Japan - Miyazawa family of 4 murdered, Setagaya, Tokyo, 30 Dec 2000 #3

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There’s something puzzling about the fanny pack and the car. If the killer arrived by car, why would he need a fanny bag? One possible explanation, though purely speculative, is that he intended to use the bag to carry something, like heaps of cash, and anticipated needing to climb. This suggests planning of the invasion. It could also imply that he didn’t use a car but arrived on foot or by bike, as a fanny bag would be more practical for hands free movement and would be easier to carry on the back rather than the front.
He carried the knife in it no? The bag was big enough to carry the sashimi knife safely while he either climbed in the window or over the balcony. It wouldn’t look great walking around holding a large knife.
 
Does anyone have an idea what gas / petrol prices were in Japan back in the early 2000s?
 
Right, I believe the nap was speculated upon from previous posts and in dramatisations of the whole event but never confirmed…

Perhaps he just didn’t care and went into the whole thing expecting to be caught anyway? So what the hell, who cares what he leaves behind because he’s for sure going to be caught. I wonder if he maybe had this attitude… and just got extremely, extremely lucky…

I’ve read posts from @Incoherent and now you about it being unlikely he used public transport due to the CCTV and the first trains not starting until around 5am, plus the very noticeable sweater he was speculated to have stolen and worn and the injuries to his hands. He’d stand out to someone surely…

So here I think… if he possibly wasn’t local due to his dumping of clothing and bag for the need to travel and look cleaner, and he didn’t use public transport due to the above, then how did he get home… using a bicycle with injured hands? It would only take him so far… Tokyo is huge. So maybe then a car? Did he drive back home or to the base in a car, or get picked in one…?

JMO for the random Japanese theory.

I think its both.

The Killer was a tourist who came to Tokyo by a car, was living in a motel nearby and was on foot when he first scouted the Miyazawas.

He came back the next day to kill them, hoping for an easy kill. Unfortunately it didn’t turn out that way and he got injured. So he took enough gas money , returned on foot to his hotel, and then went away to his real home some distance away.

Why he left behind his hip bag is also simple. He couldn’t risk someone linking the hip bag to his motel and to his excursion the previous night. Both on the previous night and the night of the murders, the hip bag would have been exposed on his way back home from the Miyazawas, and someone could have maybe noticed that pattern. He didn’t wanna risk that and so he left it behind.

He took the gas money, went back to the motel, did a early checkout, filled his car up and then went off.
 
How I wish I did, but I don’t! If anyone here that lives in Japan could chime in that would be very interesting. But from the pictures I’ve seen of that sweater, it is not exactly hard to spot in a crowd if he did indeed wear it.
And if he didn’t, what did he wear I wonder?
I can't speak to coverage but here is a still from CCTV in late 2000 showing suspects of a COMPLETELY SEPERATE CASE murder in Ibaraki, at a convenience store before the crime. Poor quality but enough to make out clothing and features.

Wanted to caps that in case people think I'm posting suspects in this case.

This is actually the case I mentioned before. Police withheld the images for almost 18 years before the public knew they existed as the men were believed to be minors.

1721592315507.png
 
JMO for the random Japanese theory.

I think its both.

The Killer was a tourist who came to Tokyo by a car, was living in a motel nearby and was on foot when he first scouted the Miyazawas.

He came back the next day to kill them, hoping for an easy kill. Unfortunately it didn’t turn out that way and he got injured. So he took enough gas money , returned on foot to his hotel, and then went away to his real home some distance away.

Why he left behind his hip bag is also simple. He couldn’t risk someone linking the hip bag to his motel and to his excursion the previous night. Both on the previous night and the night of the murders, the hip bag would have been exposed on his way back home from the Miyazawas, and someone could have maybe noticed that pattern. He didn’t wanna risk that and so he left it behind.

He took the gas money, went back to the motel, did an early checkout, filled his car up and then went off.
Not impossible! But would add to the theory that he should have been captured on CCTV if in a hotel or remembered by a clerk as suspicious due to his outfits and injuries… but just wasn’t by either. I believe there was a nationwide search of hotel booking records after the murder but that was perhaps focused on foreigners as I believe they had to have their passports copied if they stayed in a hotel in Japan. I don’t remember all the details on that though…
I can't speak to coverage but here is a still from CCTV in late 2000 showing suspects of a COMPLETELY SEPERATE CASE murder in Ibaraki, at a convenience store before the crime. Poor quality but enough to make out clothing and features.

Wanted to caps that in case people think I'm posting suspects in this case.

This is actually the case I mentioned before. Police withheld the images for almost 18 years before the public knew they existed as the men were believed to be minors.

