deep water". At that time, the authorities said they felt the women may have drown and a search for their bodies was underway.

Do you have a link for that? Interesting theory , but all 3 drowning simultaneously ?

Mark.
 
I had to take another look because I found the article in a similar webpage like this one called:

www.officialcoldcaseinvestigations.com

and under the category - Three Women Missing, Indiana

The article came from a newspaper called "The Times Recorder". It is dated July 8, 1966. It is from the UPI and is datelined "Chesterton, Indiana".

I hope this is enough information for you to find it on-line. If not, you might do as I first did and just search under something like "Missing Women Indiana Dunes State Park" and this may show as one of the topics for it.
 
Leaving their belonging behind is another thing that makes me think it wasn't a boat, if you're going off on a boat, you'd take everything with you, as you would not know how long you'd be out or if they could drop you off back where you started.

If you're wandering away to a bathroom, or getting something from the car or going down to the water, you would leave your stuff behind.

If we're looking at this as a deliberate planned act. One of the girls could have been approached on her way to a bathroom or getting something to eat/drink - removed to a car and then the other two were approached on the beach and told their friend was sick or needed them some other way and they probably would have gone, leaving everything behind.

It depends on how long a ride they were expecting. If they were just going on a quick trip they might have left things like clothes behind.
 
It depends on how long a ride they were expecting. If they were just going on a quick trip they might have left things like clothes behind.

My thoughts were it wouldn't matter the length of the ride, because even a short ride would probably take them a mile or so away from where they started.

Was there something so unique where they were that they thought they would recognize the stretch of beach they were on, once they left it?

From reading the thread, this sounds like a huge place. Except for a couple of vacations, I've only been on small lakes and we never left our stuff alone, there was always a designated sitter because it's hard to find your location once you've walked away.
 
I'm just wondering what specific items did the women leave behind? The initial information related at the start of this topic indicated "personnel belongings" were left behind. It also mentioned that the keys to Ann Miller's Buick automobile were found at the scene and belongings were found there as well. It's not clear to me if they left their purses behind either at the location they were on the beach or inside the vehicle. You would think that in taking a boat ride of any distance at all, they would have taken those with them and not left them on the beach (although maybe in the car). Is any of this indicated anywhere?
 
I wandered onto this site today and was surprised at the length of this thread and how the same people have continued to frequent it, some for up to 9 years. I’ve gone back and read most of your posts and have found them insightful and interesting; and I’m touched by your continuing interest in this nearly 50 year old tragic case.

First of all, I’d like to introduce myself. My name is Robert Blough, and I’m the brother of Patty Blough. It’s hard for me to relate to you the impact that this incident has had on my family over the years. My mother, who’s 94 now, still tears up whenever my sister’s name is mentioned, which is a subject we normally try to avoid. Personally, I still was having reoccurring nightmares about my sister 30 years after her disappearance. It’s always hard losing a loved one. But when someone is taken from you with this kind of uncertainty, I believe it’s the most painful kind of loss; due to the fact that there is no closure. I’ve talked with investigators regarding this case over the years, as recently as 2005 when the book “Unbridled Rage” came out and provided new interest in the case.

While reading through this thread, I was impressed at the fact that there is very little information, clues and leads that haven’t been mentioned here. There are however, a few things I can add from my own perspective, which I’d like to share with you.

First of all, Patty and I were very close throughout our childhood. She was 4 years older than I, and I looked up to her and respected her greatly. She was a unique person, very independent and very honest. Ever since I can remember, Patty was a horse lover. Even as a small child she lived and breathed her love for horses.

During the time leading up to her disappearance a few interesting things happened. First, the winter prior to her disappearance, she mentioned to me that she had a friend who was involved in organized crime. This person I later came to find out was George Jayne, brother of Silas. From what I’ve read about George, he wasn’t actually all that bad a guy, and certainly could not be compared to the pure evil personified that went by the name of Silas Jayne.

Sometime in early May, 1966, Patty came home with her face badly bruised and swollen. She had obviously been beaten up badly by someone. She claimed that she fell off her horse while exercising him, and our family naively believed her at the time. Even at 15 I remember wondering how the particular injuries she had could have come from a fall, and thought she looked like she’d gotten the hell beaten out of her.

