John Andrew Ramsey

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I believe JAR was right where he said he was. He spent Christmas day with his mom, and later went to a movie. There are a few who believe he flew to Boulder that night for the sole purpose of sexually molesting JonBenet. If that is what he wanted to do, then why not wait until the next night when they'd all be in Charlevoix?
 
I believe JAR was right where he said he was. He spent Christmas day with his mom, and later went to a movie. There are a few who believe he flew to Boulder that night for the sole purpose of sexually molesting JonBenet. If that is what he wanted to do, then why not wait until the next night when they'd all be in Charlevoix?

That makes sense to wait til the next night. Ugh, though. I hope that wasn't what was going on.
Anyway, how do we know he didn't come for Christmas though, and then later they decided to pretend he'd never been there, thus erasing the Christmas video?
Too far fetched?
 
Okay. Let's say that JAR was at his father's home for Christmas. Later that day he takes a three hour flight to Atlanta to buy a movie ticket. After doing that, he then heads back to the airport to fly back to Boulder.
 
John Andrew was CLEARED by the Boulder Police Department. You can look it up on acandyrose.
 
I've always been suspicious of his whereabouts. I know all about the alibi- the ATM photo where you can't really see the face of the person at the machine. The movie ticket (which proves nothing).

I guess what makes me suspicious is that JR got his ex-wife and son a lawyer almost immediately. WHY? If there were not in Boulder they would have nothing to hide. But it was obvious the Rs did not want them talking to police.

This is hearsay, but I know someone who attended the U of Colorado in Boulder that year. He did not know JAR personally, but he knew who he was- he was fairly well known on campus. I spoke to this kid when he was home on break and as soon as he heard about what happened, he said he thought JAR had to have something to do with it. He said JAR was "obsessed" with his little sister to the point that it was weird.
 
I wonder what obsessed meant? I guess the kid heard it from someone else, but does it mean talking about her constantly, pics in his room, or jealous?
 
I've always been suspicious of his whereabouts. I know all about the alibi- the ATM photo where you can't really see the face of the person at the machine. The movie ticket (which proves nothing).

I guess what makes me suspicious is that JR got his ex-wife and son a lawyer almost immediately. WHY? If there were not in Boulder they would have nothing to hide. But it was obvious the Rs did not want them talking to police.

This is hearsay, but I know someone who attended the U of Colorado in Boulder that year. He did not know JAR personally, but he knew who he was- he was fairly well known on campus. I spoke to this kid when he was home on break and as soon as he heard about what happened, he said he thought JAR had to have something to do with it. He said JAR was "obsessed" with his little sister to the point that it was weird.

I too think it's odd for JR to get his ex-wife and son a lawyer. I could see the son, as he lived/stayed in the house at times, but an ex-wife?
 
I have to believe in my heart that there is a limited number of people that would lie for JAR.
I do have questions though why there were fibers from JBR shirt on the comforter in the suitcase.
 
I have to believe in my heart that there is a limited number of people that would lie for JAR.
I do have questions though why there were fibers from JBR shirt on the comforter in the suitcase.

Someone probably wrapped her in said comforter, changed their mind, and put it in the suitcase. When the comforter was removed from her, it picked up fibers from her top. And, if I remember correctly, it was her first time wearing that item of clothing.
 
Someone probably wrapped her in said comforter, changed their mind, and put it in the suitcase. When the comforter was removed from her, it picked up fibers from her top. And, if I remember correctly, it was her first time wearing that item of clothing.

You are right icedtea4me. I vaguely remember someone saying they checked at the store that JBR's top was purchased from and it was a new design that year.
Someone had that baby all over that house.
 
I've always been suspicious of his whereabouts. I know all about the alibi- the ATM photo where you can't really see the face of the person at the machine. The movie ticket (which proves nothing).

