Kyron Horman Discussion Thread 2020 - 2022 - #2

[Vegan1234]

Law enforcement clearly showed Terri was the focus of their investigation.

Snipped Quote: [Jun 18, 2010] “Terri is the last-known person to have seen him [Kyron] before he disappeared,” Multnomah County Sheriff’s Capt. Jason Gates said, contrary to previous reports of someone else who might have seen the boy afterward.
Investigators say Kyron’s family cooperating as search continues

View attachment 523935
1st Flyer, Released June 18, 2010:

Law enforcement would not name her as so much as a person of interest because they would have had to move forward with the case. They did not want to proceed until Kyron was found. This would have been a death penalty case.

Terri could not testify in a civil case because she was a suspect in the criminal case. She risked "either self-incrimination or a waiver of her right to not help the State prosecute her". She has rights and the judge protected them by admitting she was a "prime suspect".

Snipped: [August 20th 2012] By calling her a suspect, the judge said Terri can for now avoid a deposition in the civil case against her.
Judge calls Terri Horman 'suspect,' rules civil suit can continue

Snipped: The focus of the defendant’s motion is to stop the prosecution of this civil case while an ongoing active criminal investigation into both young Kyron Horman’s disappearance in 2010 and a murder-for-hire plot against Kyron’s father, Kaine Horman, is pending, so that the defendant (Terri Horman, Kyron’s step-mother and Kaine’s wife) is not required to decide whether to exercise her constitutional rights against self-incrimination under the United States and Oregon Constitutions before it is necessary to do so in any criminal prosecution which may follow the investigation. The plaintiff is Kyron’s mother. The defendant is a prime suspect in the investigation.
http://katubim.s3.amazonaws.com/Terri Horman Civil Suit Order.pdf

We wouldn't want anything like the following to happen.

[August 1st 2010 ] McCain said if Terri Horman is the prime suspect in the case, she won't be called to testify.
"Terri will not be called to the grand jury if she is in fact the prime suspect, because if you have your prime suspect testify to the grand jury, then you just granted them immunity in the process if you compel them to testify," he said.
Kyron's parents testify before grand jury

This is in the very beginning. Yes at that time Terri was the last known person. But Kaine said recently that second hand information…LE interviews witnesses and then LE tells parents, that there are witnesses who claim to have seen Kyron get into another car and not with Terri, witnesses who saw Kyron after Terri left. They can only confirm Terri’s statement because she dropped him off and they know what time she got to her first stop. There is no time stamped video of Kyron being seen by the bus driver or anyone else at a specific time which LE can’t confirm if their exact times are correct or not. Which is probably why they asked for photos taken that day.

Edit to add: I wonder if those witnesses who saw Kyron after Terri left are the ones her lawyers have sworn statements from and LE knows that. LE would not give their files to the defense yet Kaine was privy to info. And it’s interesting to me that Kaines attorneys wanted the info for Terri’s witnesses…..and LE was very quiet and the next thing we know Desiree drops the civil suit.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Nancy Grace : [18:33] Now I understand also—to Annette Newell joining us, KXL News—that at least one person saw stepmother, Terri, leaving the building. How do we know what time she left, did she leave alone? Who is confirming that?
Annette Newell: Actually that information came from the mother of Kyron. She said that there were several witnesses who have told her that they did witness him leaving in a truck with the stepmother. So that’s basically where that information came from.
BOY DISAPPEARS FROM ELEMENTARY SCHOOL SCIENCE FAIR: WHERE'S KYRON HORMAN?

The reporter’s answer to Nancy’s question at this point in the video is flat-out misinformation. Desiree has never said that witnesses told her they saw Kyron leaving in a truck with Terri. Never. Not once.

Nancy Grace asks Ms Newell nearly the same question again at timestamp 31:59 and Ms Newell provides factual information in her answer.

However, let’s look at what Desiree has said time and time again. Desiree has said that witnesses saw Kyron, Terri, and Baby K leaving the school parking lot together at approximately 8:50 a.m. The school parking lot is on the east side of the school. The white F250 pickup was not parked in the school parking lot.

In the book “Boy Missing—The Search For Kyron Horman by Rebecca Morris”, we learn Desiree’s information came from a meeting “at the Marriott with the deputy DAs and Kaine and his attorney” present. [Pg 199] In other words, it’s not simply information Desiree received first or second-hand. The fact that there are witnesses who saw Kyron, Terri, and Baby K leaving the school parking lot together has been confirmed by law enforcement.