View attachment 519549
Thank you @TokyoSleuth this is the kind of thing I was hoping to see! If that were convenience store quality do you think a train station’s CCTV would be more or less? If he were captured on CCTV even by the standards in the image you attached, he would definitely be noticeable in the sweater if he wore it… and if he travelled to the house via train, was he already wearing the outfit that he murdered the Miyazawas in? I feel like if he did he would have been seen instantly.
So again it leads me to believe the train wasn’t the method in or out of Kamisoshigaya…
 
No one saw what he wore when he came in. We just know what clothes he left in the house. He could have taken something off and then put back on. I think that the guy is Faceless because he blended into the Japanese reality of the New Year.

One question we never discussed was the weather on that day. Google was of no help. My question is, could it be raining that night? Did the perp wear a raincoat or a thin rain poncho that anyone can pull over?

What Japanese profession could potentially wear a “work robe” or a uniform that could cover anything?

I assume he was unnoticed on the streets of Tokyo in wee hours of late December. Some ideas for covering would include, a raincoat poncho, a loose trenchcoat, a kimono, a mailman’s uniform, maybe a monk’s robe in a darker color? Would a Japanese doctors’ lab coat be white, or is blue OK? Do taxicab or bus drivers themselves wear uniforms? Garbage collectors? Who won’t a Tokyite notice? I assume the policemen themselves are a little bit out of place? Good neighborhoods are aware, but some people are expected and hence, unnoticed. It is seasonal, too.

One more consideration. The Miyazawas actually were going to move in March, meaning at a certain point, there should have been a house inspection, maybe a few? I am thinking, here could be a person who is usually unnoticeable, is aware of the layout of the house and soon, forgotten. But, if he comes back, he could be let in.
 
Thank you for your thoughts @Sor Juana!

Regarding your first point, just how far is he expected to walk before hailing the taxi? From what I understand, though the location of the house was somewhat isolated, the area the family lived was not. So for the point about hailing a taxi from an area not “isolated” it seems he would only need to walk 10 minutes down the street.
However, if we are talking Setagaya as a whole, from my (albeit limited) knowledge of Tokyo… he could have walked hours and still been in Setagaya. If taxi drivers were directed to recall passengers picked up in Setagaya I wonder just how far an injured man, who had shed his clothes, is expected to walk on a winter’s night before hailing a taxi down to be far away enough from the scene to not ring a bell. After all it is named the Setagaya Family Murders. Would he need to walk out of the city entirely before finding the taxi?

About the sweater I also thought the same. Just how sure could the TMPD and family be that he did take and wear that sweater?
Well, from what we do know, he took off his t-shirt and jacket. He could have perhaps worn an undershirt but he obviously wasn’t going outside just in that. While Ann, her husband and kid, had only returned earlier that year to the house (around Spring from what I recall) Haruko had been there the entire time. Yasuko had run the cram school out of her side of the house, so it is only to be expected Haruko had a close relationship with her daughter and the grandkids. There are photos out there of Mikio in that same ABC sweater with Haruko. If I had to guess, she was the one to report that sweater missing. The TMPD would obviously have no idea. The other part of the family may have had ideas too, even though they had only been back less than a year, depending on how much time they spent together.

I do agree it is not impossible that he could have escaped via taxi (less likely) or train (more likely) only that after this long there has been nothing that has led the TMPD to announce they suspect he did. To me that only leaves he escaped via foot or bike, or took a car.

How I wish I did, but I don’t! If anyone here that lives in Japan could chime in that would be very interesting. But from the pictures I’ve seen of that sweater, it is not exactly hard to spot in a crowd if he did indeed wear it.
And if he didn’t, what did he wear I wonder?
Does anyone know what the outside temperature was in Setagaya on the night of the murders? He ditched the coat he had been wearing so was this shirt he had taken from Mikio's closet been enough to combat the cold weather that night if the perp had a long walk home?

I also wondered if it was ever confirmed the shoes he was wearing that night were 'white' in color? Wouldn't the shoes have been splattered with blood? This along with the injuries he sustained to one or both hands would have been one heck of a risk to take when hopping on a train full of curious onlookers.
 
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Does anyone know what the outside temperature was in Setagaya on the night of the murders? He ditched the coat he had been wearing so was this shirt he had taken from Mikio's closet been enough to combat the cold weather that night if the perp had a long walk home?

