James Kolar's New Book Will Blow the Lid off the JonBenet Ramsey Investigation

[ILikeToBendPages]

It also irritated me that nothing sinister on the Ramseys' behalf eventuated as that was the theory I had from the get-go but the few extracts I've read from Kolar's book reproduced by other members made everything click into place - for me anyway.

I think this was an event with four acts. Act 1 - Burke accidentally kills JB (with or without sexual abuse). Act 2 - both parents discover the horrific accident and cook up and stage a somewhat ludicrous murder (although not so ludicrous if they had managed to get the body out of the house as initially planned). Act 3 - having spent the early hours concocting and executing their plan, it is finally a semi-decent hour to phone a friend. Patsy hears from the pediatrician that Burke is too young to be prosecuted. Immediately after this relieving advice, Patsy phones the police, meanwhile John has been receiving initial crisis management instructions from a lawyer. Act 4 - John manages to slip away from the group mid-morning, again speaks to a lawyer in a lengthier and detailed conversation and is advised to 'find' the body.

Yes, maybe or totally wrong?

I don't think any doctor would be giving out legal advice to Pasty.

Kolar was told the head bash could of taken up to two hours before it would of killed her. If you go from the neighbor hearing a child scream from a range of midnight to two in the morning, it gives a smaller window before the 911 call. If it was more towards a two in the morning head bash, that would of given Pasty (or John) about three hours or less to stage before 5:45 that Pasty gave as the time she woke up, put her make on, did her hair and redress in the same clothes from the night before, then going down and finding the ransom letter and calling out for John. They had that early morning flight at 7:00 and it took thirty minutes to drive to the airport. They would of needed to leave the house by 6:30 at the most. If something happened around midnight (counting from the scream) you'd get one one about more hour to decide to kill her and stage?

Maybe Pasty was in the sunroom with her friends to stay away from John and his questions. I wonder if he had found JonBenet when he went missing for those two hours and moved her to the wine cellar. In PMPT John was seen sitting at the dining room table with head in his hands and tapping his foot after that.

John was a very controlled person and I don't see him falling apart about any of this kidnapping and murder. I could see (and I've posted before) that with John being the only one who used the laundry chute that maybe Pasty grabbed his shirt, wiped her down and put the shirt back. That could also be one way Pasty kept him out of the loop until she screamed for him. That is the only thing that links John to her assault. Pasty was the one that left fibers near the wine cellar, in her her paint tote, on the duct tape and in the garrotte. Not much else points to John other than he could of pulled that cord tight around his baby girls neck.
I wonder whose DNA was found on the packages that's been tore open? Pasty's would of been on them from her wrapping the gifts and Burke's and JonBenet's could be explain by two nosy kids, but if John or JAR doing it means they knew the gift panties were in one of them. But I read where John said he took presents with him the day before (Christmas eve) when he went to check out the plane. I don't think John would of known what Pasty was giving her niece and that they were down there.

I read that the wine cellar had been built during Pasty's remodeling binge, but to me it looks old and moldy and damp. The whole basement looks old to me. Why did the Ramsey's pour all that money into a house that needed major remolding instead of one that was finished? I'd think you could find or have built a very nice imposing house for seven hundred thousand dollars. Ant that's not including the purchase price.

I see that there are two new photo's released of the small chair in the basement. Where was the stool usually kept? Was that where JonBenet painted along with Pasty upstairs?? Could Burke of picked it up and bashed her on the head if it was in the kitchen and then relocated to the basement? It looks to be metal and has round corners. Could that of caused the hole punched out of her skull.

If something happened between Pasty and Jonbenet in the bathroom, could Pasty of laid her on bed then sat outside of her door and wrote the ransom letter? And that accounts for the butt prints?

What is up with the photo of Pasty, JonBenet, Burke and Nedra? It looks so unnatural and cold. Why not a happy smiling one?

Just wondering.

 

[Bonnette]

I should say up front I'm bitter and mad as heck about all of this.

But that's only because I drank the Kool-aid way back in childhood and spent most of my life believing in Truth, Justice, and the American Way.

Now? I think we'd find plenty of corruption in every arrest, trial, and conviction or not guilty verdict we chose to examine. From the innocent and guilty, from lawyers to judges, from politicians to crime syndicates--it's probably all rigged from the git-go.

And probably always has been.

If not outright corruption, at least ignorance and arrogance. Justice really does seem to be blind...and not in the original sense of fairness and objectivity.

 

[otg]

In answer to your question as to the source of the timing between the head blow and the strangulation:
(snipped)

TY, mwmm, for all the effort you put in to answering me (I’ve gotta get my own book soon.), and for your passion.

