LA - Officer fatally shoots Alton Sterling outside store, Baton Rouge, 2016

[Irish_Eyes]

Sure I can. The police should be held to a higher standard of conduct. They are sworn in with the understanding that their role is to protect and serve. Not to shoot first, cover it up, and ask questions later.

Police should be held to a higher standard of conduct. That doesn't change what I said.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

I hear you, and it saddens me that there is such an empathy deficit on the part of so many who deny the fact that there is a deadly and growing problem with racial discrepancies in regards to how citizens are treated by police in this country. It's like the police have this enormous, glaring, impossible to not see disease in their culture, and they refuse to acknowledge it, or listen to the people for whom their conduct has become most dangerous. I don't know if it's pride, ego, a feeling of superiority when wearing a gun, or what. But the police are going to have to play a part in the solution to this mess. And they as of yet have refused to come to the table to talk.

You have adequately described the ideologues on one side of the issue, and then parlayed that into an unsupportable rant about police. How would you describe the ideologues on the other side of the issue?

 

[katydid23]

Um...that is their job. To protect and serve....and that means protect and serve all. IMO

CORRECT. But they need to protect themselves and their fellow officers as well.

 

[animlzrule]

You have adequately described the ideologues on one side of the issue, and then parlayed that into an unsupportable rant about police. How would you describe the ideologues on the other side of the issue?

How is what I said an "unsupportable rant?" Presumably, you've been watching the news and hearing about all of the incidences of black people being killed by police under suspicious and demonstrably negligent/criminal circumstances? If not, I don't think these threads are going to have much relevance for you. In fact, one of those incidents happened in your very own state. This thread wouldn't exist if not for the actions and culture of policing in this country today.

 

[scmom]

How many of us can tell whether Sterling was trying to get the gun from his pocket?

 

[Irish_Eyes]

I hear you, and it saddens me that there is such an empathy deficit on the part of so many who deny the fact that there is a deadly and growing problem with racial discrepancies in regards to how citizens are treated by police in this country. It's like the police have this enormous, glaring, impossible to not see disease in their culture, and they refuse to acknowledge it, or listen to the people for whom their conduct has become most dangerous. I don't know if it's pride, ego, a feeling of superiority when wearing a gun, or what. But the police are going to have to play a part in the solution to this mess. And they as of yet have refused to come to the table to talk.

My brother-in-law is a police officer. Actually just retired. I wish you could meet him, or one of the many others like him. I truly believe that if you could, your feelings and beliefs would change.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

How many of us can tell whether Sterling was trying to get the gun from his pocket?

Not me.

 

[tangelo]

Speaking of personal attacks...

....youre 2 for 2

 

[kimlynn]

CORRECT. But they need to protect themselves and their fellow officers as well.

Of course. They seem to do that for the most part very well. IMO

 

[katydid23]

I hear you, and it saddens me that there is such an empathy deficit on the part of so many who deny the fact that there is a deadly and growing problem with racial discrepancies in regards to how citizens are treated by police in this country. It's like the police have this enormous, glaring, impossible to not see disease in their culture, and they refuse to acknowledge it, or listen to the people for whom their conduct has become most dangerous. I don't know if it's pride, ego, a feeling of superiority when wearing a gun, or what. But the police are going to have to play a part in the solution to this mess. And they as of yet have refused to come to the table to talk.

And it goes both ways. Maybe if you ever walked a beat in a low income community, you might see that there is also an enormous, glaring hatred towards LE by many of the young people. And as long as they have this seething anger and hatred, which comes out in violent spurts at times, there is not going to be peace between them. They need to play a part in the solution as well. And if EVERY time a young male is shot, it is AUTOMATICALLY turned into a protest, even when it is a totally justified shooting, then LE will never be able to trust those neighborhoods.

 

[katydid23]

Of course. They seem to do that for the most part very well. IMO

Understandably. Their job puts them in the line of fire and they are trained to stay alive.

 

[animlzrule]

My brother-in-law is a police officer. Actually just retired. I wish you could meet him, or one of the many others like him. I truly believe that if you could, your feelings and beliefs would change.

Well, presumably he's an honorable man, and served with integrity. If so, it's too bad he is not still on the force to serve as an example to his fellow officers. I trust while still on duty, he did his part to acknowledge and identify officers who have participated in unscrupulous profiling, harassment and bigotry/racism. That's what we need for our police forces today. Not ragey, militarized warriors out to kill over disrespect, misdemeanor crimes, traffic violations, etc.