I also wondered if it was ever confirmed the shoes he was wearing that night were 'white' in color? Wouldn't the shoes have been splattered with blood? This along with the injuries he sustained to one or both hands would have been one heck of a risk to take when hopping on a train full of curious onlookers.
According to this website the temperature in Tokyo was between 6c - 2c that night between 12-6am. What was supposedly stolen was a sweater… so perhaps warm enough to be outside for a little while? But he would’ve definitely been cold if outside for a long time on foot for example…

Edit: @Charlot123 for your question, it also says zero precipitation so I assume no rain that night.

The only pictures I’ve ever seen released from the TMPD shows the shoes as white, with slight variation in the pattern on the shoe… but still a white shoe. And yes I agree, they would’ve had blood on them since he was walking around in the house for hours doing things post-murder… unless he successfully cleaned them before leaving? But I haven’t heard anything about that.

Thoughts?
 
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He carried the knife in it no? The bag was big enough to carry the sashimi knife safely while he either climbed in the window or over the balcony. It wouldn’t look great walking around holding a large knife.
Possibly. This is the most obvious and easiest scenario to imagine. However, it is not the only scenario. For the sake of considering alternative scenarios that can always be ruled out later, the knife could be wrapped in a handkerchief and kept in a pocket, even though some part of it might stick out. One reason to keep a knife in a pocket is for better control. If it were in a bag, it could be risky if one slips and falls on their back, for example. JMO.
 
Possibly. This is the most obvious and easiest scenario to imagine. However, it is not the only scenario. For the sake of considering alternative scenarios that can always be ruled out later, the knife could be wrapped in a handkerchief and kept in a pocket, even though some part of it might stick out. One reason to keep a knife in a pocket is for better control. If it were in a bag, it could be risky if one slips and falls on their back, for example. JMO.
I’m not sure here because the knife was 34cm in length, with the blade itself 21cm… that’s a rather large knife I feel like?
I suppose it could be kept in a pocket but that would need to be a pretty deep pocket… though the bag itself was sizeable, what else did he have in there I wonder? Perhaps he did intend to take things from the house with it but just ended up leaving it behind for what ever reason…
IMG_3472.jpeg
 
According to this website the temperature in Tokyo was between 6c - 2c that night between 12-6am. What was supposedly stolen was a sweater… so perhaps warm enough to be outside for a little while? But he would’ve definitely been cold if outside for a long time on foot for example…

Edit: @Charlot123 for your question, it also says zero precipitation so I assume no rain that night.

The only pictures I’ve ever seen released from the TMPD shows the shoes as white, with slight variation in the pattern on the shoe… but still a white shoe. And yes I agree, they would’ve had blood on them since he was walking around in the house for hours doing things post-murder… unless he successfully cleaned them before leaving? But I haven’t heard anything about that.

Thoughts?
How would they know the color? They can know the size (approximately) and perhaps the brand, but don’t sneakers come in different colors?
 
How would they know the color? They can know the size (approximately) and perhaps the brand, but don’t sneakers come in different colors?
I assumed that the pattern on the sole of the shoe only came in one colour but with a design variation on the shoe and that’s how they were so sure of it.
What do you think?
 
Thank you for your thoughts @Sor Juana!

Regarding your first point, just how far is he expected to walk before hailing the taxi? From what I understand, though the location of the house was somewhat isolated, the area the family lived was not. So for the point about hailing a taxi from an area not “isolated” it seems he would only need to walk 10 minutes down the street.
However, if we are talking Setagaya as a whole, from my (albeit limited) knowledge of Tokyo… he could have walked hours and still been in Setagaya. If taxi drivers were directed to recall passengers picked up in Setagaya I wonder just how far an injured man, who had shed his clothes, is expected to walk on a winter’s night before hailing a taxi down to be far away enough from the scene to not ring a bell. After all it is named the Setagaya Family Murders. Would he need to walk out of the city entirely before finding the taxi?

About the sweater I also thought the same. Just how sure could the TMPD and family be that he did take and wear that sweater?
Well, from what we do know, he took off his t-shirt and jacket. He could have perhaps worn an undershirt but he obviously wasn’t going outside just in that. While Ann, her husband and kid, had only returned earlier that year to the house (around Spring from what I recall) Haruko had been there the entire time. Yasuko had run the cram school out of her side of the house, so it is only to be expected Haruko had a close relationship with her daughter and the grandkids. There are photos out there of Mikio in that same ABC sweater with Haruko. If I had to guess, she was the one to report that sweater missing. The TMPD would obviously have no idea. The other part of the family may have had ideas too, even though they had only been back less than a year, depending on how much time they spent together.

I do agree it is not impossible that he could have escaped via taxi (less likely) or train (more likely) only that after this long there has been nothing that has led the TMPD to announce they suspect he did. To me that only leaves he escaped via foot or bike, or took a car.