There has been a great deal of discussion in the past between different posters on that very point. There is even disagreement between some so-called "experts" as to which came first. But most seemed to agree, as I recall, that the two were at least fairly close in time to one another. So the idea that such a long period of time could have passed between the two events is somewhat of a headline-grabber, and it brings in a lot more possibilities that I hadn't even considered before. Of course, you probably know all this; I’m simply stating it so we all understand how much everything changes if the time between head blow and strangulation is even more than 30-minutes.

I don’t have a medical background, which is why I have to depend on others to explain things to a dummy like me ( :dunno: ). But I think if it is simply the opinion of one more expert (Dr. Rorke, or Rorke-Adams now), no matter how eminent she is (and she is), I’m gonna have to put that down as a possibility -- but not a confirmed fact. Looks like I’ll be doing some research on my own again, like I did to try and understand the mark on JonBenet’s throat -- the “CTE” :wink:.
.

 

[hetty]

Deleted because I can't put into words properly what I'm trying to say, Boesp, I apologise if what I said made no sense, I'm with you most of the way, just was agreeing with what I thought intriguing was saying, but I may have misunderstood his/her meaning.

 

[otg]

Intriguing and Hetty, not sure if your posts were directed at what I said but if so both posts seem to contradict the point I assume you were trying to make. In my opinion, if JonBenet's death was an accident and Burke did it why not get help for JonBenet. If purposeful and Burke did it, he should be accountable. I can't find any excuse for adults not acting with character and integrity. Compassion and charity should not exclude the former two attributes in my opinion.

For the record, I am not necessarily a BDI but I think whoever did it should be accountable.

Perhaps something along this line is exactly why JR and FW had the "falling out". FW is a smart man. He saw things we don't even know about. Perhaps he has a sense of integrity and responsibility as well.
.

 

[OpenMind4U]

TY, mwmm, for all the effort you put in to answering me (I’ve gotta get my own book soon.), and for your passion.

There has been a great deal of discussion in the past between different posters on that very point. There is even disagreement between some so-called "experts" as to which came first. But most seemed to agree, as I recall, that the two were at least fairly close in time to one another. So the idea that such a long period of time could have passed between the two events is somewhat of a headline-grabber, and it brings in a lot more possibilities that I hadn't even considered before. Of course, you probably know all this; I’m simply stating it so we all understand how much everything changes if the time between head blow and strangulation is even more than 30-minutes.
I don’t have a medical background, which is why I have to depend on others to explain things to a dummy like me ( :dunno: ). But I think if it is simply the opinion of one more expert (Dr. Rorke, or Rorke-Adams now), no matter how eminent she is (and she is), I’m gonna have to put that down as a possibility -- but not a confirmed fact. Looks like I’ll be doing some research on my own again, like I did to try and understand the mark on JonBenet’s throat -- the “CTE” :wink:.
.

You're absolutely correct: identifying the TRUE time between the head blow and strangulation would be (and probably already IS) the most important information and could be (and probably already IS) the golden KEY in solving this murder. So, yes please do your analysis! For sure, I'll be not the only one looking forward to read them!

 

[Linda7NJ]

The acute sexual assault which happened that night still has to be accounted for. The evidence exists, it was noted in the autopsy, and is not a matter of conjecture or theory. She was penetrated with something that made her bleed, and she was alive when it happened. Bruising does not occur on a dead person. There was vaginal bruising, both on the labia and internally, and blood internally as well as evidence of wiped blood externally. Whether it was BDI or not, there was sexual contact with JB that night by someone in that house.
The parent's motive for staging this to look like an intruder murder may have had to do with the sexual abuse as well as the head bash, and they may have been covering up for their son(s) or one of themselves.

I still haven't received my copy of the book! Biting nails in anticipation. Still, with what I've gleaned from posts here I am still a Pasty did it. I can not rule her out of anything, even the sexual abuse.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Chrishope]

It also irritated me that nothing sinister on the Ramseys' behalf eventuated as that was the theory I had from the get-go but the few extracts I've read from Kolar's book reproduced by other members made everything click into place - for me anyway.

I think this was an event with four acts. Act 1 - Burke accidentally kills JB (with or without sexual abuse). Act 2 - both parents discover the horrific accident and cook up and stage a somewhat ludicrous murder (although not so ludicrous if they had managed to get the body out of the house as initially planned). Act 3 - having spent the early hours concocting and executing their plan, it is finally a semi-decent hour to phone a friend. Patsy hears from the pediatrician that Burke is too young to be prosecuted. Immediately after this relieving advice, Patsy phones the police, meanwhile John has been receiving initial crisis management instructions from a lawyer. Act 4 - John manages to slip away from the group mid-morning, again speaks to a lawyer in a lengthier and detailed conversation and is advised to 'find' the body.