I guess what makes me suspicious is that JR got his ex-wife and son a lawyer almost immediately. WHY? If there were not in Boulder they would have nothing to hide. But it was obvious the Rs did not want them talking to police.

This is hearsay, but I know someone who attended the U of Colorado in Boulder that year. He did not know JAR personally, but he knew who he was- he was fairly well known on campus. I spoke to this kid when he was home on break and as soon as he heard about what happened, he said he thought JAR had to have something to do with it. He said JAR was "obsessed" with his little sister to the point that it was weird.

That last part is weird...

I don't think JAR could successfully fly back and forth undetected. Too many ways to cross check, but it is suspicious that he needed a lawyer, as was his response about what he believes the "killer deserves."

To me, if he's guilty of anything, it's the knowledge of what that household was like....i.e., JR was a child molester, or BR was a little psychopath, or that PR was obsessed with being perfect and was abusive herself. That's how I see him fitting into this whole thing.
 
Didn't he say that the killer deserved forgiveness? Very odd response to such a brutal murder of his half-sister.

Yup, beyond bizarre IMO, just like dear old dad's comments. I'm not advocating they start ranting and raving about personally killing the perpetrator, but where's the outrage? Where's the demand for justice for their brutally murdered family member?

That's why I can't accept all the lawyering up they did. I get--to a point--the feeling that they needed to ensure they weren't railroaded, but the lying, obfuscation, and outright circumvention of the process was/is inexcusable IMO.

Innocent people don't behave that way.
 
When Burke was going to be reinterviewd, CNN had an article about it and you could comment. This was one of the comments:

My dad's best friend was a neighbor of the Ramseys and a friend of Patsy's. He's always believed the most likely suspect was John Ramsey's older son from a previous marriage (and that John Ramsey's wealth was the motive for what was meant to be a kidnapping/ransom attempt, which went wrong). It would explain how intruders could know the layout of the house even though the oldest son was in another state at the time. I don't really know anything about the oldest son, and he may be a perfectly decent person, but I think the scenario sounds plausible

I'm skeptical of people who claim to have a close/intimate connection to this case due to how notorious it is. However, the Ramseys did have neighbors so there are people out there who were friends with their neighbors so this post could be legitimate. Now if it's true, then why did the neighbor suspect JAR? If he or she was a friend of Patsy's, then they had probably met JAR on some occasions. Was there something they didn't like about him? Could this neighbor be Barnhill? It says, "Friend of Patsy's" though so that makes me think it's a woman. Maybe his wife? Was he a widower when JBR was murdered?

Here's another tidbit about JAR, that I found on another forum, which was found on another forum so who knows how legitimate it is but I'll post it anyway:

"Classmates of JAR have stated for the record that he talked about JonBenet all the time... How beautiful she was and how much he loved her. He was fixated on her...Probably just a proud older brother talking but some of classmates thought is was strange to say the least."

Here's some other info about JAR:

Gosage and I interviewed twenty-year-old John Andrew Ramsey. He was a lanky young man with dark eyes and short dark hair, who wore a checkered shirt, a winter jacket, and an attitude. When the blood tech moved close with her needle, the former Eagle Scout, who was now a third-semester sophomore at the University of Colorado, whispered, "I may pass out."

Although he also claimed to have been in Atlanta when the crime occurred, we had to check him out because of the neighbor who had reported seeing him on Christmas Day. We had to determine who was right.

We asked him to put his thoughts on paper, and he wrote a document that brimmed with feelings about his little stepsister being murdered, giving us a glimpse into his world. He caught our attention immediately by writing, "I think it was someone that had intimate knowledge of my family and how we lived day to day. Why would they leave the ransom note on the back staircase instead of the front?" Good question, I thought. How would a stranger know which stairway Patsy Ramsey would come down that morning?

He ridiculed the idea of a small foreign faction being involved, was certain the crime had nothing to do with his father's company, and questioned why a ransom note was left at all. "Why did they ask for $118,000? I could pay that amount," he wrote. Someone was envious of their wealth and thought of the Ramseys as "rich bastards," he said.