How I wish I did, but I don’t! If anyone here that lives in Japan could chime in that would be very interesting. But from the pictures I’ve seen of that sweater, it is not exactly hard to spot in a crowd if he did indeed wear it.
And if he didn’t, what did he wear I wonder?
I do realise that taxi drivers were surveyed extensively. However, it all comes down to the questions they were asked. If they were asked about a single man wearing a sweater with "DIVE" on it, having his wrist bandaged, and travelling from Point Zero (which was close enough to the crime scene), there could be a variety of answers. Apparently, there wasn't a single answer that fit all criteria.

If a taxi driver did not notice a bandaged wrist or if the passenger was wearing a dark trench coat and was calm and polite, this passenger would not attract attention. Let's assume all single men, regardless of their clothes, had to be reported. The police could then receive numerous reports about men catching cabs at different places and going to different locations.

If there were many such reports, how could the TMPD track all those passengers down if they all paid in cash? These days, people use cards, so the police could have transactions to follow. But if you have many reports that partially fit the picture, it leads nowhere.

We don't know if the police got anything potentially interesting, as they only disclose what they think is useful to disclose. Maybe they have no leads and no particularly interesting information about taxi passengers. I do not favour this scenario, but I don't see why it should be dismissed as impossible.

Re: distance, to drive from Setagaya and Shibuya at night takes about 15 min, to walk - 1.5hr for a young athletic man. Although, the closest rout out of Setagaya would be towards the east to Meguro Ward. If you start from Setagaya City Hall, and walk eastwards towards the Meguro Ward boundary, it would take roughly 30-40 min.

I also find that the sweater is a bit conspicuous and would likely be picked up by cameras, even with poor resolution. Now, just an idea, half-serious—what if he wore the sweater inside out, either on purpose or inadvertently, to make the letters invisible? Was it a print or real embroidery? Or maybe he found an old raincoat or a loose trench coat of Mikio's that fit, something Mikio did not wear very often, so the siblings would not remember it. But if he did have a car, in that scenario, it wouldn’t matter what he wore.
 
I do realise that taxi drivers were surveyed extensively. However, it all comes down to the questions they were asked. If they were asked about a single man wearing a sweater with "DIVE" on it, having his wrist bandaged, and travelling from Point Zero (which was close enough to the crime scene), there could be a variety of answers. Apparently, there wasn't a single answer that fit all criteria.

If a taxi driver did not notice a bandaged wrist or if the passenger was wearing a dark trench coat and was calm and polite, this passenger would not attract attention. Let's assume all single men, regardless of their clothes, had to be reported. The police could then receive numerous reports about men catching cabs at different places and going to different locations.

If there were many such reports, how could the TMPD track all those passengers down if they all paid in cash? These days, people use cards, so the police could have transactions to follow. But if you have many reports that partially fit the picture, it leads nowhere.

We don't know if the police got anything potentially interesting, as they only disclose what they think is useful to disclose. Maybe they have no leads and no particularly interesting information about taxi passengers. I do not favour this scenario, but I don't see why it should be dismissed as impossible.

Re: distance, to drive from Setagaya and Shibuya at night takes about 15 min, to walk - 1.5hr for a young athletic man. Although, the closest rout out of Setagaya would be towards the east to Meguro Ward. If you start from Setagaya City Hall, and walk eastwards towards the Meguro Ward boundary, it would take roughly 30-40 min.

I also find that the sweater is a bit conspicuous and would likely be picked up by cameras, even with poor resolution. Now, just an idea, half-serious—what if he wore the sweater inside out, either on purpose or inadvertently, to make the letters invisible? Was it a print or real embroidery? Or maybe he found an old raincoat or a loose trench coat of Mikio's that fit, something Mikio did not wear very often, so the siblings would not remember it. But if he did have a car, in that scenario, it wouldn’t matter what he wore.
All very good points here, and it’s because of these points that I find it astounding he supposedly disappeared without a trace or so much of an inkling of how he did it… for me personally I’ve got to go with he had a car out of there… perhaps not immediate but after he walked or rushed down the path beside the river under darkness to a parked car and then drove off to wherever.

I just feel like if he were on foot the entire time, or took a taxi, or had a hotel there would be something… anything! That would give more of a lead to where he went and how he went there. JMO.
 
