Kyron's General Discussion Thread for 2012-13

[cluciano63]

It is my personal belief that no one saw her leave with him because she planned it that way. Plus she fit right in. Even if people saw them together, it wouldn't have been something unusual enough to remember.

But people knew about his being missing right away, before nightfall and for sure over the weekend. I think if she had left with Kyron, someone would have seen her, and also, that by now she would have been charged. So was she that lucky? And if Kyron had left alone,, same thing, seems he would have been noticed. But of course, he had to get out of that building in some fashion.

Anyway, I have never seen enough to be convinced that the perp is TH. i do believe she is guilty of lots of things, but not sure about whether she had Kyron taken away and/or killed. I guess it is hard for me to believe that she did it and that LE, after all this time, is unable to link her to it in any real way. Such a public place, so many things had to go her way.

I hope if she is guilty, proof is not much longer in coming.

 

[PDXMom]

I'm sorry, it's been a long time since I logged in, so I may be doing this wrong. Is anyone aware of this possible new development? And if so, is there a place where people are already discussing it?
http://www.kptv.com/video?clipId=8007011&autostart=true

 

[Chili Fries]

But people knew about his being missing right away, before nightfall and for sure over the weekend. I think if she had left with Kyron, someone would have seen her, and also, that by now she would have been charged. So was she that lucky? And if Kyron had left alone,, same thing, seems he would have been noticed. But of course, he had to get out of that building in some fashion.

Anyway, I have never seen enough to be convinced that the perp is TH. i do believe she is guilty of lots of things, but not sure about whether she had Kyron taken away and/or killed. I guess it is hard for me to believe that she did it and that LE, after all this time, is unable to link her to it in any real way. Such a public place, so many things had to go her way.

I hope if she is guilty, proof is not much longer in coming.

I just don't see any way to reconcile Terri's innocence with DeDe taking the Fifth 147 times in her affidavit and with Terri choosing to not have any contact with her daughter for 2 1/2 years because she's afraid of what might come up in divorce proceedings. Those just aren't the actions of innocent people.

When Kyron disappeared, I started with him possibly wandering off, being abducted by a stranger or even being hit by someone driving thru the school parking lot (who removed his body to cover it up). Since then, my estimation of the probability of Terri's guilt has gone up, up, up...and is well over 90%. I'm not absolutely sure Terri was responsible for Kyron's disappearance, that's impossible at this point, but I'm close.

 

[worriedmommy]

I was wondering the same thing....what have they found?

 

[angelmom]

I just don't see any way to reconcile Terri's innocence with DeDe taking the Fifth 147 times in her affidavit and with Terri choosing to not have any contact with her daughter for 2 1/2 years because she's afraid of what might come up in divorce proceedings. Those just aren't the actions of innocent people.

When Kyron disappeared, I started with him possibly wandering off, being abducted by a stranger or even being hit by someone driving thru the school parking lot (who removed his body to cover it up). Since then, my estimation of the probability of Terri's guilt has gone up, up, up...and is well over 90%. I'm not absolutely sure Terri was responsible for Kyron's disappearance, that's impossible at this point, but I'm close.

Just because they aren't guilty of taking Kyron doesn't mean they aren't guilty of anything. That's what keeps me on the fence. If she were really guilty, I have a hard time believing she'd have taken the LDT so willingly the first time and gotten so upset in subsequent visits. A guilty person is more likely to have lawyered up BEFORE the LDT, IMHO.

But I get what you're saying. Sometimes I still wonder if, years from now, they will find his body in/very near the school and realize that no one is guilty. I know that's crazy, but it nags me that no one saw anything.

 

[sweetsavi]

Who here has been following the news today about the girl, Nailla Robinson, in Philadelphia? So easily taken by a stranger, from her classroom, no one realized something was wrong until she did not come home from school. Even then, the only reason they knew she was abducted was because it was caught on camera.

My mind immediately thought of Kyron. Today's events make me believe even stronger, that some one got away with the perfect crime, the moment fingers pointed at Terri.

 

[Chili Fries]

Just because they aren't guilty of taking Kyron doesn't mean they aren't guilty of anything. That's what keeps me on the fence. If she were really guilty, I have a hard time believing she'd have taken the LDT so willingly the first time and gotten so upset in subsequent visits. A guilty person is more likely to have lawyered up BEFORE the LDT, IMHO.

But I get what you're saying. Sometimes I still wonder if, years from now, they will find his body in/very near the school and realize that no one is guilty. I know that's crazy, but it nags me that no one saw anything.

I just can't imagine what they could be so guilty of, other than making Kyron disappear, that would cause them to act like this. Especially considering that there are questions about what DeDe was up to the day Kyron disappeared.

