Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.14.17 - Day 15

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Another email from Penner: "Hi Shane, here is the invoice for the remainder of the incinerator. Please send a cheque for the amount. Any questions please let me know. That you for your business."
by Adam Carter 3:16 PM

One more email from Schlatman. In it, he's talking about having trouble getting the unit operational.
by Adam Carter 3:19 PM
 
Penner says he's used Eliminator machines before. "In a 500 pound unit, if the burn has gone well ... there might be a five pound pail of ashes left over," he says.
by Adam Carter 3:22 PM

Penner says you get the ash out of the machine with a "rake" a steel tube with a piece on the end to pull ashes out of the bottom.
by Adam Carter 3:23 PM



Penner says the rake comes with the unit. We've seen it in photos before.
by Adam Carter 3:24 PM
 
Alongside with the propane, there's also an electrical hookup used to get it started and for a fan, Penner says.
by Adam Carter 3:26 PM
 
I just looked on Google and there's one for sale on a Govt auction, if anyone wants one.
 
You need to plug the unit into an outlet or a generator to get it to run, Penner says.
by Adam Carter 3:28 PM
 
That's not good. A 1/2" either way on a 2" grid is a 25% margin of error, which puts some of the measurements she used to rule out deer bones in question. :/
If you think about it no. I think it works against him yet again if the jury thinks hard about it. Remember, she stated bones SHRINK as they are burned. Deer bones would be so much smaller... as would Lauras!
 
Penner says the animal placed inside the incinerator would sit on top of cement tubes inside the unit. "The purpose is to keep the carcass off the floor so it will burn better," Penner says.
by Adam Carter 3:32 PM
 
The Crown is now asking how the tubes are attached to the inside of the machine.
by Adam Carter 3:33 PM
 
The Crown is now done with Penner. Millard is up to cross-examine.
by Adam Carter 3:34 PM
 
If you think about it no. I think it works against him yet again if the jury thinks hard about it. Remember, she stated bones SHRINK as they are burned. Deer bones would be so much smaller... as would Lauras!

I think it entirely depends on if that 1/2" variance is per grid square, or for the whole grid. 1/2" per square would be a up to 25% variance.
 
I thought LB's phone was thrown away at 11:00 AM a half an hour from Dellen's house.

It's hard to wade thru the threads for Nov. 2 afternoon and maybe Nov. 3rd am when that evidence was presented. Personally, I believe reporters, who mostly weren't in court, and were focussed on the pings that placed Laura at Maplegate, mixed up 11 am and 11 pm in news coverage.

I found this tweet, from the mid afternoon of November 2nd

Shannon Martin‏ @ShannonMartinTV 10m10 minutes ago
Rubello now shows us Babcock's phone records from midnight July 4, to 11pm the same night.

It's all incoming calls and texts.

I think that indicates her phone went dead at 11 pm.
 
I haven’t seen the actual cell location evidence, and the news reports I’ve seen are vague and in some cases contradictory to each other. If you have some links please share!

The cell tower that was pinged on 3 July for DM's home is reported to be 800m from the Maplegate residence. Would the same tower be used to pick LB up at Kipling Station? I don't know Toronto streets very well.

If the same tower would be used, is it possible that MS did not leave Maplegate and travel with DM to pickup LB? MS phone would ping the same tower by virtue of being in the same area, not necessarily in a vehicle with DM?
 
"We've never met in person, have we?" Millard asks. "No, we haven't," Penner responds.
by Adam Carter 3:35 PM

Millard now talking about the tubes that are in the incinerator. He's asking what the purpose is for each of them. "Number four tube, even in the photograph, you can tell it's a little bit higher," Millard says. "It's possible," Penner says.
by Adam Carter 3:37 PM

This is calling back to Millard's testimony from this morning, where he was saying these cement tubes weren't totally level, which would have thrown off calculations Dr. Tracy Rogers made.
by Adam Carter 3:38 PM

Penner says that the tubes aren't 100 per cent straight, and there can be slight variations.
by Adam Carter 3:38 PM

Millard also saying it's conceivable the tubes could shift in transit. "Oh, absolutely," Penner says.
by Adam Carter 3:39 PM

Penner says police forces sometimes even use these to dispose of contraband.
by Adam Carter 3:40 PM
 
Millard now asking about the difference between the prices on the two units, and the "good value" of going from the 250 model to the 500.
by Adam Carter 3:41 PM

Millard now asking about what makes this unit unique -- that it was put on a trailer. "It makes it able to travel to other locations, right?" Millard says, adding it could do more than one job, because it was mobile. "Making it mobile actually gives it the ability to shift from one job to the next," Millard says.
by Adam Carter 3:43 PM
 
The cell tower that was pinged on 3 July for DM's home is reported to be 800m from the Maplegate residence. Would the same tower be used to pick LB up at Kipling Station? I don't know Toronto streets very well.