At some point between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45 a.m., the F250 was parked on the gravel/dirt road on the school's west side, which leads to the soccer field. (The gravel/dirt road is also called the service road and/or the access road).

In my opinion, there is an important distinction between witnesses seeing Kyron, Terri, and Baby K walking through the parking lot and witnesses seeing Kyron, Terri, and Baby K leaving in a truck.

The next series of links are statements from Desiree from 2015 to 2023. Desiree does not say Kyron was seen leaving in a truck with Terri. If anyone witnessed that happening it has not been confirmed by law enforcement, Desiree, or Kaine.

Unofficial transcript:
Snipped: [November 25, 2015] [Voiceover] [1:23] This picture of Kyron beaming proudly in front of his project on the red eyed tree frog was taken by his step-mom, Terri, just minutes before he vanished.
Jason Mattera: What time did Kyron go missing?
Desiree: It was exactly between 8:45 am and 8:55 am.
[Voiceover] Yet the school marked him absent that day. In fact, it wasn’t until Kyron’s father, Kaine, and stepmom, Terri, went to pick him up from the bus that anyone realized he was missing. The 7-year-old’s disappearance triggered a massive search that captivated the nation. But even in those first agonizing days, Desiree, seen here being comforted by Terri, knew something was amiss. Desiree claims several people told her they saw Kyron leave with Terri Horman.
Desiree: He was in his classroom. He got the photo taken by Terri, and he, apparently according to eyewitness accounts, multiple adults that can vouch for the fact that Terri walked out the side entrance of the school with Kyron in tow and we know this because Kyron’s friend even saw him with her right outside the school.
Jason Mattera: Terri denied that she ever left with Kyron but scrutiny intensified when Desiree claims Terri reportedly failed two polygraphs.
Missing: The Search for Oregon Boy Kyron Horman Pt. 1 - Crime Watch Daily

Snipped: [May. 25, 2018 ] “He was seen in in throughout the school along with Terry (Kyron’s step-mom) and Kiara (Kyron’s step-sister) and a lot of eyewitnesses place him in the key classrooms, looking at the exhibits. Then we know that at approximately 8:44 in the morning he was posing in front of that picture that we all know, in front of his exhibit. We know that Terry was in the school when she took that picture, then from that point we have eyewitness accounts that place him leaving the school with Terry right out the side exit,” said Young.
According to Young, that was the last time anyone saw him, “We just don’t know what she [Terry] did with him from that point until the time that she’s captured on surveillance footage at the gym,” said Young.
https://web.archive.org/web/20180526053432/https://www.kdrv.com/content/news/national-missing-childrens-day-the-search-continues-for-multiple-families-483754111.html

Unofficial Transcript:
Snipped [June 4, 2019]
Matt Johnson: [15:15] And do you think that he made it to school that day? What is your working theory on that because I know that some people thought that maybe the picture had been taken before.
Desiree: Nope. I know for sure, 100%, the picture was taken in the school. It’s GPS—it’s confirmed; it’s verified. We know exactly what time she took the picture, where she was at. And it’s confirmed with technology. So, she was in the school at 8:45 taking that photo of Kyron in front of his exhibit. I know that she left the school; she left with Kyron. And we have eyewitnesses that place them outside the school en route to the truck. It’s from that point where it gets unknown.
3 - MISSING: The disappearance of Kyron Horman, Mother Speaks Out

[Pg 200] The bombshell was that Kyron was seen leaving the school with Terri. The MCSO had said it a couple of weeks before, then retracted it. Now it was confirmed. Kyron’s regular bus driver, plus Kyron’s friend Carson and Carson’s sister and grandmother, had all seen Kyron leaving the school on June 4 with Terri. It was true. Kyron, [baby “K”] and Terri had walked through the parking lot at 8:50 a.m. on June 4. They were not holding hands, the bus driver said, but they were walking together. Terri had not parked in the school parking lot, where she said she had, but on a gravel road on the far-west side of the school where the elevation of the school building and grounds partly concealed the white truck.

