Madeleine McCann found?

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The McCanns did cooperate with The Police. And if you read The 48 Questions you will see that Kate McCann had already answered questions put to her on the previous day. Sadly, this Interview was not recorded in any way. One might wonder why.

And again, if you look at The 48 Questions, at least half of them were deliberately designed to get Kate to incriminate herself, and were at the very least downright insulting.
Kate McCann simply exercised her right to silence. Gerry answered all of their questions, and when he asked to see their "Evidence" he was fobbed off because they didn't have any.
Their Stitch Up didn't work, so The PJ continued to leak lies.

<Mod Snip>. Please supply a link to support your assertions.

Why on earth would an entire Police Force wish to "stitch up" two innocent holiday makers by leaking "lies"?

How do you know the information is "lies"?

Only the abductor and the McCann would know the difference...are you the abductor? Do you have Madeleine in your broom cupboard?

WHAT IS THE MOTIVE FOR AN ENTIRE POLICE FORCE TO LIE AND STITCH UP TWO INNOCENT HOLIDAY MAKERS?

:what:
 
I think the statistic claiming children who are abducted are murdered within a three hour time frame has been misinterpreted. I think one will find that it is actually of those abducted children who are murdered most are found within three hours.
Snipped to include relevant portion.

I think one will find, if one actually researches it, that over 75% of abducted children are indeed murdered within a 3 hour time frame. I believe very heavily in researching, and double-checking, any numbers I may throw out there.

In 76 percent of the missing children homicide cases studied, the child was dead within three hours of the abduction&#8211;and in 88.5 percent of the cases the child was dead within 24 hours.
http://www.atg.wa.gov/ChildAbductionResearch.aspx

Jaycee Dugard, Elizabeth Smart, and Shawn Hornbeck are exceptions not rules. There are anomolies to every statistic...might Maddie be one? Sure...but is it likely? Statistically, no.
 
Eddie (Cadaver dog) is the one who told us Madeleine died in 5a that night.

Cadaver dogs do not lie, nor "stitch" innocent people up, nor attempt to withhold information or steer investigations.

Of course Team McCann has done a fairly thorough job of discrediting the dogs, too...but I notice the very same posters who completely discredit the dogs, also are calling for them to be involved in other investigations...as though the dogs also are only wrong with the McCann case but trustworthy for every other case.

:banghead:
 
The fact remains that either could be true. An Abductor could have killed Madeleine, so both have to be looked at. But he also said that he believed that Madeleine had been taken by a Stranger, so let's hope that she is still alive, eh?

Why would an "abductor" steal a dead body?

Surely the motive of an "abductor" is to steal a live child?

If Madeleine died that night at the hands of a failed "abductor", her body would have been found discarded.
 
Three years before a child went missing just a few miles away and has yet to be found, in the years before madeleine disappeared there were several break ins to holiday flat and tourist children abuse din their beds. The last one was just six months before madeleine disappeared. All happened within an hour of PDL.
Yep. I really need links for this. If you're alluding to the Joana Cipriano case her mother and uncle were convicted of her murder. (To avoid going down a rabbit hole, for the sake of argument, let's presume the mother's confession was indeed beaten out of her as the court has upheld her claims of torture. We'll know more about her involvement, or lack of, after her retrial for the crime. Regardless, Joao has made no such claim of coercion.) So at least her uncle is likely to remain imprisoned, convicted of her murder. How then does this factor into the McCann case?

As for the tourist children abused in their beds I can find no information available online to either entirely refute or confirm this. What I can locate is Kate McCann's accusations of such - along with this - which I find very important:
Evidence of these incidents had never been collected or collated by Portuguese police.
http://www.thejournal.ie/madeleine-who-could-have-taken-her-134143-May2011/

So where is the proof these events even occurred? And again how does a sex abuse scandal, if there was one, relate to Maddie when we have no proof she was molested either? To me it's kind of like saying because someone was robbed in Dudley it means they also murdered someone in Wolverhampton, iykwim. There needs to be a pattern relevant for me to believe in coincidences that are seemingly unrelated - if even factual.
 
If you actually look at what the mccanns have said, they believe she may be with a family. How awful that, whilst terrified she may have been take for abuse, they cling to the hope she is alive and happy, just like parents of other missing children such as katrice less, ben needham.

And the mccanns have never taken people to court for saying they think madeleine is dead.

Brits kate,
the quote you make does not suport your interpretation.
The quote says In 76 percent of the missing children homicide cases studied, the child was dead within three hours of the abduction&#8211;and in 88.5 percent of the cases the child was dead within 24 hours.
The quote supports what I said, that of those children who are sadly killed, most of them are dead within a few hours. Nowhere does this quote state that the majority of abducted children are murdered.

and eddie the cadaver dog did nto tell anyone madeleine died in 5A, he was a spaniel. He was trained to bark if he smelt scent from bodily fluids and blood, as well as scent from a dead body. He cannot tell anyone if he is barking to bodily fluid, blood or a body, nor can he say who the material belonged to. He is nto known for his accuracy outside of anti-mccanns forum and red tops. When syp released a FOI statement they said he was not even the most successful dog in his two dog team, his alerts were found not to be a body in the jersey case, and when searching for kate prout he barke din her house, but not when standing over her body. He was just in the press a lot because his handler was no longer employed by the police and was setting up a private company where he charged tens of thousands for the use of the dog and needed publicity.
 