John Andrew told us that whoever did this was probably uneducated, were amateurs at kidnapping, and had seen the movie Ransom, in which the family of Mel Gibson's character was a "spitting image" of his own. He did not believe anyone came in through the broken basement window. They had a key, he surmised.

In one comment, he described his stepmother as "flashy" and guessed that the killer might be someone close to her.

John Andrew also buttressed the comments of the housekeeper's husband, Mervin Pugh, and former nanny Suzanne Savage about the house being difficult to navigate. "You don't know your way around real easy right off the bat. . . . You have to open lots of doors. It has lots of ups and downs," and the basement entrance was hard to find. It was becoming very clear to the police just how difficult it would have been for any stranger to get to that distant basement storage room."


And here's an email from JAR:

"After M, S and I arrived in Denver we proceded to the house. As soon as we arrived J and P were in the street, they had just found JB. It was a bad scene. Very quickly S and I got in John Fernies van with my dad. Melinda went with Patsy in I think Fleets car. NO ONE WAS THINKING. We just got in the nearest car and drove. NO THOUGHTS. That is when my dad told us he found JB and she was dead. NO THOUGHTS. We prayed and drove to the Fernies. I would imagine that is when Stewart got his information, I was probably sitting right there but I don't remember.

"...my parents were destroyed. They were not thinking about their own butt, or covering up any crimes. They were just not plainly thinking straight. No one was, or could think."

"I will never be able to explain the feelings and thoughts of that day. From the moment of the phone call with my dad until we arrived in Denver was maddening. We had to get on a plane, that was first. I was constantly scanning the crowd, for what I have no idea. By the time we were on the plane I had come to the realization that JB was dead. A couple of weeks earlier I had watched a Geraldo show about kidnappings, they had the parents on, none of the kids had survived. I knew the chances were not good, I just prayed that she was not in any pain. I don't think you would call it an out of body experience b/c lots of my senses were heightened. I was scared, angry and nervous. However, other functions shut down. I was not rational, I was not thinking ahead, I was not thinking at all. It is survival instincts at their best. Survive in the moment and not worry about the future."

"My point is this. To build a case around the hours following the crime are ridiculus. Behavior can not be accounted for during these times. It would seem much more logical to seek answers in the other fifty plus years of ones life, rather than the moments of one's darkests period."

"I can't answer for Stewart, I can't answer for my Dad. I can only provide some insight to the psyche during such a period of high stress."




Ramsey's son accused in assault
By Michael O'Keeffe
Rocky Mountain News Staff Writer
April 4, 1997
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A photographer working for the National Enquirer told police that he was assaulted by John Ramsey's eldest son at Denver International Airport this week.

Alan E. Butterfield, 33, of Salt Lake City, said he was photographing John Andrew Ramsey Monday in DIA's Concourse B. Ramsey had just arrived on a flight from Atlanta.

Butterfield is a free-lance photographer who said he was on assignment for the supermarket tabloid.

Ramsey, 20, swung his hands at Butterfield and knocked Butterfield's camera from his hands, the photographer said.

The back of the camera was then knocked open and the lens was damaged.

Investigators said last month that John Andrew Ramsey is not a suspect in the death of his stepsister, 6-year-old JonBenet Ramsey.