"Boy Missing · The Search for Kyron Horman" by Rebecca Morris [2020]​

Snipped: [September23, 2023]
Desiree: …So he was in the school with you, Terri, between 8:15-8:45am, then he left. Walking out the doors with you 8:45-8:50am as noted by several eyewitnesses.
Websleuths Kyron Horman Discussion Thread Post 9

Unofficial Transcript:
Snipped [May 2024]
Desiree: [17:32] The other caveat is the picture. So the real timeline that we know—absolutely; witnessed by everybody; on GPS with the camera—is that she came up that stairwell; walked Kyron all the way to Ms. Porter’s classroom, took pictures of him and his two friends in front of the diorama, timestamped 8:45 a.m. right before she walks out the side doors with Kyron. That also is witnessed by Kyron’s bus driver. She happened to be sitting in her bus and saw Terri and Kyron come out of the school with [the baby]. And his other friend and grandma and sister are outside the school and see Kyron leaving with Terri. So we know that Terri went from the school, and we know that she went to two Fred Meyers.
7-year old ABDUCTED from Portland SCHOOL: A mothers fight for JUSTICE

Unofficial transcript:
Snipped [May 2024]
Desiree: [50:01] The one thing that I hold onto—cause a lot of people come to me and say ‘well, when you are prosecuting a case like this you can’t say if Kyron is out there in the world somewhere’. And I say this: ‘Kyron relied on one person that day. That’s it. Terri is it. He relied on her that day. He was with her. She had him’. It’s the worst kind of evil.
7-year old ABDUCTED from Portland SCHOOL: A mothers fight for JUSTICE

If anyone has time, please take a look at where the F250 was parked. Kyron, Terri, and the baby were witnessed in the school parking lot/driveway. To get to the truck, they would have to turn right at the end of the parking lot/driveway. As far as we know, no one saw them after they walked out of view at the end of the driveway. Notice the wooden telephone pole on the side of the gravel/dirt road. According to LE’s reenactment, the F250 was pulled up just past that.
‘Street view’ from the base of the school driveway.
'Street View' on NW Brooks Rd facing gravel/dirt road leading to soccer field

Maybe this is better. The big white push pin (added to the screenshot by me) is approximately where Kaine’s white F250 was parked between 8:15 a.m. and 8:45: a.m. (I have to link the video to post the screenshot. The timestamp is 4:35 for the screenshot).


Where is Kyron Horman? Portland Boy Has Been Missing For 10 Years.


3rd Flyer, LE's Reenactment Released August 11, 2010

[Pg 263] Underhill said at least one witness told police they saw a second adult, on a phone, in the truck while Terri was in the school. Another had seen the truck moved. Later, detectives told Desiree that despite tips, they didn't think there was anyone else in Terri's truck, at least when it was parked at the school. They thought the person sighted on the phone in the truck was Terri.

"Boy Missing · The Search for Kyron Horman" by Rebecca Morris​

 

[Knox]

Desiree and Rebecca Morris will be speaking at the True Crime Fest Northwest tomorrow in Portland.

Our Schedule & Events | TCFNW

View our schedule and events here...

www.truecrimefestnorthwest.com

Kyron Horman's World Soldiers has a table for Kyron at the event also.​

 

[Knox]

Desiree Young speaking at the True Crime Fest Northwest.

 

[Sleuth2010]

Thank you so much @Knox.

We were wondering how it went.

Heartprints to these warriors for Kyron. Pulling for all of you.

Keep going. Go. Go. Go. Don't stop, Go!

jmo omo moo

 

[Tricia]

Hey Everyone,
Isn't it nice that you no longer have to deal with the obnoxious ads on Websleuths. You also don't have to deal with me whining asking for donations for the server. Websleuths is so much better now and that is because of our partnership with Othram. We are now free of my whining and those horrid ads.
If you like the fact that we are ad-free then please consider making a monthly donation to DNA Solves.com CLICK HERE TO SIGN UP FOR A MONTHLY DONATION TO DNA SOLVES
By subscribing and making a monthly donation, you will be helping the families finally get the answers they deserve.
The amazing people at DNA Solves/Othram care deeply about finding the families of the unidentified.
Even 5 dollars a month would go a long way to finding the families of the unidentified.
Please do not discuss this on this thread. CLICK HERE if you would like to discuss further or have any questions.
Thank you,
Tricia Griffith
Manager/Websleuths.com

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Desiree Young speaking at the True Crime Fest Northwest.