And I've seen other cases where the perp took a LDT. Initially cooperating can probably can seem logical to the guilty as a way to throw off LE (and, in this case, other family members') suspicion. But as time goes on, and the pressure heats up, the guilty realizes that he or she has to change strategy and hire a lawyer.

 

[cluciano63]

Maybe the plot to kill Kaine existed and Dede was in on it...who knows.

Anyway, I just can't not consider other options besides these two women, without seeing some real evidence. Seems like they should have been so easy to crack, and/or to get one of them to talk. Or to just find some major screw-up on their part. As far as Dede taking the fifth, her lawyer may not have wanted her to answer a specific question, so he told her to take it on all of them. Anyway, I just don't know. They just don't seem like masterminds to me. And i know that is not necessary to pull off a crime, but still.

 

[Cazzie]

To me, the main telling point is that Teri hasn't apparently been fighting for custody (or at least visitations) with her daughter. As far as "we" know, she just walked away from her.

Also, the divorce case has been postponed a couple times, due to the investigation of Kyron's disappearance.

 

[MissJ]

I still wonder about those kids who said they saw him after TH left. Were they all wrong? Also, I never understood the timing, if she planned this, as many think. He was leaving for the weekend that day, and for a part of the summer very soon. I have always hung on to some doubts.

I agree. There was too little time (to me) for TH to take Kyron and do whatever with him. He has never been found. One would think he would have been found if it were TH.:moo:

 

[mrsu]

Kyron brought me to WS. He captured my heart.

I hope you can get justice soon Buddy. The recent events seem encouraging.

 

[angelmom]

Who here has been following the news today about the girl, Nailla Robinson, in Philadelphia? So easily taken by a stranger, from her classroom, no one realized something was wrong until she did not come home from school. Even then, the only reason they knew she was abducted was because it was caught on camera.

My mind immediately thought of Kyron. Today's events make me believe even stronger, that some one got away with the perfect crime, the moment fingers pointed at Terri.

Also this/

http://www.11alive.com/rss/article/...es-left?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cluciano63]

To me, the main telling point is that Teri hasn't apparently been fighting for custody (or at least visitations) with her daughter. As far as "we" know, she just walked away from her.

Also, the divorce case has been postponed a couple times, due to the investigation of Kyron's disappearance.

That is not quite enough to me. People have given up custody forever. Who knows what one would do, if facing potential murder charges?

 

[Cazzie]

That is not quite enough to me. People have given up custody forever. Who knows what one would do, if facing potential murder charges?

I have no idea.

It's just that she apparently adored Baby K, and K is her only daughter. So, it would seem "normal" to fight for at least visitation. She hasn't been allowed to see her for eons (I forget how long now).

I forgot to mention that another thing may be the alleged murder for hire issue.

In any case, she hasn't gotten any charges for Kyron or the MFH (yet, if ever).

I feel badly for Kaine; I'm sure he wants the divorce final ASAP (making that assumption).

 

[cluciano63]

I would have lost all faith in LE by now, if I was Desiree or Kaine. If more than 2.5 years is not enough to figure out if this woman is guilty or not and find a way to charge her with...something, I would probably be pushing them to look elsewhere. I just can't figure out why they can't find something to charge her with; custodial interference, something. Can she have pulled off such a perfect crime? And yes, it is perfect, if she is not charged and he is never found, even if she lives under a cloud, IMO.

 

[Bluestars]

Here is what Kaine's attorney had to say about Terri's intention to plead the Fifth if questioned:

"Mother has not yet taken the stand and she has not yet invoked her Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination. Instead, Mother's civil attorney advised the court that Mother intends to invoke her privilege against self-incrimination and that Mother will not testify at all in support of her motion. Mother's attorney informed the court that mother would seek to quash certain discovery subpoenas on the grounds that the information is protected by Mother's right against self-incrimination."

"The fact that Mother's attorney has advised the Court that Mother intends to plead the Fifth speaks volumes about what Mother has to hide."

http://images.bimedia.net/documents/kaine+horman+court+1112.pdf

Here is what Dede Spicher had to say when asked about Kyron:

Do you know where Kyron Horman is?
"I'm asserting my Fifth Amendment right."

Do you know whether Kyron Horman is alive?
"I'm asserting my Fifth Amendment right."


Have you ever been to Skyline Elementary School?
"Going to assert my Fifth Amendment right."

http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/DeDe-watermarked-1.pdf

Based on Terri and Dede's responses as noted in the court documents, all signs point to their involvement, in my opinion. Dede can only plead the Fifth if she believes her answers will incriminate her, not Terri. Therefore, her answers in her deposition questions are very revealing. She did answer many questions in her deposition. Why wouldn't she answer whether or not she thought Kyron was alive? If she didn't know the answer, then her answer to that deposition question would not have been incriminating. The only way her answer would incriminate her is if she knew whether or not he was alive, in my opinion.