Edited to add:

ST: And I have spoken with Linda, and she’s identified this suitcase as belonging to, well not necessarily belonging to, but a suitcase that she has used and that John Andrew has used, and that John Andrew likely had left at your house.
PR: Right.
ST: Do you recognize that blue suitcase?
PR: Yes.
ST: OK. Can you tell me anything about it?
PR: Well, just it’s old hard Samsonite or whatever, you know.
ST: And what this something that John Andrew let at the 15th Street home while he went to school at CU?
PR: Yeah, yeah, that’s to my recollection. Yeah, he moved out here with a bunch of stuff and then he left a lot of stuff t our house that he didn’t want to take to the dorm.
ST: Do you know where he kept that in your home, or where you last saw that?
PR: No, I don’t remember where I last saw it.
ST: OK.
PR: He, I don’t know.
ST: Where would John Andrew store his other items and affects?
PR: Some of the things are in his room I think, in the closet, and I think he put a bunch of stuff down in the basement. A computer, he had a computer and a printer, and I think that might have been in the basement too. It’s pretty big, I think it was in the basement.
ST: Do you know what room in the basement he would have, his stuff was stored in? Was it in the train room, or the…
PR: It wasn’t, I don’t know now, there was so much stuff down there. I can, it could have been anywhere.
 
Didn't he say that the killer deserved forgiveness? Very odd response to such a brutal murder of his half-sister.


BPD Detective Jim Byfield, Your Affiant, filed an affidavit for a search warrant based, in part on Linda Arndt's police report. During Patsy's interview, she states that she thinks the computer and printer in the basement belong to JAR.


From the 01/31/97 Search Warrant:

On December 28, 1996 Your Affiant saw a computer, monitor, mouse, printer, and removable computer storage media. Your Affiant saw this equipment in the play room area on the second floor of the Ramsey residence at 755 15 Street, Boulder Colorado. [snip] Officer Yamaguchi told Your Affiant that he saw a modem near the computer that was in the play room area of the residence. Officer Yamaguchi [snip] further stated that, using his personal computer, he found that John Ramsey in Boulder, Colorado was a subscriber to Compuserve. [snip] With this information, Officer Yamaguchi told Your Affiant that an investigator could determine if the computer was used to view text or images involving child *advertiser censored*.



On December 28, 1996 Your Affiant saw a compact video camera, compact video tapes, and standard size video tapes inside the Ramsey residence at 755 15th Street Boulder, Colorado. You Affiant personally knows that Detective Linda Arndt [snip] has attended classes on the investigation of child sexual assault cases. [snip] She further stated that they can conceal such videos within commercially labeled video tapes. She further stated to your Affiant that these images may or may not be obviously pornographic in nature. Detective Arndt also told Your Affiant that child molesters have been known to video tape the murder of their victim(s).
 
Just for what it's worth- my daughter was friends with a young man who attended the U of C at Boulder in 1996. She visited him there over the February (1997) break, and of course the case was red-hot at the time.
He did not know JAR personally, but did know who he was. The Rs were, as we know, prone to flaunt their wealth and perceived power. This young man said that it was well-known that JAR was "obsessed" with his little sister. When he heard about the murder, the first thing he said was "He (JAR) had to have something to do with it.

Not that this has any great impact on the case, but when I read the above post about JAR's classmates feeling he was obsessed with JB, I though I'd add my :twocents:
 
I was blown away. We had just found a credible witness who heard John Ramsey say he’d discovered the body two hours earlier than we previously believed. That punched a big hole in the generally accepted timeline. Eleven o’clock would have been just about the time John Ramsey temporarily vanished from the sight of Detective Arndt, when she thought he had gone out to get the mail. I recalled how Arndt described the marked change in his behavior after he came back, silent, brooding, and nervous.

JonBenet: Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation



I am blown away by this, it really stopped me on my tracks.
 
Just thought I had better add that I have no idea why there was such a pronounced and markedly difference in his mourning of his two daughters. I do question the reason behind it, and can only surmise that if another of his children were behind JonBenets death, I believe he would have gone into survival mode for his other offspring.

Sorry but no. Every single person mourns differently. The end of a relationship, the death of a loved one, the end of a cycle...nobody mourns the same. losing not one but two daughters in a lifetime must be a terrible blow and you can't expect John Ramsey to have mourned replicating the same pattern twice, he is not a robot. How can you even make this statement? We have no idea how he grieved for each one of his daughters in private.
 

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