Found Deceased Ks - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #31

[Jackeee]

I wonder if the case against JH will proceed. There is no longer a need for a protection order for EG's boys. They are protected from her now forever. I really think that was the whole point of her ex filing anything anyway.....to keep the boys away from her.
Not to discount that JH may have been rough with one of the boys, but I just think the reason for the arrest and the result intended is gone.

I think there are still some points to
be made here. I know that I wouldn’t let it go.

 

[andalso]

I have had such intense anger and HATRED in my heart for EG for so long. I loathed everything about her, picked everything apart such as her appearance at court to every word she's ever spoken, to every action ever detailed in a report. My worst fear was her getting away with killing sweet innocent little Lucas. I think some of my anger spilled out into my daily life, with my interactions with others, because I was so darn frustrated and worried we'd never seen justice.

Then, I saw some hope when the unverified information about Lucas' possibly dying in the bathroom of the house on Edgemore the 10th or 11th, and that that information may have come from a 2nd autopsy. I thought finally...answers are coming to light. Lucas just might get the justice he so deserves. I was still furious, but we were all hot on the trail again as things seemed to make more sense with those dates and we scrambled and made it all fit pretty much.

Then, Emily's suicide happened. I wasn't glad. At first, I thought, yes, she took the easy way out and that was not justice. The weird thing is, I don't know where that anger is now. I'm angry that she took Lucas' life away in a general, human sense, but the intense anger I felt so directly towards her has mostly dissipated. And in it's place, is just an emptiness almost. It feels good to let go of so much of that anger and hatred. I think there were a lot of reasons she killed herself, and not to say I'm pro-suicide but I probably would've done the same thing. But look at what it has caused for those who may have loved her...sorrow, for some, I'm sure. And I even feel, dare I say, some compassion for even JH now.

This is probably not a popular opinion, and that's ok. This has been a horrific case with so much tragedy, I myself am finally relieved I'm still not bursting at the seams with anger and bitterness . Instead, I feel like we will get some answers and that some good (perhaps changes or additions in laws regarding child protection) may come from this. This case has wrung me out and hung me up to dry, and I am so sad, but at least I have more hope than ever before.

JMO.

Your words sum up a lot of what I am feeling/struggling with. Great post! Thank you!

 

[andalso]

I was talking to a friend who is a social worker about this case and she said - you know some people don't have the skills or ability to parent and nurture a child properly but it doesn't mean they don't love that child. What is common sense to some is not common sense to all what is natural for some has to be learned by others.

I agree with your friend. Somehow, I can't quite bring myself to believe that EG loved her kids, though. Maybe she did, in some bizarre way that I can't comprehend.

I had thought @Busylady was speaking about JH in their post, not EG?

 

[Busylady]

I had thought @Busylady was speaking about JH in their post, not EG?

I was talking in general about all involved in this sad situation.

 

[andalso]

I was talking in general about all involved in this sad situation.

In my opinion, EG did not have the capacity to love, at least in her current state of mind (meth).

 

[liltexans]

I had thought @Busylady was speaking about JH in their post, not EG?

I apologize if I misunderstood. I definitely think JH and his family and JO and her family loved Lucas.

 

[Steelslady]

It has taken me time to absorb the fact that EG's death essentially ended this case.
It seems unfair at first glance...but as I have thought on it more, I am not as angry about this outcome.
I feel really bad saying that.
Just my opinion.

I don't think it would have mattered in the long run, for me, the case ended when they found Lucas.

She's lied the last 3 and 1/2 months about everything, tried to pin his death on JO, then finally helps reveal where his body was- we have our answer as to who harmed him, at the very least. We always had that answer, though, in our hearts. If she was still alive, she would have tried once more during her trial to lie again, it was never her fault. Now at least, Lucas' family and friends, most especially his siblings/step siblings, will never have to worry about her getting off like Casey Anthony. They will never have to worry about visitation rights forced upon them again in a scary and frightening household. They will never have to worry about if she goes to prison again, that she will one day get out. That made sound cold to everyone, and I am sorry about that, but it's all I can think of now that she's gone- collective sighs of relief was probably going on behind many closed doors, when it was announced she died.