This is the problem with adding onto the story, it gets more and more unbelievable. Originally, Terri was supposed to have taken Kyron to school, sneak him out and made everyone think she left without him and the school lost him. Of course, that would have meant the school realized Kyron was gone the moment Terri left, so the fact that the teacher (Porter) had got the idea that Terri had taken Kyron to an appointment became a deliberate plan of Terri's to deceive Porter (this doesn't work with the witness statements we have, but that's another story).

But then Desiree adds to the story. In the Morris book she says Terri walked to her car with Kyron in front of witnesses, and that she had sent the teacher an email where she said Kyron would be absent on the 4th. And now she adds that not only did Terri promise to have Kyron back by 11, she even left a note on the teacher's desk that she took him to the appointment.

Several problems:
1. How could Terri possibly claim to have left Kyron in the school when apparently everyone and their grandma knew about and saw her leave with Kyron?
2. Why would the school expect Kyron to be gone all day if the teacher had it in writing that Kyron was supposed to be back at 11? Why would they not sound the alarm when Kyron didn't return at 11?
3. With all that info - in writing, multiple times, easily confirmable by the police and undeniable by Terri - how was Terri not arrested in 2010? Why was there ever any doubt how Kyron left the school?

And that's not all. Desiree says Terri took Kyron out of his group for a private tour - despite the fact that the groups didn't form until after 8:45, which is when Terri left. There were no groups before that - how could there be, when the buses hadn't even arrived until shortly before?

Desiree says Terri was trying to hurt Porter and the principal because Terri had applied for teacher at Skyline and the principal had given the job to Porter. Except Terri didn't reinstate her teaching licence until the winter of 2010. She couldn't have applied for Porter's position.

In the book Desiree claims Terri immediately washed Kyron's backpack and jacket - now she says Terri washed everything Kyron owned to prevent a scent sample - seriously?

By piling all this on, it just becomes completely unbelievable that any DA refused to charge her with anything - and not just the three that supervised Kyron's case. Desiree says Terri tried to murder her parents through arson as a teen - no charges. Desiree says Terri stabbed a man in California a few years ago - the DA didn't have the guts to charge her (what?) I almost expect that within a few months we'll hear about Terri handwriting and laminating a full confession and delivering it to the Multnomah County DA in a scented envelope only to have the spineless incumbent - trembling with fear and indecision - refuse to do anything.

 

[Sleuth2010]

Maybe it isn't, " adding onto the story," but revealing more truth. Detectives and LE want nothing revealed when these heinous crimes happen. Until years have gone by, sometimes families do not know if speaking-truth / facts will harm the investigation.

Kyron's case is straightforward. His perpetrator isn't even a good liar... watch the videos without sound. Her tell's are obvious!!!

The new District Attorney is in the Wings-of-Justice!!!

Let's hope Nathan V. takes this all the way to shiny bracelets and locked-up for good.

jmo moo jmo

Nathan Vasquez prepares to take on the role of Multnomah County district attorney

Vasquez isn't set to take office until January 1, giving him months to prepare while still prosecuting cases — but he has some idea of what he'll do next year.

www.kgw.com

 

[Knox]

Maybe it isn't, " adding onto the story," but revealing more truth. Detectives and LE want nothing revealed when these heinous crimes happen. Until years have gone by, sometimes families do not know if speaking-truth / facts will harm the investigation.

Kyron's case is straightforward. His perpetrator isn't even a good liar... watch the videos without sound. Her tell's are obvious!!!

The new District Attorney is in the Wings-of-Justice!!!

Let's hope Nathan V. takes this all the way to shiny bracelets and locked-up for good.

jmo moo jmo

Nathan Vasquez prepares to take on the role of Multnomah County district attorney

Vasquez isn't set to take office until January 1, giving him months to prepare while still prosecuting cases — but he has some idea of what he'll do next year.

www.kgw.com

In the video I linked, at the end during the Q&A portion. Desiree says she is hopeful the "US Attorneys Office can find an end run, so they can actually charge Dede with murder". You might remember the DA granted her State immunity, but maybe the Feds can find grounds to charge?

I can't see the post you are responding too, so I hope mine to you is relevant.

