Interim discussion regarding questions from the jury and Arias on the stand #81

[bsk]

I think proving the lies re the gas cans is much more than just proving she lied.. me thinks is goes to premeditation.

and possibly cover-up. Might JM have some evidence (GPS, forensic, etc.) of a little bonfire the night she drove home somewhere off I-80 in Nevada where some remains of a kerosene can were found among the debris?

 

[BritsKate]

Does anyone know, is psychopathy considered a personality disorder, in the clinical sense, or is that something different?

Currently there's no DSM classification for psychopathy. In the next version, due out in May, psychopathy will be lumped together with ASPD. All the axis II disorders are being reclassified if memory serves...

There's still a lot of research being conducted and a lot of debate raging...I personally believe a psychopath can be any mixture of several current disorders. It deserves its own classification as a result.

Recent studies suggest a new type of psychopathy too, inherent to mostly females, that is very similar to borderline traits.

 

[Dmacky]

as if she'd tell you.......

Ohh she'd tell you. She LOVES to talk, and absolutely loves/encourages the attention! Wouldn't be the truth, but she's definitely up for any and all Q & A :wink:

 

[Clue Finder 55]

Thought on how spent shell casing landed on puddle of blood

Here’s a theory of how the spent shell casing in the Jodi Arias Trial wound up on top of the blood.

If you were standing in the bedroom looking towards the bathroom down the hallway try picturing this.

Travis laying on his back face up,
Jodi standing in the hallway on his right facing his head. She aims the gun downward at his head and pulls the trigger, the bullet hits Travis above the right eyebrow travels through the front of his skull and lodges in his cheek.
When the gun was fired the spent shell would eject to her right with quite a force and flying through the air for 7 or 8 feet then bounces on the tile floor and lands in the pool of blood.
The shot may not have come from inside the bathroom at all but came from the hallway near his bedroom.
When shells are fired from semi automatic hand guns most of the 25 cal ones eject to the right and can be flung through the air for quite a distance and can also bounce of a tile floor when it hit for another few feet.
So it would mean that it would be possible for the spent casing to land in the bathroom from a shot that came from the hallway that went to his bedroom ( around the place his neck was cut ) This would mean he was stabbed and his throat cut then he was shot and that is how the spent shell found clean on a puddle of blood.

Sometimes people who are shooting semi automatics at gun ranges have the people in the next stall to them complain about getting hit with spent shell casings from people in the stall to their left.

IF there are any 25 cal semi auto gun owners that read this how far does your gun eject spent casings?. Please post

 

[katiecoolady]

Heads up anyone in the LA area..I have one extra ticket for the Ricki Lake taping tomorrow at 11:15 til 2 ish. If anyone wants it just pm me your email address and name which is what they need to get you in and info re parking etc. getting ready to board the plane after this delicious skinny margarita so will check again when I arrive. First come first serve.

Taken! Thanks for playing....:seeya:

 

[GetSmart]

The Family said they could prove it was ID theft ..another family member used Travis's ID

 

[Mykeru]

Does anyone know, is psychopathy considered a personality disorder, in the clinical sense, or is that something different?

Yes, it is. Just off the top of my head, I believe it's part of the "Dark Triad" along with Borderline Personality and Antisocial Personality, within which there's considerable overlap of characteristics.

Antisocial personalities is determined by behavior, how they act out. Psychopathy is within, demonstrating profound lack of empathy and remorse.

The distinction between Psychopathy and Sociopathy has so much overlap and nuance that they are often used interchangeably. All the sources I've read seem to just muddy the water even more, so if someone with clinical background and a knack for explaining things like I'm six years old could actually explain the difference, I would be indebted.

[Ignore me and read BritsKate above]

 

[Schuby]

Currently there's no DSM classification for psychopathy. In the next version, due out in May, psychopathy will be lumped together with ASPD. All the axis II disorders are being reclassified if memory serves...

There's still a lot of research being conducted and a lot of debate raging...I personally believe a psychopath can be any mixture of several current disorders. It deserves its own classification as a result.

Recent studies suggest a new type of psychopathy too, inherent to mostly females, that is very similar to borderline traits.