 

[Ardeaa]

My first thought was that eventually DeDe would give up Terri; after all, how long would you cover for a friend, with all this pressure on YOU? But then, the fact that she pled the 5th so many times tells me she's in deeper than just knowing about it. Think about it. If I had a friend whose step-child went missing, I'd be willingly going to the police and telling them anything I could to help find him, no matter how good a "friend" the stepmom was. I wouldn't care if she got mad at me. A kid is missing here! This is not normal behavior. She's got something to hide, was in on it physically (either abducted him from the school, took part in a murder, hid the body, or whatever) -something that would make her culpable in the eyes of the law. You have to wonder why one of them won't just turn on the other and claim she did it? Try to save their own skin? There has to be some sort of evidence that they were both guilty that keeps them from ratting each other out. It's obviously not video surveillance or eyewitnesses. Does each of them have a copy of some sort of secret signed agreement that if one goes down, the other goes down? To keep them from blaming it all on each other? I really do think these two did something to Kyron. Not sure about Terri's older son; I wonder if he's going to be questioned again, or has been, since he's 18?

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I would have lost all faith in LE by now, if I was Desiree or Kaine. If more than 2.5 years is not enough to figure out if this woman is guilty or not and find a way to charge her with...something, I would probably be pushing them to look elsewhere. I just can't figure out why they can't find something to charge her with; custodial interference, something. Can she have pulled off such a perfect crime? And yes, it is perfect, if she is not charged and he is never found, even if she lives under a cloud, IMO.

I feel like Desiree and Kaine need Terri to be guilty. If Terri is guilty, they can try things like the civil trial to try to get information out. Desiree can put up billboards to put pressure on her. And there's that hope that since they "know" who it is, maybe, they will get enough evidence to arrest her.

If a stranger is guilty...Well, he's left no trace. He's just a nameless, faceless entity. Unless someone turns him in, I don't see how he would ever be caught.

 

[Bluestars]

My first thought was that eventually DeDe would give up Terri; after all, how long would you cover for a friend, with all this pressure on YOU? But then, the fact that she pled the 5th so many times tells me she's in deeper than just knowing about it. Think about it. If I had a friend whose step-child went missing, I'd be willingly going to the police and telling them anything I could to help find him, no matter how good a "friend" the stepmom was. I wouldn't care if she got mad at me. A kid is missing here! This is not normal behavior. She's got something to hide, was in on it physically (either abducted him from the school, took part in a murder, hid the body, or whatever) -something that would make her culpable in the eyes of the law. You have to wonder why one of them won't just turn on the other and claim she did it? Try to save their own skin? There has to be some sort of evidence that they were both guilty that keeps them from ratting each other out. It's obviously not video surveillance or eyewitnesses. Does each of them have a copy of some sort of secret signed agreement that if one goes down, the other goes down? To keep them from blaming it all on each other? I really do think these two did something to Kyron. Not sure about Terri's older son; I wonder if he's going to be questioned again, or has been, since he's 18?

Regarding Terri's son James, he gave a deposition. However, it doesn't seem like he pleaded the Fifth to any questions. If he had, I feel that Rosenthal would have filed a motion to compel testimony like he did with Dede. Since it doesn't seem like that happened, my guess is that James is not involved. He may have information from things he overheard in the household while he lived with the Moultons or possibly things he heard while living with the Hormans. IMO.

 

[Bluestars]

I feel like Desiree and Kaine need Terri to be guilty. If Terri is guilty, they can try things like the civil trial to try to get information out. Desiree can put up billboards to put pressure on her. And there's that hope that since they "know" who it is, maybe, they will get enough evidence to arrest her.

If a stranger is guilty...Well, he's left no trace. He's just a nameless, faceless entity. Unless someone turns him in, I don't see how he would ever be caught.

If Terri and Dede were innocent, they wouldn't need to plead the Fifth. Especially Dede pleading the Fifth to whether or not she had been to Skyline school or whether she thought Kyron was alive. I don't know how many parents of missing children would be ok with people who had contact with their children pleading the Fifth when questioned or telling their attorney that they intend to plead the Fifth. I probably would have been much more vocal than either Kaine or Desiree if this had happened to me.

If a stranger took Kyron, then Terri and Dede's answers would not be self-incriminating and they would not legally be able to plead the Fifth when questioned about him, nor would pleading the Fifth be necessary.