Judge's Order re: OP's Mental Health Eval Thread #42

[ColonelMustard]

Welcome back!

Is this the SA attorney's blog you're referring to?

http://criminallawza.net/2013/02/28/what-if-you-shoot-the-wrong-person/

It's not but it may be even better!!

Thank you for this! Thanks too to Harmony2 for suggesting I go back through my browser history. I tried that and couldn't find it, which is totally ridiculous!

 

[ColonelMustard]

FYI An insight into the teenage Oscar Pistorius who states that he has adapted to and is quite comfortable with prosthetic legs as he has grown up that way. It also shows his interest in art/drawing and playing his 'jack russell' dog. He answers questions, but IMO there is still something monotone/flat about his affect.

A Teenage Oscar Pistorius on Trans World Sport - YouTube

watching this made me very sad. To think that he would end up a murderer when, perhaps, things could have gone so differently. It honestly breaks my heart.

I don't know why I have this nagging feeling that something went very wrong in the boat accident because he turned into a real jerk after that. Somewhere I read/heard that his trip to New York when he was on Jay Lenos show marked a change in him.

Maybe before then he was wise enough not to believe his own press releases, after that he wasn't.

 

[Karmady]

September 2012[/B]
He was enraged upon returning home from London 2012 Olympics to discover that his girlfriend, Sam Taylor, had allegedly cheated on him. He approached Van der Burgh and swore at him about his relationship with Sam. At the time, Van der Burgh was sitting with numerous businessmen and was embarrassed by what happened. He then laid a charge of intimidation against OP.

The animosity escalated and Van der Burgh received numerous SMSes threatening him. Mark Batchelor heard about what had happened and began defending Van der Burgh. OP and Batchelor exchanged threats via SMS during which OP is alleged to have told Batchelor that he would break his legs.

snipped by me:

I'm absolutely sure someone posted that Sam said she "broke up" with Oscar because he cheated on her with Reeva?

eta: not the post I was thinking of, but zweibel's transcription of her testimony says:

He cheated on her twice she says. Second time with Reeva, first time I did not catch the name, if she said one. Probably a good friend, from the way she broke down.

Roux calling her untruthful like that so early backfired badly, imo.

from post 89 on the 3/7/14 thread

 

[ColonelMustard]

Welcome back Colonel. I too have been looking for a few things, and doesn't it drive you nuts. Many threads ago I posted "Criminal law of South Africa", part of which I've quoted below. Is this what you were looking for?

"What if you shoot the ‘wrong’ person?
Posted: February 28, 2013 in Education


http://criminallawza.net/2013/02/28/what-if-you-shoot-the-wrong-person/[/QUOTE

Thanks so much for this. You guys on this site are completely on top of so many things!

 

[Karmady]

I'm watching a pre-trial dateline talking about Oscar's "afraid of violence" defense. This was way before the trial so, apparently, not a new development by any standard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=YYRFEnT9-d0

eta: at about 11:00-12:00

 

[ColonelMustard]

I think this one from prof James Grant is new. All about SA law.

http://wp.me/p3efQr-2U

Now I know why i am not a lawyer ... And never will be!. Trying to figure all that out gave me a headache... And I never did figure it out.

was it here that I read that he could get as low as 5 years? If I was reevas family and heard his testimony and he got 5 years ... even 10... It would make me sick that that was all my daughters life was worth.

I really think they gave him a huge benefit of the doubt up until they heard him, then that was if. The sister and maybe June too called him a disgusting liar. I think they could have come to terms with things if they truly believed it was some horrible accident but it was crystal clear, imho, from his testimony that it was cold blooded murder. .. And that he was LYING about it to save his own neck, was just too much.. In their shoes, I'd go from one extreme to the other, also.

I don't know whether it's in this trial, and/or others, that the family rallies behind the murderer feeling one life is lost, the murder victim can't come back but there's still a living person who's life they should "save" because it's the only life left TO save.

I honestly don't know what I would do if my kid was a murderer. I was shocked that both sets of parents from columbine still live right where they always did. Even if I thought my mid was innocent, I'd move away and change my name. whether warranted or not, I wouldn't be able to stand the shame.

 

[wb180]

I'm watching a pre-trial dateline talking about Oscar's "afraid of violence" defense. This was way before the trial so, apparently, not a new development by any standard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=YYRFEnT9-d0

eta: at about 11:00-12:00

..."persistently living in a state of fear and terror"...