So does that mean (at least until the new version) that psychopathy is not a medical diagnosis? (Sorry, that feels like a dumb question, lol)

 

[mck16]

OMG, JVM just showed the clip where JA is standing with her arm around her other attorney. I thought at first it was Jodi and her mother. Her attorney looks just like her mother. :what: Too funny!!! jmo

 

[Colt46]

What the hell did she do to elicit this response?????

Whatever it was, it cost Travis his life! Sure hope JM has pieced it all together - she deserves the ultimate punishment!

 

[beeshie]

Of course it's not! It is bullying, however, to insist over and over again that someone is wrong based on "obvious facts",(that are not really facts at all because no one knows for sure except a lying murderess and her victim), because someone won't cave in and agree that your pov is the correct pov. Every time I visit these boards I learn something new that causes me to look at the case in a different way. Just when I think I have it all figured out...BOOM...here comes Schuby with some wacky theory that, OMG, changes EvErYtHiNg I thought about this case. Or...maybe it's OMG, WTF are you smokin' Schuby?...*eye roll* . I'm not going to INSIST you are right, I am not going to INSIST you are wrong, no matter what my opinion, or imply that you lack the capacity to rationalize or even think sensibly simply because I don't see what you're seeing! Just sayin'...

Urgh. I didn't intend to offend anyone. I asked someone to provide me with a reason why they believe what they believe. I asked for analytical thinking and didn't insist that anyone subscribe to my point of view. I'm just really trying to understand where this idea comes from based upon the evidence.

Hey, I've got an open mind, but if the responder just criticizes the question instead of trying to answer it, am I not entitled to point that out?

 

[Zuri]

FYI ..the ME said the bullet did not go through sinus cavity..went through brain which means immediate incapacitation. He was very sure about this. Just watched his testimony again.

I just re-listened to the testimony of Dr. Horn as well and compared it to the autopsy report. There were a few discrepancies between the 2, which would be expected as it has been 4 1/2 years since he performed the autopsy on TA. Dr. Horn stated in his autopsy report that the bullet was recovered from the left maxillary sinus. On the stand, he stated that the bullet lodged in his cheek. Same difference. JM actually subptally corrected Dr. horn in his testimony about the GSW entry wound location, to clarify it for the jury. It was interesting to hear the testimony again. Dr. Horn is very good at explaining the medical forensics so the jury could understand it with ease. Respectfully, IMO

 

[bsk]

Quote:
Originally Posted by SusieD
It was quite awhile before I realized it was an actual banana.

had to sign in just to hit the thanks button on that one... ha ha ha ha hahad to sign in just to hit the thanks button on that one... ha ha ha ha ha

Maybe ja brought this up hoping it would give her grounds for a peel.

OK kill me - I couldn't resist!

 

[katiecoolady]

I think I've just narrowed down her diagnosis to this label: Evil Demon

And no it's not in the DSM whatever number. But Dr Lillian Glass used the first word on the radio last night so I feel I do have some professional back up.

 

[TigerBalm]

LOL even Jason Lamm on JVM is calling the defendant a sociopath.

He is a criminal defense attorney and was pro-defense before the murderer took the stand.

 

[Allyne Smithe]

My DH can soak in the shower a half an hour before he starts scrubbing anything.

Imo he had already showered earlier that day. And shaved, despite JA's claim to the contrary.

JA had a time problem. She had to commit the murder and get away before his roommates came home. Ergo, the forced 'photo shoot.'
MOO

Thank you so much Allyne Smithe! I was beginning to feel like the step child here too.

You are welcome!

I don't mind a differing opinion. What I do mind is when there is an opinion without providing reasoning for it and when (rarely) asked to do so, it is not forthcoming. I am more inclined then to think that it is, indeed, done for the titillation factor (that has nothing to do with photos) or some personal reason that has little to do with examining the case. In my experience.

Apart from that, examining all angles can only be helpful!

I can think of many reasons people have differing opinions, some valid, some not, but nobody imo has to explain their reasoning. Even when reasons are offered, I sometimes disagree but usually just keep quiet and move on.

Maybe I am misunderstanding what you mean by the titillation factor, but I have not noticed that.

 

[BritsKate]

BBM ^ Unless I am missing something, I have seen no "proof" Travis was "entertaining" her on June 4th. The nude pics on the bed are not proof that any sexual encounter had occured. Look at both his and her faces in the nude ones... do they appear as if sex had just happened (or was about to happen?) The shower pics were more than likely done at gunpoint. That boy was not a willing participant, and appears to be praying in some, and terrified in another. MOO

None of us will really ever know...

