MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #3

[ThinkHard]

I suspect the killer is will be serial killer, and this is his first kill. I have searched Google and it does not seem like their are any other missing women or unsolved murders in Central Mass within the last 15 years or so that are similar to this case. Although, the killer could be new to the area or have a lifestyle where he travels and may have killed other players.

If it's his first kill, how can he be a serial killer?

 

[Rocky1]

According to FBI, long distance truck driving is the ideal occupation for a serial killer.... So surprised to see stat in the above 72% of serial killers never kill outside of one state

I think that tells us the percentage of serial killers that are truck drivers.
As Crimestopper pointed out there are certain situations that enable the FBI to join a case. They don't have jurisdiction to get involved with just any case. I was trying to figure out why the FBI was called in in the first place, and the reason they could have become involved.
I'll post the link below where I got my Stats from.
I clicked on the links that would apply here.
1)Violent Crimes.
2)What we investigate.. The only category I found that fit was "Serial Murder: Pathways For Investigations." This is the reason I think they were called in. Nothing to go on, just my thoughts.
3)Page 18 starts explaining the stats.

https://www.fbi.gov/investigate

 

[rosesfromangels]

I always use research and statistics as directional, baseline, info. It's very helpful; humans are for the large part, quite predictable. I always use the example that a LE friend of mine gave me once. "How many women have jewelry/valuables "hidden" in their underware drawer right now? That's the *first* place a burglar looks!"

I was imagining in my mind how this crime unfolded, and here's the scenario/profile I came up with. Several gaps in the theory, but a place to start.
The Perp is in late teens, maybe very early 20's, but most likely around 19 years old. Lives at home, not in school and has very spotty work history. A problem child. May have displayed developmental issues, most especially impulse control. History of animal abuse, lacks empathy. If there is a younger sibling, history of being abusive to them. Fascination with fire, perhaps noted for setting small fires. May be history of mental illness of some sort on mothers side of family. History of bedwetting beyond average age of cessation.

The Perp lives within "observation" range of the victim. Tracked her every move; knew her routine very well. He might have known her indirectly, such as bagging her groceries, or setting up scenarios where he would be in close proximity to her. The day of the murder was well planned. For some reason that I can't quite figure out, I really do not believe he escaped via a car. I think his incendiary gear was either in a backpack, or stashed somewhere. He grew up in the area, so knew his route well.

The Perp lay in wait, and had the advantage of the element of surprise. I think he attacked her from behind. Do we know if she sustained a blow to the back of her skull? He dragged her off her jogging path, stunned, in to the area where she passed over. Hidden from view. He took objects to nourish his memories of the attack. As far as the use of fire, in my amateur profile, this gear was obtained from a gas station where repairs are made to cars, or an auto repair/body shop. He either stole the gear, has access to it; maybe his father works there?

When the crime was reported to the public, his family immediately thought of him. They know he is unstable. I don't think this really had much to do personally with the victim; I think she was just "prey" who was in his target zone, his geography. She was an object to him, not a person. No empathy. (Obviously). I don't see this as personalized towards her, just fulfillment of his aberrant mind.
I also believe while devious and furtive, he will absolutely be arrested. His behavior is impossible to completely conceal, and I believe his family knows this.

So this is my *amateur* profile of this Perp. Emphasis on amateur. We will see how close I am when he is arrested. And he will be, and soon I believe.

 

[writermom]

just a few thoughts and questions i have been pondering. personally, as an outsider, i think its quite possible that the killer lived in the vicinity and maybe spotted vanessa and was attracted to her. it sounds like it is a bit off the beaten path. how long had vanessa been visting her mom and aunt at that address? is there a young male nearby that has been out of town for awhile and recently returned? perhaps for college, employment, incarceration, rehab, mental health reasons? a local might be incredibly familiar and comfortable with those woods. if the murder was staged, could he have been trying to make it appear to be religious in nature? could someone nearby have spotted her in a car with her dad the night before and mistaken him for a boyfriend and become enraged?