He can really live in a state of fear and terror in prison

 

[zwiebel]

According to the info on RT Kendall's photo with OP, it was taken Saturday 24th, not Monday. Maybe he wrote the tweet and took the photo Saturday but only posted it Monday, without updating?

http://ow.ly/i/5GVEv

Some very supportive msgs for OP coming in, including from family, with people pleased to see him looking so happy.
https://mobile.twitter.com/DrRTKendall/status/470943119727665152

 

[zwiebel]

I may have a suspicious mind, but it seems OP's team have been very careful not to allow photos of OP appearing happy or enjoying himself to leak out - in case it's seen as in poor taste?

So is it just coincidence that one of the few that does slip through, happens to be with the author of the bestselling book, 'Total Forgiveness'?

 

[Interested Bystander]

I may have a suspicious mind, but it seems OP's team have been very careful not to allow photos of OP appearing happy or enjoying himself to leak out - in case it's seen as in poor taste?

So is it just coincidence that one of the few that does slip through, happens to be with the author of the bestselling book, 'Total Forgiveness'?

When one does leak out it makes me realise just what an act he puts on in court. I am still a little fearful that somehow he will get away with murder but hopeful that I am entirely wrong. 25 Years inside would be about right!

 

[Estelle]

I had not thought of this before:

From an article published on 6 September 2012

"I want to take a step back and explore the rise of the Oscar phenomenon and suggest that, for far too long, Pistorius has been cheating the classification system that is central to the ethos of Paralympic sport."

http://theconversation.com/pistorius-shouldnt-be-allowed-to-compete-at-the-paralympics-9278

It could be argued that Pistorius – and those impaired in a similar manner such as Oliveira – should not be competing in the London Paralympic Games because to do so is unfair on the majority of athletes in their events.

The simple fact is that double below-the-knee amputees – such as Pistorius – have an unfair advantage over single below-the-knee amputees – the majority of Oscar’s competitors.

Many of the athletes that Oscar competes against in Paralympic competitions are single below-the-knee amputees (T44) and as such have difficulty balancing the uneven ground forces between their human leg and the lower-leg prosthesis during running.

Since there are not enough class T43 athletes running at an elite level (IPC rules state the ranking lists must be ten athletes deep from at least four nations) Pistorius should not be eligible to compete in the Paralympics.

According to the Guardian "The International Paralympic Committee has promised to try and split the categories in time for Rio."

 

[Estelle]

<Respectfully snipped>

Sept 2008
At Beijing Paralympics he didn’t like the running vest and shorts supplied to him and wanted to go on the air and complain.

His roommate moved because OP was always shouting at people on the phone.

21 February 2009
Boating accident

10 March 2009
An accident happened on the N4 highway when a female friend of his knocked over and killed a pedestrian. OP prohibited press photographers from taking pictures of the scene. When they asked why he was quoted as saying “Because I am Oscar Pistorius”.

12 September 2009
Arrested for assault after slamming a door so hard that the top of it shattered and flying pieces injured a woman’s leg after he chased her from his house where he was having a party. The matter settled out of court.

28 October 2011
Incident at a concert where he was physically and verbally abusive to two women. He was very drunk.

May 2012
During workouts at the gym prior to the Olympics his swearing astonished mothers and children also using the gym.

2 September 2012
Suffered a shock loss in the final of the Paralympic 200m and lashed out at Alan Oliveira who beat him to the gold. He apologized the day after, not for what he said, but for the timing of it at the track right after the race in front of hordes of media.

September 2012
He was enraged upon returning home from London 2012 Olympics to discover that his girlfriend, Sam Taylor, had allegedly cheated on him. He approached Van der Burgh and swore at him about his relationship with Sam. At the time, Van der Burgh was sitting with numerous businessmen and was embarrassed by what happened. He then laid a charge of intimidation against OP.

The animosity escalated and Van der Burgh received numerous SMSes threatening him. Mark Batchelor heard about what had happened and began defending Van der Burgh. OP and Batchelor exchanged threats via SMS during which OP is alleged to have told Batchelor that he would break his legs.

September 2012
Fired his pistol out of a car’s open sunroof after a heated argument with a police officer.

January 2013
Fired a gun under a table in Tasha’s Restaurant.

April 2013
On his first public outing since bail he attended the Kitchen Bar Restaurant, flirted with several women and inappropriately patted a friend’s girlfriend on the bottom.

Several years prior to 2013
Drove over a dog that darted in front of his car, breaking its back. He got out of his car and shot it in the head without speaking to the owner who was shouting and screaming, got in his car and drove off.

Feel free to delete any you're not interested in.

BIB I think you will find that this occurred in November, 2012.