I am just grateful that Lucas was found and will be laid to rest, that his family and friends can properly grieve his death now, instead of hanging on to that one little shred of hope that he might still be alive out there somewhere.

Heartbreaking all around, most especially for Lucas, who didn't stand a chance against that violent household he lived in.

 

[newmember]

In my opinion, EG did not have the capacity to love, at least in her current state of mind (meth).

i wonder if between her jail time, drug dealers prob wanting to stay a bit clear from her and JH not 100% funding her lifestyle anymore (maybe he was, im speculating he pulled back due to there being no kids to support/tension between them), if she had sobered up in the past 3 months, at least on and off, and if it brought some bits of clarity to her what a monster she had become. not that it excuses her behavior, or anyone's, when under the influence of any narcotic, but im wondering if her sober self had flashbacks to horrible things she had done but she still was sometimes using drugs these past three months & she couldnt deal with this jekyll & hyde persona she created in addition to her entire life crumbling around her.

i really want to stay focused on Lucas' and not EG so to clarify, i am only posting this bc i am hoping that EGs actions between Feb 11(ish)-her suicide will lead us to some clarity as to what happened with Lucas.

 

[Steelslady]

Has JH stated anything about working towards trying to get MH back in any news articles/reports or interviews?

I understand his focus early-on was finding Lucas, and his plate is still full in terms of plans to lay his son to rest, the recent development of EG's suicide, and the fact he still (as far as we know) works out of state in New Mexico 2/3 of the time, but it almost seems as if his other small child is barely an afterthought.

How motivated is he to attempt to regain custody of his only surviving child? He has never mentioned her in any interviews that I am aware of, is he not motivated? That's very telling if he is not; is it because he is at such a low point that friends/family should be seriously concerned about the possibility of his having suicidal thoughts himself? Is he simply not concerned about it or it's not a priority?

The only time I've seen him reference the little one was in his recent interview with Nancy Grace, where he stated that he loved both of his children very much. Plus, he has that charge against him for abuse towards EG's son- it was postponed again and rescheduled until July because the PI came out that day he was due in court. I don't know how he could honestly raise her by himself at this point, unless he moved in with a family member that can take care of her while he goes back to work.

 

[PetDetective]

The thing about EG that tugs at my heart strings is how sad her existence turned out to be and all of the innocence she destroyed with it. There is no longer the slightest chance that she will see the error in her ways and offer a sincere apology to those she hurt. She killed her parents’ dreams of what their little girl could have been, her children’s one and only Mom, and left Lucas’s family without a chance to get answers from her. There won’t be any questions answered, ever. At least with her alive, there was that possibility.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

I just don't understand how JH allowed this to go on. People say EG was manipulative and had him fooled, but he himself was involved in violent altercations with her, we learned from EG ex that baby MH might of been hurt in one of those altercations, numerous reports of abuse, he knew there was drug use, Lucas with bruises repeatedly. He knew she was capable of being violent so why leave children in that enviornment. Did he think this is way families behave? I just can't grasp the excuse of EG was manipulative and he is a victim of EG controlling him. The thought of him caring for another child scares me.

I am not excusing JH's forceful, physical harm on EG's son -- but. We have talked just a smidge about double standards in this case; if roles were reversed, we would hold the mother accountable for allowing her boyfriend/fiancé to injure/murder her child. Yet - we see time and time again in DV cases that the woman took beatings but never believed the violence would ever involve the children. It is erroneous thinking, but understandable. I think it's possible that until DM arrived, JH thought any relationship issues were just between him & EG.

JO said JH could be difficult (euphemism), but that he was never violent with her or Lucas when they were together -- I can only assume he was never violent with her other children as well. Why so forceful with the little boy? Did he underestimate his own strength while trying to make the boy stop and listen? I think it's possible he ventured out of his usual realm on this day for one reason or another -- perhaps he was using, given his work schedule and long drives. Perhaps it was an issue--he could use it with more discretion and control than she could? Perhaps he let his emotion & frustration get the best of him?

I feel I must reiterate--I'm not excusing his behavior.