This is becoming another semantics game, brit1981, as I don't know how else to quantify the statistics. Of children murdered after being abducted 76% had been murdered within 3 hours. This is a very well-known and relied upon statistic in the true crime community based on a report conducted through funding by the US Department of Justice.

But I see your point (although you'd said I was misinterpreting as to time victims were found which is categorically not true - reread quoted portion) - I'm of course assuming she was murdered as where you are not - so to rephrase my previous statistics I can state of 'stereotypical kidnappings' 40% lead to homicide but of those murders 76% occurred within 3 hours with 4% never being found. (Based on an October 2002 USDOJ report)

So, assuming this was a stereotypical kidnapping, Maddie is either 4% or 40%.
 
Thats it exactly, if she was killed the chances are she would have been found, but sadly not a given. But the fact she has disappeared to not mean she has to be dead. Look at this site alone just to see how many people go missing and are never found, children included. The fact is that even if she is dead, there are a huge number of places she could have been hidden. I mean unless someone pops up on the police radar they have no reason to dig their garden etc, so she could be there for years. When peter tobin was found guilty of killing a young woman, the police thought he may have killed others so dug up the gardens of his former residences and found the bodies of two missing teenagers that had been there for nearly twenty years one five hundred miles from where she disappeared. If it was not for the murder of the final girl, they would only have been found if the people living there had dug up the garden for some reason. The same with the wests, they had twelve girls buried on their property and no-one suspected a thing until they were reported for child abuse and a police woman noticed one of their daughters had suddenly disappeared, and decided to dig up their garden to look for her and in doing so uncovered one of the worst seriel killings in UK history. That is the problem until soemone comes up on the radar there is no reason they woudl be investigated. I suspect there is a good chance that madeleine will be found by chance if she has been killed. Someone will get arrested for soemthing else and a background check will reveal he was in the area at the time and one thing will lead to neother, just as with levi bellfield. But the fact she has not been found is another reason I do not believe her family were involved, they had an hour to come up with a plan and hide her body whilst on foot with no immediately available digging implements in a village they hardly knew, and where they only had access to public area and it was daylight. So if they did it it means she is buried someone publicly accessible within about a twenty five minute walk from the flat, but if she was then she would have been found by now plus no-one reports seeing either of them walking through the village at this point.
However, just as with ben needham, katrice lee, and all the other missing children I will continue to hope she is alive and happy.
 
until a body is found then there is always a chance however small - . Sadly i do think that the probability is she is no longer with us - but until we know for sure then every option is open to the police.

As Brit says one day this mystery will be solved - It could be by chance if a known offender gets aressted and things begin to unravel. and yes before everyone jumps down my throat if remains of Maddie turn up in the area and it is proved that the parents were involved -

But at the present - no-one knows ( apart from those who wre involved ) The police have no idea and nor do the family. so we wait and the family do what they do - the fact that they have kept her name still in the news all these years is all power to them -
 
Listen up Guys - Bashing the parents is NOT allowed. You may discuss their suspect status and the LE reports - BUT DO NOT make ugly, nasty posts that have no purpose except to stir up trouble and be mean. That will not be tolerated and TOs will be issued.

Salem

This post lands at random.
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...k-make-Gerry-Kate-arguidos.html#ixzz29q4VDKv2

the above is an article regarding the parents aguido status. I should say that although it tends to be translated into suspect, it is not actually the same as suspect hence people can claim the status themselves. It is more like person of interest although it is a formal status. However according to the interview quoted in this article at the time no actual evidence was needed to back up the police's decision to make someone an aguido, but shortly after the mccanns were made an aguido a law came into force requiring police to at least have some evidence. So if the PJ had waited a little bit longer then they would not have been able to make the mccanns or murat aguidos (the final reports states there is no evidence the mccanns or murat had committed any crimes) and it is speculated this might be the reason for the haste.
However the mccanns and murat are not longer aguidos, and the final report of the case has said there is no evidence they committed any crimes. This is supported by the operation grange who have stated they belive madeleine was taken in a criminal act by a stranger.
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...k-make-Gerry-Kate-arguidos.html#ixzz29q4VDKv2

the above is an article regarding the parents aguido status. I should say that although it tends to be translated into suspect, it is not actually the same as suspect hence people can claim the status themselves. It is more like person of interest although it is a formal status. However according to the interview quoted in this article at the time no actual evidence was needed to back up the police's decision to make someone an aguido, but shortly after the mccanns were made an aguido a law came into force requiring police to at least have some evidence. So if the PJ had waited a little bit longer then they would not have been able to make the mccanns or murat aguidos (the final reports states there is no evidence the mccanns or murat had committed any crimes) and it is speculated this might be the reason for the haste.
However the mccanns and murat are not longer aguidos, and the final report of the case has said there is no evidence they committed any crimes. This is supported by the operation grange who have stated they belive madeleine was taken in a criminal act by a stranger.