Yes, maybe or totally wrong?

You're getting warmer, but not quite there, IMO. You're right that the plan was to get the body out of the house. So why did PR call 911? If she was working jointly with JR, there would be no reason for her to do that. The obvious conclusion is that PR wasn't in on the plan. IOWs the plan to dump the body hadn't changed, it simply hadn't been carried out yet. It was JR's plan, and he figured PR would read the whole RN and be persuaded by all the threats not to call the police. If it was their plan together there was really no reason not to go through with dumping the body. Put it in the trunk, with the garage door closed, then drive out to a remote area and dump it. RN and a body both in the house looks very bad. The fact that PR called 911 with the body still in the house tells us she wasn't in on it.

PR wouldn't hear from the pediatrician that BR was too young to be prosecuted. Why would one seek legal advice from a medical doctor? Even if the doctor told her that, why would she rely on it? I wouldn't trust my lawyer's advice on cancer treatments, even if he were willing to give such advice.

 

[SapphireSteel]

For the BDI's -

what exactly was the parents motive to the motive to stage and cover?

Why would they do that? As Burke was a minor, he would not be held criminally responsible.

 

[OpenMind4U]

For the BDI's -

what exactly was the parents motive to the motive to stage and cover?

Why would they do that? As Burke was a minor, he would not be held criminally responsible.

IMO, to keep the dirty secrets under the cover!!!!! JBR murder is ALL about molestation!!!!....it starts with acute sexual assult and finished with hiding the chronic sexual assult. JMO.

 

[Chrishope]

For the BDI's -

what exactly was the parents motive to the motive to stage and cover?

Why would they do that? As Burke was a minor, he would not be held criminally responsible.

I'm not BDI, but I can't resist answering. It's simple, they wouldn't.

 

[BOESP]

Deleted because I can't put into words properly what I'm trying to say, Boesp, I apologise if what I said made no sense, I'm with you most of the way, just was agreeing with what I thought intriguing was saying, but I may have misunderstood his/her meaning.

No problem! :blowkiss:

I just want this case brought to justice.

 

[otg]

Is there a movie in the works based on Kolar's book?

http://player.vimeo.com/video/36008498?title=0
.

 

[OpenMind4U]

Is there a movie in the works based on Kolar's book?

http://player.vimeo.com/video/36008498?title=0
.

Looks like 'documentary'...with the release date December 2011?.....

 

[eileenhawkeye]

For the BDI's -

what exactly was the parents motive to the motive to stage and cover?

Why would they do that? As Burke was a minor, he would not be held criminally responsible.

Okay I am not BDI...I can't choose between BDI and PDI but...

They probably thought that the local media would say that a girl named JonBenet Ramsey was killed by her brother. Everyone who knew the family would know it was Burke. They didn't want that to happen because of the bullying it would cause for Burke, and it would shatter their "perfect family" image.

I don't think they ever thought that people would still know about the case 16 years later. I know they went on CNN, but they probably thought everyone would believe them and the case would just be forgotten in a month. The Internet was in its infancy then. The whole concept of people going online to discuss everything about a case....I doubt it even crossed their minds.

So I think in their minds that night/early morning, they probably thought they would only have to "keep up" with the whole, "Our daughter JonBenet was killed by an intruder" with people they personally knew like friends, family, co-workers, neighbors, etc....NOT with the media/the entire country.

So I think to try to understand why (if) they staged for Burke, you have to forget everything that happened from December 27, 1996 and on because they never could have anticipated it.

 

[otg]

Looks like 'documentary'...with the release date December 2011?.....

I've written to the videographer. I'll post any answer I get.
.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

For the BDI's -

what exactly was the parents motive to the motive to stage and cover?

Why would they do that? As Burke was a minor, he would not be held criminally responsible.

Incest?

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

What do many think of the Bonitia papers? I've come across them and in them Pasty said she put JonBenet to bed wearing the red turtle neck and the white long johns. John says that Pasty and Burke went to bed and he read to JonBenet about ten minutes and then went to bed.

I also saw that there were fibers found under JonBenet's ring when they took it off at the autopsy.

So how much weight should I give them?