Around this same time, my mother found some scratch paper where Patty had doodled, “trouble, trouble, I’m in so much trouble.”

The weekend before she disappeared, Patty and her friends also went to the Dunes State Park. She had told me she was going a few days earlier and asked if I wanted to come, which I replied yes. When Saturday came, she left early in the morning without telling me. When she got back, I asked her why she hadn’t taken me, and she answered, “You wouldn’t have wanted to come. We met guys there.”

I was sick with a bad cold the week prior to sister’s disappearance, and was lying in bed with a fever, when Patty came into my room and seemed troubled. She said to me, “I’m making out a will. I want you to have Hank (her Thoroughbred) if anything ever happens to me.” I said, “Patty, you’re 19 years old, what do you need a will for?” She said, “I just want to make one up. If I will you Hank, do you promise to take care of him?” I was 15 years old at the time and had no way of getting all the way out to Scottsdale farm near rt. 53 and Roosevelt Rd. from Westchester. Plus, I wouldn’t have been able to pay the boarding fees on top of it. I told her just that. She seemed a little hurt that I wasn’t willing to take on this responsibility; but I think she understood, and she told me she appreciated my honesty.

Later on that same day she came into my room to talk to me again. This time she said, “I’m going to tell you something, but you first have to promise that under no circumstances will you ever tell anyone.” I said, “I promise. What?” She said, “No matter what happens, you can never tell anyone.” I said, “I promise, no matter what happens, I’ll never tell anyone.” She thought for a few seconds and said, “I can’t tell you. Under the circumstances, even I would tell,“ and she walked out of my room. A few days later she disappeared; and had she told me this was going to happen, of course I wouldn’t have been able to watch my parents suffer without telling them what she had said, and she knew that. I sometimes think this was her way of telling me she was going to disappear, without actually saying it.

One of the men involved with Silas Jayne matched the description of the man who was reported to have picked the girls up in the small boat, and he owned a boat that matched the suspected boats description. It was an unusual boat for Lake Michigan, a 16 foot white tri-hull runabout with blue interior. He also kept the boat less than 3 miles from the Dunes. I can’t remember the source, but I read somewhere or was told that this person put in a claim on his insurance for the boat the week following the girl’s disappearance, claiming it burned up and sunk in Lake Michigan. I still remember the man's name and he's still alive. At least as far as I know he was still alive a couple of years ago.

In 2005 when the book “Unbridled Rage” came out, I contacted the author Gene O’Shea and had a lengthy conversation with him regarding my sister’s case and her association with Silas Jayne. Gene suggested I talk with one of the ATF agents that worked on the Helen Brach case. I contacted him and we also had a lengthy conversation regarding the same matter. The agent told me that one of the cooperating witnesses in the investigations of both Helen Brach and the Schuessler-- Peterson murders had told the agent that someday he'd tell him what happened to the Dunes girls. The agent explained that this person was difficult to deal with, and he had to approach him just right, but said he would reach out to him for me. The agent never got back to me, and I’ve found out that he has since retired. I’ve tried to contact him on a couple of occasions with no success.

Anyway, this is much of what I know about my sister’s disappearance. For years I believed she was still alive, due to the conversations we had just days before that dreaded 4th of July weekend. Patty had recently gotten beaten up. She had doodled, “I’m in so much trouble, trouble, trouble.” She indeed was troubled when she came to me and offered to will me her horse, and then tried to tell me a secret, which she admitted she herself wouldn’t be able to keep were she in my shoes. I now believe, like someone else on this thread mentioned previously, that she was in bad trouble with Silas Jayne and his horse mafia, and she was planning to stage her disappearance in order to get away from these people. I believe that most likely the man in the boat was part of the murder scheme and set the girls up under the guise of helping them disappear. There were reports of a large flash on the horizon, looking north from the southern shores of Lake Michigan on the day of my sister’s disappearance. Silas Jayne’s henchmen were familiar with dynamite. Wreckage of a boat was found near one of the southern Lake Michigan pumping stations; although no boats were reported missing. The only exception being the boat owned by the man associated with Silas Jayne who put in the insurance claim but never reported the incident to the Coast Guard.