Oscar ‘Blade Runner’ Pistorius ‘threatened to break man’s legs’
By Eurosport 21 November 2012 14:48 World of Sport

https://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blog...rius-threatened-break-man-legs-144818024.html

 

[Estelle]

snipped by me:

I'm absolutely sure someone posted that Sam said she "broke up" with Oscar because he cheated on her with Reeva?

eta: not the post I was thinking of, but zweibel's transcription of her testimony says:

He cheated on her twice she says. Second time with Reeva, first time I did not catch the name, if she said one. Probably a good friend, from the way she broke down.

Roux calling her untruthful like that so early backfired badly, imo.

from post 89 on the 3/7/14 thread

First time he cheated on Sam was with Anastassia in New York. I reported this one page back.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

snipped by me:

I'm absolutely sure someone posted that Sam said she "broke up" with Oscar because he cheated on her with Reeva?

eta: not the post I was thinking of, but zweibel's transcription of her testimony says:

He cheated on her twice she says. Second time with Reeva, first time I did not catch the name, if she said one. Probably a good friend, from the way she broke down.

Roux calling her untruthful like that so early backfired badly, imo.

from post 89 on the 3/7/14 thread

Olympic Blade Runner Oscar Pistorious Dating Russian Model Anastassia Khozissova
By Gabe Zaldivar , Pop Culture Lead Writer
Jul 17, 2012

The New York Post (h/t SportsGrid) reports the double amputee who may just engulf the London Games with controversy is dating a model that some are saying is one of the hottest in the world.

 

[Estelle]

Olympic Blade Runner Oscar Pistorious Dating Russian Model Anastassia Khozissova
By Gabe Zaldivar , Pop Culture Lead Writer
Jul 17, 2012

The New York Post (h/t SportsGrid) reports the double amputee who may just engulf the London Games with controversy is dating a model that some are saying is one of the hottest in the world.

Sam Taylor probably thought her romance with OP was over when she read this in the media. Hence why she probably chose to accept Van Der Burgh's invitation.

But it was Sam Taylor whom he took to the Seychelles in October, 2012.

Then in November 2012 he took Reeva to the Sports Awards Night. That was also the day also that OP argued with Van Der Burgh when OP bumped into him at a car rally and when he met Reeva.

 

[Val1]

<Respectfully snipped>



Okay Lyra, this is the best I could come up with:

Sept 2008
At Beijing Paralympics he didn’t like the running vest and shorts supplied to him and wanted to go on the air and complain.

His roommate moved because OP was always shouting at people on the phone.

21 February 2009
Boating accident

10 March 2009
An accident happened on the N4 highway when a female friend of his knocked over and killed a pedestrian. OP prohibited press photographers from taking pictures of the scene. When they asked why he was quoted as saying “Because I am Oscar Pistorius”.

12 September 2009
Arrested for assault after slamming a door so hard that the top of it shattered and flying pieces injured a woman’s leg after he chased her from his house where he was having a party. The matter settled out of court.

28 October 2011
Incident at a concert where he was physically and verbally abusive to two women. He was very drunk.

May 2012
During workouts at the gym prior to the Olympics his swearing astonished mothers and children also using the gym.

2 September 2012
Suffered a shock loss in the final of the Paralympic 200m and lashed out at Alan Oliveira who beat him to the gold. He apologized the day after, not for what he said, but for the timing of it at the track right after the race in front of hordes of media.

September 2012
He was enraged upon returning home from London 2012 Olympics to discover that his girlfriend, Sam Taylor, had allegedly cheated on him. He approached Van der Burgh and swore at him about his relationship with Sam. At the time, Van der Burgh was sitting with numerous businessmen and was embarrassed by what happened. He then laid a charge of intimidation against OP.

The animosity escalated and Van der Burgh received numerous SMSes threatening him. Mark Batchelor heard about what had happened and began defending Van der Burgh. OP and Batchelor exchanged threats via SMS during which OP is alleged to have told Batchelor that he would break his legs.

September 2012
Fired his pistol out of a car’s open sunroof after a heated argument with a police officer.

January 2013
Fired a gun under a table in Tasha’s Restaurant.

April 2013
On his first public outing since bail he attended the Kitchen Bar Restaurant, flirted with several women and inappropriately patted a friend’s girlfriend on the bottom.

Several years prior to 2013
Drove over a dog that darted in front of his car, breaking its back. He got out of his car and shot it in the head without speaking to the owner who was shouting and screaming, got in his car and drove off.

Feel free to delete any you're not interested in.

You may want to give this article a read for any other instances that might fit the bill;

http://www.macleans.ca/news/world/oscar-pistorius-from-the-podium-to-purgatory/

But he also wrote of their “fiery” rows, including one meltdown over the phone after which he resolved to drive all night from Durban to Johannesburg to patch things up—a distance of 650 km. He ended up falling asleep at the wheel and plowing his car into a guardrail.