 

[katydid23]

How is what I said an "unsupportable rant?" Presumably, you've been watching the news and hearing about all of the incidences of black people being killed by police under suspicious and demonstrably negligent/criminal circumstances? If not, I don't think these threads are going to have much relevance for you. In fact, one of those incidents happened in your very own state. This thread wouldn't exist if not for the actions and culture of policing in this country today.

There were over a million arrests last year. How many people died at the hands of police during those million arrests? And how many cops were injured or killed? There is a purposeful exaggeration in the amount of 'suspicious' circumstances in my opinion. Even when the suspect was running from a violent crime and shooting at the cops, BLM a activists go to the scene and start up a protest, AS IF it was a bad shooting by LE.

 

[animlzrule]

Of course. They seem to do that for the most part very well. IMO

VERY well. What is it called again, the Blue Wall of Silence?

 

[kimlynn]

And it goes both ways. Maybe if you ever walked a beat in a low income community, you might see that there is also an enormous, glaring hatred towards LE by many of the young people. And as long as they have this seething anger and hatred, which comes out in violent spurts at times, there is not going to be peace between them. They need to play a part in the solution as well. And if EVERY time a young male is shot, it is AUTOMATICALLY turned into a protest, even when it is a totally justified shooting, then LE will never be able to trust those neighborhoods.

And now we need to ask why the hatred toward authority/LE. I don't need to ask.....it seems there is good reason and well placed for some to have that mistrust. IMO

 

[kimlynn]

VERY well. What is it called again, the Blue Wall of Silence?

Brothers in Blue. I get it. It is an org after all.
IMO

 

[Irish_Eyes]

How is what I said an "unsupportable rant?" Presumably, you've been watching the news and hearing about all of the incidences of black people being killed by police under suspicious and demonstrably negligent/criminal circumstances? If not, I don't think these threads are going to have much relevance for you. In fact, one of those incidents happened in your very own state. This thread wouldn't exist if not for the actions and culture of policing in this country today.

One incident happened in my state? No, three happened in my city alone. Tamir was from my old neighborhood. But before him there were Timothy Russel and Malissa Williams. Google the term "137 shots." At TWO people. How insane is that? Before that was Dan Ficker. I know his family. The anniversary of his death was just a few days ago, and it's hard to see how this has affected their family. Tell me again how ignorant I am about this issue, please.

I'm NOT against holding bad officers accountable. I am against treating good officers like bad officers just because people feel like they have to pick a side in everything and sit on that side regardless of the circumstances. 11 officers have been shot tonight - intentionally targeted - and 3 are dead and it's still continuing. If that doesn't make someone jump out of their chosen "side" I honestly don't know what will.

 

[katydid23]

And now we need to ask why the hatred toward authority/LE. I don't need to ask.....it seems there is good reason and well placed for some to have that mistrust. IMO

And once again, it goes both ways. Of course there will be hatred for people who arrest you for dealing drugs, driving without a license, stealing cars, etc. It is natural there will be animosity. So YES, there is good reason on both sides for the distrust.

 

[bluesneakers]

I hear you, and it saddens me that there is such an empathy deficit on the part of so many who deny the fact that there is a deadly and growing problem with racial discrepancies in regards to how citizens are treated by police in this country. It's like the police have this enormous, glaring, impossible to not see disease in their culture, and they refuse to acknowledge it, or listen to the people for whom their conduct has become most dangerous. I don't know if it's pride, ego, a feeling of superiority when wearing a gun, or what. But the police are going to have to play a part in the solution to this mess. And they as of yet have refused to come to the table to talk.

What's it going to take? The only thing I can think is if someday there are criminal charges and real jail time they might be willing to work it out. But we reward them, for the most part, and there's no reason for them to change.

It sounds like I'm describing an episode of Dr. Phil, doesn't it? Keep doing what you do and getting what you get, and ya gotta acknowledge what needs to be changed.

 

[animlzrule]

What's it going to take? The only thing I can think is if someday there are criminal charges and real jail time they might be willing to work it out. But we reward them, for the most part, and there's no reason for them to change.

It sounds like I'm describing an episode of Dr. Phil, doesn't it? Keep doing what you do and getting what you get, and ya gotta acknowledge what needs to be changed.

Exactly. It's kind of like all of the children who are killed in their homes by guns, and it's just chalked up to a "tragic accident" and no one is charged. Until they institute mandatory minimums for these "tragic accidents" they are going to continue unabated. One thing that NEEDS to happen is that the police should no longer be allowed to investigate themselves. That might make a dent right there. A totally independent agency needs to review every case. I suspect were the police to have to face actual consequences, some might be less inclined to go the Rambo route in their interactions with citizens.