I see so many of you have a continuing interest in this case, and I hope I provided some insight for you. If there are any questions you might have, I will be checking this site from time to time, so please feel free to ask me via this thread or a PM.
 
My thoughts were it wouldn't matter the length of the ride, because even a short ride would probably take them a mile or so away from where they started.

Was there something so unique where they were that they thought they would recognize the stretch of beach they were on, once they left it?

From reading the thread, this sounds like a huge place. Except for a couple of vacations, I've only been on small lakes and we never left our stuff alone, there was always a designated sitter because it's hard to find your location once you've walked away.

This is a good point, and the beach was very crowded that weekend on top of it. But even more curious... I've never seen a woman go anywhere without her purse. It would have been very easy for one of the girls to just run back to the blanket and grab the purses. One other thing, I remember my sister Patty had been hording money for several months and saving every penny she made, yet there were only a few dollars in her purse and no money or bank accounts left behind.
 
Thanks to Robert for his posts which were no doubt still hard to share even after all of these years. You just wonder what it was that Patty came very close to telling him? It does make you wonder what, if anything, the other two girls, Renee Bruhl and Ann Miller, may have known going into that visit to the park that day. Just wondering if at any time Robert has seen the home movie footage that was taken that day on the beach which has been mentioned quite a bit on these posts?
 
Thanks to Robert for his posts which were no doubt still hard to share even after all of these years. You just wonder what it was that Patty came very close to telling him? It does make you wonder what, if anything, the other two girls, Renee Bruhl and Ann Miller, may have known going into that visit to the park that day. Just wondering if at any time Robert has seen the home movie footage that was taken that day on the beach which has been mentioned quite a bit on these posts?

No one from my family has ever seen the footage and I can't imagine why it was never shown to us. The FBI reportedly stated "it looked like the girls in the boat". I think someone very familiar with the girls could probably have said that with more certainty.

i remember when the incident first happened, there was a big controversy over who was responsible to investigate the case. Indiana thought Illinois should do it and visa versa. The main investigator in the case ended up being a Westchester patrolman... not even a detective... a patrolman. Then the Indiana State Police had the case for a while, and ultimately the Illinois State Police. I know the FBI got involved somewhere along the line but not until much later, as they claimed there was no evidence of a federal crime having been committed. One thing in common with each department's investigation... they'd all get just so far before they dead ended into a brick wall.
 
I would think the Porter County Sheriff's Office would have had initial jurisdiction in this case since the park lies with-in that county although since it is a state park, it might go to the Indiana State Police. I'm not sure how law enforcement in Illinois might be involved although maybe it has to do with which state has jurisdiction once you venture very far onto Lake Michigan? You also would think the Coast Guard would have gotten involved, too. At some point, I assume the on-going investigative agency could have called in the FBI in terms of possible kidnapping, since two states were seemingly involved or that organized crime might be mixed up in the disappearance.

Robert mentioned the report of a large flash being seen looking north from the southern shore area on the same day of the disappearance. This is the fiirst time I have heard of this. With that in mind, you start to wonder if the three women were left on one boat (perhaps unconscious, drugged, etc.) where exlosives were rigged up and set off while the killer or killers were on another boat and he/they left the scene shortly beforehand? Could something have been learned from a better examination of the wrecked boat that was found later near the pumping station?

So many questions remain after all of these years.
 
I wandered onto this site today and was surprised at the length of this thread and how the same people have continued to frequent it, some for up to 9 years. I’ve gone back and read most of your posts and have found them insightful and interesting; and I’m touched by your continuing interest in this nearly 50 year old tragic case.