I’m not sure here because the knife was 34cm in length, with the blade itself 21cm… that’s a rather large knife I feel like?
I suppose it could be kept in a pocket but that would need to be a pretty deep pocket… though the bag itself was sizeable, what else did he have in there I wonder? Perhaps he did intend to take things from the house with it but just ended up leaving it behind for what ever reason…
View attachment 519613
Yes, sizewise, the bag seems more suitable for carrying a knife of that size. We don’t know exactly what he took from the house besides the cash. Where did he put it? If his right hand was injured, he might have placed the cash in his left pants pocket. Was it large enough to hold all the cash? Alternatively, he could have found a bag from the Miyazawas, similar to his fanny bag, or maybe a canvas bag that looks like a grocery shopping bag, something that appears ordinary. He would have needed something to fit both the cash and possibly other items he stole. It seems plausible that he took a light, loose coat from Mikio, perhaps a hat as well, and probably a bag. JMO.
 
All very good points here, and it’s because of these points that I find it astounding he supposedly disappeared without a trace or so much of an inkling of how he did it… for me personally I’ve got to go with he had a car out of there… perhaps not immediate but after he walked or rushed down the path beside the river under darkness to a parked car and then drove off to wherever.

I just feel like if he were on foot the entire time, or took a taxi, or had a hotel there would be something… anything! That would give more of a lead to where he went and how he went there. JMO.
I completely agree that using a car is the best way to avoid attention. If that was the case, why did he spend so much time at the crime scene? Why didn’t he leave earlier? Although we don’t know the exact time he left, some media reports insist that he spent hours there and left just before dawn.

Regarding cctv, the car could have been captured by traffic cameras. The TMPD likely reviewed all car movements in the area and then tracked down the car owners. JMO.
 
I also wondered if it was ever confirmed the shoes he was wearing that night were 'white' in color? Wouldn't the shoes have been splattered with blood? This along with the injuries he sustained to one or both hands would have been one heck of a risk to take when hopping on a train full of curious onlookers.

RSBM. I am not sure he hopped on a train. A bike, a car or by foot is more likely. It is possible, though, that he went back through the Setagaya park - I think he used it earlier at daytime, either observing the house, or satisfying some other impulses. Wasn’t there a river/lake next to the park? Grass and water is enough to clean the shoes, or maybe, they had some decorative fountain in the park?

Another place that could potentially be used - if that exists… having read about Japanese public attending Shinto or Buddhist temples close to their houses on January 1-2, I started asking myself where was the Miyazawas’ one located? Could it be close to their house and behind the park? This is a great place to hide, as you can keep silent. Also, even if there are monks around, their natural tendency to distance from the world could prevent knowing about the murders. Who else won’t read the morning newspapers? I would not be surprised if the local monks found out about the killings one-two days later, for example. (They could have left the Jizo statue; their style, in fact. They’d do the proper ritual for the departed, and explanations to the living ones is not their job.) By that time, the killer could be far away.

So I am thinking, hiding in the abandoned house nearby then going home; staying in a temple and leaving by Jan 1st; going or biking home or calling to be picked up.

One wonders if TMPD used bloodhounds. Where did the trail lead them?

Are there any bird feeders in Japanese temples?
 
I completely agree that using a car is the best way to avoid attention. If that was the case, why did he spend so much time at the crime scene? Why didn’t he leave earlier? Although we don’t know the exact time he left, some media reports insist that he spent hours there and left just before dawn.

Regarding cctv, the car could have been captured by traffic cameras. The TMPD likely reviewed all car movements in the area and then tracked down the car owners. JMO.
My thoughts on that are that he was resting to regain his energy and trying to stem the bleeding on his hand/hands, as well as rifling through the drawers and documents etc. Though his stay was extended longer than I feel it needed to be… Was he waiting for the right moment to leave if someone were picking him up by car maybe? Or perhaps he was in panic-mode about what he had just done, needed to change his clothing, needed to stem his bleeding, eat and drink something to calm his nerves…

Do you think it’s possible he actually is on CCTV out there somewhere, no matter the mode of transport, and that he’s just been… missed?
 
I completely agree that using a car is the best way to avoid attention. If that was the case, why did he spend so much time at the crime scene? Why didn’t he leave earlier? Although we don’t know the exact time he left, some media reports insist that he spent hours there and left just before dawn.

Regarding cctv, the car could have been captured by traffic cameras. The TMPD likely reviewed all car movements in the area and then tracked down the car owners. JMO.

That depends on the car. Anything out of place in the neighborhood, yes. But not something typical for the area. I am also thinking that the car that “had the right to be there” could be totally missed. A garbage truck or any mail delivery would be missed (I know that Japanese mailmen use bikes, but if the amount is too huge, he could take a car.) Also, NY. Gifts, gifts from abroad since the neighbors recently left GB? Here, FEDEX or USPS, I don’t know what delivery system would be in Japan.

I am also thinking, the intercom and cable for Mikio’s computer. They needed to be installed. Interestingly, when did it happen?
 

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