On one hand, you're exactly right -- who else but EG would have put those bruises on Lucas, given their history? But I think that he just couldn't believe it -- she was a woman he loved, a mother, a girlfriend who appeared to share mutual affection with Lucas at one point, at least. He may have looked at it as it made no sense--what reason would she have to hurt Lucas? She played the victim game hard, IMO. Maybe he viewed himself as her savior of sorts--if he didn't love her and give her multiple chances, who would? He could put up with her BS because he saw her as a tragic victim (as she wanted to be seen), but he never thought she would injure his child. Any other half-baked reason for those bruises was more believable to him than that.

 

[Squirrel85]

I just don't understand how JH allowed this to go on. People say EG was manipulative and had him fooled, but he himself was involved in violent altercations with her, we learned from EG ex that baby MH might of been hurt in one of those altercations, numerous reports of abuse, he knew there was drug use, Lucas with bruises repeatedly. He knew she was capable of being violent so why leave children in that enviornment. Did he think this is way families behave? I just can't grasp the excuse of EG was manipulative and he is a victim of EG controlling him. The thought of him caring for another child scares me.

I agree! People are just making excuses for JH by saying EG was manipulative. JH should know right from wrong. He shouldn't have left the children with EG. And, I think if he didn't want to parent, he should have left LH with someone else, and not have sought to gain custody of him. Most children do alright without their parents being involved in their lives. I think LH should have stayed with whoever was previously caring for him. A lot of people in Lucas's life are probably feeling pretty damn guilty, right now.

 

[motheroffour]

I wonder if the case against JH will proceed. There is no longer a need for a protection order for EG's boys. They are protected from her now forever. I really think that was the whole point of her ex filing anything anyway.....to keep the boys away from her.
Not to discount that JH may have been rough with one of the boys, but I just think the reason for the arrest and the result intended is gone.

The charges against JH are separate in the eyes of the law from anything related to Lucas, just as EGs were in the CE case regarding MH. It should proceed and I have no doubt it will. I can’t predict the outcome and his will be a different type of trial. I believe it was said here that he will have a bench trial with a judge determining his guilt or innocence and sentencing if he were to be found guilt. I couldn’t find the link though. Apologies

 

[Busylady]

I am not excusing JH's forceful, physical harm on EG's son -- but. We have talked just a smidge about double standards in this case; if roles were reversed, we would hold the mother accountable for allowing her boyfriend/fiancé to injure/murder her child. Yet - we see time and time again in DV cases that the woman took beatings but never believed the violence would ever involve the children. It is erroneous thinking, but understandable. I think it's possible that until DM arrived, JH thought any relationship issues were just between him & EG.

JO said JH could be difficult (euphemism), but that he was never violent with her or Lucas when they were together -- I can only assume he was never violent with her other children as well. Why so forceful with the little boy? Did he underestimate his own strength while trying to make the boy stop and listen? I think it's possible he ventured out of his usual realm on this day for one reason or another -- perhaps he was using, given his work schedule and long drives. Perhaps it was an issue--he could use it with more discretion and control than she could? Perhaps he let his emotion & frustration get the best of him?

I feel I must reiterate--I'm not excusing his behavior.

On one hand, you're exactly right -- who else but EG would have put those bruises on Lucas, given their history? But I think that he just couldn't believe it -- she was a woman he loved, a mother, a girlfriend who appeared to share mutual affection with Lucas at one point, at least. He may have looked at it as it made no sense--what reason would she have to hurt Lucas? She played the victim game hard, IMO. Maybe he viewed himself as her savior of sorts--if he didn't love her and give her multiple chances, who would? He could put up with her BS because he saw her as a tragic victim (as she wanted to be seen), but he never thought she would injure his child. Any other half-baked reason for those bruises was more believable to him than that.

I respect your thoughts on all this and agree with a lot of what you stated. Your comments about the gender reversal, we have seen time and time again on WS where people are so angry when a child dies at the hand of a boyfriend/husband and hold the women responsible and want charges filed because they stayed and kept their children in the environment. Post after post saying there is no way the mother didn't know what was going on or what could happen.

It wasn't like there was just violent altercations between JH and EG, there was multiple times evidence was on Lucas that he was being abused, multiple people told him, how many black eyes, bruises all over the body before you say hey something isn't right here. I don't buy being out of town as an excuse.