First of all, I’d like to introduce myself. My name is Robert Blough, and I’m the brother of Patty Blough. It’s hard for me to relate to you the impact that this incident has had on my family over the years. My mother, who’s 94 now, still tears up whenever my sister’s name is mentioned, which is a subject we normally try to avoid. Personally, I still was having reoccurring nightmares about my sister 30 years after her disappearance. It’s always hard losing a loved one. But when someone is taken from you with this kind of uncertainty, I believe it’s the most painful kind of loss; due to the fact that there is no closure. I’ve talked with investigators regarding this case over the years, as recently as 2005 when the book “Unbridled Rage” came out and provided new interest in the case.

While reading through this thread, I was impressed at the fact that there is very little information, clues and leads that haven’t been mentioned here. There are however, a few things I can add from my own perspective, which I’d like to share with you.

First of all, Patty and I were very close throughout our childhood. She was 4 years older than I, and I looked up to her and respected her greatly. She was a unique person, very independent and very honest. Ever since I can remember, Patty was a horse lover. Even as a small child she lived and breathed her love for horses.

During the time leading up to her disappearance a few interesting things happened. First, the winter prior to her disappearance, she mentioned to me that she had a friend who was involved in organized crime. This person I later came to find out was George Jayne, brother of Silas. From what I’ve read about George, he wasn’t actually all that bad a guy, and certainly could not be compared to the pure evil personified that went by the name of Silas Jayne.

Sometime in early May, 1966, Patty came home with her face badly bruised and swollen. She had obviously been beaten up badly by someone. She claimed that she fell off her horse while exercising him, and our family naively believed her at the time. Even at 15 I remember wondering how the particular injuries she had could have come from a fall, and thought she looked like she’d gotten the hell beaten out of her.

Around this same time, my mother found some scratch paper where Patty had doodled, “trouble, trouble, I’m in so much trouble.”

The weekend before she disappeared, Patty and her friends also went to the Dunes State Park. She had told me she was going a few days earlier and asked if I wanted to come, which I replied yes. When Saturday came, she left early in the morning without telling me. When she got back, I asked her why she hadn’t taken me, and she answered, “You wouldn’t have wanted to come. We met guys there.”

I was sick with a bad cold the week prior to sister’s disappearance, and was lying in bed with a fever, when Patty came into my room and seemed troubled. She said to me, “I’m making out a will. I want you to have Hank (her Thoroughbred) if anything ever happens to me.” I said, “Patty, you’re 19 years old, what do you need a will for?” She said, “I just want to make one up. If I will you Hank, do you promise to take care of him?” I was 15 years old at the time and had no way of getting all the way out to Scottsdale farm near rt. 53 and Roosevelt Rd. from Westchester. Plus, I wouldn’t have been able to pay the boarding fees on top of it. I told her just that. She seemed a little hurt that I wasn’t willing to take on this responsibility; but I think she understood, and she told me she appreciated my honesty.

Later on that same day she came into my room to talk to me again. This time she said, “I’m going to tell you something, but you first have to promise that under no circumstances will you ever tell anyone.” I said, “I promise. What?” She said, “No matter what happens, you can never tell anyone.” I said, “I promise, no matter what happens, I’ll never tell anyone.” She thought for a few seconds and said, “I can’t tell you. Under the circumstances, even I would tell,“ and she walked out of my room. A few days later she disappeared; and had she told me this was going to happen, of course I wouldn’t have been able to watch my parents suffer without telling them what she had said, and she knew that. I sometimes think this was her way of telling me she was going to disappear, without actually saying it.

One of the men involved with Silas Jayne matched the description of the man who was reported to have picked the girls up in the small boat, and he owned a boat that matched the suspected boats description. It was an unusual boat for Lake Michigan, a 16 foot white tri-hull runabout with blue interior. He also kept the boat less than 3 miles from the Dunes. I can’t remember the source, but I read somewhere or was told that this person put in a claim on his insurance for the boat the week following the girl’s disappearance, claiming it burned up and sunk in Lake Michigan. I still remember the man's name and he's still alive. At least as far as I know he was still alive a couple of years ago.