 

[minazoe]

Terri's record speaks for itself. mOO

 

[EllaMae]

This is in the very beginning. Yes at that time Terri was the last known person. But Kaine said recently that second hand information…LE interviews witnesses and then LE tells parents, that there are witnesses who claim to have seen Kyron get into another car and not with Terri, witnesses who saw Kyron after Terri left. They can only confirm Terri’s statement because she dropped him off and they know what time she got to her first stop. There is no time stamped video of Kyron being seen by the bus driver or anyone else at a specific time which LE can’t confirm if their exact times are correct or not. Which is probably why they asked for photos taken that day.

Edit to add: I wonder if those witnesses who saw Kyron after Terri left are the ones her lawyers have sworn statements from and LE knows that. LE would not give their files to the defense yet Kaine was privy to info. And it’s interesting to me that Kaines attorneys wanted the info for Terri’s witnesses…..and LE was very quiet and the next thing we know Desiree drops the civil suit.

There are no witnesses who saw Kyron get into any car after Terri left on the day he disappeared. That is simply untrue. LE knows that did not happen. There is digital and forensic evidence proving that Terri and DeDe took Kyron and caused his disappearance.
On the day he disappeared....he was seen by people who knew him, and knew Terri, and he was seen leaving the school with her and Baby K. This is a known fact. They DO know what time he left with Terri because the infamous photo of Kyron with his tree frog project was time stamped. And the bus driver had a schedule as well. Terri lied about everything she did that morning...including her timeline and her route inside the school.She changed her story early and often. She washed all of Kyron's clothes, bedding....every single thing he owned so that the search dogs had nothing to key a scent from. She did not cooperate with LE, she lied and lied, and did not grieve Kyron's absence. She has no alibi and neither does DeDe.
Terri gave up her baby and refused to testify. Her lawyers had nothing that proved her innocence. Quite the opposite. They knew if she testified she'd incriminate herself. They knew she lied to LE.
<modsnip - personalizing>

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Maybe it isn't, " adding onto the story," but revealing more truth. Detectives and LE want nothing revealed when these heinous crimes happen. Until years have gone by, sometimes families do not know if speaking-truth / facts will harm the investigation.

The problem is that the additions to the story just makes it more unbelievable. Like I said, now Desiree has added a note from Terri on the teacher's desk that she would take Kyron to an appointment - yet from day one Terri said that the teacher had "misheard" when she left the classroom. How could Terri make the claim that the teacher misheard when there are now supposed to be two written notes from her - an email and a note - that the police would have had access to from day one? It just doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. Same with the new claim that Terri took Kyron out of the group he was supposed to be in for a private tour - yet even Desiree herself says Terri left the school at 8:45 and the groups weren't even supposed to be formed until after 8:45. The kids who got to the school by bus wouldn't be there to be in groups before that!

The new story from Desiree that Terri stabbed a man in 2016 and the DA (in California) "lost his guts" about charging her? No one can seriously believe that story, right?

Terri immediately washed every piece of clothing Kyron had ever worn, all his bedding and his bag so there wouldn't be scent articles for the police dogs? Again, no one can seriously believe that story, right? Did the police just lie to the media in the early days, or did Terri do all this in front of the law officers that the MCSO say were there in the house?

And that there's a picture of "it" (implied to be Kyron where he was killed) on the cell phones Dede supposedly led the police to in 2012 after getting immunity (despite Dede not getting immunity until 2013 and despite those burner phones being purchases almost a month after Kyron had vanished)? Does anyone truly believe that?

Desiree's story keeps getting details that seem tailor made to make Terri and Dede look as bad as possible and the evidence against them as overwhelming as possible and the spinelessness of at least five DAs as complete as possible, yet all it really does is make the story collapse under the weight of its unbelievability.

Kyron's case is straightforward. His perpetrator isn't even a good liar... watch the videos without sound. Her tell's are obvious!!!

The new District Attorney is in the Wings-of-Justice!!!

Let's hope Nathan V. takes this all the way to shiny bracelets and locked-up for good.

I hope Desiree doesn't get her hopes up. The more unrealistic her tale becomes, the more it's going to hurt when it crashes into reality. I do hope she gets let down easy, and can move on to act more effectively for Kyron.

And by that I mean requesting the FBI to take the case over completely. Hopefully the new DA has a head on his shoulders and supports that. But that is certainly not just her responsibility. Kaine should request that too, as should the MCSO. Sadly, I kind of feel like both of the latter have left Desiree alone in the spotlight with little support or reliable information. It's not fair to her.