My thoughts on JH actions does not mean that my heart doesn't break for him for the loss of his son.

I respect posters here at WS, but I have learned I have offended a few with my stance on my feelings of JH actions so time for me to stop my post on thoughts of JH.

 

[Steelslady]

Listening to some the people that were standing around talking outside JH's house, the TV reporters cameras picked up on some of them saying they heard it on their police scanners that were inside their homes. Then they went to the address stated.

Just how pathetic are they to even show up after hearing it on the scanner. Just what the police and family needed- strangers (who claimed to be friends of hers, even though they never met her!) coming and sticking their faces in front of a camera and causing an uproar. Some fools never cease to amaze me.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

Hey all. Still here... I'm having a hard time with EG's suicide. I guess it's a trigger for me and I never knew it.

I honestly think she did feel guilty. Look at her life... there's no way she was a happy person. The fact that she had old scars on her wrists... I don't know... I have old scars on MY wrists, so I guess hearing that reminds me of those feelings of hopelessness and darkness. I think she was in a lot of pain, which led to the self-medicating with drugs, which led to emotional instability (ha! how's that for an understatement?). She should have never been left alone with those kids. I think she wanted her perfect life with JH and her kids, but she just couldn't handle it and had too many demons. At the time when she killed herself, she should've been very confident in her chances of getting away with it. I don't think it was thoughts of jail that led her down that path. I think she gave up on life in general. She had literally lost everything... her children, her significant other, probably her freedom.

I never thought I would be saying this, but I actually have a lot of sympathy for her, and the fact that she took her own life is super tragic. In a way, I was kind of hoping someone else had killed her instead. I've also been suicidal, and I wouldn't wish those feelings on anyone, even EG.

I understand where you're coming from. I also don't wish those feelings on anyone.
It is hard to give any positive credit to people we've come to resent, especially when their actions hurt children. I don't truly believe anybody is pure evil, but I sometimes forget that.

I don't know if I agree that she felt guilty so much as she knew she would forever be seen as guilty and that was too much -- well, I guess I'm thinking she had no shame. She may have felt guilty and with good reason, but I don't know if I believe she felt ashamed of herself. Everything had a reason and no one understood her, and she was able to justify almost everything to a point, IMO. Her life could have had a much different outcome if circumstances were different and she got the help she needed to cope and if she could bring herself to admit what she couldn't handle.

And that last part is what absolutely kills me when people want to judge JO -- we so desperately want parents to admit they need help or can't manage the responsibility but we are quick to judge. We immediately look cross-eyed at mothers who don't have custody and assume the worst. We glorify dads who take on responsibilities we expect of mothers, things we think are routine and no big deal with mothers. I would bet that EG was keenly aware of this, and she was not going to give anything to JO or to her ex. This resentment that she carried about being judged likely fueled her behavior--along with mood swings, impulsivity, and drug use on top of everything else. It just built up and up until poor Lucas was crushed under the weight -- I believe that if Lucas weren't around, EG would have eventually been found to have at least neglected MH. I believe sweet Lucas saved MH.

We need to start looking at moms and dad as parents and hold them to the same standards, and we need to be grateful for parents who can admit their children are better off with at least temporary guardianship elsewhere. We also need to look at mental illness as a health issue that can be managed and encourage its utilization without penalizing those who bring themselves forward to receive help. It's hard for parents with mental illness to fight a system that punishes them for admitting they need care.

Sorry for the rant in the last paragraph -- I just keep looking and looking at how anyone or anything could have possibly intervened in a way that might have changed the ending, both for Lucas and for EG. All moo...

 

[Philigumbo]

I have had such intense anger and HATRED in my heart for EG for so long. I loathed everything about her, picked everything apart such as her appearance at court to every word she's ever spoken, to every action ever detailed in a report. My worst fear was her getting away with killing sweet innocent little Lucas. I think some of my anger spilled out into my daily life, with my interactions with others, because I was so darn frustrated and worried we'd never seen justice.