But what we can know, for absolute certain, is that psychopaths are very skilled at getting people to ignore their instincts and discount their fears as exaggerated. In a sense they know their target even better than the target themselves. They know just what to say, or do, or claim to achieve the desired result.

For all we know Jodi showed up with a sob story of being kicked out and homeless; or getting beaten by her latest boyfriend; or having had a car accident. She would have specifically been playing to Travis' nature, though, which by almost all accounts was generous and sometimes too kind. With psychopaths there are no lengths they won't go to in order to get what they want. I don't think such boundaries even exist for them.

 

[JusticeJunkie]

Listening to HLN, and was reminded she sent the suicide letter to be opened Nov of 2008. Nov of 2008?? Her Gma kept them?? Or did her Gma not get them EVER?
When exactly she wrote them will never be revealed. At least not by Arias.

 

[Mykeru]

Currently there's no DSM classification for psychopathy. In the next version, due out in May, psychopathy will be lumped together with ASPD. All the axis II disorders are being reclassified if memory serves...

That it's not an actual clinical category is noted.

There's still a lot of research being conducted and a lot of debate raging...I personally believe a psychopath can be any mixture of several current disorders. It deserves its own classification as a result.

A lot of the confusion seems to come from popular literature for the lay person. For example, Robert Hare uses the term 'psychopath" while Martha Stout uses the term "sociopath" when they are seemingly talking about the same sort of personality down to superficial charm, lack of empathy and manipulative behavior.

Recent studies suggest a new type of psychopathy too, inherent to mostly females, that is very similar to borderline traits.

Having been in a relationship with a bona fide Borderline Personality, the idea of a more virulent strain scares me.

 

[LizardQueen74]

→This is something I copied from another person's post to WS.
These are all FROM Travis TO JA
April 2008 (I think - if not, its close)
(illegible) you have that
information. its 15 minutes it
would take to gt the info.
But you won't take 15
minutes. Why because it is
an Fing lie. So either text
me you that you are ready
to tell the truth or give me
your imaginary friend with
the worst BS story you have
ever told or leave me alone.
Its a lie like no other. It is
freaking foolish. There is no
way out of it, you have
screwed up your story so
bad you can't mend it. You
are caught. When will you
realize that. I do not know.
You have til tomorrow. to
have me this persons
information before I tell all
of the hughes' leslie udy,
the freemans, your parents
and anyone else that
matters about all the crazy
things you have done. So
either fess up or feel the
wrath. No matter how bad
the truth is I promise you
the punishment will be
better than the lie. This is
worse than your magical
email that a mysterious man
you've never seen before
wrote for you. You insult me
by thinking ill believe such
crap. nothing else from you
til the truth. I already know
your lying so why continue.
After tomorrow, its gonna
get real bad for you. Time to
spit it out.
-----------------------------
These 3 are all part of one long text,
no replies from JA in between:
05/26/08 at 07:59:15am
I sent you a response to
your dire conversation, that
I hope youread because
you need to read it. Maybe
it will spark human emotion
in you, something that only
seems to exist when it
comes to your own
problems. But everyone
else is just a part of your
sick agenda. By the way,
your pic comment to Danny
Jones makes you look like a
pure *advertiser censored*, even more to
the people who know you.
You should be embarrassed
by it. If he knew what I knew
about you he'd spit in ur
face. Sow ould everyone
else. I have never never in
my life been hurt so bad by
someone. But why do I
even say it because you
don't care. It doesn't serve
your evilness.
05/26/08 at 08:35:02am
You couldn't get off your
lazy butt to to read it could
you. That's the sociopath (I)
know so well. it freakin
figures
05/26/08 at 09:11:11am
I don't want your apology I
want you to understand
what I think of you. I want
you to understand how evil I
think you are. You are the
worst thing that ever
happened to me.

I transcribed the first part of this text:

Do not call me. And do not text me anything. The next thing I want is this michelle K that is friends with Elena(?) that nobody knows but knows details about my life. Not one other thing ever. Until you have that information. Its 15 minutes it would take to get the info. But you won't take 15 minutes....