 

[Intriguing]

Hey Chrishope! Ironically, after I posted it was your contributions that I've been most struck by mainly because, in my mind, you have been on exactly the right track and then, at the last minute, veered off into precisely the opposite conclusion - with all due deference!

I'll tackle the pediatrician issue in a bit - I was using shorthand and conflated a couple of things which you rightly saw as unconvincing. First I want to react to your main point of conjecture which has consistently stated that the staging, by definition, precludes an accident and Burke's involvement. Au contraire! IMO, that is the element which specifically shouts out that the parents didn't do it.

The weakness with this supposition (again please imply 'with respect' in all I say!), is that it relies on two humans behaving perfectly rationally and logically in the midst of terrifying, extreme circumstances, overcome with grief yet having to operate on autopilot to protect their one surviving child.

If they didn't do it, why would they stage? To cover up for their son. Why? There had been some sexual activity going on - not sexual to a child's mind but certainly something that complicated the simple accident scenario. Without going into details, Burke might have accidentally bashed JB on the head and THEN gone about stabbing her with a paintbrush - or else he had inserted the paintbrush, then she screamed because it hurt; he bashed her to shut her up for fear of discovery out of bed after lights out by his parents. Either way, Burke would have been in shock and, again, his actions not subject to the rationale and lucidity we wrongly presume.

'But the parents must have known they would have been implicated?' Nope - exactly the opposite. They are in shock, terror and John goes into crisis management mode. The one thing they do not give a second thought to is their own implication (it may steadily dawn on them a few hours later). As they HADN'T committed the 'murder' they would have been convinced that the police couldn't implicate them. They wouldn't have had to give this a second thought, even if their state of mind had been calm enough to consider it. They did not do it therefore they wouldn't be in the frame. This seems exactly the reasoning (or lack of objective logic) a traumatised parent might experience whilst unwillingly trying to cover up and protect another child. A Sophie's Choice moment if you will. They were thinking of anything BUT themselves as they weren't the main protagonist.

The staging, whether it was violent or not, occurred BEFORE the Ramseys had sought professional advice. What was the parents' motive to stage as they knew Burke would not be held criminally responsible. THEY HAD NO IDEA he wouldn't be deemed culpable. Why on earth would they know? Child accidentally kills sister. Child complicates the situation by having obviously been 'exploring' his sister's genitalia. Parents stumble into this horror.

Why was the dictionary opened at the entry 'incest'? Was it because Patsy had never heard of it before? A morbid fascination from a predatory paedophile father wanting to relish his evil deeds in a lexical context? No. Surely the action of a grief and horror-stricken mother whose fevered mind is desperately trying to figure out the ramifications of the situation. Maybe their might be some legal viewpoint in the dictionary? If John had perpetrated the crime I hardly think Patsy would need to reassure herself of the consequences of such actions by an adult.

Back to the pediatrician. Yes Chrishope, the legal culpability would not have been her first line of enquiry with him. If, in the week or months preceding this tragedy, there had been irregularities in Burke's behaviour with his sister, it would have been something she would have discussed with the doctor. On the 17th December she had phoned him three times. A pediatrician can not only consult on his patient - he would also be the best person to appraise and consult on the actions of another child i.e. Burke.

Perhaps, the Ramseys had spoken to a lawyer BEFORE the call to the doctor. The lawyer might reasonably have asked, 'does anyone else know about this irregularity between brother and sister?' Patsy would have mentioned the doctor. A good lawyer would then say, temporarily in a crisis, that the next step is to ensure that the doctor would keep the information CONFIDENTIAL. Hence, Patsy makes the call and receives that assurance. If that was a green light the LAWYER might have instructed Patsy to call the police.

So, accident, autonomous staging by parents, phonecalls for professional advice, plan changed subsequent to this advice. Surely this is the only sequence that would explain all the inconsistencies, confusion and silence from the parents. It wasn't a linear trajectory. It was rushed, misguided and aborted - hence erratic at first.

 

[txsvicki]

IMO, to keep the dirty secrets under the cover!!!!! JBR murder is ALL about molestation!!!!....it starts with acute sexual assult and finished with hiding the chronic sexual assult. JMO.

Unless ST was right and there was some abusive cleanin g going on when jonbenet wet and soiled. I see the decision to let a child sleep wet and deny pullups plus wearing of soiled stained undies as abusive. Any pediatrician would have said that some kids bedwet and especially if there is family history you just have to let them outgrow it but patsy was trying to force it. There could have been a rage with jonbenet hit and knowin g it couldn't be properly explained. A full physical would have revealed the former vaginal trauma that had to of resulted in blood and pain.