 

[rosesfromangels]

just a few thoughts and questions i have been pondering. personally, as an outsider, i think its quite possible that the killer lived in the vicinity and maybe spotted vanessa and was attracted to her. it sounds like it is a bit off the beaten path. how long had vanessa been visting her mom and aunt at that address? is there a young male nearby that has been out of town for awhile and recently returned? perhaps for college, employment, incarceration, rehab, mental health reasons? a local might be incredibly familiar and comfortable with those woods. if the murder was staged, could he have been trying to make it appear to be religious in nature? could someone nearby have spotted her in a car with her dad the night before and mistaken him for a boyfriend and become enraged?

We are absolutely thinking along the same lines. I think you are tracking on all elements. Agree...agree.

 

[Paulclapper]

Had an extra is in the first sentence. Just seems like he will kill again.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Had an extra is in the first sentence. Just seems like he will kill again.

Yes. It seems if we look at other examples, the compulsion doesn't go away, it only amplifies.

 

[Mskin]

I suspect the killer is will be serial killer, and this is his first kill. I have searched Google and it does not seem like their are any other missing women or unsolved murders in Central Mass within the last 15 years or so that are similar to this case. Although, the killer could be new to the area or have a lifestyle where he travels and may have killed other players.

Molly Bish



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rocky1]

I always use research and statistics as directional, baseline, info. It's very helpful; humans are for the large part, quite predictable. I always use the example that a LE friend of mine gave me once. "How many women have jewelry/valuables "hidden" in their underware drawer right now? That's the *first* place a burglar looks!"

I was imagining in my mind how this crime unfolded, and here's the scenario/profile I came up with. Several gaps in the theory, but a place to start.
The Perp is in late teens, maybe very early 20's, but most likely around 19 years old. Lives at home, not in school and has very spotty work history. A problem child. May have displayed developmental issues, most especially impulse control. History of animal abuse, lacks empathy. If there is a younger sibling, history of being abusive to them. Fascination with fire, perhaps noted for setting small fires. May be history of mental illness of some sort on mothers side of family. History of bedwetting beyond average age of cessation.

The Perp lives within "observation" range of the victim. Tracked her every move; knew her routine very well. He might have known her indirectly, such as bagging her groceries, or setting up scenarios where he would be in close proximity to her. The day of the murder was well planned. For some reason that I can't quite figure out, I really do not believe he escaped via a car. I think his incendiary gear was either in a backpack, or stashed somewhere. He grew up in the area, so knew his route well.

The Perp lay in wait, and had the advantage of the element of surprise. I think he attacked her from behind. Do we know if she sustained a blow to the back of her skull? He dragged her off her jogging path, stunned, in to the area where she passed over. Hidden from view. He took objects to nourish his memories of the attack. As far as the use of fire, in my amateur profile, this gear was obtained from a gas station where repairs are made to cars, or an auto repair/body shop. He either stole the gear, has access to it; maybe his father works there?

When the crime was reported to the public, his family immediately thought of him. They know he is unstable. I don't think this really had much to do personally with the victim; I think she was just "prey" who was in his target zone, his geography. She was an object to him, not a person. No empathy. (Obviously). I don't see this as personalized towards her, just fulfillment of his aberrant mind.
I also believe while devious and furtive, he will absolutely be arrested. His behavior is impossible to completely conceal, and I believe his family knows this.

So this is my *amateur* profile of this Perp. Emphasis on amateur. We will see how close I am when he is arrested. And he will be, and soon I believe.

Very detailed post. Thanks.
When I first heard of this crime, there were a lot of thoughts that I had that match yours. Lives in the area. or knows it well. Knew her routine. Waited and ambushed her from behind, no car involved.etc.
To answer your question about the blow on the back of the head. As far as I know the public has not been made aware of any details, by LE. The media leaked that she was burned, and sexually assaulted.My thoughts are in agreement with you. She was struck from behind.
Writermom, welcome, and not sure how long she visited her mom for, but it was made public that she visited her bi monthly, and was known to go jogging/take a walk on Sunday afternoon, before she went back to NY.

 

[FindHG]

According to FBI, long distance truck driving is the ideal occupation for a serial killer.... So surprised to see stat in the above 72% of serial killers never kill outside of one state

I think I remember Foxfire posting information about cemeteries for some reason being a proclivity for SK's, considered part of their process, in some cases. I noticed one on the corner of Barn Hill and Brooks Station.

In so many ways, Vanessa's murder, the location especially, seems to lend itself to a heightened sense fear and of false avenues. Seems just coincidence, most likely.