 

[EllaMae]

The problem is that the additions to the story just makes it more unbelievable. Like I said, now Desiree has added a note from Terri on the teacher's desk that she would take Kyron to an appointment - yet from day one Terri said that the teacher had "misheard" when she left the classroom. How could Terri make the claim that the teacher misheard when there are now supposed to be two written notes from her - an email and a note - that the police would have had access to from day one? It just doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. Same with the new claim that Terri took Kyron out of the group he was supposed to be in for a private tour - yet even Desiree herself says Terri left the school at 8:45 and the groups weren't even supposed to be formed until after 8:45. The kids who got to the school by bus wouldn't be there to be in groups before that!

The new story from Desiree that Terri stabbed a man in 2016 and the DA (in California) "lost his guts" about charging her? No one can seriously believe that story, right?

Terri immediately washed every piece of clothing Kyron had ever worn, all his bedding and his bag so there wouldn't be scent articles for the police dogs? Again, no one can seriously believe that story, right? Did the police just lie to the media in the early days, or did Terri do all this in front of the law officers that the MCSO say were there in the house?

And that there's a picture of "it" (implied to be Kyron where he was killed) on the cell phones Dede supposedly led the police to in 2012 after getting immunity (despite Dede not getting immunity until 2013 and despite those burner phones being purchases almost a month after Kyron had vanished)? Does anyone truly believe that?

Desiree's story keeps getting details that seem tailor made to make Terri and Dede look as bad as possible and the evidence against them as overwhelming as possible and the spinelessness of at least five DAs as complete as possible, yet all it really does is make the story collapse under the weight of its unbelievability.



I hope Desiree doesn't get her hopes up. The more unrealistic her tale becomes, the more it's going to hurt when it crashes into reality. I do hope she gets let down easy, and can move on to act more effectively for Kyron.

And by that I mean requesting the FBI to take the case over completely. Hopefully the new DA has a head on his shoulders and supports that. But that is certainly not just her responsibility. Kaine should request that too, as should the MCSO. Sadly, I kind of feel like both of the latter have left Desiree alone in the spotlight with little support or reliable information. It's not fair to her.

This is not "Desiree's tale". It is a complete fabrication to claim that Desiree invented any of the elements in Kyron's case. This is information she learned directly from the investigators. This is evidence uncovered during the investigation of a missing child. It is beyond disrespectful to insinuate that Desiree is not being honest or in touch with reality. That's an actual lie. Desiree has in fact been a very effective advocate for her son, and has kept his story alive for all these years. She has organized searches and spoken to LE all over the country, and educated them on how to do a better job when searching for those who are missing.
<modsnip - personalizing>

 

[FergusMcDuck]

This is not "Desiree's tale". It is a complete fabrication to claim that Desiree invented any of the elements in Kyron's case. This is information she learned directly from the investigators. This is evidence uncovered during the investigation of a missing child. It is beyond disrespectful to insinuate that Desiree is not being honest or in touch with reality. That's an actual lie. Desiree has in fact been a very effective advocate for her son, and has kept his story alive for all these years. She has organized searches and spoken to LE all over the country, and educated them on how to do a better job when searching for those who are missing.
<modsnip - personalizing>

But it is her tale. Since 2015 she has built up a scenario that diverges from all the info we had before, including from law enforcement. Has anyone from law enforcement ever confirmed any of her latter-day facts? Has anyone ever independently verified her claims? Has Rebecca Morris or any reporter who covered the story gone to the witnesses (CL, his sister and grandmother, the bus driver) and asked them? If they have, they've never said - I've never even found a "we asked so-and-so but they declined to comment".

It all comes from Desiree. And now we have Kaine, who got all the same info as Desiree, disagreeing with her claim that the four witnesses were more than second-hand info.

And I don't see how acknowledging this is anything other than victim-friendly. Facts are facts. Evidence is evidence. None of it depends on whether the person who claims them is a victim themselves. Ultimately it is about finding Kyron, and giving out wrong or misleading info and claiming them to be facts are at best inefficient - at worst detrimental. That's not victim-friendly in my book.