Then, I saw some hope when the unverified information about Lucas' possibly dying in the bathroom of the house on Edgemore the 10th or 11th, and that that information may have come from a 2nd autopsy. I thought finally...answers are coming to light. Lucas just might get the justice he so deserves. I was still furious, but we were all hot on the trail again as things seemed to make more sense with those dates and we scrambled and made it all fit pretty much.

Then, Emily's suicide happened. I wasn't glad. At first, I thought, yes, she took the easy way out and that was not justice. The weird thing is, I don't know where that anger is now. I'm angry that she took Lucas' life away in a general, human sense, but the intense anger I felt so directly towards her has mostly dissipated. And in it's place, is just an emptiness almost. It feels good to let go of so much of that anger and hatred. I think there were a lot of reasons she killed herself, and not to say I'm pro-suicide but I probably would've done the same thing. But look at what it has caused for those who may have loved her...sorrow, for some, I'm sure. And I even feel, dare I say, some compassion for even JH now.

This is probably not a popular opinion, and that's ok. This has been a horrific case with so much tragedy, I myself am finally relieved I'm still not bursting at the seams with anger and bitterness . Instead, I feel like we will get some answers and that some good (perhaps changes or additions in laws regarding child protection) may come from this. This case has wrung me out and hung me up to dry, and I am so sad, but at least I have more hope than ever before.

JMO.

I understand completely, haven. I am angry about Lucas, but I didn’t want EG to die, but I thought she may kill herself. Of course, my anger she wasn’t in jail is gone, but being in jail could have saved her life. Wish they could have charged her with concealing a body or something.

However, even if she lived, I don’t believe she would have ever taken responsibility for Lucas’s death. I don’t think she would have ever told the whole story no matter the evidence presented. I don’t believe she would have ever given JO or JH and their families the benefit of knowing the truth of what happened to him and when...from her mouth.

The evidence will have to show it now; and it would had to have shown it had she lived for trial, if charged. She just couldn’t tell the truth. Whether it was mental illness, drugs, sociopathy, psychopathy, jealously, or just plain shame, I don’t know.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

I don't think it would have mattered in the long run, for me, the case ended when they found Lucas.

She's lied the last 3 and 1/2 months about everything, tried to pin his death on JO, then finally helps reveal where his body was- we have our answer as to who harmed him, at the very least. We always had that answer, though, in our hearts. If she was still alive, she would have tried once more during her trial to lie again, it was never her fault. Now at least, Lucas' family and friends, most especially his siblings/step siblings, will never have to worry about her getting off like Casey Anthony. They will never have to worry about visitation rights forced upon them again in a scary and frightening household. They will never have to worry about if she goes to prison again, that she will one day get out. That made sound cold to everyone, and I am sorry about that, but it's all I can think of now that she's gone- collective sighs of relief was probably going on behind many closed doors, when it was announced she died.

I am just grateful that Lucas was found and will be laid to rest, that his family and friends can properly grieve his death now, instead of hanging on to that one little shred of hope that he might still be alive out there somewhere.

Heartbreaking all around, most especially for Lucas, who didn't stand a chance against that violent household he lived in.

BBM. And this is why her death is another assault on the people in her life -- it has robbed them of the opportunity to gain strength from setting their own boundaries with her. I can imagine as relieved as some might be, it will also cause additional pain because they will feel guilty for wishing they didn't have to deal with her. I just don't know what to make of it -- there are positives when I think about it, but it's all just so unbelievably tragic for everyone left to pick up the pieces.

 

[Squirrel85]

I am just going to throw this out there. I don't want JH to be able to regain custody of his daughter. I don't want the baby to be left with some girlfriend, while JH goes back to working out of state. I want someone who loves children to foster, and eventually adopt MH. I want her to have a good life, and not let history repeat itself. MH deserves to be with someone who is able to make healthy choices and not choices out of convenience. Lucas deserved better, and he won't ever get that chance. But, it isn't too late for MH to have a chance at having a happy life.

 

[liltexans]

I respect posters here at WS, but I have learned I have offended a few with my stance on my feelings of JH actions so time for me to stop my post on thoughts of JH.

RSBM

I hope you don't feel as if you can't express your feelings or thoughts here on the forum. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion on the actions of the people in Lucas' life. This case may seem closed, but it's still an open murder investigation until LE tells us they have closed the case.