Goncalo Amaral knew that the law was changing and consequently acted in some haste to make them Arguidos before it was no longer possible. This was mentioned by Rebelo who took over from Amaral when Amaral was removed from the Case.
 
Goncalo Amaral knew that the law was changing and consequently acted in some haste to make them Arguidos before it was no longer possible. This was mentioned by Rebelo who took over from Amaral when Amaral was removed from the Case.

Thats interesting, is there a link to that Rebelo statement?
 
I know in the link above the head of the PJ says Amaral was too hasty in making them aguidos.
 
It's hardly likely that Amaral didn't know about the change in the law concerning Arguidos since it came into effect some five days later, so the entire Judiciary must have been aware.
However, The McCanns were never arrested and were in fact allowed to leave the country.
 
Got to laugh, one minute "posters are picking and choosing what to use" when talking about Jane Tanner and Jeremy Wilkins but then the next minute it is fine to use a quote from the daily mail as accurate?

As for it being "hardly likely that Amaral didnt know about the change in the law"
what does that matter? He acted within the laws that were applicable at that time he couldnt do anything else.
Was he expected to wait until the laws were changed just for the McCanns?

Yes the McCanns were allowed to leave the country, good spot!
Didnt hang about for long though, total innocence and not leaving Portugal without Madeleine?
 
The McCanns did cooperate with The Police. And if you read The 48 Questions you will see that Kate McCann had already answered questions put to her on the previous day. Sadly, this Interview was not recorded in any way. One might wonder why.

And again, if you look at The 48 Questions, at least half of them were deliberately designed to get Kate to incriminate herself, and were at the very least downright insulting.
Kate McCann simply exercised her right to silence. Gerry answered all of their questions, and when he asked to see their "Evidence" he was fobbed off because they didn't have any.
Their Stitch Up didn't work, so The PJ continued to leak lies.


So there is no record anywhere of this interview, yet you know it happened?
As for the 48 questions incriminating Kate McCann, if the PJ suspected her of something what do you expect them to ask about? The point of a police investigation is to investigate, not chat about trivial matters

THen Gerry McCann asking to see the evidence - are you being serious?
Maybe that would defeat the whole object of an investigation into a missing child? Just a thought you know?
 
Got to laugh, one minute "posters are picking and choosing what to use" when talking about Jane Tanner and Jeremy Wilkins but then the next minute it is fine to use a quote from the daily mail as accurate?

As for it being "hardly likely that Amaral didnt know about the change in the law"
what does that matter? He acted within the laws that were applicable at that time he couldnt do anything else.
Was he expected to wait until the laws were changed just for the McCanns?

Yes the McCanns were allowed to leave the country, good spot!
Didnt hang about for long though, total innocence and not leaving Portugal without Madeleine?


it is from a radio interview so one could hear him say it himself, the above link is just t a news article about it. Besides do yo think the Portuguese lawmakers are only faking the law change? The head of the PJ has admitted Amaral was too hasty to make. them arguidos, The PJ file show this was no evidence against the McCanns or Murat, and the final report states this clearly.

I assume you are not implying by your last sentence that the McCanns are anything less than totally innocent of any crime? If you think the PJ are wrong, and scotland yard are wrong what evidence are you basing that on?
 
So there is no record anywhere of this interview, yet you know it happened?
As for the 48 questions incriminating Kate McCann, if the PJ suspected her of something what do you expect them to ask about? The point of a police investigation is to investigate, not chat about trivial matters

THen Gerry McCann asking to see the evidence - are you being serious?
Maybe that would defeat the whole object of an investigation into a missing child? Just a thought you know?

Actually as an arguido Gerry had a legal right to see any evidence against him.
 
it is from a radio interview so one could hear him say it himself, the above link is just t a news article about it. Besides do yo think the Portuguese lawmakers are only faking the law change? The head of the PJ has admitted Amaral was too hasty to make. them arguidos, The PJ file show this was no evidence against the McCanns or Murat, and the final report states this clearly.

I assume you are not implying by your last sentence that the McCanns are anything less than totally innocent of any crime? If you think the PJ are wrong, and scotland yard are wrong what evidence are you basing that on?

I dont see me saying the PJ or Scotland Yard are wrong, I also dont see any official result from the Scotland Yard review or an official end to the Portuguese investigation.
I do see people making bold statements that Scotland Yard have officially cleared the McCanns or anyone else of anything, if that is the case I wonder why Operation Grange is still ongoing and why the PJ state that the case can be reopened if there is new evidence or if the McCanns and associates would be willing to cooperate in a reconstruction.

Is that a clear enough basis for you?
 
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