 

[jay-jay]

I had not thought of this before:

From an article published on 6 September 2012


http://theconversation.com/pistorius-shouldnt-be-allowed-to-compete-at-the-paralympics-9278

It could be argued that Pistorius – and those impaired in a similar manner such as Oliveira – should not be competing in the London Paralympic Games because to do so is unfair on the majority of athletes in their events.

The simple fact is that double below-the-knee amputees – such as Pistorius – have an unfair advantage over single below-the-knee amputees – the majority of Oscar’s competitors.

Many of the athletes that Oscar competes against in Paralympic competitions are single below-the-knee amputees (T44) and as such have difficulty balancing the uneven ground forces between their human leg and the lower-leg prosthesis during running.

Since there are not enough class T43 athletes running at an elite level (IPC rules state the ranking lists must be ten athletes deep from at least four nations) Pistorius should not be eligible to compete in the Paralympics.

According to the Guardian "The International Paralympic Committee has promised to try and split the categories in time for Rio."

BBM .. I personally find that can be said of the whole of the Paralympic games and is why I never really watch with very much enthusiasm. I know that they try the best they can to put people into categories to limit the advantages/disadvanges but I still can't see how, if you are not racing against like with like, that it can ever be fair .. you do really need to have people with the exact same disabilities in order to make it truly fair, and even then there can be some dispute over it such as in the case of OP and Oliveira where they both have the same disability but have different blades because of their differing physical stature. But then I guess that could also be said of the able bodied olympics too, as those athletes all come in different shapes and sizes, so I guess it's not really any different when it comes to the paralympics.

The one thing I never understood is why Pistorius ran in the able bodied events .. I don't think it matters whether he has an advantage, disadvantage from wearing the blades, to me it's the fact that it's not the same event .. one is running, and the other is blade running .. and I always just got the impression that OP felt himself more superior to the rest of them in the paralympics that he pushed to run in the able bodied events, as well as the paras. It can't have been anything to do with no-one else being as fast as him in the paras, because Oliveira beat him.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

I have read through Vorsters assessment again and here is a thought I feel is worth considering. In just three days, OP has now been under professional observation for longer than Vorster spent with him.

Remember, she only interviewed him on the 2nd & 7th of May and managed to arrive at the conclusions she did with supplementary information from his close friends & family. Four of these people, Aimee, Carl, Peet & Ampie were interviewed on the same day - 5th of May. ( I bet most of you know where I am going with this already

The other interview with Mrs Binge, was also carried out on the same day that OP's first session took place, May the 2nd….

So not a full day of assessment on the 2nd of May, followed by four interviews on the 5th of May (which was a trial day too.) Vorster then has a couple of days to let all this sink in before (and this is giving the benefit of the doubt here,) one full day of assessment on the 7th. From that, Vorster had enough collateral to sit on the stand for a day and a half.

OP has already has had more professional, clinical assessment in three days, than he had in this botched attempt to shroud proceedings with a diminished responsibility defence.

The detail these assessors will already have is greater than Vorster managed, and there are potentially three more weeks of analysis. It is only my humble opinion, but I cannot see this assessment lasting the full 30 days. It must already be becoming clear to these professionals the likely diagnosis, (if any,) when compared to the ad hoc shambles of Vorsters testimony.

 

[jay-jay]

You may want to give this article a read for any other instances that might fit the bill;

http://www.macleans.ca/news/world/oscar-pistorius-from-the-podium-to-purgatory/

But he also wrote of their &#8220;fiery&#8221; rows, including one meltdown over the phone after which he resolved to drive all night from Durban to Johannesburg to patch things up&#8212;a distance of 650 km. He ended up falling asleep at the wheel and plowing his car into a guardrail.

That's the same distance as driving from London to Glasgow, just over 400 miles .. :scared:

 

[Val1]

First time he cheated on Sam was with Anastassia in New York. I reported this one page back.

This article, among many many others certainly contain a lot regarding OP's past "incidents".

http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/the-meteoric-rise-and-fall-of-a-hero-1.1471757

Allegations are that the on-and-off noise of an apparently protracted argument would go on for hours until neighbours finally called security and the police about 1am.

Pistorius took her as his date to the awards that very night. This was apparently in spite of the fact that the athlete had a girlfriend at the time.

Samantha Taylor immediately went public, calling him a love cheat and questioning his honesty. There had also been rumours that he was seeing a Russian supermodel while he and Taylor were together.