Thank you, Rosesfromangels, for taking the time and OldSteve, always. Nice to see posters keep posting their thoughts. Much obliged.

I hope Vanessa's family, friends, Princeton and all those affected soon find some relief.

 

[Inthedetails]

Anyone have insights on how the body is left? In this case, there was no attempt to cover her or to cover the crime, as far as I know. She was left naked, exposed, and burned - which to me means the perp wanted to humiliate her (or himself). She was also was left to be found - in other words, she wasn't far from where she was last known to be and was found quickly.

Does anyone know if this points to stranger or someone the victim knew. In my mind, it would indicate a stranger and she was a random "woman" to violate - that the crime wasn't against Vanessa personally but against females in general, but that's just a hunch.

 

[DatelineFan]

I can't help but think LE is trying to throw people, (neighbors, the perp(s), sluethers) off the trail.

I believe they know who it is.

Sent from my SM-G386T using Tapatalk

I think they know what the car is, but they want more witnesses to corroborate it, and help them find the driver.

 

[ThinkHard]

I always use research and statistics as directional, baseline, info. It's very helpful; humans are for the large part, quite predictable. I always use the example that a LE friend of mine gave me once. "How many women have jewelry/valuables "hidden" in their underware drawer right now? That's the *first* place a burglar looks!"

I was imagining in my mind how this crime unfolded, and here's the scenario/profile I came up with. Several gaps in the theory, but a place to start.
The Perp is in late teens, maybe very early 20's, but most likely around 19 years old. Lives at home, not in school and has very spotty work history. A problem child. May have displayed developmental issues, most especially impulse control. History of animal abuse, lacks empathy. If there is a younger sibling, history of being abusive to them. Fascination with fire, perhaps noted for setting small fires. May be history of mental illness of some sort on mothers side of family. History of bedwetting beyond average age of cessation.

The Perp lives within "observation" range of the victim. Tracked her every move; knew her routine very well. He might have known her indirectly, such as bagging her groceries, or setting up scenarios where he would be in close proximity to her. The day of the murder was well planned. For some reason that I can't quite figure out, I really do not believe he escaped via a car. I think his incendiary gear was either in a backpack, or stashed somewhere. He grew up in the area, so knew his route well.

The Perp lay in wait, and had the advantage of the element of surprise. I think he attacked her from behind. Do we know if she sustained a blow to the back of her skull? He dragged her off her jogging path, stunned, in to the area where she passed over. Hidden from view. He took objects to nourish his memories of the attack. As far as the use of fire, in my amateur profile, this gear was obtained from a gas station where repairs are made to cars, or an auto repair/body shop. He either stole the gear, has access to it; maybe his father works there?

When the crime was reported to the public, his family immediately thought of him. They know he is unstable. I don't think this really had much to do personally with the victim; I think she was just "prey" who was in his target zone, his geography. She was an object to him, not a person. No empathy. (Obviously). I don't see this as personalized towards her, just fulfillment of his aberrant mind.
I also believe while devious and furtive, he will absolutely be arrested. His behavior is impossible to completely conceal, and I believe his family knows this.

So this is my *amateur* profile of this Perp. Emphasis on amateur. We will see how close I am when he is arrested. And he will be, and soon I believe.

Given the size of the town and the location of things like gas stations and supermarkets (neither in town) I think you might want to re-evaluate how he may or may not have come into contact with her, because the suggestions proposed in your theory do not fit this location.

 

[ThinkHard]

Molly Bish



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not even close. Moly was abducted from Warren which isn't really near Princeton. Distance wise it's maybe 30-45 minutes but culturally wise and area wise very different.

The ages, the crimes, the MO all completely different. If Molly's crime is connected to anyone it Holly Piaranean but not to this one....at least is my eyes I just don't see it.

Holly was abducted on my 10th birthday, (and probably started my lifelong interest in unsolved crimes) VM 2 days after my 34th. I've followed all three crimes closely and I just don't see a connection.

 

[ThinkHard]

I think I remember Foxfire posting information about cemeteries for some reason being a proclivity for SK's, considered part of their process, in some cases. I noticed one on the corner of Barn Hill and Brooks Station.

In so many ways, Vanessa's murder, the location especially, seems to lend itself to a heightened sense fear and of false avenues. Seems just coincidence, most likely.