The way I see it, Desiree and Kaine are victims, yes. But so is Terri. Yes, she is obviously the main suspect of the police, so she's sleuthable by Websleuth rules, but she has never been indicted, never been charged and never been convicted. She's not perfect, sure, but victims don't need to be.

 

[Truth Prevails]

This is not "Desiree's tale". It is a complete fabrication to claim that Desiree invented any of the elements in Kyron's case. This is information she learned directly from the investigators. This is evidence uncovered during the investigation of a missing child. It is beyond disrespectful to insinuate that Desiree is not being honest or in touch with reality. That's an actual lie. Desiree has in fact been a very effective advocate for her son, and has kept his story alive for all these years. She has organized searches and spoken to LE all over the country, and educated them on how to do a better job when searching for those who are missing.

<modsnip - personalizing>

Desiree is a powerful speaker now. She has kept her promise to her little boy. Kyron Richard Horman, age 7. Fourteen years ago, she promised him she would never stop.

She gave a very effective presentation at the "True Crime Fest Northwest". I would even go so far as to say she was bold in releasing new details.

Sometimes, it's still the little things that get to me. If my adorable stepson went missing, I would never pile unfolded laundry on his bed. I would believe he was coming home any minute and would need his bed to be ready. It's one more thing that's very telling. (And Desiree was talking about that happening on the evening of June 4th).

Justice for Kyron! Terri is not a victim.

In my opinion.

 

[Sleuth2010]

But it is her tale. Since 2015 she has built up a scenario that diverges from all the info we had before, including from law enforcement. Has anyone from law enforcement ever confirmed any of her latter-day facts? Has anyone ever independently verified her claims? Has Rebecca Morris or any reporter who covered the story gone to the witnesses (CL, his sister and grandmother, the bus driver) and asked them? If they have, they've never said - I've never even found a "we asked so-and-so but they declined to comment".

It all comes from Desiree. And now we have Kaine, who got all the same info as Desiree, disagreeing with her claim that the four witnesses were more than second-hand info.

And I don't see how acknowledging this is anything other than victim-friendly. Facts are facts. Evidence is evidence. None of it depends on whether the person who claims them is a victim themselves. Ultimately it is about finding Kyron, and giving out wrong or misleading info and claiming them to be facts are at best inefficient - at worst detrimental. That's not victim-friendly in my book.

The way I see it, Desiree and Kaine are victims, yes. But so is Terri. Yes, she is obviously the main suspect of the police, so she's sleuthable by Websleuth rules, but she has never been indicted, never been charged and never been convicted. She's not perfect, sure, but victims don't need to be.

Regarding victims:

" But so is Terri ..." makes no common sense.

Perpetrator's are those who take action / commit crime's... and generally are cowards (imo) who bring results of their actions.

Perpetrators are not victims.

She hasn't been indicted YET. Common sense indicates Terri's arrest is coming. She will never be a victim, she will be held accountable.

There are legal procedures to nullify immunity...watch and see.

Justice4Kyron. Justice 4 victims.

jmo moo omo

 

[FergusMcDuck]

Regarding victims:

" But so is Terri ..." makes no common sense.

Her stepson, who lived with her and of which she was the primary guardian was taken. Excepting Desiree (long afterwards) everyone agreed that they had a great relationship. That makes her a victim as much as Kaine, Desiree and Tony are.

Perpetrator's are those who take action / commit crime's... and generally are cowards (imo) who bring results of their actions.

Perpetrators are not victims.

Terri being a perpetrator is just hypothetical. We have no evidence she was, no statement from LE that she was, no indictment, no charges and no conviction - which puts her in the same position as the other parents.

She hasn't been indicted YET. Common sense indicates Terri's arrest is coming. She will never be a victim, she will be held accountable.

"Common sense" indicated Terri's arrest in late June 2010, after the restraining order and divorce. And so it went, month after month, year after year until now, more that fourteen years later and zero movement from law enforcement.

Common sense at this point says she won't be arrested.

There are legal procedures to nullify immunity...watch and see.

Terri doesn't have immunity. And there's no hint of a case against Dede.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Precious child, today is your 22nd birthday.


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Justice for Kyron!

 

[MamaSleuth5]

Precious child, today is your 22nd birthday.

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Justice for Kyron!

Happy birthday Kyron.

 

[mmeynstyn]

Kyron remains in our hearts and minds after all these years.

Justice for Kyron.