In 2005 when the book “Unbridled Rage” came out, I contacted the author Gene O’Shea and had a lengthy conversation with him regarding my sister’s case and her association with Silas Jayne. Gene suggested I talk with one of the ATF agents that worked on the Helen Brach case. I contacted him and we also had a lengthy conversation regarding the same matter. The agent told me that one of the cooperating witnesses in the investigations of both Helen Brach and the Schuessler-- Peterson murders had told the agent that someday he'd tell him what happened to the Dunes girls. The agent explained that this person was difficult to deal with, and he had to approach him just right, but said he would reach out to him for me. The agent never got back to me, and I’ve found out that he has since retired. I’ve tried to contact him on a couple of occasions with no success.

Anyway, this is much of what I know about my sister’s disappearance. For years I believed she was still alive, due to the conversations we had just days before that dreaded 4th of July weekend. Patty had recently gotten beaten up. She had doodled, “I’m in so much trouble, trouble, trouble.” She indeed was troubled when she came to me and offered to will me her horse, and then tried to tell me a secret, which she admitted she herself wouldn’t be able to keep were she in my shoes. I now believe, like someone else on this thread mentioned previously, that she was in bad trouble with Silas Jayne and his horse mafia, and she was planning to stage her disappearance in order to get away from these people. I believe that most likely the man in the boat was part of the murder scheme and set the girls up under the guise of helping them disappear. There were reports of a large flash on the horizon, looking north from the southern shores of Lake Michigan on the day of my sister’s disappearance. Silas Jayne’s henchmen were familiar with dynamite. Wreckage of a boat was found near one of the southern Lake Michigan pumping stations; although no boats were reported missing. The only exception being the boat owned by the man associated with Silas Jayne who put in the insurance claim but never reported the incident to the Coast Guard.

I see so many of you have a continuing interest in this case, and I hope I provided some insight for you. If there are any questions you might have, I will be checking this site from time to time, so please feel free to ask me via this thread or a PM.


Hello Mr.Blough,

It is always a very welcome pleasure when someone close to a case[ victim ] comments on the discussions we are having here about cases.
As usual my thoughts are was someone stalking any one of them? Did someone seem creepy and follow them?
I do not think people knew what a stalker was until recently?
I mean I may be wrong?
My first thought would be an ex of one of them?
A jealous person for one reason or another?
Always look close, as some clues seem to be there but not realized until later.
I have seen many stories on LMN about people who have people who pretend to like somebody and turn out to not like them?
I do hope someday you and your family find closure.
I have been reading about many cases here on Websleuths.Old ones and new ones.
It is very hard to understand how more than one girl follows along willingly? Making me wonder if some well-known culprit was in the area at that time?
Is there a way you can check to see what inmates may have been recenly let out at the time they went there?
Or perhaps a criminal got to work on a ship? A boat?
And had access to the boat to do this?
Never give up....:loveyou:
justice will come someday just put a few puzzle pieces together:twocents:
again, I would look into escaped or recent parolees or something like that?
A halfway house near there?
Something along those lines.:seeya:


Also?
If your sister was fearful I find it odd that she would be with other girls like that?
I know from the way you describe her, she would want to protect her friends and not hang with them if they would also be harmed right?

So I think whatever happened was a complete surprise.
I looked up the Silas guy and he was a Horse person, so that is how she met him in an innocent way.
Then not knowing it was dragged into a situation maybe overheard something?
and that was what happened maybe?
She may have been with her horse and heard something by accident?
 
Robert mentioned the report of a large flash being seen looking north from the southern shore area on the same day of the disappearance. This is the fiirst time I have heard of this. With that in mind, you start to wonder if the three women were left on one boat (perhaps unconscious, drugged, etc.) where exlosives were rigged up and set off while the killer or killers were on another boat and he/they left the scene shortly beforehand? Could something have been learned from a better examination of the wrecked boat that was found later near the pumping station?So many questions remain after all of these years.

I think this is the most logical conclusion when looking at all the pieces of the puzzle. The big question is who did it and why. Again, the most logical culprit is Silas Jayne and his crew, especially since a cooperating witness told the ATF agent investigating two other of Jaynes murders that "someday" he would tell him what happened to the Dunes Girls.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
173
Guests online
227
Total visitors
400

Forum statistics

Threads
608,852
Messages
18,246,391
Members
234,467
Latest member
Aja777
Back
Top