Thank you, Rosesfromangels, for taking the time and OldSteve, always. Nice to see posters keep posting their thoughts. Much obliged.

I hope Vanessa's family, friends, Princeton and all those affected soon find some relief.

What are you referring to? There is no "Barn Hill" road in Princeton.

 

[Steleheart]

I don't know what kind of "Incendiary gear" someone would use in a heavily wooded area right now that would not result in a massive forest fire. It seems some speculation has grown legs as actual fact despite the fact that we don't know the extent of her burns.

"The official said Vanessa Marcotte was found dead more than 100 yards off Brooks Station Road on Sunday afternoon in a heavily wooded area about half-mile from her mother’s home.
The official said the woman had burns on her hands, legs, and face and was partially clothed when she was found.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...g-princeton/AfIQDNRaY60Ek5DtkL9H3O/story.html

In Worcester, right now, the city is under a stage 3 Drought Emergency. As of now it is illegal to serve a customer a glass of water in a restaurant " Unless they ask for it".

Worcester's reservoirs are now down to 55 percent capacity.
http://www.worcesterma.gov/dpw/drought


Woodlands are so dry you can't get a hot idea without risking a darned fire. Never mind torches, incendiary gear or setting a body on fire. Unless he also brought a fire truck how did he put it out?

IMO I think we are more on the line of torture/ abuse with a Bic lighter or cigarette.

Let's not forget they found male DNA on her and knew that the perp has bruises and scratches. That tells me fingernail evidence and defensive wounds, knuckles, etc., so not burned up hands.

IMO this is a young, disorganized killer who may have staked out or stalked women on that road but had no real plan. SO not in the system, no prior evidence to match.

Many women run that road on a regular basis.

MOO

 

[ThinkHard]

Anyone have insights on how the body is left? In this case, there was no attempt to cover her or to cover the crime, as far as I know. She was left naked, exposed, and burned - which to me means the perp wanted to humiliate her (or himself). She was also was left to be found - in other words, she wasn't far from where she was last known to be and was found quickly.

Does anyone know if this points to stranger or someone the victim knew. In my mind, it would indicate a stranger and she was a random "woman" to violate - that the crime wasn't against Vanessa personally but against females in general, but that's just a hunch.

If your intimately familiar with the town of Princeton and that particular point in BSR it seems like a very odd place for just some random person to find, or even just for some local to pick to happen upon a victim. While it's not a place no one runs, it's also a place you could sit in a Sunday afternoon for over 3 hours and not see a single runner go by too.

If someone where just waiting for a random runner to pounce on, it just doesn't seem like the spot you'd pick.

I think at the very least someone would have to know she was running by ten, if not intentionally were meeting here.

I suppose it's possible Simone drove by and spotted here, though this is low on my theory list, the absolute lowest possibility to me though, is that some random person just lay in wait for hours for someone to go by....that just seems very unlikely to me.

 

[Tempura]

What are you referring to? There is no "Barn Hill" road in Princeton.

I'm sure Ball Hill was intended

 

[Inthedetails]

If your intimately familiar with the town of Princeton and that particular point in BSR it seems like a very odd place for just some random person to find, or even just for some local to pick to happen upon a victim. While it's not a place no one runs, it's also a place you could sit in a Sunday afternoon for over 3 hours and not see a single runner go by too.

If someone where just waiting for a random runner to pounce on, it just doesn't seem like the spot you'd pick.

I think at the very least someone would have to know she was running by ten, if not intentionally were meeting here.

I suppose it's possible Simone drove by and spotted here, though this is low on my theory list, the absolute lowest possibility to me though, is that some random person just lay in wait for hours for someone to go by....that just seems very unlikely to me.

I didn't suggest random but a stranger.

I am thinking the crime was against "a woman" not against Vanessa personally.

I wonder if anyone has insight based on how the body was found if it is a stranger or known person.

jmo

Edited to add for clarity....it could be someone who knew Vanessa's routine but wasn't interested in HER, but interested in obtaining a victim in general and used her for that purpose.

 

[Steleheart]

What are you referring to? There is no "Barn Hill" road in Princeton.

I think the poster meant Ball Hill Road, and yes there is a cemetery there. HTH