If the same tower would be used, is it possible that MS did not leave Maplegate and travel with DM to pickup LB? MS phone would ping the same tower by virtue of being in the same area, not necessarily in a vehicle with DM?

No, he would ping off several different towers on that trip.
 
Penner says a propane unit would have a smaller tank, and would make it easier to move around.
by Adam Carter 3:45 PM
 
It's hard to wade thru the threads for Nov. 2 afternoon and maybe Nov. 3rd am when that evidence was presented. Personally, I believe reporters, who mostly weren't in court, and were focussed on the pings that placed Laura at Maplegate, mixed up 11 am and 11 pm in news coverage.

I found this tweet, from the mid afternoon of November 2nd



I think that indicates her phone went dead at 11 pm.

I get the feeling he turned the phone on just before he chucked it to make sure there were no concerning messages on there.
 
Millard asking if you could buy any of the pieces of this machine separately, and Penner says yes -- but says they've never sold a unit as individual pieces, unless they hadn't sold a unit to a person before.
by Adam Carter 3:47 PM
 
So with the latest Mob Reporter video I was able to clean up the text messages for July 3-4 on the timeline. Some observations:

MM was at Maple Gate
It looks like MS and MM were both at Maple Gate during July 3, overnight to July 4, and throughout the day on July 4. Perhaps we'll hear more details of what happened in that time when MM gets on the stand?

The "heini"
IMO the present that DM left for MS at the top of the stairs was just a pack of beer.

Did MS have a clue what was happening that night (July 3)?
It seems that after picking up LB and bringing her back to Maple Gate, DM went back out again around 7:30pm. MS was still at Maple Gate and suggesting they get some food when DM returned. He had also asked for some change to get food. IMO it doesn't seem like MS is aware of or getting ready for a pending murder mission.

Was MS present for LB's murder?
There's a 5 hour window between when DM tells MS he's "on a mission, back in 1 hour," and when MS later asks, "Where u at?" The window is July 3 at 7:33pm to July 4 at 12:42am. Anything could have happened in that time, but it's difficult to tell whether MS was ever with DM.

Let's say DM returned to Maple Gate around 8:30pm, then "hit the vapes and tripped out for a bit", and then regained his senses around 1:00am. MS, expecting to have heard from DM earlier, was then asking "Where u at?" at 12:42am. So perhaps they never actually met up earlier.

Then, at 2am MS wants to talk to DM but DM says he's going to sleep and they'll talk in the morning. MS doesn't respond until 9am in the morning when he says, "Aight."

Based on all of this, it's not clear whether MS even saw DM in person during the evening of July 3 and through until the morning of July 4. IMO until we hear further evidence, MS could have a good argument to say he wasn't present if/when LB was killed. At this point I haven't heard any evidence to suggest that MS was involved in the planning/deliberation aspect, either.

DM does all the work
DM seems to be doing everything by himself on July 4. He rolled his first spliff, drove to Waterloo and the farm, and eventually returned to Maple Gate in the afternoon. Meanwhile, it seems MS was sleeping the whole time. DM texted MS, "Back before 4pm" and, "Left some dough on the coffee table in the basement," so if MS did return to Oakville that day, it likely wasn't until later in the evening.

Who pulled all-nighters?
At 2am DM told MS he was going to sleep and they'd talk in the morning. So it seems like DM did sleep that night. Or alternatively, he stayed awake but just said that to defer talking to MS until later. In either case, it puts distance between DM and MS for that time period.

If MS didn't get up until 3:20pm then it seems he didn't get much sleep. Was he just getting drunk in the basement with MM? From his 3:21pm text, "How's the spliff?", he seems to understand what that means. This suggests that either he was involved in killing LB, or DM filled him in about it at some point (say, in the morning).

Awesome that MM was there. Imo her testimony will be a real nail biter from start to finish. She'll spill all she knows/recalls imo.

Imo, no way MM knew what was to happen that night nor is she likely to have realized it the next day. I base this mainly on the fact DM did not want her to be at the hangar when LB was cremated in the Eliminator on 24 July.
 
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